Schiit EITR

[Abtr]

7 hours ago, Charente said:

@Abtr IIRC ... UpTone have stated that the type of energiser for the LPS-1 makes no difference (technically) ... atho' some say there is a difference. I use an iFi iPower as I already had one.

 

Hi Charente,

 

The various power supplies that can be used with the Uptone LPS-1 will differ in the amount of common mode AC mains noise they produce, which is audible as a relatively 'veiled' or 'dull' sound. Balanced mains power is said to audibly reduce such common mode noise by about 20dB. Nevertheless, IME it's always better *not* to add another mains powered component to the audio chain.

 

The largest single improvement of my system was the introduction of a balanced mains power iso transformer a few months ago. It isolates the audio system from regular noisy mains power and it 'rejects' common mode noise generated by the connected audio power supplies. The difference is huge. I have been listening to noise all the time!

Anyway, since the balanced power, every powered audio component I remove from the (USB) audio chain brings a further improvement. The fact that in my system the Modi Multibit sounds better with the USB-powered Intona than with the mains powered Eitr is consistent with that. I also tried the Uptone Audio iso Regen + LPS-1, powered by the 7V Meanwell SMPS and a 9V Ifi iPower. Both combinations significantly degrade SQ in my system.

 

The explanation is that before balanced power, the above mentioned devices solved  some common mode noise problems and introduced some of their own. After balanced power, common mode noise is minimized such that all these devices do is produce noise by their power supplies..  

[Charente]

@Abtr  Thank-you for your detailed experiences ... I can appreciate what you're getting at ... although I'm not an EE to fully understand the technical reasons behind this. I'm a mere software developer that loves music ! So, even though I have an LPS-1 powered microRendu feeding a 'clean' signal to the EITR it's still not clean enough ... potentially ! I guess, such a transformer connected to the electrical output I use for my audio gear would isolate (and get rid of) the effects of a UPS connected to a nearby outlet (for my main computer) and the relays on my lighting system elsewhere in the house. These occasionally manifest themselves as relay clicks on my Gungnir, ever since I installed the EITR. It would be good to get rid of this. Am I thinking along the right lines ? 

[Abtr]

1 hour ago, Charente said:

... Am I thinking along the right lines ? 

 

Yes, I think you get it!  

[Charente]

39 minutes ago, Abtr said:

 

Yes, I think you get it!  

 

Looking at what's available in Europe ... something like this ?

 

https://airlinktransformers.com/category/standard-balanced-power-supply

[Abtr]

18 minutes ago, Charente said:

Looking at what's available in Europe ... something like this ?

 

https://airlinktransformers.com/category/standard-balanced-power-supply

 

Yes, that basically looks excellent. I know Airlink has special audio-grade (low capacitance) isolation transformers, not sure if this is one of them..

[George Hincapie]

How would that be implemented in practice?

[Abtr]

10 hours ago, George Hincapie said:

How would that be implemented in practice?

 

Well, basically you plug the transformer in a 230V wall socket and connect all your audio gear to its output terminal(s). It's best to use a single simple power strip for lowest impedance. Don't use a power conditioner after (or before) the transformer. Such filters tend to increase impedance which increases noise from AC leakage currents. Note that I didn't connect my computer to the iso transformer output. It's unnecessary and computers are very noisy devices that you best keep separated from your dedicated balanced audio power, and in my case it would defeat the galvanic USB isolation by the Intona.

[George Hincapie]

That's interesting. It sounds really similar then to this one I was thinking about: https://www.nvahifi.co.uk/balanced-mains-unit/

[Charente]

Yes, This looks like it could be an effective solution. Would I still plug in the iFi iPower (for the LPS-1) and the EITR WallWart into the same strip ? 

 

I've been looking up some possible transformers ... some of the high quality Audio optimised units are eye-wateringly expensive (e.g. Russ Andrews) !!

[Abtr]

1 hour ago, George Hincapie said:

That's interesting. It sounds really similar then to this one I was thinking about: https://www.nvahifi.co.uk/balanced-mains-unit/

That one looks OK. I can't find the wattage though. I would recommend at least ~1000VA output power.

