Best next upgrade up from microRendu? Go for Ultra or SOtM or a Server or something else?

[firedog]

I think I'm about to order a Bricasti M5 Network Player as an upgrade from my mRendu and LPS-1. I'm surprised you wouldn't try that  (Or the internal card equivalent for your M1) first since you love the M1. I'd guess you'd have a very hard time beating that combo, and it saves you boxes and cables. Sell some of the accessories and they will pay for the Bricasti card.  

BTW, there is supposed to be a review of the M5 posted today at audiostream.com

 

Sorry, I'm skeptical that with so many devices and cables you really are "upgrading" every time you add one in. 

 

The Innuos MKII SE is surely  a fine unit if you want to go to that price level. It has the advantage of also being a server. 

[firedog]

8 hours ago, fsmithjack said:

Is it the ultra or the SoTM or something else.

 If you look on the ultra thread here people who upgraded from a mRendu said it was a noticeable improvement.

 

On the Sig Rendu SE thread most said that was a further improvement, even if you already owned a Rendu device powered by the Signature Power Supply. 

 

At audiostream.com they did a shootout between the Sig Rendu SE and the 3 piece SOtM  "stack" and had a slight preference for the SOtM stack.

 

Take all of the above with a grain of salt and just buy what most appeals to you.  You can never know for sure what will be "best", unless you have both in your system to compare. You can't really go wrong with any of these. They will all give you great sound on a level that you probably wouldn't notice any difference  at all unless you did a direct A/B. and even then it will be small. 

 

Will be interested to hear your comparison of the Bricasti card to whatever external solution you get. 

 

8 hours ago, fsmithjack said:

this stuff is always changing - who cares - just want the best I can for the best price I can - what am I going to do sit home and wait for something to be invented - I assume you guys are just joking on that one. Why buy anything when something tomorrow maybe better comes along  / I’ve never done that in my life and never will. That’s like the old lady putting the plastic on her couch or my buddy who has a beautiful Rolex but keeps in his draw so he doesn’t scratch it. Wear proudly and enjoy it. Ware out that couch and get another one in 5 - 10 years. Have some fun... 

 

Pretty much agree. You can always wait for the "next best" thing and you will never get anything. Of course some people can't afford to keep buying more stuff every few years so they are more cautious. To each his/her own. 

[firedog]

7 hours ago, fsmithjack said:

Because my digital beats my analogue I was thinking of flipping my table for Aurender N10 but honestly I’m after the sound. The best sound and don’t care about simplifying anything at the expense of sound quality. 

 

Dutch review of M5 where he prefers it to the more costly N10:

http://www.hifi-advice.com/blog/review/digital-reviews/network-player-reviews/bricasti-m5-network-player/

Quote

Using RAAT and any server running Roon Server, M5 not only offers more sonorous bass and a more luscious midrange, its overall sound quality is all the way at the level of the four times as expensive Aurender N10 music server, and that makes it almost a bargain!

YMMV.

[firedog]

7 hours ago, One and a half said:

Next week I'll be home to commission the M5 and let you know how this works and how it sounds. I do have a quite a few DSD files, Roon can convert using software, and they sound very good indeed. In my case, it's possible to locate the M5 at the computer end and use the existing CAT5 cable with Ethercon connectors over 25m as AES3 and into a 100 Ohm to 75 Ohm transformer, or a Mutec MC-1.1 (optional). DSD is played as 176.4 PCM. I'd rather not use the house network as the switches and routers will just add trash to the signals, the facilities to run direct are there, so why not use them. It may mean some tricky with starting a DHCP server software on a non server PC, but there are ways around this for the computer savvy.

Will be interested to hear what you think. I'm pretty sure I'm going to go for the M5 as a source upgrade, as it seems to be one and there is a limit how much I want to spend. The M5 seems like a relatively good bang for the buck in the high end of USB sources. 

[firedog]

3 hours ago, One and a half said:

The intent is to use AES3 or the coax S/PDIF out to the DAC and avoid USB. Still mulling whether to reclock the M5 output and introduce another box that could colour the sound with high leakage currents, impeding the gains of the re-clocking.  

I will probably try the AES too, I guess `I should have written “`USB capable”.

[firedog]

5 hours ago, fsmithjack said:

Guys - I have found a US Dealer that has a Innous  ZENith Mk.II Std that I can demo and buy for $3,000.

 

Is this a good deal?

 

I never even heard of it before you guys but here i am preparing to buy one.

 

You guys have taught me a lot and that is why I came on here. Thank you 

 

Kinda bummed to lose JRiver but I want sound quality much more. If sound quality is better than that is what i want.

 

JRiver has an EQ that lets you tweak the sound and to be honest it makes a pretty big deal but my room is big enough its not a room needed EQ but more shaping the sound bit is all. That said I am fine without it just that I am use to JRiver is all and like it. That said I am using a garden variety HP PC so thinking this Innous should be a nice upgrade.

 

You guys agree? Also, I don't need to save every last dollar but don't want to just overpay either so wanted your thought on the $3,000 for that lists for $2,299 abroad.

