pkane2001 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 hour ago, Cornan said: If you did well yes! -Paul DeltaWave, DISTORT, Earful, PKHarmonic, new: Multitone Analyzer Link to comment
Popular Post wgscott Posted July 11, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 hour ago, Cornan said: Sorry, now you're a bit stupid again. Perhaps assuming you might be interested in learning physics from the courses made publicly available by MIT was rather stupid of me. But why would you want a stupid person to teach you? After all, you learned internet trolling really well all by yourself. The Computer Audiophile and sarvsa 2 Link to comment
Popular Post wgscott Posted July 11, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 11, 2017 So you mean that you know how to measure how grounding boxes works? Great, give it to me! ? Or you could just do an experiment: Attach a "hot" wire to your grounding box device with an amp meter, and measure the current. What do you get? (A more mean-spirited version would have you connect the hot wire, and then touch the metal in the grounding box while you stand barefoot on the ground. If you live, the grounding box works. If not, then your faith in alternative facts was misplaced.) The Computer Audiophile, sarvsa, esldude and 1 other 4 Link to comment
Popular Post The Computer Audiophile Posted July 11, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 11, 2017 2 hours ago, Cornan said: Sorry, now you're a bit stupid again. You have some very smart and talented people trying to help you and giving their own valuable time. More comments like this and you'll be asking for help on another site. sarvsa, gridlock74 and mansr 3 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
elcorso Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Cornan, I downloaded installation instructions but I can't see if there is a 'drain' wire to ground (earth) ? Roch Link to comment
jabbr Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Everything sounds better if I plug all my equipment here: I try not to go blind Custom room treatments for headphone users. Link to comment
Popular Post Ralf11 Posted July 11, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 11, 2017 this thread reminds me of when Ben Franklin handed a kite string to one of graduate students, and said "Here kid, hold this" sarvsa and esldude 2 Link to comment
fas42 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 At least there has has been a bit more supplied to the subject - the info about tourmaline. Personally, I've never tried any such ideas, but the concept of self-capacitance may figure in this, and/or static issues. The latter is a biggy, and I've spent much time working out approaches to mitigate the audible influence of this - don't ask me why it should have significant impact, it just does! If I don't tackle this, then I don't get the quality I'm after - so, for me it's a necessary. So, the "grounding boxes" may be about neutralising static build up, in some fashion - it's as good a theory as any floating around ... Link to comment
Ralf11 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 actually, the mode of action is different: Ancient magicians relied upon Tourmaline to protect them from earth demons as they cast their spells. We call it grounding, but the Brits call it earthing. https://www.crystalvaults.com/crystal-encyclopedia/black-tourmaline Link to comment
Popular Post esldude Posted July 11, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 11, 2017 First saw this video referenced over at http://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/still-think-grounding-removes-noise.1683/ It is worth the 5 minutes of your time I think. Teresa and Cornan 2 And always keep in mind: Cognitive biases, like seeing optical illusions are a sign of a normally functioning brain. We all have them, it’s nothing to be ashamed about, but it is something that affects our objective evaluation of reality. Link to comment
marce Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 9 hours ago, Cornan said: To make it simple I will decide your questions in 1:1 and 2:1 etc. 1:1 No, not what they are suppose to do either 1:2 How do you know? Explain. 1:3 How do you know? Explain. 1:4 How do you know? Explain 1:5 How do you know? Explain 2:1 How do you know? Explain 2:2 Nothing wrong with a common ground AFAIK. 2:3 Then please explain to me as a guy that do understandfor these things! Firstly this as a general overview. http://web.mst.edu/~jfan/slides/Archambeault2.pdf 1.1 If they worked them the designer would understand how. 1.2 Henry Ott Electromagnetic compatibility engineering. 1.3 Any basic analogue text on filters. 1.4 Ralf Morrison The fields of electronic. Any work any Maxwell and Heaviside 1.5 Link Above. 2.1 http://www.hottconsultants.com/pdf_files/dipoles-1.pdf 2.2 Depends... Nothing simple about controlling return currents. 2.3 I and many other do, we do it daily in our jobs at PCB level, component level and system level, its called signal integrity/EMC engineering. Cornan 1 Link to comment
