FLAC files from 16/44 CD (WAV) files are smaller than MP3s.

[dalethorn]

42 minutes ago, mansr said:

We already told you why. It is because piano music has simple waveforms that compress well.

 

Are you so thick you don't understand 35 times 7 versus 22 times one?  And do not forget, that's the smaller issue in this thread.

[dalethorn]

15 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

 

The vibrations of strings are pretty simple. The complexities come from the hammer action and the interaction of string material and the tension where it's attached. Here's an interesting result that shows that piano strings do not produce even-spaced harmonics, but rather harmonics with increased, non-integer spacing at higher frequencies:

 

https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/268568/why-are-the-harmonics-of-a-piano-tone-not-multiples-of-the-base-frequency

 

Probably nothing to do with the topic of compressibility, just an interesting side-bar on piano sound 

 

 

 

Most of the comments here over-simplify what isn't simple - this comment gives a small peek at the real complexity of sound.  The simplicity or rigidity of Redbook action is far from simple, and the term 'sampling' is just one clue.  High-pass, low-pass, cutoff etc. filters are simple enough, and even the compressors are relatively simple to a programmer/coder, but when 7 solo piano CDs compress to 35-40 percent and one compresses to 22 percent, I wonder about the 22 percent.  The other guys who post ad nauseam here have no curiosity whatsoever.

[mansr]

If you're so curious, why don't you go and learn how FLAC works? You keep talking about some issue, but the simple fact of the matter is that there is none. Everything is working exactly as intended.

[miguelito]

9 hours ago, dalethorn said:

Not relevant here - the quest for truth needs to know why a solo piano CD (or set recorded in kind) is compressing very much smaller than the average piano CD.  I believe a case can be made that the average compression for modern digital recordings is going to range from 35 percent up.  I don't need more examples of high compression unless the average compression percentage were to drop significantly with a large random sampling.

I think the implication here is that FLAC compression is losing data if it is compressing to that small of a file. How about you do this: Take the WAV, compress it (getting to 24% of the size), then uncompress it back to WAV and do a data comparison. Admitedly, the file headers etc might have changed so doing such comparison might not be possible by just doing diff or similar. @mansr might know how to do this properly.

[mansr]

1 hour ago, miguelito said:

I think the implication here is that FLAC compression is losing data if it is compressing to that small of a file. How about you do this: Take the WAV, compress it (getting to 24% of the size), then uncompress it back to WAV and do a data comparison. Admitedly, the file headers etc might have changed so doing such comparison might not be possible by just doing diff or similar. @mansr might know how to do this properly.

Somehow I doubt that would convince him.

[The Computer Audiophile]

2 hours ago, dalethorn said:

 

Are you so thick you don't understand 35 times 7 versus 22 times one?  And do not forget, that's the smaller issue in this thread.

 

Watch the personal attacks. 

[kumakuma]

3 hours ago, dalethorn said:

 

This thread has the full details, repeated several times.

 

As far as I can tell, you used Jriver to convert the DSD files to 24/88.2 FLAC format. You were unfamiliar with Jriver so you needed to ask some other folks how to do this. You converted the files based on their advice and there were problems with the converted file. You believe that the cause is something to do with the DSD files.

 

All I can tell you is that the DSD file you shared seems fine here and I'm unable to reproduce what you experienced. If I had to guess what the cause was, I would go with something in your JRiver settings, probably on the DSP Studio page.

 

Here are the settings I used:

 

 

[dalethorn]

1 hour ago, kumakuma said:

 

As far as I can tell, you used Jriver to convert the DSD files to 24/88.2 FLAC format. You were unfamiliar with Jriver so you needed to ask some other folks how to do this. You converted the files based on their advice and there were problems with the converted file. You believe that the cause is something to do with the DSD files.

 

All I can tell you is that the DSD file you shared seems fine here and I'm unable to reproduce what you experienced. If I had to guess what the cause was, I would go with something in your JRiver settings, probably on the DSP Studio page.

 

Here are the settings I used:

 

 

 

Yes, I used those same exact settings.  The FLACs I got destroyed my Foobar2000 install on my Windows XP PC.  I know for a fact that my Foobar is perfect, because it plays all commercial high-res FLACs.  So the problem is JRMC on my Macbook making those conversions.  I have to wonder if the other people making those conversions are not playing them back on a generic PC in Foobar2000, and whether their playback requires a specific DAC.  My thousand-plus FLACs play fine with the internal soundcard (Realtek?) or the Dragonfly Red.

[dalethorn]

1 hour ago, mansr said:

Somehow I doubt that would convince him.

 

No convincing is needed where logic is applied, but when certain opinions say that "Well, 7 CDs compressed to 35+ percent and one CD to 22 percent, it's all the same thing" -- THAT is not logic.

[kumakuma]

Just now, dalethorn said:

 

Yes, I used those same exact settings.  The FLACs I got destroyed my Foobar2000 install on my Windows XP PC.  I know for a fact that my Foobar is perfect, because it plays all commercial high-res FLACs.  So the problem is JRMC on my Macbook making those conversions.  I have to wonder if the other people making those conversions are not playing them back on a generic PC in Foobar2000, and whether their playback requires a specific DAC.  My thousand-plus FLACs play fine with the internal soundcard (Realtek?) or the Dragonfly Red.

 

 

Can you share one of the files that's giving you grief?

 

[dalethorn]

3 hours ago, mansr said:

If you're so curious, why don't you go and learn how FLAC works? You keep talking about some issue, but the simple fact of the matter is that there is none. Everything is working exactly as intended.

 

I know how FLAC works, but you are trying repetitively to steer the subject away from the huge anomalies, not to mention the original JRiver issue.

