Allo Digione

[nbpf]

I have ripped all my CDs with Rubyripper but the program is not maintained any longer ...

[Dr.J]

nbpf, have you compared your new configuration, with 1T drive, to a cd player with a coax connection? I'm wondering which is the better way to go, with a dedicated transport or burned to a hard drive - am assuming there will be some degradation in sound quality?

 

[nbpf]

8 minutes ago, Dr.J said:

nbpf, have you compared your new configuration, with 1T drive, to a cd player with a coax connection? I'm wondering which is the better way to go, with a dedicated transport or burned to a hard drive - am assuming there will be some degradation in sound quality?

 

No, I haven't but I expect the results to very much depend on the CD player at stake. I currently have two devices that are connected via electrical S/PDIF to a Naim DAC: an Oppo 203 and the RPi + DigiOne combo. If this is of any help I can easily compare a track replayed via

 

Oppo 203 > Supra RCA-RCA > DAC

 

to the same track replayed via 

 

RPi + DigiOne > Supra RCA-RCA > DAC

 

but, generally speaking, I find it difficult to draw reliable conclusions from these kind of comparisons. I'll give it anyway a try and report back. 

 

[Dr.J]

nbpf, that would be well appreciated, provide perspective for us all! 

 

Thank you! 

[nbpf]

2 hours ago, Dr.J said:

nbpf, that would be well appreciated, provide perspective for us all! 

 

Thank you! 

I have only listened to a couple of tracks from J. S. Bach's Suite for solo Cello Nr. 1 by  Pieter Wispelwey. What I can say is  that I can tell the difference between the two transports: the Oppo sounds slightly heavier (but perhaps also a bit more constipated), the DigiOne seems more airy and transparent but perhaps also a bit lighter. I cannot say from such a short test that I prefer one to the other or that I am missing something in one of the two presentations. In this test I also have not used the same cable, the Oppo was connected to the Naim DAC by the Supra cable, the DigiOne via a Naim DC1. This way I could play exactly the same piece of music and switch sources on the DAC. Thus, it is possible that the differences that I have reported are due to the cables, not to the transports. As I anticipated, making meaningful tests is difficult and time consuming. I will try to switch cables or to listen to more difficult music but, as a first assessment, I would argue that replay from a DigiOne with attached USB drive can certainly sound as good as replay from the Oppo transport. 

[Dr.J]

nbpf, thank you for sharing! My interest in this is that I have a chance to buy a nearly new Cambridge audio cxc transport, for reasonable money; but, if the sound quality is that close, then, there's no point (makes the cd transport redundant) - best I concentrate on the DigiOne.

[nbpf]

1 hour ago, Dr.J said:

nbpf, thank you for sharing! My interest in this is that I have a chance to buy a nearly new Cambridge audio cxc transport, for reasonable money; but, if the sound quality is that close, then, there's no point (makes the cd transport redundant) - best I concentrate on the DigiOne.

Of course your choice very much depends on what you already have and on what you want to achieve but, generally speaking, I can recommend the DigiOne if you have a DAC with S/PDIF inputs. It is a simple and straightforward way to get into streaming. The DigiOne Signature is probably better. But it is significantly more expensive and so far we no detailed comparisons between DigiOne and DigiOne Signature. 

[Dr.J]

nbpf, thank you. Yes, I have a dac, a Schiit Gungnir with S/PDIF inputs. At this point, I will probably get the Signature version, I’m just unsure about the dedicated CD transport. We will see.

[Dr.J]

Rx8r3rod, I’m looking at the voltage regulator LT3045 and, with this unit, I’m guessing there’s no need for filter capacitors, given it is already listed as ultra low noise?

 

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi Dr. J, I v much like your sense of adventure ... IMHO that way lies knowledge and progress. ??

 

As you have so rightly identified, the LT3045 is a super-measuring regulator.