semente Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 8 hours ago, Speed Racer said: Grounding boxes and $1000 power cables.....where is Rob when you need him? Rob Hood? "Science draws the wave, poetry fills it with water" Teixeira de Pascoaes HQPlayer Desktop / Mac mini → Intona 7054 → RME ADI-2 DAC FS (DSD256) Link to comment
marce Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 9 hours ago, Cornan said: Wow esldude! I am impressed that you are actually trying to figure this out! I am not against the antenna clue at all. It is just so much negative impressions buried in that word. Tourmaline stones have really amazing properties if you start to learn about them. They are used in many different areas for their antistatic properties. Read about it. If you put pressure on tourmaline stones they'll release a lot of negatively charged ions. Think about if for a moment. Ground is negatively charged. It is right here where the puzzle starts. Why does negatively charged ions affect grounding? No the ground is NOT negatively charged. These grounding boxes only exist (like a few other far out components) in the esoteric audio world, no other area of electronics, why is that one wonders. How many studios use these. How many high precision, low noise measurement set ups use them... That has to speak volumes about their effectiveness, they are only sold into a market where data sheets and measurements or even a basic explanation on how they work is not required, just some good marketing and a few believers... Most other references to tourmaline stones is of this nature... https://www.healingcrystals.com/Crystals_for_Electromagnetic_Pollution_from_Computers_Articles_592.html Sorry for being rather abrupt, but these sort of devices and claims detract from the already abundant real problems in audio reproduction and neither forward the quest for fidelity or give the hobby a good name. Link to comment
semente Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 8 hours ago, Cornan said: So, anyone got an idea why grounding boxes might work? "Science draws the wave, poetry fills it with water" Teixeira de Pascoaes HQPlayer Desktop / Mac mini → Intona 7054 → RME ADI-2 DAC FS (DSD256) Link to comment
marce Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 8 hours ago, Cornan said: I have got atleast +30 years of experience in this hobby. I am very confident in hearing what is noise and what is not. In terms of objective and subjective I will always prefer the subjective part. Objective is boring! From starting piano lessons at 4 on to listening to the radio under my bed clothes and onwards I have several decades behind me, one I learner NOT to trust my ears my system has improved fidelity wise and I can concentrate on listening to the music, not the system. Link to comment
marce Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 8 hours ago, wgscott said: The same way prayer works to cure cancer. Didn't work for me had to resort to major surgery, maybe I should have knelt on a grounding box. Link to comment
semente Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 10 hours ago, Cornan said: I would'nt qualify that as a hard evidence against grounding boxes. Bias controlled testing! Common! Just tell me how you think they work. Not by accusing believers of being half deaf. ? Belief systems are the stories we tell ourselves to define our personal sense of Reality. in WHAT ARE BELIEF SYSTEMS? J.L. Usó-Doménech and J. Nescolarde-Selva Department of Applied Mathematics. University of Alicante. Alicante. Spain "Science draws the wave, poetry fills it with water" Teixeira de Pascoaes HQPlayer Desktop / Mac mini → Intona 7054 → RME ADI-2 DAC FS (DSD256) Link to comment
Cornan Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 6 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said: You have some very smart and talented people trying to help you and giving their own valuable time. More comments like this and you'll be asking for help on another site. Sorry Chris! I was just referring to the OP. Maybe it came out wrong? Quote Above all keep it civil and without any personal attacks or stupid comments please! ? I would love a discussion on this matter that could dig deeper in the subject rather than being a center for ironic comments. Link to comment
Cornan Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 9 hours ago, esldude said: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charge_conservation wgscott normally gets paid to teach college students. You'll need to find a high school teacher to start with high school level physics. You keep saying teach me, but you have to be willing to do your part as a student. I haven't gone thru these lessons here. They claim to be equivalent to two terms of college level physics. If you would like to learn for yourself give it a try, and it you find yourself lost, then maybe back up a step to something more basic. http://fearofphysics.com/Videos/ I honestly do want to know how they work, but do not expect me to read the laws of physics. I am only interested if someone have a clue how they work. Not if someone do not have a clue. Teresa 1 Link to comment
