Kii Three - my impressions and pro reviews

[atletico]

3 hours ago, input username here said:

 

I honestly don't know.  I've never used the bundled cable. 

 

Like I said, not really a great way to make buying decisions.  But, the way my speakers are set up, wire-swapping is a real pain in the ass and so, this way, I just don't have to worry (or I worry less) that I'm getting the most out of my speakers ... and I like to think that peace of mind's priceless.  (Everything, the ultraRendu, the Kii CONTROL and the THREEs are all lashed up with AQ Cinnamon; the USB and PC's are from Kubala Sosna, and I am willing to go on record to say that those certainly make a positive difference in sound quality).

 

What I can say about the AQ is that the short runs of Cinnamon, which feature a very nice braided jacket, are much more attractive than a stock CAT5/6/7, though the longer runs use a disappointing rubber jacket.  Also, the connectors are certainly of higher quality than most others, at least from a visual perspective (though not nearly as cool-looking as the Telegartner RJ-45s on AQ's higher-end Ethernet cables).  Whether or not this all adds up to better sound quality, I really cannot say--it certainly might... and I doubt very much that it sounds any worse.

I also use the AQ Cinnamon CAT 7 cables..not for the better sound but more for the look, handling the cable  and better / tighter connectors into the Kii Threes. The USB cable from Aries G2 into Kii Control are Chord Signature ARAY USB

[jaspal kallar]

8 hours ago, input username here said:

PC's are from Kubala Sosna,

 

 

Thanks for your reply.  

 

Just one more thing.  

 

Are you using Kubala Sosna PC's on each Kii speaker? If so, what model?  I've  only read positive things about the  Kubala Sosna PC's, hence why I ask.  

 

[jaspal kallar]

6 hours ago, firedog said:

Approx 2.85m. It's a fairly small room, which is part of the reason I bought the Kiis. I can get full range reproduction (20-20k), lots of dynamics, and still not overload the room. Difficult to do with a conventional system in a room like this. 

 

How far apart are the Kii's? And, how far from the wall are the Kii's?

[firedog]

10 minutes ago, jaspal kallar said:

 

How far apart are the Kii's? And, how far from the wall are the Kii's?

About  1.5 m and about 70cm from wall behind and side walls

[firedog]

Asked Kii if there is any news on the bluetooth update to the controller. This is the answer I got:

 

Quote

happy new year ;-))
Currently not, sorry. We are indeed busy with a few more features to add in a future update.

But most importantly we are working on an easy to use Software tool, which customers can download to do all firmware upgrades (Kii THREE and Control) themselves.
When this is ready it´s much easier to offer firmware updates.

 

[AMR/iFi audio]

9 hours ago, firedog said:

Asked Kii if there is any news on the bluetooth update to the controller. This is the answer I got:

 

 

 

Honest reply is always a big plus.

[phosphorein]

12 hours ago, firedog said:

Asked Kii if there is any news on the bluetooth update to the controller. This is the answer I got:

 

 

The software update tool is great news. I've been hoping that they would provide this.

[input username here]

On 1/6/2018 at 11:44 AM, jaspal kallar said:

 

 

Thanks for your reply.  

 

Just one more thing.  

 

Are you using Kubala Sosna PC's on each Kii speaker? If so, what model?  I've  only read positive things about the  Kubala Sosna PC's, hence why I ask.  

 

 

Emotion! series PCs, 2 meters/ea--and yes, I've got one on each speaker.  And if you've head good things about the KSs, I do believe you've head right.  I shop at GTT Audio (Kii dealer) and the only cables that Bill caries are KS; the whole line.  I trust Bill a lot, he's not steered me wrong yet, so I bought the KSs without comparing vs. other cables.  But I've since had a chance to compare the KSs to comparably priced (e.g. very good, but not top-of-the-line) Nordosts and Shunyatas and preferred the KSs in each case.

[input username here]

21 hours ago, firedog said:

Asked Kii if there is any news on the bluetooth update to the controller. This is the answer I got:

 

 

 

Thanks a lot for the update, FD.  I guess I'm disappointed a bit in the timing, I'd hoped that they would have rolled out updates by now.  But, in the end, I agree with AMR: honesty is a big plus.  At least they are working on something....

[firedog]

Note that they also mentioned firmware updates to the Kii itself (not the controller). Good to know updates are possible and planned.

[Kelly]

That is a bummer for them not to even have an estimate for BT activation. I am awaiting Bluetooth because my wife has recently become addicted to an Amazon echo (don't get me started about allowing a commercial eavesdropping  device into my home. The ONLY reason I allowed it into the house was because it had a camera and microphone OFF switch, which is how it stays unless we are actively talking to it. Bit who knows if it is truly off...) Anyway, ROON is now too fiddly for my wife and she wants to just tell Alexa to play stuff. The Echo dot has Bluetooth out but no other digital out. It seems a horrible joke to play horrendously compressed  music from Amazon thru a $50 transport, thru Bluetooth, then into the Kii Control and one of the finest audio systems available. But such is life...