 

Thank so much for all the help and I will look forward to your responses. Thanks again to everyone

 

ZENith Mk.II Std 
Our flagship model, designed for Audiophiles who want to extract all the detail and dynamics out of their music on high end hi-fi systems.

Unit Price 
£ 2,299.00 
Quantity

Sounds like the standard price. Allowing you to demo is worth quite a bit vs. someone who won't. 

I was thinking of getting one, the fact that the HD is not user replaceable/upgradeable put me off. YMMV.

Innuos is also setup for Roon. You might be able to work out a Roon>JRiver playback setup if you have Roon Core and JRiver set up externally to the Zenith - just guessing, no idea if it is actually possible.

 

Roon also has extensive EQ/DSP functions so you use Roon and define something that will do the same thing you were doing in JRiver. 

[firedog]

1 hour ago, Ben2300 said:

This is no longer their flagship. I think people are talking about the MKII SE version not the std version.

People are talking about both. It gets confusing.

Innuos still call it the flagship b/c they claim the SE version is limited to 100 pieces and then won't be made anymore. Time will tell. 

[firedog]

55 minutes ago, KingRex said:

 

 

In reading through this site I find  2 main camps of people  both pitching their spin.  The SOTM /Sonosre group and the purpose built computer group. Each has their technical guru wowing everyone with their deep knowlede of why their camp is  best.  These people sound very educated and make solid points.  Both groups have valid arguments.  

I have not heard a Rendu, but know and trust people who have compared the two designs.  They prefer internal storage. 

 

Some depends on what you want to do. Are you a Redbook PCM or DSD upsample person.  Upsampling makes a lot of noise.  Mojo highly recommends 

 PCM without upsampling.  

 

 

 

Ben wants to sell equipment so he has a bias, just like every other designer.  I would still go to his site and give him a call.  He can tell you more about what he does. 

I'd only recommend that if you go with something with internal storage, check if the storage is user upgradeable. If not, it could be very inconvenient/expensive in case of failure or upgrade.

 

BTW, I'm sure either method can be manufactured with good SQ results. 

[firedog]

cables: bluejeanscable.com

 

Will make good quality cables cut to any length and in various colors. Tested to meet spec (unlike most, even expensive ones). 

[firedog]

1 hour ago, beerandmusic said:

i would go with sotm instead of m5....m5 doesn't support high res native dsd...must be an older product...

Not true. The present version of the m5 supports DSD 128

[firedog]

3 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

what native dsd over enet?

 

The device is an Ethernet to spdif, AES, and USB renderer. So it supports DSD 64 over the first 2, and also DSD 128 over USB.

[firedog]

2 hours ago, beerandmusic said:

I like the idea of an internal unit and bypassing the usb interface all together...but then would he only get DSD64?  seems if you eliminate an interface that he should be able to get DSD128 with the internal one?

That's a limit of the type of output. Standard SPDIF and AES are generally limited to DSD 64/PCM 192. There may be exceptions, I can't think of them offhand. That's one of the reasons some people go to USB as a source. 

[firedog]

1 minute ago, beerandmusic said:

he mentioned an "internal m5"....if he goes with an internal m5 (that doesn't need any interface), what would be his rate?

You are misunderstanding. Briasti developed a network card for it’s DAC that allows the DAC to become a network renderer to the analog outputs of the DAC. 

The m5 is the same tech, but in it’s own case and as a standalone, it has it’s own power supply, etc. It’s just the network renderer part, without the DAC and analog outs. Since it isn’t a DAC, it has digital outs.

Functionally - in terms of network connectivity  - the 2 items are the same, so there is no difference in terms of rate. The m1 digital inputs have the same rates as the equivalent outputs on the m5. 

[firedog]

41 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

 

ok, the m5 is an external renderer (network in, usb out DSD128 or eas/toslink DSD64)

so the internal one (m1?) has enet in, and has no usb out since it is interal...so if it doesn't have toslink or usb out, what is it's rate?

 

It’s a DAC that in addition to more usual digital inputs also has an option for a network input card. Why are you making this some really complicated issue?

One’s a DAC, one’s a Renderer. Go to the Bricasti site and read up. 

[firedog]

1) Can you please stop copying and pasting massive bits with pictures from other sites? it's annoying to scroll through. All sorts of irrelevant information for people even a little interested in helping you. Just put the page link. Anyone who is interested can clink on the link and look-it is the Internet, after all. 

 

2) Don't know how to answer your question, as it isn't clear what the setup of this server is and how you add software to it. It would be best to ask the manufacturer how one would load JRiver on to it, or if you even can run it on the server. It doesn't seem to be setup for that kind of thing. Or ask Bricasti if their internet solution can work with Twonky software, as that is what is on this unit already. I personally wouldn't use Twonky, it is sort of old and clunky and has issues.

 

The point of that server seems to be RAID/data redundancy. It doesn't seem to have any other purpose. Seems to me there are easier and cheaper ways of doing backup. And they didn't tell you exactly how much HD capacity it has. They told you the maximum it can have.

[firedog]

Very glad you like it. Should have my M5 in about 2 weeks.