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Kii Three - my impressions and pro reviews


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Apple’s small silver remote works first time .... pretty cheap on Amazon

Aurender W20 Music Server, Kii Three Active Speakers, Kii Digital Controller

Audioquest Diamond USB, Audioquest Niagara 7000 conditioner, Audioquest NRG-1000 HC mains leads

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While I admit right upfront that I've never heard the Kii Three's, I do notice that @firedog lists GIK Room Treatments in his signature. I also admit that I don't know whether or not the GIK Room Treatment existed in his listening space prior to his purchase of the Kii Three.  My question is, does room treatment(GIK or otherwise) still make for significant improvements in sound or does the built in DSP processing make said room treatment unnecessary(or, perhaps, minimize the positive contribution of room treatment)?

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On 01/04/2018 at 7:49 PM, firedog said:

If you are auditioning, you might take a look at the Dutch&Dutch 8c also.

I had a chance to listen to both and I personally preferred the D&D 8Cs.

8Cs sounded bigger with slightly bigger headroom too. Well, they are bigger than the Kiis, and I guess physical size still plays an important part whatever the technology.
 

mevdinc.com (My autobiography)
Recently sold my ATC EL 150 Actives!

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To make it abundantly clear, you will absolutely need room treatments if you want Kii Three to sound anywhere near its potential. Here is what the Kii offers by its own;

 

- Adjustable output below 40 hz to compensate for boundary reinforcement (proximity to walls).

- Adjustable output in the bass, midrange and treble area in any combination - more detailed and adjustable via Control.

- Cardioid dispersion above 100 hz which reduces (but not eliminates) output behind the speakers - and thus reduces the interference level from front wall reflections, meaning you hear more direct sound.

 

What the speakers can't do;

 

-  Room correction. The speakers doesn't measure or account for the room and its acoustics.

-  Reduce reflections from sidewalls or backwall (wall behind head) - meaning peaks and nulls in the frequency response.

-  Reduce modal build-up in the bass.

-  Reduce time domain issues that comes from asymmetrical placement. 

 

In short, Kii Three uses its DSP to correct for inherent problems in any speaker as well as to provide a controlled dispersion pattern that results in a more homogeneous sound in the sweet spot than most other speakers, making them sound better than most in normal environments, but not in any way immune to the effects of physics.

To make it clearer I can provide a measurement that demonstrate the effect of the room even with Kii Three;

 

 

 

distortion.jpg

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2 hours ago, baconbrain said:

So, the Kii Control arrived and I am struggling a bit to get a remote functioning.

 

The manual states that by selecting advanced settings -> IR remote settings -> imprint remote, the kii control will recognize the remote utilized by pressing any key on the RC handset. I have attempted to do so with 3 different RC’s and the kii control does not recognize any of them.

 

Any Ideas?

You have to push a button on your remote when you are in the pairing menu. First select te type rc5 or apple.

 

Kii Three / Kii Control / Lush 3 Uptone Iso Regen-Farad super 3 / OpticalRendu Farad super 3 / Etherregen / Roon Rock-Farad super 3

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1 hour ago, simonp said:

You have to push a button on your remote when you are in the pairing menu. First select te type rc5 or apple.

 

Tried to set to RC5 prior to pairing but the setting won’t stick. As soon as I press “esc” to save it, it reverts back to no setting ...?

 

 

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8 minutes ago, baconbrain said:

Tried to set to RC5 prior to pairing but the setting won’t stick. As soon as I press “esc” to save it, it reverts back to no setting ...?

 

 

I use a apple remote, and I needed to pair (push a button of the rc) the control has to know wich channel is used.

Kii Three / Kii Control / Lush 3 Uptone Iso Regen-Farad super 3 / OpticalRendu Farad super 3 / Etherregen / Roon Rock-Farad super 3

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2 hours ago, TheStupidOne said:

To make it abundantly clear, you will absolutely need room treatments if you want Kii Three to sound anywhere near its potential. Here is what the Kii offers by its own;

 

- Adjustable output below 40 hz to compensate for boundary reinforcement (proximity to walls).