[Kelly]

After 5 months of flawless operation, my Kii Control has stopped responding to my Apple remote. I have changed the battery and no help. I tried to imprint the remote again and the control is acting strange. If I try to scroll thru which type of remote it does not alternates between RC5 and none selected, then maybe 1 time in 10 it will show Apple. If I attempt to manually select this it just goes back to "none selected." Has anyone had any sort of erratic behavior like this? I reset the Control to Factory settings with no change. I am hoping I don't have to send it in, but I will contact my dealer tomorrow morning.

 

I should add I have tried two different Apple remotes to no avail.

[firedog]

8 hours ago, Kelly said:

After 5 months of flawless operation, my Kii Control has stopped responding to my Apple remote. I have changed the battery and no help. I tried to imprint the remote again and the control is acting strange. If I try to scroll thru which type of remote it does not alternates between RC5 and none selected, then maybe 1 time in 10 it will show Apple. If I attempt to manually select this it just goes back to "none selected." Has anyone had any sort of erratic behavior like this? I reset the Control to Factory settings with no change. I am hoping I don't have to send it in, but I will contact my dealer tomorrow morning.

 

I should add I have tried two different Apple remotes to no avail.

Write Kii - either the info address or the address for owners. They've always responded to me with 24 hours other than weekends or if they are all at a  show (there aren't many of them). 

 

Do you have an RC5 remote to try?  

[AMR/iFi audio]

19 hours ago, Kelly said:

After 5 months of flawless operation, my Kii Control has stopped responding to my Apple remote. I have changed the battery and no help. I tried to imprint the remote again and the control is acting strange. If I try to scroll thru which type of remote it does not alternates between RC5 and none selected, then maybe 1 time in 10 it will show Apple. If I attempt to manually select this it just goes back to "none selected." Has anyone had any sort of erratic behavior like this? I reset the Control to Factory settings with no change. I am hoping I don't have to send it in, but I will contact my dealer tomorrow morning.

 

I should add I have tried two different Apple remotes to no avail.

 

We'd write to Kii directly as well. It's highly likely that any tech issues are sent to them anyway and a distributor can make communication a bit longer. We might be wrong, yet this is what we'd do in your place. Good luck!

[Kelly]

I don't know that I have an RC5 remote. I did just for giggles try all of my other remotes with no success. I have written them and will see what they say. My dealer doesn't even keep demos around anymore so isn't any real help. I am hoping it is a firmware something that can be reset. If I have to send it in I will be super bummed.

[PleasantSounds]

I've had Kii Three for about a year, using them  as desktop speakers. Probably no point trying to review them here as  I'd have to say all the things already said in this thread, but I have a few things to throw into the discussion.

 

Kii Control - I have done without it for about half a year, using Lynx Hilo as a digital preamp with the AES connection to the speakers. Definitely a workable setup, but Control has some advantages. To me the most valuable are:

- Losless volume control. Without Control the digital signal has to be attenuated before it reaches speakers, losing some resolution.

- Configuration presets: mostly for switching between low latency (for movies) and exact phase (for audio) modes.

- The EQ in Control is actually quite useful, allowing to dial in the starting frequency and up to +/-6dB boost for LF and HF shelves (but I wish we could have a 5-band parametric equalizer separate for each speaker to deal with room correction).

On top of that, initially I had some configuration mismatches between my speakers, which could have been avoided by simply plugging the Control in (thankfully they have performed flawlessly ever since).  More on that here if anyone is interested.

 

Recently I have measured their in-room frequency response with REW using a calibrated mic, and while I am quite pleased with +/- 5dB across the audible range (uncorrected), there is also a small bonus: there is no low frequency roll-off down to 10 Hz!

 

Oh, and regarding those old lower quality recordings that we all love and the fear of revealing too much of their flaws: I have found that a  DAC connected to XLR inputs may go a long way towards making them enjoyable again.

[baconbrain]

I am building a set of power cables for my Kii’s and was wondering if anyone knows which terminal on the speaker power socket is phase? 

[firedog]

11 hours ago, baconbrain said:

I am building a set of power cables for my Kii’s and was wondering if anyone knows which terminal on the speaker power socket is phase? 

Can you update us about using them with the sub and Trinnov? I'm very curious.

 

 

[firedog]

When I bought the Kiis, I called Kii Audio and asked them about upsampling the feed into the Kiis and if there was an optimal samplerate to feed them. Basically the answer was no, they said Kii uses its own proprietary signal resampling which upsamples to a non-conventional rate, and does this differently for each type of incoming rate. They recommended that I  just feed the Kii the native rate of whatever I play back, even DSD.