 

if you fancy going with one of these, you might find something like the attached the simplest option, as the regulator itself is absolutely tiny. These boards contain the capacitors, etc needed to make the regulator work and set its voltage output.

 

The one with the prongs is dead easy to work with on a breadboard as the prongs just slip into the holes on the breadboard, the other one (which only gives 200ma in that example) is also easy to work on a breadboard using some wire links to connect power in and out.

 

I personally found the LT3045, with our without additional capacitance, to sound extremely clear and clean and very low-noise, but insufficiently ‘gutsy’ for my liking. I’m still trying to discover why that is (and it’s not inconceivable that I just like the sound of a supply that isn’t quite so fully-regulated) ... and currently I’m using a TI LM7805, which measures a bit worse but to me sounds a bit better. ?

 

But that is just personal preference, my electricity supply isn’t great, and you’re more than likely to find your preferences are different to mine. ?

 

Hope that helps?

[Dr.J]

Hi, Rx8r3rod &

 

I checked and can see the problem with the LT3045, it is current limited to .5 amps, while the stock power supply outputs up to 3amps. This suggests that even the LM7805, limited to 1.5 amps, might be creating a bottle neck; I wonder if you can use a pair of these, in parallel, to up the current to 3 amps?

 

I just checked and the ifi ipower 9v seems to supply only 2 amps, 1 less than stock.

 

Then, again, I just checked the Allo site and it claims a 5 - 6v, 100 ma requirement for the DigiOne Sig, which would suggest the 500 ma LT3045 should suffice, theoretically, while a single LM7805 should do. 

 

Are there any particular caps you’re fond of so far?

 

Thanks,

 

John

[Dr.J]

Rx8r3rod, the parts for the dc mod, male/female socket and ground wire, I’ve not been able to locate these parts; would you, or, could you provide a link to a source for them?

 

 Thanks,

 

John

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi John,

 

I think you’re good with just one of either of the regulators, as (as you say) the Signature only needs about 65 ma or so. From memory it’s the Pi that needs ~2 - 2.5 amps or so?

 

The regulators all seem to sound different; so I think it is very much a personal thing where one person might prefer the 7805, and another the 3405, or vice versa, depending on their musical preferences and systems.

 

In some ways the easiest thing might be to start with a 3405 packaged on a board, and then if it sounds a bit lightweight to you (and bear in mind that I’m using Eclipse TD712Z speakers with single 4” drivers, so my ‘lightweight’ could easily be your ‘perfectweight’ with bigger, more ‘normal’ speakers / different amp, etc) try something like a 7805?

 

if you are going for a 7805, LM317 or similar at some point, I have found Panasonic OSCONs to work really well (I’m following the crowd with that one, I think ?) along with WIMA’s for bypass duty, though am still experimenting on the latter.

 

if you fancy experimenting a bit more on caps, I found a Kemet 12v 1F supercapacitor gave (for me) a great combination of bass timing and weight, whereas the 12v 5F (£60 each, ouch) gave even better bass weight but the bass timing wasn’t so good. ? (Again though, if you’re using bigger speakers, maybe even the 1F supercapacitor might also give a bit too much bass weight?).

 

One thing to watch with the supercaps when experimenting is they are seemingly v sensitive to excess voltage, so it seems not a great idea to (say) use a 12v iPower into 9v supercaps unless you put them in series.

 

This stuff is IME surprisingly easy to hear, it usually takes my other half all of about one song  (sometimes just the intro ) to express a clear preference.

 

I’ll try and put some links up tomorrow, but I got most of the stuff from one of Amazon, eBay (great for the 3045 packages), RS, Farnell or Mouser.

 

Rod.

 

 

[RX8R3ROD]

... and these are the dc sockets. I just used some wire I had to hand for the grounding lead ?

[Dr.J]

Rx8r3rod, thank you for this!