- Adjustable output in the bass, midrange and treble area in any combination - more detailed and adjustable via Control.

- Cardioid dispersion above 100 hz which reduces (but not eliminates) output behind the speakers - and thus reduces the interference level from front wall reflections, meaning you hear more direct sound.

 

What the speakers can't do;

 

-  Room correction. The speakers doesn't measure or account for the room and its acoustics.

-  Reduce reflections from sidewalls or backwall (wall behind head) - meaning peaks and nulls in the frequency response.

-  Reduce modal build-up in the bass.

-  Reduce time domain issues that comes from asymmetrical placement. 

 

In short, Kii Three uses its DSP to correct for inherent problems in any speaker as well as to provide a controlled dispersion pattern that results in a more homogeneous sound in the sweet spot than most other speakers, making them sound better than most in normal environments, but not in any way immune to the effects of physics.

To make it clearer I can provide a measurement that demonstrate the effect of the room even with Kii Three;

 

 

 

distortion.jpg

Thanks for that thorough response and explanation.

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That would be a waste of money if the intention is better sound quality. But the standard cables are quite long.

 

If better sound quality is the aim, I would start with perfecting the placement of speakers and listening position to get the bass response and sound stage as good as possible. This takes time, and so does tweaking the settings in the Control. When you start fiddling with those settings you'll find out that cables will never change the sound in a reliable way like a quick eq of any frequency of your choosing will do.

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Has this been asked before? But is there any point whatsoever of using an external dac with the Kii’s?

 

from day one I have just fed them direct from my digital source but I am curious what an external dac might do to the sound sig ... I have no compunction to change but I am curious nonetheless

Aurender W20 Music Server, Kii Three Active Speakers, Kii Digital Controller

Audioquest Diamond USB, Audioquest Niagara 7000 conditioner, Audioquest NRG-1000 HC mains leads

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It is not a waste of money changing the Ethernet cables. However, playing with the Kii control and changing the power cables should be the starting point.

In addition, I have tried Wireworld Platinum USB cable from my McBookPro, but did not liked it. It muffled the sound in lower spectrum.

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3 hours ago, Mazza said:

Has this been asked before? But is there any point whatsoever of using an external dac with the Kii’s?

 

from day one I have just fed them direct from my digital source but I am curious what an external dac might do to the sound sig ... I have no compunction to change but I am curious nonetheless

I am not sure why you would do that. The internal DACs in the Kii are obviously very good, I'd think probably as good or better than most stand alone DACs. If you have a super high end DAC, or just one that you love the particular sound of, I guess you could try it. The Kii will convert the analog input from the DAC to digital for processing in the DSP, of course. 

If you have a DAC with a special sound (such as a tube DAC) it would be interesting to hear if the Kii output retains the special sound of the DAC.

Main listening (small home office):

Main setup: Surge protector +>Isol-8 Mini sub Axis Power Strip/Isolation>QuietPC Low Noise Server>Roon (Audiolense DRC)>Stack Audio Link II>Kii Control>Kii Three (on their own electric circuit) >GIK Room Treatments.

Secondary Path: Server with Audiolense RC>RPi4 or analog>Cayin iDAC6 MKII (tube mode) (XLR)>Kii Three .

Bedroom: SBTouch to Cambridge Soundworks Desktop Setup.
Living Room/Kitchen: Ropieee (RPi3b+ with touchscreen) + Schiit Modi3E to a pair of Morel Hogtalare. 

All absolute statements about audio are false :)

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4 hours ago, Mazza said:

Has this been asked before? But is there any point whatsoever of using an external dac with the Kii’s?

