Simple (I hope) cable question

[mansr]

2 hours ago, Em2016 said:

John mentioned he saw errors with cheap cables over 5ft.

 

But there are High Speed Certified USB cables that are cheap and up to 10ft (Supra not included in this because those aren't cheap).

 

So my question is asking if errors showing up with cables >5ft even included cheap High Speed Certified Cables.

 

Or does High Speed Certified mean error free, regardless of length. 

 

For those that don't know, the Supra USB cables are High Speed Certified for up to 15ft but I'm not asking about those.

The USB spec is quite clear. If the signal at the receiving end meets the eye pattern requirements, there should be no errors. Obviously, a longer cable is more sensitive to external interference, even if the signal degradation is otherwise within limits.

[asdf1000]

1 hour ago, mansr said:

If the signal at the receiving end meets the eye pattern requirements, there should be no errors. 

 

Understood. My question is to John regarding his actual findings though, i.e. were there any cheap High Speed Certified cables over 5ft that had errors showing up, or were the only ones that failed over 5ft NOT High Speed Certified.

 

 

[mansr]

23 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

Understood. My question is to John regarding his actual findings though, i.e. were there any cheap High Speed Certified cables over 5ft that had errors showing up, or were the only ones that failed over 5ft NOT High Speed Certified.

Certified by whom?

[plissken]

Time for an Ethernet based DAC as 328 foot or WiFi effectively puts an end to cabling distance issues for 99.9% of us. 

[asdf1000]

34 minutes ago, mansr said:

Certified by whom?

 

I don't know but I'm referring to USB cables sold with this logo:

 

USB-HighSpeed-certified-Logo.svg

[JohnSwenson]

14 hours ago, Em2016 said:

 

Hey John, did these cheap basic cables that had errors showing up, even include High Speed Certified USB cables?

 

All these tests were high speed going from a computer into a high speed DAC (actually several DACs) using a protocol analyzer to measure errors at the DAC end.

 

I didn't go out and buy any cables for this test, just using the ones I had in my USB cable drawer (about 50 cables). None of these cables actually have the high speed mark molded into the cable, so I don't know which ones were officially certified as high speed.

 

Results did vary from cable to cable, I did not mean that ALL cables showed errors at exactly 5 feet, but that one cable had a few errors at 5 feet. At 6 feet a few cables had a few few errors. At 10 feet a fair number had a few errors a one or two had a lot of errors. etc.

 

I was not trying to be the cable police so I did not try and figure out what companies these were. In a lot of cases there was no identification mark on the cable, making it impossible to tell where it came from.

 

The reason I brought this up is to let people know that errors DO occur on USB cables, and the longer the cable the more likely this is to happen. This IS important for audio since there is no error correction for audio data.

 

John S.

[asdf1000]

14 minutes ago, JohnSwenson said:

The reason I brought this up is to let people know that errors DO occur on USB cables, and the longer the cable the more likely this is to happen. This IS important for audio since there is no error correction for audio data.

 

No worries John and thanks for sharing. I was just trying to see if seeing High Speed Certified on the cable packet/box added any assurance, in terms of the testing you spoke about.

 

Obviously Supra cables do have that logo and measured really well for you (I use Supra cables too) but there are other cheaper alternatives like Startech (and others) that are High Speed Certified, i.e. that meet USB 2.0 spec.

 

https://www.startech.com/Cables/USB-2.0/USB-2.0-Cables/10-ft-High-Speed-Certified-USB-20-Cable~USB2HAB10

 

It would be interesting to see if that $7.99 10ft certified StarTech performed as well as the Supra 10ft cable.

 

Obviously not asking you test every cable on the planet though. Was just trying to see if there was a link there in your testing. Thanks again for sharing anyway.

 

 

[andrewmg]

I'm late the party, but you might try wireless streaming to a Raspberry Pi running Roon Bridge right at your DAC.  Inexpensive (~$70), easy to set up, bitperfect streaming through Roon, and no wires strung across your room.

[One and a half]

8 minutes ago, andrewmg said:

I'm late the party, but you might try wireless streaming to a Raspberry Pi running Roon Bridge right at your DAC.  Inexpensive (~$70), easy to set up, bitperfect streaming through Roon, and no wires strung across your room.

The license for Roon can be more than the cabling cost. If Roon were that bit perfect it would render the likes of A+, jriver, hqplayer redundant, but are still in use by those that prefer.  

Anyway,  pi needs PSU for the sending and receiving,  so more leakage currents to manage. Not a free lunch. 

 

[sandyk]

28 minutes ago, JohnSwenson said:

The reason I brought this up is to let people know that errors DO occur on USB cables, and the longer the cable the more likely this is to happen. This IS important for audio since there is no error correction for audio data.

 

 I have a generic 5 metre USB cable that has NO shielding whatsoever !

[asdf1000]

On 01/10/2017 at 8:07 PM, Em2016 said:

For those that don't know, the Supra USB cables are High Speed Certified for up to 15ft but I'm not asking about those.

 

I need to correct myself here. The Supra High Speed Certified USB cables are approved for up to 15m not 15ft...

 

Just picked up one of their microUSB cables for my Hugo2 and realised this on the packet.