More Disruptive Schiit (Vidar)

[Hoang Nam]

4 minutes ago, mazuly said:

 

Good idea but how would I know if I need more power?

 

I have been running these speakers with the Rotel amp and have never needed more power since I can play them very loud and still no clipping or distortion (any louder and I wiould gert kicked out of my apartment )

 

I am looking for best sound quality and was thinking mono amps will porobbaly give me more separation and less crosstalk, XLR connection which would be less noise and of course more power.

 

Any comments?

 

Thanks

Maziar

And in my opinion, in terms of power, it's not about the loudness, it's about the soundstage, the mid, the low, and of course the high. And also the details and so on...

[Speed Racer]

6 minutes ago, mazuly said:

Good idea but how would I know if I need more power?

 

I have been running these speakers with the Rotel amp and have never needed more power since I can play them very loud and still no clipping or distortion (any louder and I wiould gert kicked out of my apartment )

 

I am looking for best sound quality and was thinking mono amps will porobbaly give me more separation and less crosstalk, XLR connection which would be less noise and of course more power.

 

Any comments?

 

 

Your speakers call for up to 120 watts into 8 ohms. Vidar, in stereo configuration, has 100 watts per channel into 8 ohms. That should be plenty. Also, Vidar is dual mono back to the transformer so crosstalk is not an issue nor is differing power draw on the channels. I would certainly start with one Vidar. If you had two, you would have 400 watts per channel which is significant overkill.

[fas42]

32 minutes ago, mazuly said:

 

Good idea but how would I know if I need more power?

 

I have been running these speakers with the Rotel amp and have never needed more power since I can play them very loud and still no clipping or distortion (any louder and I wiould gert kicked out of my apartment )

 

I am looking for best sound quality and was thinking mono amps will porobbaly give me more separation and less crosstalk, XLR connection which would be less noise and of course more power.

 

Any comments?

 

Thanks

Maziar

 

The word I would use is "effortless" - most systems display a marked inability to go loud cleanly, irrespectively of what the labels on the amplifier profess - usually the treble starts to disintegrate, and the punch and sparkle goes bye bye. When one comes across an amplifier that is totally capable in this department it stands out dramatically, to me at least - the impression given is that there are no limits, that there is always headroom beyond the volume one is using. And this corresponds to the best sound quality - the system conveys the impact and intensity that listening up close and personal with live music making delivers.

[Hoang Nam]

I used to use Cambridge CXA80 amp which produces 80W per channel to drive my Spendor A6. Great sound (is what I feel), very detail, but somehow I didn't feel the punch as much as I wanted (not talking about the loudness, any amps can produce the loudness once you raise the volume). So I sold the CXA80 and ordered Vidar (hopefully it will give me the punch as I wanted, also the details and the soundstage, I need something larger in terms of soudstage). Currently, I am temporarily using an old amp, Sansui AU 20000, which can produce 170W per channel, but I can't hear the details, soundstage is too narrow, the bass is loud, but noise, the mid and the high also can't compare to CXA80

[mazuly]

Exact

27 minutes ago, fas42 said:

 

The word I would use is "effortless" - most systems display a marked inability to go loud cleanly, irrespectively of what the labels on the amplifier profess - usually the treble starts to disintegrate, and the punch and sparkle goes bye bye. When one comes across an amplifier that is totally capable in this department it stands out dramatically, to me at least - the impression given is that there are no limits, that there is always headroom beyond the volume one is using. And this corresponds to the best sound quality - the system conveys the impact and intensity that listening up close and personal with live music making delivers.

Exactly.  

Never had any strain from the Rotel to this date.  Very effortless no matter how loud I play them.  I guess I need to try other amps side by side to see what are the differences.

 

The only issues I have with Vidar are

1) no 12 volts triger

2) no balanced input for stereo

 

But hey, nothing is perfect.   They are on my list now.  Waiting to see more reviews on this amp before pulling the plug.

 

Thanks,

Maziar

[schiit]

Hey all,

 

Okay, so I'm back in the office, and I spent some time with Chris’ problematic Vidars. And yep, there’s something up with them, something that’s triggered by the cable he sent us. Apparently the cable’s combination of capacitance and inductance sets the amps off, even though Vidar has (a) a full Zobel network, and (b) is tested into punishing reactive loads.

 

What’s weird is that we can’t reproduce the problem on any of the Vidars we have currently in stock.