 

I found this Dclass regulator:

 

http://www.newclassd.com/index.php?page=131&hv=1

 

and, as they’re available locally, may start here. They’re rated at 650 ma. I will combine it with the Kemet 1f and Wima .1 uf caps. Will keep fingers crossed! lol

 

I only ordered the raspberry/DigiOne Sig, yesterday, will need to get my head around the setup, hope it’s not too confusing. For eg., I want to control the Raspberry with my iPad, while using an external HD for my cds; but, to burn my cds, I have only a Windows 10 based system to rely on for ripping. Is there a good site for this type of setup info?

 

 Thanks,

 

John

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi John,

 

I say a big thank you for pointing out that 7805, it looks veeeery interesting indeed! ?? (Please do tell us all how you get on with it!!)

 

I think you’ll find the setup pretty easy. My apologies, I can’t remember if Roon was of interest to you but that really was dead easy (I used the Roipee version of the operating system to run the Pi), and I got most of the setup info from the Roon site, where there’s a very active support community.

 

In my case, it was something like: download Roon trial, Load Roon Core trial onto my Mac Pro (you could use your Windows 10 system as an equivalent to the Mac Pro in my setup, to burn CD’s, connect your external music HD, and host Roon Core, and then control it via an iPad) and set up trial Roon account, tell Roon where to find the music on one of the Mac Pro’s several external hard drives, load Roon Remote onto the iPad, and log that in.

 

Roon indexes the music, and while that’s happening...

 

Burn Roipee (or similar) to an SD card using Etcher, stick it in the Pi and power on (having attached the Signature to the Pi first). This will only take a minute or two.

 

Connect Ethernet cable from Mac Pro to Router.

 

Connect another Ethernet cable from Router to Pi.

 

Have a cup of coffee while it all talks to one another and settles down.

 

Connect Signature to DAC via SPDIF.

 

Select the Pi as your main output device in Roon.

 

Find the music you want to play on iPad. Press play and ...

 

Enjoy and marvel at the music on Roon Core computer controlled via iPad. ??

 

But unfortunately my set up experience doesn’t go beyond that ...

 

However, I believe nbpf has very good experience of running without Roon, so he may also be able to help if Roon isn’t quite your thing! ?

 

And congratulations on ordering the Pi and Signature... I imagine you can’t wait for it to arrive?

 

 Rod.

 

 

[Dr.J]

Hello Rod &

 

yes, I will let you know how I make out with this Dclass regulator; I figure it's worth a try. 

 

I hadn't decided on software, but my source for the Pi suggested Volumio. 

 

My intention is to run a LAN line from my main modem to the Pi B3+ and stream this way; I hope it's doable without the addition of another computer? I'm guessing a WiFi connection wouldn't suffice here; or, would it?

 

I'm torn between buying an external HD and/or a CD transport (on sale), as I have quite a few cd's and am really not keen on investing all the time that's required in ripping them all; have yet to make a decision. 

 

Excited? Well, at this point, I'm not sure what to expect, but, yes, I guess I am, a little. 

 

Thank you, Rod!

 

John 

[nbpf]

5 hours ago, Dr.J said:

...

I hadn't decided on software, but my source for the Pi suggested Volumio. 

 

My intention is to run a LAN line from my main modem to the Pi B3+ and stream this way; I hope it's doable without the addition of another computer? I'm guessing a WiFi connection wouldn't suffice here; or, would it?

 

I'm torn between buying an external HD and/or a CD transport (on sale), as I have quite a few cd's and am really not keen on investing all the time that's required in ripping them all; have yet to make a decision. 

...

One of the advantages of the RPi platform is that it is very easy to try different distributions and to make images of the micro SD card. See https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/installation/installing-images/linux.md.

 

I have no experience with Volumio, Dietpi or other audiophile distributions. I use a minimal Raspbian installation with no desktop and no web interface. Management and configuration are done via remote ssh access. In this minimal system, I run MinimServer and upmpdcli, see  https://minimserver.com/ and https://www.lesbonscomptes.com/upmpdcli/. This allows me to use the RPi + DigiOne both as a complete UPnP server + renderer solution and as a network interface. It is very easy to start/stop MinimServer from a remote computer using the MinimWatch application.