 

from day one I have just fed them direct from my digital source but I am curious what an external dac might do to the sound sig ... I have no compunction to change but I am curious nonetheless

Only if you like the sonic signature of a particular dac, because the extra conversions will obviously not improve the sound in theory. The signal goes through the internal ADC-DACs in Kii regardless.

 

I tried Hegel HD20 dac while I was waiting for Control, and that worked just fine. The sound improved by including the Hegel P20 pre-amp, noticable by a somewhat softer and more comfortable sound.

The clarity and impact improved with Control without suffering anywhere, so I'd say keep it simple.

 

1 hour ago, Gastronaut said:

It is not a waste of money changing the Ethernet cables. However, playing with the Kii control and changing the power cables should be the starting point.

In addition, I have tried Wireworld Platinum USB cable from my McBookPro, but did not liked it. It muffled the sound in lower spectrum.

Depending on the goal of the purchase, it may or may not be a waste of money.

If you spend money on Ethernet cables expecting better sound, you will have spent money to test the effect of expectation bias, and nothing else.

 

Power chords might be a different matter, but Ethernet cables either work or they don't.

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I have change my Ethernet cables to some  little bit shorter AudioQuest cables,  5 m between and 3 meter from Kii Control, not because I expected any changes in sound but just for the look and slightly better / tighter connectors on these cables .

I use a Chord Signature Array USB cable from my main source  Aries G2 to the Kii Control.

 

From my earlier post what I experienced improved my set up with the Kii Three:

"- Using better power cables with much better (Furutech) connectors also will have a positive impact on the overall soundstage.

 

- My original Kii stands are nice but the top-plate with the gasket will have a full connection  to the speakers. This causes the speaker stand to vibrate and also make unwanted resonances to my wooden floor and again had a bad impact on my turntable.

Solution: Fill the stands with sand and I have also used four extra rubber dampers on the top-plates  to lift the speakers aprox. 2-3 mm over the gasket. This also have improved the low frequency  and made the overall sound more "airy" and even a more  3D soundstage."

Auralic Aries G2 - Kii Control -  Kii Three active speakers -  OPPO BDP 95 - Clearaudio Concept turtable / AT-33 PTG II pu /Clearaudio Maestro Wood pu - Rega Fono MC riaa / Musical Surrondings riaa

Head-fi:

Beyerdynamic DT 1770 Pro - Shure SE846w/Silver Dragon - Chord Mojo

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1 hour ago, atletico said:

I have change my Ethernet cables to some  little bit shorter AudioQuest cables,  5 m between and 3 meter from Kii Control, not because I expected any changes in sound but just for the look and slightly better / tighter connectors on these cables .

I use a Chord Signature Array USB cable from my main source  Aries G2 to the Kii Control.

 

From my earlier post what I experienced improved my set up with the Kii Three:

"- Using better power cables with much better (Furutech) connectors also will have a positive impact on the overall soundstage.

 

- My original Kii stands are nice but the top-plate with the gasket will have a full connection  to the speakers. This causes the speaker stand to vibrate and also make unwanted resonances to my wooden floor and again had a bad impact on my turntable.

Solution: Fill the stands with sand and I have also used four extra rubber dampers on the top-plates  to lift the speakers aprox. 2-3 mm over the gasket. This also have improved the low frequency  and made the overall sound more "airy" and even a more  3D soundstage."

 

Thanks for the input guys, guess I'll look into upgrading the power cables first, then USB and Ethernet cables later on.

 

Anyone have any experience with Neotech cables? I'm currently looking at their "The Amazon-P Power Cord", extremely expensive unfortunately.

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3 hours ago, Gastronaut said:

I have used Neotech cables many years back. Power cables and interconnects. To me, they darken the sound. However, that was completely different  system. If you can, try them first and see will you like them.

 

I see, I'll also take a look at Triode Wire Labs.

 In regards to the usb cable, if not the WireWorld Platinum Starlight 7, what would you recommend?

 

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1 hour ago, zachchen1996 said:

 

 In regards to the usb cable, if not the WireWorld Platinum Starlight 7, what would you recommend?