4est Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 10 hours ago, Ralf11 said: your OP made personal attacks if not a stupid comment If you call that a personal attack, you must not get out much as many would consider being "extremely curious" as a compliment. Forrest: Win10 i9 9900KS/GTX1060 HQPlayer4>Win10 NAA DSD>Pavel's DSC2.6>Bent Audio TAP> Parasound JC1>"Naked" Quad ESL63/Tannoy PS350B subs<100Hz Link to comment
Cornan Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 5 hours ago, fas42 said: At least there has has been a bit more supplied to the subject - the info about tourmaline. Personally, I've never tried any such ideas, but the concept of self-capacitance may figure in this, and/or static issues. The latter is a biggy, and I've spent much time working out approaches to mitigate the audible influence of this - don't ask me why it should have significant impact, it just does! If I don't tackle this, then I don't get the quality I'm after - so, for me it's a necessary. So, the "grounding boxes" may be about neutralising static build up, in some fashion - it's as good a theory as any floating around ... Tourmaline stones, copper and silver are the main ingredients in the grounding boxes. As far as I see it there must be a reason for it to enhance SQ. They are usually very effective in chassi groundI and signal ground. I am all for the possibilities that it could deal with anti-statics for example. Link to comment
mansr Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 2 minutes ago, Cornan said: I honestly do want to know how they work, Your honesty doesn't seem to include the possibility that they don't work. 2 minutes ago, Cornan said: but do not expect me to read the laws of physics. Too bad. Physics is where you'll find the answer. 2 minutes ago, Cornan said: I am only interested if someone have a clue how they work. Not if someone do not have a clue. Then why do you keep dismissing everybody who tries to give you an explanation? sarvsa 1 Link to comment
Cornan Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 2 hours ago, marce said: No the ground is NOT negatively charged. These grounding boxes only exist (like a few other far out components) in the esoteric audio world, no other area of electronics, why is that one wonders. How many studios use these. How many high precision, low noise measurement set ups use them... That has to speak volumes about their effectiveness, they are only sold into a market where data sheets and measurements or even a basic explanation on how they work is not required, just some good marketing and a few believers... Most other references to tourmaline stones is of this nature... https://www.healingcrystals.com/Crystals_for_Electromagnetic_Pollution_from_Computers_Articles_592.html Sorry for being rather abrupt, but these sort of devices and claims detract from the already abundant real problems in audio reproduction and neither forward the quest for fidelity or give the hobby a good name. I know ground is a 0v reference and that ground is not negatively charged. I am trying to understand why the work? I know they do. They might not do it as a ground reference in a proper sence, but they seem to make those spots better. Could this be due to a reduction of anti-statics do you think? Link to comment
Popular Post Cornan Posted July 11, 2017 Author Popular Post Share Posted July 11, 2017 8 minutes ago, mansr said: Your honesty doesn't seem to include the possibility that they don't work. Too bad. Physics is where you'll find the answer. Then why do you keep dismissing everybody who tries to give you an explanation? I think the OP clearly indicates that I want to know why they WORK. Not why the do not work. It would be interesting to know theories that explains a plausible explanation, even if that explanation does'nt include grounding in a proper sense. Wladimir and Teresa 2 Link to comment
fas42 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 1 hour ago, marce said: Didn't work for me had to resort to major surgery, maybe I should have knelt on a grounding box. Marce, I thought you had gone through a medical unpleasantness, and I see that it was a wee unpleasant, pun iintended . Hope life has restabilised fully, and you're in full stride, in everything that matters! Myself, slowing down even more than before - I'm doing something now I never thought I would do, going to bed early in the evening sometimes; the energy reserves just run out, and it's time to call it quits for the day. Ahhh, well, the price of getting older ... Cheers, Link to comment
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