How DOES the grounding boxes work?

[Cornan]

I think it's time to see if we can unite in a subject that stir up a lot of feelings here at CA. It is like a new USB cable discussion. So, how about the grounding boxes? Why do they work? How could they possibly improve SQ? Considering the tons of great reviews they must work in some way, right? 

 

This thread belongs to both believers and disbelievers of grounding boxes. Let's get this hot subject sorted out ones and for all!  ?

Anything from scientific materials to personal ideas are most welcomed. I am a personal believer in that scientist is just a person with an extremely curious mind.

 

Above all keep it civil and without any personal attacks or "stupid" comments please! ?

[esldude]

They don't work. 

 

Next!

[esldude]

They do work.  Tremendously well.  For audiophiles looking for emotional support they are doing something to clean up their grounding and improve their system.  The money spent validates the emotional improvements.

[Cornan]

To start this thread off I can tell a little something about myself. I have used Entreq Cupper Minimus for almost five years and have experimented with it a lot. Before I even bought one I constructed numerous DIY grounding boxes using battery, bentonite clay, tourmalines, rose quartz, clear quartz, Himalayan salt etc etc. The closest to "the real deal" I got was my battery grounder embedded in tourmaline stones that I still use today. Still, it was'nt even close to the Entreq Minimus in performance. How come? I read about stones, grounding and grounding boxes for ages but still did'nt come close enough. What did I miss?

[Cornan]

4 minutes ago, esldude said:

They do work.  Tremendously well.  For audiophiles looking for emotional support they are doing something to clean up their grounding and improve their system.  The money spent validates the emotional improvements.

 

Hmm, you mean they work or not? Any clues why they work or not? ?

[plissken]

Based on the:

 

Instrumented data that I have seen

The lack of any human, bias controlled testing

 

They don't appear to work other than sighted. Ground means ground.

[pkane2001]

They don't work in the following ways:

 

1. They don't provide a safety ground

2. They don't extract and store noise from the ground plane

3. They don't filter noise

4. They don't attract stray currents or voltages (where "they find peace"! )

5. They don't work "like a bit of mother Earth"

 

What they might be actually doing:

 

1. Acting as an antenna receiving (or even broadcasting) signal

2. They might form a common ground across devices if more than one device is connected to the same grounding box/connector (resulting in more cross-talk but possibly fewer ground loops)

3. Their 'technical' explanations sound plausible to folks that don't understand how ground actually works, but sounds like gobbledygook to anyone with basic a Physics education

 

[Cornan]

4 minutes ago, plissken said:

Based on the:

 

Instrumented data that I have seen

The lack of any human, bias controlled testing

 

They don't appear to work other than sighted. Ground means ground.

 

I would'nt qualify that as a hard evidence against grounding boxes. Bias controlled testing! Common! 

Just tell me how you think they work. Not by accusing believers of being half deaf. ?

[esldude]

28 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

Hmm, you mean they work or not? Any clues why they work or not? ?

I mean exactly what I said.

Electrically to improve how well your gear functions, they don't work.  They will slightly degrade it.

 

As an experiential thing for audiophiles who believe in them, and don't do listening unsighted, or don't measure how things function, they work fabulously well. They also are an excellent product business-wise. 

[Cornan]

2 minutes ago, esldude said:

I mean exactly what I said.

Electrically to improve how well your gear functions, they don't work.  They will slightly degrade it.

 

As an experiential thing for audiophiles who believe in them, and don't do listening unsighted, they work fabulously well. They also are an excellent product business-wise. 

 

Quick question. Have you tried them IRL?

[plissken]

4 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

I would'nt qualify that as a hard evidence against grounding boxes. Bias controlled testing! Common! 

Just tell me how you think they work. Not by accusing believers of being half deaf. ?

 

Based on the testing they can act as an antenna and introduce noise into a system.

[esldude]

Just now, Cornan said:

 

Quick question. Have you tried them IRL?

Nope. 

 

Didn't drink salamander hormones and chop off a finger to see if it would grow back either.  I guess in some people's eyes I am unqualified to speak to the effectiveness of salamander hormones or grounding boxes.

[mozes]

They do work!

I invited two friends yesterday and I didn't tell them about my new Entreq box. They have never heard of it and they know nothing about it.

They asked me how come my system sounds much better than before so they wanted to know if I have a new amp or dac. I told them I just added a grounding box from Entreq.

I was a skeptic myself but before you try it in your system, pls don't make any conclusions!

[Cornan]

5 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

They don't work in the following ways:

 

1. They don't provide a safety ground

2. They don't extract and store noise from the ground plane

3. They don't filter noise

4. They don't attract stray currents or voltages (where "they find peace"! )

5. They don't work "like a bit of mother Earth"

 

What they might be actually doing:

 

1. Acting as an antenna receiving (or even broadcasting) signal

2. They might form a common ground across devices if more than one device is connected to the same grounding box/connector (resulting in more cross-talk but possibly fewer ground loops)

3. Their 'technical' explanations sound plausible to folks that don't understand how ground actually works, but sounds like gobbledygook to anyone with basic a Physics education

 

 

To make it simple I will decide your questions in 1:1 and 2:1 etc.

 

1:1 No, not what they are suppose to do either

1:2 How do you know? Explain.

1:3 How do you know? Explain.

1:4 How do you know? Explain

1:5 How do you know? Explain

 

2:1 How do you know? Explain

2:2 Nothing wrong with a common ground AFAIK.

2:3 Then please explain to me as a guy that do understandfor these things!

[Cornan]

6 minutes ago, plissken said:

 

Based on the testing they can act as an antenna and introduce noise into a system.

 

Which testings? Please post the links.

[plissken]

Bottom line is maybe you prefer the added noise:

 

http://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/entreq-signal-grounding-preliminary-measurements.476/page-3#post-11656

[Cornan]

9 minutes ago, esldude said:

Nope. 

 

Didn't drink salamander hormones and chop off a finger to see if it would grow back either.  I guess in some people's eyes I am unqualified to speak to the effectiveness of salamander hormones or grounding boxes.

 

Why am I not surprised?  

[Cornan]

3 minutes ago, plissken said:

Bottom line is maybe you prefer the added noise:

 

http://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/entreq-signal-grounding-preliminary-measurements.476/page-3#post-11656

 

What makes you think I beleive in that post compared to me own ears? Have you tried any grounding boxes yourself?

[AJ Soundfield]

They work on a very simple, well know principle

 

[plissken]

1 minute ago, Cornan said:

 

What makes you think I beleive in that post compared to me own ears? Have you tried any grounding boxes yourself?

 

Again, I said you MAY PREFER THE ADDED NOISE.

[Kal Rubinson]

23 minutes ago, Cornan said:

Just tell me how you think they work. Not by accusing believers of being half deaf. ?

They work by having believers.

[Cornan]

Just now, AJ Soundfield said:

They work on a very simple, well know principle

 

AJ Soundfiield. I am not surpriced to find you here!  ?

[Cornan]

1 minute ago, plissken said:

 

Again, I said you MAY PREFER THE ADDED NOISE.

But I may NOT! ?

[Cornan]

1 minute ago, Kal Rubinson said:

They work by having believers.

You could be one as well. If you ever try one! ?

[AJ Soundfield]

5 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

What makes you think I beleive in that post compared to me own ears?

I had no idea there were so many advocates for blind listening here. Bravo sir.

Yes, own ears is the way to test this.

No peeking, etc, etc