 

I would recommend a Curious Cable.
From LAN cables I tried different - in order of improvement:
AQ Pearl
Ghentaudio CAT6A (ET02 Belden 1303E CAT6A Metz Ethernet(JSSG) Cable)
Melco Audiophile Ethernet Network Cable
AQ Vodka
Fidata HFLC

Coming soon from Japan AIM NA7.
I will compare Fidata Vs AIM NA7.

Pure Vinyl Club

 

Listen to short demos of the LP Records

and share your experience and observations.

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17 hours ago, Pure Vinyl Club said:

I would recommend a Curious Cable.
From LAN cables I tried different - in order of improvement:
AQ Pearl
Ghentaudio CAT6A (ET02 Belden 1303E CAT6A Metz Ethernet(JSSG) Cable)
Melco Audiophile Ethernet Network Cable
AQ Vodka
Fidata HFLC

Coming soon from Japan AIM NA7.
I will compare Fidata Vs AIM NA7.

 

3 hours ago, Gastronaut said:

+1 for Curious cable.

For LAN: Chord Signature.

 

I'll definitely look into the Curious USB cable, anyone know how it compares to the Neotech NEUB-1020 USB cable?

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On 4/17/2018 at 9:10 AM, zachchen1996 said:

 

Thanks for the input guys, guess I'll look into upgrading the power cables first, then USB and Ethernet cables later on.

 

Anyone have any experience with Neotech cables? I'm currently looking at their "The Amazon-P Power Cord", extremely expensive unfortunately.

 

Haha, like atletico, I also replaced the stock CAT cables with AudioQuest--similarly not for SQ, per se, but because I also wanted custom lengths and liked the "look" of the AQ (is it "great" or was it "foolish" minds that were supposed to think alike?).  BTW, it was with much disappointment then that I found that AQ uses a crappy rubber-ized jacket on their longer, 5M, LAN cables (which I use from speaker-to-speaker), unlike the sexy, braided cable that they use for shorter lengths (which I use from the CONTROL to the master speaker).  Anyway, since the objective was looks and convenience, I never even tried the Kii-supplied cable, so I cannot speak to sound quality differences, if any. 

 

OTOH, and to echo the experiences of others, replacing the stock AC cables with Kubala Sosna Emotion-series mains did make a significant improvement, soothing out the speakers and making their sound both more musical and "of a piece," if you get my meaning.  The difference was not night and day, but, IMHO, absolutely worthwhile.  

 

With respect to USB, however, I am a big fan and of Kubala Sosna, I love the AC cables and have heard them better cables from a number of other companies.  However, when I put my KS up against a much less expensive Blue Haven USB from Nordost, gun to my head, I could hear no difference... though, if I were to go out on a limb (no gun to my head), I'd say that the Nordost sounded a bit better (both killed the cheap, stock USBs we had on hand).  Based on feedback here, maybe I ought to have a look at the Curious... or maybe one of the newly released, higher-end Norost USBs.

 

 

Roon --> ultraRendu/Uptone LPS-1 --> Kii CONTROL --> Kii THREE active speakers (everything on Black Ravioli bases and footers)

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On 17/04/2018 at 2:10 PM, zachchen1996 said:

 

Thanks for the input guys, guess I'll look into upgrading the power cables first, then USB and Ethernet cables later on.

 

Anyone have any experience with Neotech cables? I'm currently looking at their "The Amazon-P Power Cord", extremely expensive unfortunately.

 

Had Neotech with my previous setup but didn’t seem to have same synergy with the Kii’s. I have changed to the Vertex Q system..mains block, power leads etc which have passive filtration: very pleased with results. Much lower noise floor

Aurender W20 Music Server, Kii Three Active Speakers, Kii Digital Controller

Audioquest Diamond USB, Audioquest Niagara 7000 conditioner, Audioquest NRG-1000 HC mains leads

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