 

Because of this, I dug into Chris’ amps some more:

• Tested the Zobels to make sure they were connected and not fried—they were fine
• Replaced the Zobels with current production parts—no change
• Changed the compensation capacitors to current production parts—and that fixed it

Now, this makes no sense. Changing a like-for-like part shouldn’t make any difference. Unfortunately, I didn’t keep the comp caps I took out of Chris’ amps to measure (and you can’t measure them in circuit, they’re tiny, low-value 0805 SMD parts.)

 

So what happened? I’m not completely sure. Perhaps some amps got the wrong comp caps in them, even though they are surface-mount and robotically placed, and you’d think that would be very unlikely. The parts are unmarked, and most small SMD caps look the same, so they can’t be identified visually.

 

Because of this, we’re adding a new stability test to the Vidar production process, using an RLC network that mimics the cable Chris sent us. This is in addition to the standard process which includes automated instrumented test, load testing, 1 day burn-in, and a listening test. We’ll also notify Vidar owners in the same batch as Chris’ amps that if they are experiencing operational oddities, we’ll swap them out at our cost.

 

But, in any case, if you have Vidars that are behaving oddly, contact us and we’ll get you taken care of. Sorry for the trouble!

 

(Oh, and Chris, we'll get the cables back to you today.)

 

All the best,

 

Jason Stoddard

Co-Founder

Schiit Audio

[Speed Racer]

@schiit

 

Is there any way to test for this at home? I am not having any issues now, but who knows what speaker cables I might use down the road.

[schiit]

10 minutes ago, Speed Racer said:

@schiit

 

Is there any way to test for this at home? I am not having any issues now, but who knows what speaker cables I might use down the road.

 

If you're having trouble, contact us anytime and we'll get the amps taken care of. 

[rlow]

Thanks for the update Jason, very strange indeed.

 

Don't forget folks, there's still a 5 year warranty in place in case you find issues down the road.

[Ralf11]

Thanks Jason!

[Zorlac]

Thanks for the detective work Jason! You guys rock!

 

My replacements should be here Saturday.

[arcman]

Very impressive. Plus, they initiated another quality check at the production process.

[esldude]

6 hours ago, schiit said:

Hey all,

 

Okay, so I'm back in the office, and I spent some time with Chris’ problematic Vidars. And yep, there’s something up with them, something that’s triggered by the cable he sent us. Apparently the cable’s combination of capacitance and inductance sets the amps off, even though Vidar has (a) a full Zobel network, and (b) is tested into punishing reactive loads.

 

What’s weird is that we can’t reproduce the problem on any of the Vidars we have currently in stock.

 

Because of this, I dug into Chris’ amps some more:

• Tested the Zobels to make sure they were connected and not fried—they were fine
• Replaced the Zobels with current production parts—no change
• Changed the compensation capacitors to current production parts—and that fixed it

Now, this makes no sense. Changing a like-for-like part shouldn’t make any difference. Unfortunately, I didn’t keep the comp caps I took out of Chris’ amps to measure (and you can’t measure them in circuit, they’re tiny, low-value 0805 SMD parts.)

 

So what happened? I’m not completely sure. Perhaps some amps got the wrong comp caps in them, even though they are surface-mount and robotically placed, and you’d think that would be very unlikely. The parts are unmarked, and most small SMD caps look the same, so they can’t be identified visually.

 

Because of this, we’re adding a new stability test to the Vidar production process, using an RLC network that mimics the cable Chris sent us. This is in addition to the standard process which includes automated instrumented test, load testing, 1 day burn-in, and a listening test. We’ll also notify Vidar owners in the same batch as Chris’ amps that if they are experiencing operational oddities, we’ll swap them out at our cost.

 

But, in any case, if you have Vidars that are behaving oddly, contact us and we’ll get you taken care of. Sorry for the trouble!

 

(Oh, and Chris, we'll get the cables back to you today.)

 

All the best,

 

Jason Stoddard

Co-Founder

Schiit Audio

Kudos. 

 

This is how a company should handle problems for their customers when they crop up.  So many would be in denial and obsfuscation instead of handling the problem. 

[TheDotProd]

7 hours ago, schiit said:

We’ll also notify Vidar owners in the same batch as Chris’ amps that if they are experiencing operational oddities, we’ll swap them out at our cost.

 

But, in any case, if you have Vidars that are behaving oddly, contact us and we’ll get you taken care of. Sorry for the trouble!

 

Thats amazing customer service Jason!

 

I have very recently been tracking the Schiit Vidar to pair with my KEF LS50s based on a bad experience with NAD and the D3020. Initially it was for the claimed performance, but now I'm impressed with your customer service too!

