Sonore ultraRendu v1.3

[Matias]

On 21/08/2017 at 7:20 PM, vortecjr said:

What do you mean by native streaming?

 

Sorry, I never got to answer.

I mean an Tidal and/or Spotify app running directly on the ultraRendu, controlled by cell phone (app or local website). Too much for the ultraRendu's hardware to host?

[esmit]

19 minutes ago, Matias said:

 

Sorry, I never got to answer.

I mean an Tidal and/or Spotify app running directly on the ultraRendu, controlled by cell phone (app or local website). Too much for the ultraRendu's hardware to host?

Did you miss the Spotify Connect app?

 

I would like a Tidal Connect app too, but I don't think it exists on any platform. Squeezeplay or Roon can do that.

[vortecjr]

15 hours ago, Matias said:

 

Sorry, I never got to answer.

I mean an Tidal and/or Spotify app running directly on the ultraRendu, controlled by cell phone (app or local website). Too much for the ultraRendu's hardware to host?

You can use the Spotify Connect app or you can try this:

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/27851-sonicorbiter-tidalqobuz-setup-with-openhome/

 

[fbczar]

I am interested in an UltraRendu, but I am confused as to how it would effect my system. I would appreciate any input. I use an iMac with Audirvana and a NAS, The iMac is connected to an Emotiva XMC-1's asynchronous USB port. Would the UltraRendu likely improve the sound of my system or does the asynchronous input to the DAC, which re-clocks the data stream, do the same thing as the UltraRendu?

[R1200CL]

3 hours ago, fbczar said:

I am interested in an UltraRendu, but I am confused as to how it would effect my system. I would appreciate any input. I use an iMac with Audirvana and a NAS, The iMac is connected to an Emotiva XMC-1's asynchronous USB port. Would the UltraRendu likely improve the sound of my system or does the asynchronous input to the DAC, which re-clocks the data stream, do the same thing as the UltraRendu?

 

I’m confused too ?

 

The UltraRendu is network based. Your setup is USB from a Mac to the Emotiva. 

If you like to continue that route, a Iso Regen with an LPS-1 may be the best upgrade for you. 

 

If if you are willing to take a further step up, of cause the UltraRendu is fantastic. 

 

And according too this https://audirvana.com/?page_id=4289 it should be just fine together.  So I guess the Audivarna then also can acts as a network player. 

 

But ten you may end up with using Roon ?

If your NAS is a Qnap or Synology, you can install Roon on it. As well as your MAC. 

 

But then again, maybe you Emotiva is or will become Roon ready with RAAT, and then you may start thinking again. 

[fbczar]

32 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

 

I’m confused too ?

 

The UltraRendu is network based. Your setup is USB from a Mac to the Emotiva. 

If you like to continue that route, a Iso Regen with an LPS-1 may be the best upgrade for you. 

 

If if you are willing to take a further step up, of cause the UltraRendu is fantastic. 

 

And according too this https://audirvana.com/?page_id=4289 it should be just fine together.  So I guess the Audivarna then also can acts as a network player. 

 

But ten you may end up with using Roon ?

If your NAS is a Qnap or Synology, you can install Roon on it. As well as your MAC. 

 

But then again, maybe you Emotiva is or will become Roon ready with RAAT, and then you may start thinking again. 

Thanks for your reply. If I were using an UltraRendu I would use it as a network device. My main concern was the difference in sound quality, if any, in a situation where the connection to a DAC was asynchronous. I cannot understand how the UltraRendu can make a difference if an asynchronous DAC is involved. Perhaps someone with a device like Oppo's Sonica DAC could tell me how the UltraRendu affected the sound of the Sonica DAC.

[HookEm]

4 hours ago, fbczar said:

I am interested in an UltraRendu, but I am confused as to how it would effect my system. I would appreciate any input. I use an iMac with Audirvana and a NAS, The iMac is connected to an Emotiva XMC-1's asynchronous USB port. Would the UltraRendu likely improve the sound of my system or does the asynchronous input to the DAC, which re-clocks the data stream, do the same thing as the UltraRendu?

Using UltraRendu as a Network-To-USB bridge should be a significant improvement over using your Mac for that purpose.

- The Mac is a general-purpose computer, and the Ultra is a purpose-specific computer (from both a HW &  SW perspective) dedicated and tuned to the streaming task.

- The USB port on the Ultra should be a lot quieter than the USB port on the Mac

 

But even after integrating UltraRendu, I suppose your Mac may still play a role in your system, but connected to the network rather than driving your DAC directly via USB (letting the Ultra drive the DAC instead).

Good luck.

[d_elm]

3 minutes ago, fbczar said:

Thanks for your reply. If I were using an UltraRendu I would use it as a network device. My main concern was the difference in sound quality, if any, in a situation where the connection to a DAC was asynchronous. I cannot understand how the UltraRendu can make a difference if an asynchronous DAC is involved. Perhaps someone with a device like Oppo's Sonica DAC could tell me how the UltraRendu affected the sound of the Sonica DAC.