[dalethorn]

13 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

 

Can you share one of the files that's giving you grief?

 

 

I'm going to convert a DSD to 24/88 FLAC and put it into my Dropbox, but so far I can't get JRiver to show the one track on the screen.  I did the folder import, and there's an option that keeps bringing up an old playlist, and even though I remove that list, it keeps reappearing.  This is possibly the worst software I've ever used.

 

Once I find how to display that track to convert I'll do so.  This worked a few days ago when I first installed JRiver, but today none of the display options are showing the track I just "imported".

[mansr]

23 minutes ago, dalethorn said:

The FLACs I got destroyed my Foobar2000 install on my Windows XP PC.  I know for a fact that my Foobar is perfect

If a program is "destroyed" by some particular file, said program is by definition not perfect.

[mansr]

21 minutes ago, dalethorn said:

I know how FLAC works

Everything you have said so far suggests otherwise.

[kumakuma]

3 minutes ago, dalethorn said:

 

I'm going to convert a DSD to 24/88 FLAC and put it into my Dropbox, but so far I can't get JRiver to show the one track on the screen.  I did the folder import, and there's an option that keeps bringing up an old playlist, and even though I remove that list, it keeps reappearing.  This is possibly the worst software I've ever used.

 

Once I find how to display that track to convert I'll do so.  This worked a few days ago when I first installed JRiver, but today none of the display options are showing the track I just "imported".

 

You should be able to use File > Open Media File...

 

Then right click Library Tools > Convert Format

[dalethorn]

24 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

 

Can you share one of the files that's giving you grief?

 

 

I managed to get the view to show the track I want to convert**, but when I right-click that track and click on "convert format" or "library tools - convert format", nothing is coming up.  Maybe the gurus at JRiver turned something off here?  Dunno.  It worked the other day to make bad 24/88s and playable 16/44s.

 

I wrote windows software for years, converted databases and code for MS SQL Server, but haven't seen a worse user interface than this.

[dalethorn]

5 minutes ago, mansr said:

Everything you have said so far suggests otherwise.

 

So you think being repetitive and abusive gets you past the Computer Audiophile warnings?  You need to go away, because you're not helping anyone, you're just agitating.

[dalethorn]

5 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

You should be able to use File > Open Media File...

 

Then right click Library Tools > Convert Format

 

I did, but nothing happens.  I trashed the current MC app, then reinstalled it to start over.  I got the track to appear, but right-click and convert does nothing.

[dalethorn]

8 minutes ago, mansr said:

If a program is "destroyed" by some particular file, said program is by definition not perfect.

 

Said program is free and public and plays over a thousand commercial high res FLAC files from all of the known distributors.

 

So, by your own definition, you do not know what you're talking about.

 

So far in this discussion you've been trolling repetitively.  You're not helping the situation at all.  Go away.

[dalethorn]

41 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

You should be able to use File > Open Media File...

 

Then right click Library Tools > Convert Format

 

BTW, I told the guys at JRiver last week that I wanted a refund since their player could not make playable 24/88 FLACs, so I wonder if they disabled the thing already.  I know that Apple can "reach out" and do things to my phone without my permission, like an abusive landlord who sneaks in whenever they wish without regard to the law.  I wonder if JRiver is able to turn off the functionality of my player remotely without notice, other than my asking them for a refund?  I haven't seen the refund BTW.

[mansr]

38 minutes ago, dalethorn said:

So you think being repetitive and abusive gets you past the Computer Audiophile warnings?  You need to go away, because you're not helping anyone, you're just agitating.

The only one being abusive here is you. If I have failed to help you, it is because you are either unwilling or unable to accept the facts that have been laid out before you.

[dalethorn]

Just now, mansr said:

The only one being abusive here is you. If I have failed to help you, it is because you are either unwilling or unable to accept the facts that have been laid out before you.

 

I told you to go away, so go away.  If you insist on keeping up the nonsense, it will inform everyone who you are.  I'm reporting your continued abuse.

[kumakuma]

3 minutes ago, dalethorn said:

 

BTW, I told the guys at JRiver last week that I wanted a refund since their player could not make playable 24/88 FLACs, so I wonder if they disabled the thing already.  I know that Apple can "reach out" and do things to my phone without my permission, like an abusive landlord who sneaks in whenever they wish without regard to the law.  I wonder if JRiver is able to turn off the functionality of my player remotely without notice, other than my asking them for a refund?  I haven't seen the refund BTW.

 

If you are just trying to do conversions, you might want to consider XiSRC as a replacement. It's super easy to use:

 

https://www.xivero.com/xisrc/

 

[dalethorn]

1 minute ago, kumakuma said:

 

If you are just trying to do conversions, you might want to consider XiSRC as a replacement. It's super easy to use:

 

https://www.xivero.com/xisrc/

 

 

Thank you.  That's the second possibility I've been suggested.  Now to find the time to repeat a (possible) second scenario like the first here, hoping for success....

 

I see that JRMC is a primary advertiser here.

[dalethorn]

14 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

If you are just trying to do conversions, you might want to consider XiSRC as a replacement. It's super easy to use:

 

https://www.xivero.com/xisrc/

 

 

Another amazement - the payment asks for the money without allowing selection of the proper version (Mac).  I'm sure there's a simple explanation....

 

EDIT: I sent this message to xivero - the second question as important as the first:

 

1)  I see a download button for the Mac version *without* purchase, and I see a purchase button that does *not* specify the version.  Can I specify the version *before* I purchase.

 

2)  Once I buy and install the software and validate the "key" or whatever is the procedure, can I work offline, or do you require my computer to be online for the software to work?  Are there *any* times after installing that my computer has to be online?