 

A few years ago I bought a NAD D3020 partially due to its advertised and documented 80Hz high pass when using the sub out. Based on this feature I went to upgrade my system two weeks ago with a subwoofer, only to find post subwoofer  purchase that the 80Hz high pass feature didn't work/didn't exist.

 

I emailed NAD about the problem, and they replied quite factually that it was a mistake and documents were since corrected at some time during the last 3 years.

 

I emailed again regards how disappointed I was in that had I known I likely would have upgraded the amp before buying a subwoofer, to which they replied I should go buy a top of the line NAD amp that actually does have a bass management feature.

 

Schiit unlike NAD just chose to pro-actively hunt down the affected consumers and make them aware of the situation. In both cases it is likely going to be very expensive to resolve, which is why NAD tried to sweep their issue under the carpet. But I don't think I'll ever buy a NAD again, and very likely I'll be picking up a Vidar once the reviews start turning in.

 

I have one beef though Jason regards the Schiit lineup -> Switching between analog and digital sources. 

In the Schiit quest for purity, the usability of switching sources amongs the DACs and PreAmps, and Headphone Amps might get a little tricky for loved ones in the family. 

Explaining to wife and kids to switch digital sources on the DAC, line in on the PreAmp etc might be a little confusing. Is there a ... integrated DAC, PreAmp, and Headphone Amp that can switch between digital and analog sources simply on the way?

[RichardSF]

54 minutes ago, TheDotProd said:

Is there a ... integrated DAC, PreAmp, and Headphone Amp that can switch between digital and analog sources simply on the way?

 

If your digital source is USB, then the Jotunheim fits your needs.

[Hoang Nam]

On 8/25/2017 at 4:04 AM, schiit said:

Hey all,

 

Okay, so I'm back in the office, and I spent some time with Chris’ problematic Vidars. And yep, there’s something up with them, something that’s triggered by the cable he sent us. Apparently the cable’s combination of capacitance and inductance sets the amps off, even though Vidar has (a) a full Zobel network, and (b) is tested into punishing reactive loads.

 

What’s weird is that we can’t reproduce the problem on any of the Vidars we have currently in stock.

 

Because of this, I dug into Chris’ amps some more:

• Tested the Zobels to make sure they were connected and not fried—they were fine
• Replaced the Zobels with current production parts—no change
• Changed the compensation capacitors to current production parts—and that fixed it

Now, this makes no sense. Changing a like-for-like part shouldn’t make any difference. Unfortunately, I didn’t keep the comp caps I took out of Chris’ amps to measure (and you can’t measure them in circuit, they’re tiny, low-value 0805 SMD parts.)

 

So what happened? I’m not completely sure. Perhaps some amps got the wrong comp caps in them, even though they are surface-mount and robotically placed, and you’d think that would be very unlikely. The parts are unmarked, and most small SMD caps look the same, so they can’t be identified visually.

 

Because of this, we’re adding a new stability test to the Vidar production process, using an RLC network that mimics the cable Chris sent us. This is in addition to the standard process which includes automated instrumented test, load testing, 1 day burn-in, and a listening test. We’ll also notify Vidar owners in the same batch as Chris’ amps that if they are experiencing operational oddities, we’ll swap them out at our cost.

 

But, in any case, if you have Vidars that are behaving oddly, contact us and we’ll get you taken care of. Sorry for the trouble!

 

(Oh, and Chris, we'll get the cables back to you today.)

 

All the best,

 

Jason Stoddard

Co-Founder

Schiit Audio

Hi Jason,

I am from Vietnam and I have already ordered Vidar through the dealer here. It's been almost a month but still there isn't any fixed date for the Vidar to arrive. I asked the dealer and they said because they order many Vidars from you, so it could take longer than retail order. Is this true?

Thanks.

[Zorlac]

Just wanted to update everyone. Got my replacement Vidars. I can now use my original speaker cables and no audible buzz from my speakers at listening position....

..., but if I have my ears to the cones (KEF Q950), then I still hear a faint buzz.

 

Again, this is not a ground loop (I tried a ground lift) and not coming from Freya (I tried unplugging the XLR on the back of each Vidar). I use passive mode on the Freya too, so I do not think this has anything to do with tubes.

 

The other strange thing that happened the other night was that I had the Vidars on warming up with no audio signal playing. All of a sudden I heard a buzz coming from my room (not the speakers). It sounded like a distant alarm. I eventually tracked it down to one of the Vidar amps! I put my hand on it and it got quieter. I then power cycled it a few times and it finally went away. Was this what people refer to as coil wine?