 

I have no problem streaming 24bit/192kHz contents from an old Raspberry Pi 2 wired to my router to the RPi 3B+ that hosts the DigiOne wirelessly. But, as I have mentioned, I typically use the  RPi + DigiOne combination as a server + renderer solutions: the files are on an attached USB drive and there is no need to waste wireless bandwidth. Tidal and Qobuz streaming work flawlessly over the wireless.

 

If you build up a music collection (either by ripping your CDs or by downloading files from providers like Hyperion, Prestoclassical, Qobuz, etc.) you'll need to buy a couple of hard disk drives and implement a reliable backup + restore strategy. I do this via simple rsync script. The import device (for downloads or rips) is always my laptop. There I do the necessary renaming and metadata editing. Once an album is perfectly tagged (with proper values for 'composer', 'work', 'composition', 'conductor', 'ensemble', 'form', 'genre', etc.) I send copies of the album to 4 attached HDDs, two in my household and two in my office. This is done via rsync scripts.

 

If you are new to streaming, you should probably keep a CD player until you have become comfortable with streaming. Many users are not prepared to invest time in organizing and tagging their music collections. In this case it is probably better to have no music collection at all or to rely on services like Qobuz, Idagio, Tidal, etc. Roon is perhaps something in between that you also might want to consider.

 

As a summary, I would argue that the difficulties of streaming are not of technical nature. If you go for UPnP streaming, I strongly suggest reading the documentation of MinimServer. This is a very good starting point for learning how to manage and organize a music collection.

[Dr.J]

Hi, Rod &

 

I'm placing the order for the caps, now, with Digikey. The Kemet super caps, are they about an 1" in diameter and an 1 1/4" tall? Just want to make sure I'm on the right track. These are ceramic, 11v and 1uf. 

 

Thanks,

 

John 

 

[Dr.J]

nbpf, 

 

thank you for the excellent and detailed explanation, although I'm not sure my old saturated brain can absorb all that; nevertheless, I will heed your advice and start with reading/research. It's always a good thing to learn something new, maybe! lol 

I may buy the cd transport, as I don't, or won't have time to commit to ripping all my cds anytime soon and can always sell it down the road, if need be. 

 

I also happened upon this device, yesterday, am wondering if anyone here has given it a try: 

 

https://wyred4sound.com/products/digital-converters/remedy-reclocker

 

Thanks,

 

John 

[RX8R3ROD]

2 hours ago, Dr.J said:

Hi, Rod &

 

I'm placing the order for the caps, now, with Digikey. The Kemet super caps, are they about an 1" in diameter and an 1 1/4" tall? Just want to make sure I'm on the right track. These are ceramic, 11v and 1uf. 

 

Thanks,

 

John 

 

 

Hi John,

 

This is is the one I ordered, if that’s any help. As you say, about an inch in diameter and about 1.25” to 1.5” or so tall.

 

Best,

 

 Rod

[Dr.J]

Hi, Rod &

 

yes, that’s the one, only the 12v version.

 

are you filtering both the in and out sides, or, only the output side?

 

 Thanks,

 

John

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi John &

 

I have the big Ultracapacitor on the input (plus WIMAS on bypass) and an OSCON 47uf or 10uf (can’t decide which sounds better) plus bypass WIMAS on the output ?

 

Best,

 

 Rod

[Dr.J]

Excellent, Rod,

 

thank you! I’m going to order them now!

 

John

[Dr.J]

Hello everyone &

 

already I need help! I was under the impression that the Raspberry Pi 3 B+ requires one power supply source, while the Allo Digi One requires another, for a grand total of two? I’m assuming this is wrong and three power supplies are actually required? If so, does this mean that only one of the three are critical for clean power and if so, which one?

 

 Thanks,

 

John