 

I was skeptical, as I'd previously used both HQP and Roon DSP/conversion to positive effect. But so far, every time I try any outside DSP,  I find that reverting to just sending the Kii native rate sounds best - more clear, easier to hear detail, and even more apparent volume - in short, more alive. Note I am not talking about some additional room correction from outside the Kii if you find that necessary in your listening environment. 

 

I am wondering if that is just me? Anyone doing pre-processing to the Kii and finding they prefer it? If yes,  how are you altering the signal? 

[baconbrain]

6 hours ago, firedog said:

Can you update us about using them with the sub and Trinnov? I'm very curious.

 

 

Delays, delays, and more delays .... What can I say? My custom made mounts took 4 weeks longer than anticipated. An incorrect part was delivered which I need for the cabling solution and now I am in a dispute with the supplier in getting it replaced. The day after tomorrow marks the beginning of the annual three birthdays within two weeks festivities so very limited time to work on the project further ...  My grandfather always said that "Patience was a Virtue" but my virtue is about to turn into a vice. Hope to be able to come back with some first impressions mid Feb. 

 

Which email address are you utilizing when contacting Kii Audio? I have written them twice via web interface and never received a reply. 

[phosphorein]

7 hours ago, firedog said:

When I bought the Kiis, I called Kii Audio and asked them about upsampling the feed into the Kiis and if there was an optimal samplerate to feed them. Basically the answer was no, they said Kii uses its own proprietary signal resampling which upsamples to a non-conventional rate, and does this differently for each type of incoming rate. They recommended that I  just feed the Kii the native rate of whatever I play back, even DSD.

 

I was skeptical, as I'd previously used both HQP and Roon DSP/conversion to positive effect. But so far, every time I try any outside DSP,  I find that reverting to just sending the Kii native rate sounds best - more clear, easier to hear detail, and even more apparent volume - in short, more alive. Note I am not talking about some additional room correction from outside the Kii if you find that necessary in your listening environment. 

 

I am wondering if that is just me? Anyone doing pre-processing to the Kii and finding they prefer it? If yes,  how are you altering the signal? 

 

I also have not observed any enhancement by upsampling. Similarly, the requirement for DRC by Dirac is minimized with the Kii's.

 

@baconbrain I've used the web interface for e-mailing Kii. Thomas has always been very responsive. You might check your Spam folder, as his first reply to me was directed to Spam.

 

[baconbrain]

3 minutes ago, phosphorein said:

 

 

 I've used the web interface for e-mailing Kii. Thomas has always been very responsive. You might check your Spam folder, as his first reply to me was directed to Spam.

 

Thanks, I mailed directly to [email protected] and the response was almost instantaneous. 

[baconbrain]

18 hours ago, baconbrain said:

I am building a set of power cables for my Kii’s and was wondering if anyone knows which terminal on the speaker power socket is phase? 

 

Not really wanting to quote myself, but haven't figured out how to edit a post older than x hours / days.

 

For the record: The response I received from Kii Audio to the above was "the IEC connector of the PSU in the Kii THREE is fully symmetrical. It will be virtually impossible to perceive any difference."
 

[input username here]

2 hours ago, baconbrain said:

 

Not really wanting to quote myself, but haven't figured out how to edit a post older than x hours / days.

 

For the record: The response I received from Kii Audio to the above was "the IEC connector of the PSU in the Kii THREE is fully symmetrical. It will be virtually impossible to perceive any difference."
 

 

"... virtually impossible to perceive any difference" if they mean difference between PCs, that's not exactly been my experience.  I switched from the stock PCs to Kubala Sosnas and did find a notable improvement, though perhaps not quite so large as I'd expected.  But I do think good PCs cana nd do still make a difference on the THREEs.  Re: up-sampling, I received almost word-for-word the same response from Kii that firedog got.  That sort of disinclined me from doing a lot of experimenting but, in the limited amount of checking that I did do, my experience, again, mirrors his exactly: external up-sampling seemed to, if anything, reduce sound quality.  I go only native into the THREEs (via the CONTROL).  Finally, in that interaction as in others past, response from Kii has been very prompt and very forthcoming; I've never had any difficulty getting an answer from them on any audio-related topic.

[atletico]

21 hours ago, baconbrain said:

I am building a set of power cables for my Kii’s and was wondering if anyone knows which terminal on the speaker power socket is phase? 

This is perfect into the back of the Kii Three speakers FI-C15 NCF :  http://www.furutech.com/2016/11/07/13978/

I'm using this on my special made power cables for the Kii Three's.....A good PC I think can improve the overall performance...The phase issue, I'm not so sure..