The sound quality of the DAC is partially dependant on electrical noise delivered to the DAC over the input interface.  Asynchronous delivery just means the DAC provides the USB clock.  This is a good step but upstream noise still must be minimized, according to budget and products available.  The ultraRendu is a step in the right direction for better source into the DAC.

[rlow]

15 minutes ago, fbczar said:

Thanks for your reply. If I were using an UltraRendu I would use it as a network device. My main concern was the difference in sound quality, if any, in a situation where the connection to a DAC was asynchronous. I cannot understand how the UltraRendu can make a difference if an asynchronous DAC is involved. Perhaps someone with a device like Oppo's Sonica DAC could tell me how the UltraRendu affected the sound of the Sonica DAC.

 

Similar to the previous poster, here is a description of the microRendu from Sonore's website which might be useful:

 

What makes the microRendu different from a typical computer music server is that it's a purpose built audiophile device. The problem with computer music servers is that they all rely on mass produced motherboards designed for general purpose computing and are built to the lowest possible price point. The microRendu solves this problem by removing the consumer grade computer peripherals and optimizing power supplies where necessary. The microRendu has been specifically built for processing USB audio perfectly. You can also combine the microRendu with an audiophile grade linear power supply to achieve the lowest possible noise floor.

 

 

The ultraRendu is essentially an improved version of this with a slightly different form factor.

[fbczar]

28 minutes ago, rlow said:

 

Similar to the previous poster, here is a description of the microRendu from Sonore's website which might be useful:

 

What makes the microRendu different from a typical computer music server is that it's a purpose built audiophile device. The problem with computer music servers is that they all rely on mass produced motherboards designed for general purpose computing and are built to the lowest possible price point. The microRendu solves this problem by removing the consumer grade computer peripherals and optimizing power supplies where necessary. The microRendu has been specifically built for processing USB audio perfectly. You can also combine the microRendu with an audiophile grade linear power supply to achieve the lowest possible noise floor.

 

 

The ultraRendu is essentially an improved version of this with a slightly different form factor.

But does an asynchronous circuit have anything to do with whether or not a microRendu or UltrRendu will work with a given DAC? Does an Asynchronous USB circuit work to eliminate USB problems?

[fbczar]

34 minutes ago, d_elm said:

The sound quality of the DAC is partially dependant on electrical noise delivered to the DAC over the input interface.  Asynchronous delivery just means the DAC provides the USB clock.  This is a good step but upstream noise still must be minimized, according to budget and products available.  The ultraRendu is a step in the right direction for better source into the DAC.

Ok, So while the UltraRendu re-clocks using the Regen it also eliminates noise that the asynchronous circuit would not address. I assume the improvement varies by computer based on how noisy a given computer's USB bus is?

[d_elm]

7 minutes ago, fbczar said:

Ok, So while the UltraRendu re-clocks using the Regen it also eliminates noise that the asynchronous circuit would not address. I assume the improvement varies by computer based on how noisy a given computer's USB bus is?

Read the first post at the following URL and follow the links at the end of it.  You are correct USB sources will vary but also if a DAC uses 5V from the source is important.  This specification is usually not stated by the manufacturer so need to ask.  If a DAC uses 5V from the USB source this can be good or bad.  Bad if the source is

not the best and good when you have managed to optimize the source.

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/30376-a-novel-way-to-massively-improve-the-sq-of-computer-audio-streaming/

[savjam]

On 10/22/2017 at 10:42 PM, savjam said:

Just pulled the trigger on the Ultrarendu.   I was going to update the MicroRendu to 1.4 Status and get the IsoRegen which would have put me out about about $550.   But after reading the posts here, where people don’t hear any significant difference with the IsoRegen and Ultrarendu and that the Ultrarendu is clearly better than the MicroRendu with IsoRegen, I decided to forgo that plan and just get the Ultrarendu.   It is a simpler setup.   I am anxious to hear the differences as I think the MicroRendu is pretty awesome sounding already.  

Just hooked up the uR.  Took only a few minutes.   It sounds like the microRendu only slightly clearer but with much better bass definition. this is with less than 15 minutes playtime. I will report back when it has run in a bit.

[vortecjr]

5 hours ago, d_elm said:

Read the first post at the following URL and follow the links at the end of it.  You are correct USB sources will vary but also if a DAC uses 5V from the source is important.  This specification is usually not stated by the manufacturer so need to ask.  If a DAC uses 5V from the USB source this can be good or bad.  Bad if the source is

not the best and good when you have managed to optimize the source.

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/30376-a-novel-way-to-massively-improve-the-sq-of-computer-audio-streaming/

I'm not sure why the 5V would even a concern with an ultraRendu:) If one uses a clean power the ultraRendu will output very clean 5V to your USB device. Even you use a so so power supply there is still a very good regulator in line so we have your back either way.  

[d_elm]

22 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

I'm not sure why the 5V would even a concern with an ultraRendu:) If one uses a clean power the ultraRendu will output very clean 5V to your USB device. Even you use a so so power supply there is still a very good regulator in line so we have your back either way.  

I did not say 5V from ultraRendu is a concern.  I said quality of 5V to a DAC that uses 5V from the interface is a concern.