[Abtr]

1 hour ago, Charente said:

Yes, This looks like it could be an effective solution. Would I still plug in the iFi iPower (for the LPS-1) and the EITR WallWart into the same strip ? 

 

I've been looking up some possible transformers ... some of the high quality Audio optimised units are eye-wateringly expensive (e.g. Russ Andrews) !!

 

Well, you can experiment with the iPower and Eitr wallwarts. IME balanced power will always improve SQ, but I ended up with removing the USB decrappifiers from the chain altogether. They are not needed anymore, except for the Intona.

 

Equitech also makes some very expensive (120V) balanced power units. According to them: "The precision degree to which these transformers are balanced provides for the least amount of reactive phase shift possible which results in potentially a much broader bandwidth of common mode noise attenuation." (http://www.equitech.com/productsold/isolation-transformers/) Maybe it's worth the extra money, I wouldn't know..

[Charente]

@Abtr Ok, it's worth a shot, if only to reduce the effects of my mains supply that I'm experiencing. The Airlink transformers might meet that issue.... and any additional SQ benefits would be a bonus! I guess I can always try and plug in the WallWart and iPower into an outlet outside the transformer.

 

Thank-you for your suggestions.

[George Hincapie]

Can I ask, for those of you using this device, what your source is?

 

TIA.

[Lebouwsky]

11 hours ago, Abtr said:

 

Well, basically you plug the transformer in a 230V wall socket and connect all your audio gear to its output terminal(s). It's best to use a single simple power strip for lowest impedance. Don't use a power conditioner after (or before) the transformer. Such filters tend to increase impedance which increases noise from AC leakage currents. Note that I didn't connect my computer to the iso transformer output. It's unnecessary and computers are very noisy devices that you best keep separated from your dedicated balanced audio power, and in my case it would defeat the galvanic USB isolation by the Intona.

Do you mean you plug your strip in one outlet en plug all the audio devices in that strip?

 

Does the transformer humm?

 

How do you calculate your VA?

[Charente]

30 minutes ago, George Hincapie said:

Can I ask, for those of you using this device, what your source is?

 

TIA.

 Sorry, which device are you referring to ?

[George Hincapie]

The Eitr, but it applies equally to the Sonore products too. My new server arrived yesterday and I have had nothing but problems with it so I am thinking of returning and looking for another option. Just looking for inspiration I guess...

[classfolkphile]

The Eitr I ordered arrived yesterday and I replaced my (stock) SU-1 with it today. Sounds promising: more definition and resolution but a bit drier and less relaxed. Hoping the latter two qualities will resolve as the unit breaks in. Will follow up.

[Charente]

@George Hincapie Sounds like you're going through some trauma ! Some thoughts ... The microRendu is an expensive way forward but in my own experience it is worth a shot (I think you get a trial period thru VortexBox in the UK... ....but check ....I'm guessing you're in the UK ?). I'm satisfied with the EITR because I wasn't entirely happy with the direct USB input on the Gungnir MultiBit. IMO, S/PDIF is absolutely fine. I use the mR because it's just a small low powered computer, optimised for audio and relatively easy to use, IME. Now I can use Audirvana 3.1 to play thru it across Ethernet and I really appreciate the sound quality.  I won't repeat my own impressions again here, so perhaps look back at those a few pages before.

[Charente]

@classfolkphile I've had my EITR for about 3+ weeks now and I feel it does benefit from some settling down. Sounds very good now in my setup.

[classfolkphile]

8 minutes ago, Charente said:

@classfolkphile I've had my EITR for about 3+ weeks now and I feel it does benefit from some settling down. Sounds very good now in my setup.

Thanks: good news.

[Abtr]

1 hour ago, Lebouwsky said:

Do you mean you plug your strip in one outlet en plug all the audio devices in that strip?