 

At this point I am trying to keep an open mind. I talked to a friend that is really into gear as well and he said he has had several amps that caused a buzz in the speaker cones when you put your ear up to them. I guess I just thought it should be dead silent like the Rag. I do admit that the Vidars are WAY more powerful. Maybe I just need bigger speakers capable of more wattage?? ;P

 

The random buzz coming from the Vidar itself was a little worrisome.

I feel like a pest emailing Schiit all the time (yes, I did email Nick again).

[Johnseye]

1 hour ago, Zorlac said:

Just wanted to update everyone. Got my replacement Vidars. I can now use my original speaker cables and no audible buzz from my speakers at listening position....

..., but if I have my ears to the cones (KEF Q950), then I still hear a faint buzz.

 

Again, this is not a ground loop (I tried a ground lift) and not coming from Freya (I tried unplugging the XLR on the back of each Vidar). I use passive mode on the Freya too, so I do not think this has anything to do with tubes.

 

The other strange thing that happened the other night was that I had the Vidars on warming up with no audio signal playing. All of a sudden I heard a buzz coming from my room (not the speakers). It sounded like a distant alarm. I eventually tracked it down to one of the Vidar amps! I put my hand on it and it got quieter. I then power cycled it a few times and it finally went away. Was this what people refer to as coil wine?

 

At this point I am trying to keep an open mind. I talked to a friend that is really into gear as well and he said he has had several amps that caused a buzz in the speaker cones when you put your ear up to them. I guess I just thought it should be dead silent like the Rag. I do admit that the Vidars are WAY more powerful. Maybe I just need bigger speakers capable of more wattage?? ;P

 

The random buzz coming from the Vidar itself was a little worrisome.

I feel like a pest emailing Schiit all the time (yes, I did email Nick again).

 

Do you get a response to your emails? I never did. I called and left a message as well. No response. 

[Zorlac]

No response yet...are you having issues with Vidar?

[Johnseye]

4 minutes ago, Zorlac said:

No response yet...are you having issues with Vidar?

 

I was just trying to get some information.  Based on what I've read and no communication, I'm not sure this is a company I'd like to do business with.

[Zorlac]

They are awesome...I am sure they are just extremely busy. They have always been good to me.

[Bob Stern]

7 hours ago, Zorlac said:

I heard a buzz coming from my room (not the speakers). It sounded like a distant alarm. I eventually tracked it down to one of the Vidar amps! I put my hand on it and it got quieter.

 

If the amp has toroidal power transformers, the buzz can be caused by DC offset in your mains power.  Since only one of the amps is buzzing, that suggests that its toroidal transformer is not as well assembled.

[Speed Racer]

36 minutes ago, Bob Stern said:

 

If the amp has toroidal power transformers, the buzz can be caused by DC offset in your mains power.  Since only one of the amps is buzzing, that suggests that its toroidal transformer is not as well assembled.

 

Vidar does not use a toroidal transformer.

[dom]

13 hours ago, Zorlac said:

Just wanted to update everyone. Got my replacement Vidars. I can now use my original speaker cables and no audible buzz from my speakers at listening position....

..., but if I have my ears to the cones (KEF Q950), then I still hear a faint buzz.

 

Again, this is not a ground loop (I tried a ground lift) and not coming from Freya (I tried unplugging the XLR on the back of each Vidar). I use passive mode on the Freya too, so I do not think this has anything to do with tubes.

 

I've been having similar problems with my single Vidar and clearly audible buzz from my Tannoy Revolution 6s. I got a DC blocker which did help quiet down the transformer hum but had no effect on the buzz from the speakers. And as in Zorlac's case this definitely was not the fault of the preamp (Freya) or any other component - my Vidar kept on buzzing on its own with no preamp / source connected. I tried different speaker cables and even borrowed a power conditioner (which probably costs more than a pair of Vidars) but this changed nothing. 

 

I contacted Nick and Laura who told me to return my Vidar for inspection / repair. We'll see what they come back with. 

 

In the meantime I need to keep using my old home cinema receiver as an amp - this let me appreciate how much better Vidar sounds :-)

 

I'll post back when I find out more.

[Filipe]

Hi everyone.

I have just joined the community, but I have been following this thread for a while. I'm looking for a meaty amp to go with my Elac's UF5. My current amp, with lower wattage and with limited current delivery is not up to the task, sound is thin, sometimes overly bright...

The Vidar seems a pretty likely partner for the Elac's, so I have been watching this thread frequently, but it seems to be dead for quite a while... anyone with any relevant news concerning the Vidar's reliability???

Thanks in advance!