[vortecjr]

I know I was just driving the point home:)

[HookEm]

Question for UltraRendu users: Are most of you using Roon? If so:

- Are you running Roon Server on the NAS or on a separate system?
- Does the attached diagram represent a typical Roon setup that integrates UltraRendu?

 

Note: The diagram does not include:
- Power supplies
- Fibre Media Converters  (FMC's) on the network side of UltraRendu

- USB Regenerator on the DAC side of UltraRendu

[firedog]

I'm running Roon server on a powerful PC that is functioning as a NAS (not set up like a NAS, but like a minimal Windows installation). 

Both of your scenarios should work; I personally would connect the computer with my library and Roon via ethernet.Will just work more reliably and faster than wireless.

[HookEm]

39 minutes ago, firedog said:

Both of your scenarios should work; I personally would connect the computer with my library and Roon via ethernet.Will just work more reliably and faster than wireless.

 

Agreed. My intent in the diagram was to show a wireless connection for the iOS device running "Roon Remote", and maybe also for a laptop, which for convenience may use Wi-Fi (although I do not plan on using a laptop.).

The goal of my questions is to get a feel for typical "known-to-work-well" configurations that are using UltraRendu (Again, are you using Roon? If so, how are you configuring your system for optimal performance?)

Thanks.

[Cyrus]

@HookEm  I'm running Option 2. Small Green Computer sonicTransporter AP as Roon Core. Both my Android Phone (Pixel XL) and my Win 10 Laptop serve as remotes (both wireless). The ultraRendu has been replaced by the Signature Rendu SE (in the same configuration).

 

I've also run Option 1 before I had the ultraRendu (i.e. a microRendu) with good results.

[unbalanced output]

I have option 3: server runs in a dedicated computer (NUC) and media stays in the NAS. I found that to be cheaper than buying a more powerful NAS to run the server, but if I would do it again maybe I would build a diy NAS PC. 

[flummoxe]

Opinion sought please.

 

I've recently (Thursday) added a Innuos Zenith SE (running Roon) to my set which replaces a iMac, and thus far it sounds excellent, a significant upgrade.

 

I'm initially connecting the Zenith to my Chord Hugo TT DAC from its dedicated Ethernet port via a microRendu 1.4 + LPS-1 which is how it was with the iMac. However, I've read that the USB output is superior. This I tried briefly with a Chord USB SilverPlus cable and I could hear little or no difference. Is the cable not good enough or perhaps the Zenith needs more miles on the clock?

 

So the question is where to go from here as it's difficult if not impossible to try all the options.

 

Possible options I have in mind -

 

Ethernet

1. upgrade to an ultraRendu
2. as above + ISO REGEN
3. microRendu + ISO REGEN

USB

1. upgrade the cable to something like a Curious USB
2. as above + ISO REGEN

Any thoughts or experience would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

 

Paul

 

[unbalanced output]

Hi Paul, it's not clear to me which USB you are referring to - directly from the Zenith to the DAC or? The easy way to check if the USB cable would make a difference would be to hook in a generic cable and see how it behaves. Before considering spending money on an expensive cable, I'd recommend you to take a look at the highly acclaimed USPCB. 

[Dougster]

On 26/10/2017 at 7:07 PM, fbczar said:

Ok, So while the UltraRendu re-clocks using the Regen it also eliminates noise that the asynchronous circuit would not address. I assume the improvement varies by computer based on how noisy a given computer's USB bus is?

I am very pleased with the results from adding UltraRendu to a MacBook - Moon 750D DAC (asynchronous USB board). Excellent and more natural sonics. I use it with Peng and Logitech media server and iPad control and can play Qobuz or Tidal and local Synology NAS as I wish. Nice interface and no MacBook needed in the room. IOS11 allows easy switching between apps for surfing music review sites, or related artists, or my Gramophone app for inspiration...... or just listen!

For MQA, this requires Tidal desktop and I use Audirvana 3.1 for this on MacBook running in another room in case it’s fan gets busy!! - and control via iPad and  Audirvana remote app.

As noted, every setup will differ, due to noise from player / renderer and how the DAC responds to noise reduction. I found much greater sonic benefit from the UltraR than from adding ISO regen. Additionally, the ISO was two months late (my first one having been rejected by the UK importer as faulty) and the second one failing after two weeks. The Ultra has worked flawlessly produces beautiful sounds with less listener fatigue and a choice of operating modes to suit the user. I like the above options, as Roon is not for me personally, but many on here can advise on that option if you go for the UR. 

I am certainly very pleased with mine ....and it takes up virtually no rack space?

[flummoxe]

2 hours ago, unbalanced output said:

Hi Paul, it's not clear to me which USB you are referring to - directly from the Zenith to the DAC or? The easy way to check if the USB cable would make a difference would be to hook in a generic cable and see how it behaves. Before considering spending money on an expensive cable, I'd recommend you to take a look at the highly acclaimed USPCB. 

 

Hi,

 

Yes USB from the Zenith to the TT.

 

I use a USPCB with my microRendu already and would with an OSO REGEN if I go down that route. But obviously I need a USB cable from the Zenith to the DAC or ISO REGEN. Approx 60cm needed.