Allo DigiOne in connexion with Mutec MC-3+ USB

[davide256]

1 hour ago, nbpf said:

Thanks SwissBear, the Naim DAC only supports S/PDIF inputs. I would not argue that it does not process timing signals properly, the design is meant to make the device insensitive to clocking artifacts in the S/PDIF stream. Of course, it is conceivable that the internal clocks of the Naim DAC are less accurate than the clocking that they actually override. But this is a possibility, not a fact. Anyway, I have no alternative there: the DAC needs a S/PDIF signal. Ideally, I would buy a server + renderer with good S/PDIF outputs. My problem is that I absolutely need MinimServer and most devices with (allegedly) good S/PDIF outputs do not support MinimServer (Naim Core, Aurender, etc.). I also would like to have control over the OS of the server. Another constraint is that I cannot run a wired connection between the router and the living room. Hence my current setup. I will run a test in which the RPi+DigiOne acts as a pure network player and report my findings. 

While the wired connection for server is essential, I find its not so with the renderer if you can get a good 802.11ac (5ghz) wireless connection. With Aries mini I could not tell a difference between wired and wireless (5ghz), where the server was external, other than library refresh scan speed. For some reason I get more hiccups during playback if both server and renderer are wirelessly connected.

[nbpf]

6 hours ago, davide256 said:

While the wired connection for server is essential, I find its not so with the renderer if you can get a good 802.11ac (5ghz) wireless connection. With Aries mini I could not tell a difference between wired and wireless (5ghz), where the server was external, other than library refresh scan speed. For some reason I get more hiccups during playback if both server and renderer are wirelessly connected.

Yes, wireless streaming over 5GHz works flawlessly, for instance between the RPi wired to the router and the FitPC3 or Oppo 203. I will also try the FitPC3 as a pure renderer and report. The Naim DAC has 4 electrical S/PDIF inputs (2 BNC and 2 RCA) and 4 optical S/PDIF inputs. They are currently connected to TV (optical), Oppo (electrical RCA), M2tech or Eitr (Electrical BNC) and DigiOne (electrical BNC), thus a comparison between the different sources is straightforward.

[nbpf]

@davide256, @SwissBear: I have finally managed to run some preliminary tests with the FitPC3 (connected to the Naim DAC via M2Tech hiFace Evo or Schiit Eitr) and with the DigiOne (directly connected to the Naim DAC) acting as pure renderers. In both cases the server was a Raspberry Pi wired to the router. In the case of the FitPC3, the connection to the router was over the wireless. For the DigiOne I had a direct cabled connection to the router. By listening through my speakers (Naim Ovator S-400), I cannot hear any difference between this configurations and the original setup in which the FitPC3 and the DigiOne are acting as server+renderer with data stored on attached USB drives. I could try to replace the FitPC3 or the DigiOne with a Sonore ultraRendu or with a SoTM sMS-200ultra or perhaps to listen again to the two configuration through my headphones. Perhaps the Sennheiser HD-800 are more revealing than the S-400 speakers? I am actually mainly interested in listening through speakers. Thus, the headphones test would be just to try to understand if my current source could be further improved and what are the most promising ways to do so. I have to add that I am very pleased with the current sound, I am just trying to understand why replacing the hiFace Evo with the Eitr made virtually no difference (after burn in, in the beginning, the Eitr sounded quite differently from the hiFace Evo and so did the returned MC-3+ USB) and why the differences between the two and the DigiOne are almost negligible!     

[davide256]

3 hours ago, nbpf said:

@davide256, @SwissBear: I have finally managed to run some preliminary tests with the FitPC3 (connected to the Naim DAC via M2Tech hiFace Evo or Schiit Eitr) and with the DigiOne (directly connected to the Naim DAC) acting as pure renderers. In both cases the server was a Raspberry Pi wired to the router. In the case of the FitPC3, the connection to the router was over the wireless. For the DigiOne I had a direct cabled connection to the router. By listening through my speakers (Naim Ovator S-400), I cannot hear any difference between this configurations and the original setup in which the FitPC3 and the DigiOne are acting as server+renderer with data stored on attached USB drives. I could try to replace the FitPC3 or the DigiOne with a Sonore ultraRendu or with a SoTM sMS-200ultra or perhaps to listen again to the two configuration through my headphones. Perhaps the Sennheiser HD-800 are more revealing than the S-400 speakers? I am actually mainly interested in listening through speakers. Thus, the headphones test would be just to try to understand if my current source could be further improved and what are the most promising ways to do so. I have to add that I am very pleased with the current sound, I am just trying to understand why replacing the hiFace Evo with the Eitr made virtually no difference (after burn in, in the beginning, the Eitr sounded quite differently from the hiFace Evo and so did the returned MC-3+ USB) and why the differences between the two and the DigiOne are almost negligible!     

mmm, you should at least hear a difference in tonality.  In basic setups direct server connect is great for high frequency transients whereas streaming to a renderer sounds better for harmonic integrity. If they don't sound different, something is stepping on differences... "mid-fi-ing" the system.