 

Yes, that would be the  best (lowest impedance) configuration. This is explained by John Swenson in this thread:

 

1 hour ago, Lebouwsky said:

Does the transformer humm?

 

My transformer doesn't hum. Larger transformers are more prone to hum. If a transformer hums, there usually is a DC-offset problem in the AC mains power feeding it which leads to saturation of the transformer core. You can use a simple DC-blocker to mitigate this.
 

1 hour ago, Lebouwsky said:

How do you calculate your VA?

 

Well, I think the amount of power that you need is the amount that you realistically will use to reproduce sound in your listening space.  In my case that would be at most a 500 Watt(VA) peak. Double that and you have your transformer VA.

[Lebouwsky]

8 hours ago, Abtr said:

 

Yes, that would be the  best (lowest impedance) configuration. This is explained by John Swenson in this thread:

 

 

My transformer doesn't hum. Larger transformers are more prone to hum. If a transformer hums, there usually is a DC-offset problem in the AC mains power feeding it which leads to saturation of the transformer core. You can use a simple DC-blocker to mitigate this.
 

 

Well, I think the amount of power that you need is the amount that you realistically will use to reproduce sound in your listening space.  In my case that would be at most a 500 Watt(VA) peak. Double that and you have your transformer VA.

Thank you for your detaild answer, much appriciated 

[Charente]

@OldBigEars I copied the comment you made about the EITR on the Audirvana 3.1 thread (I hope you don't mind) 

 

@OldBigEars said "... Now that I'm posting,  I've got to let you all know that my Eitr replaced a W4S Recovery in my system.  As mentioned, I was initially using a Curious USB  - together with a  BJC 1 meter  Coax.  Right out of the box, before I'd even sat down I could hear that the sound quality was astonishing.  Quite an incredible jump in detail and musicality.  I'll write more, when I've reached a conclusion about USB cables and A+ 3.1. ...."

 

I agree, IME the jump was noticeable right out of the box ... just wait till it's settled down a bit

[OldBigEars]

Thanks for copying across my initial comments about the Eitr.  I was kind of building up to making my version of a 'review' but thought I'd post a quick hint at how delighted I am with the Eitr.  So here's my feedback after one week....

 

Quite honestly, I can't remember an audio product upgrade that's had such a tangible positive effect on my system's SQ as the Eitr,  compared with the W4S Recovery previously in the USB chain.  And, up 'till last week, I was very happy with the Recovery (in tandem with a full loom Curious USB set up).  With the Eitr / BJC Coax, I'm continuously enjoying a whole new level of insight and detail in music I thought I've known for decades.  And another thing....when I ordered the Eitr I was in a pretty cynical state of mind about audio wonder products, having just experienced a major disappointment with Teo's  Game Changer IC's that just didn't work well in my system.  So I was far from sure what to expect from the Eitr.  I'm happy to say that it's more than lived up to my hopes. 

 

The only disappointment so far has been the performance of the PYST USB cable that arrived on Friday. The idea was that this would replace my 20X more expensive Curious cable, with no degradation in performance. How great would that be!  It sounded too good to be true - and based on 3 days listening, it is.  I'm sticking with the PYST for a while, hoping it 'breaks in'...or I get accustomed to it....or something.  But it seems to be cancelling out a good chunk of the joy I was experiencing with the Eitr being fed by the Curious.  Of course, this must all be in my imagination.  Schiit people, and many others, have assured us that USB's make no difference - especially when you have an Eitr or Gen5 upgraded Schiit DAC. So ignore my comments if you love your Monoprice / Amazon / Schiit USB.

 

 

[Charente]

@OldBigEars Thank-you for your comments. After a few tests that I have done, I would agree that the EITR can be affected (positively or negatively) by what one might place in front of it. My own tests, which I repeated a few times, revealed that a microRendu and the UpTone USPCB both make small but worthwhile SQ improvements ... most noticeable to me is that these additions incrementally produce a clearer soundstage depth ... instruments at the back, like cymbals, shimmer or splash more intricately and ambient echoes decay with satisfying realism.