 

I am leary of your server setup...I found USB2 inadequate for media drives. Your drives should be SATAII or USB3 attached. Can you not use the FITPC as server with internal SATA or external USB3 attached media drives?

[nbpf]

1 hour ago, davide256 said:

mmm, you should at least hear a difference in tonality.  In basic setups direct server connect is great for high frequency transients whereas streaming to a renderer sounds better for harmonic integrity. If they don't sound different, something is stepping on differences... "mid-fi-ing" the system.

 

I am leary of your server setup...I found USB2 inadequate for media drives. Your drives should be SATAII or USB3 attached. Can you not use the FITPC as server with internal SATA or external USB3 attached media drives?

Hmm ... The external drive of the FitPC3 is attached to a USB3 port, the one of the DigiOne to the RPi's USB2 port, of course. I have compared replay from external drives to replay from internal (and external) SSD drives, from microSD cards and USB sticks without being able to perceive obvious differences. I also have a Raspberry Pi with a 500GB microSATA that I take with me when I go on holiday (it is set up as a wireless access point, thus I can stream to mobile devices or connect it to a Meridian Explorer USB DAC) and replay from this drive also does not sound different than replay from an external USB drive t my ears. Perhaps the problem lies in my hearing but my wife also finds it difficult to notice differences between the different setups. What I find surprising is that the Eitr and the MC-3+ USB seemed to sound different from the hiFace Evo when I first put them in my system. After about two weeks the Eitr was almost indistinguishable from the hiFave Evo and the MC-3+ USB was not as good as Eitr or hiFave Evo. The system downstream the DAC is pretty standard: the DAC is connected to a SuperNait 2 with a Super Lumina DIN-DIN cable and the SN2 is connected to the speakers via NAC A5. I will make some more experiments with headphones and report. Thanks for your assistance!   

[davide256]

53 minutes ago, nbpf said:

Hmm ... The external drive of the FitPC3 is attached to a USB3 port, the one of the DigiOne to the RPi's USB2 port, of course. I have compared replay from external drives to replay from internal (and external) SSD drives, from microSD cards and USB sticks without being able to perceive obvious differences. I also have a Raspberry Pi with a 500GB microSATA that I take with me when I go on holiday (it is set up as a wireless access point, thus I can stream to mobile devices or connect it to a Meridian Explorer USB DAC) and replay from this drive also does not sound different than replay from an external USB drive t my ears. Perhaps the problem lies in my hearing but my wife also finds it difficult to notice differences between the different setups. What I find surprising is that the Eitr and the MC-3+ USB seemed to sound different from the hiFace Evo when I first put them in my system. After about two weeks the Eitr was almost indistinguishable from the hiFave Evo and the MC-3+ USB was not as good as Eitr or hiFave Evo. The system downstream the DAC is pretty standard: the DAC is connected to a SuperNait 2 with a Super Lumina DIN-DIN cable and the SN2 is connected to the speakers via NAC A5. I will make some more experiments with headphones and report. Thanks for your assistance!   

I'm very much in the Linn camp of source being the most important component(s) in your equipment chain. Keep in mind  that while not much has changed significantly for audiophile analog components since 2010 ( except for remote control being more common ), there's been a fever pitch evolution in all the components of digital source in order to acchieve improved resolution and tone timbre. Borrowing a recent Chord or Schiit multibit DAC to compare with the original Naim DAC in your system would also be wise.

[nbpf]

1 hour ago, davide256 said:

I'm very much in the Linn camp of source being the most important component(s) in your equipment chain. Keep in mind  that while not much has changed significantly for audiophile analog components since 2010 ( except for remote control being more common ), there's been a fever pitch evolution in all the components of digital source in order to acchieve improved resolution and tone timbre. Borrowing a recent Chord or Schiit multibit DAC to compare with the original Naim DAC in your system would also be wise.

Good point! Testing a Chord or a Schiit DAC is something that I will anyway do at a certain point. For the time being, however, I am mainly interested in assessing the quality of the chain in front of the Naim DAC. The latest firmware upgrade (from Dec. 2015) had brought very audible improvements to the device. Thus, assuming that my hearing has not completely deteriorated since then, I would expect to be able to hear differences when the DAC is fed with different sources. Of course, assuming that these source provide different levels of galvanic isolation because, as I mentioned in a previous post, the clocking of the incoming S/PDIF stream get anyway overridden by the DAC's internal clocks. More after I have done some more listening tests through the headphones.

 

Getting back to the the topic: can the DigiOne profit from the new Raspberry Pi B+? The new model should have a faster processor, 5GHz wireless and a faster wired connection. The faster CPU could be useful when transcoding. Has anyone tried to power the RPi + DigiOne combination through the Mezzanine hat?