Audirvana Plus 3 (official thread)

[odelay]

I am trying to use Qobuz for the first time.

 

I can browse and add qobuz music to my playlist. However, no streamed music has been able to load/play - I get an error message (cannot load file - or similar?).

 

I can stream qobuz from its iPad app. Local music still plays fine in A+3.

 

I imagine there is something basic I'm missing. Suggestions appreciated.

 

Merci Damien. I've long felt A+ improvements to be about the best bang for my audio buck. Kudos.

 

 

Mac mini -> Regen -> Burson CV2+ -> HD560

[Kafy]

I apparently am obscure when I am trying very hard to be plain.

 

 

Whether you upsample or not, whether you are listening to MQA or not - in every situation in which you are listening to A+ version 3 - you are hearing the new, improved playback engine.

 

:-)

 

Thanks a lot for the precisions.

 

I don't think you are obscure. English is not my natural language and I certainly don't understand as well as the words tell.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile

[Jud]

Jud, Would an MQA capable DAC offer any advantages over a DAC that was not MQA capable in use with Audirvana 3.0 playing MQA encoded files in Tidal? In my system MQA encoded Tidal files sound considerably better with Audirvana 3.0, than they did with Audirvana 2.6.6, but they are not on the same level as 24/96 or 24/192 downloads.

 

I don't know the answer to that. I have never listened to an "MQA capable DAC." My listening experience with MQA files and A+ so far has been very similar to yours.

[fbczar]

I don't know the answer to that. I have never listened to an "MQA capable DAC." My listening experience with MQA files and A+ so far has been very similar to yours.

 

I have followed your posts for quite a while relative to iZotope settings in Audirvana. I use an Emotiva XMC-1 processor with a DSD 1796 Burr Brown DAC. Would you have any general "starting point" iZotope settings for a DAC like mine relative to Audirvana 3.0? I think there are many users that could benefit from a jumping off point for their specific DAC.

[astrostar59]

Jud, Would an MQA capable DAC offer any advantages over a DAC that was not MQA capable in use with Audirvana 3.0 playing MQA encoded files in Tidal? In my system MQA encoded Tidal files sound considerably better with Audirvana 3.0, than they did with Audirvana 2.6.6, but they are not on the same level as 24/96 or 24/192 downloads.

Are you feeding the files to your DAC as non upsampled?

 

I have an NOS DAC that can only handle 96K so I set the max rate at 96K and not up sampling. The MQA playing shows (top right) either 24/96K or 24/192K and the progress bar (top left) text shows 24/96K as my DAC input. My understanding from this is I am playing bit-perfect on 96K files, and down sampled from 192K to 96K on the 192 MQA original.

 

Oddly Beyoncé Lemonade in the Master listing is showing up as MQA but is 24/44.1 same resolution as the standard Redbook version in Tidal list.

 

So far, the sound quality is great. Like for like albums, the midrange jumps out at you, quite alarmingly sometimes, takes you by surprise. The bass a super deep and textured, and female vocals and piano is not as cold and thin, less digital in fact. How much of this is the MQA or simply, in the case of my R-2R DAC, playing a bigger res file of 96K as opposed to 44.1 I am not sure at the moment.

 

I can't compare much high res downloads as I haven't bought that many. I will go off and buy some later for a A/B comparison. Obviously the fact the MQA process may have managed to get their hands on a better master, especially in older analogue recordings muddies the water somewhat. Regardless, it is all good IMO and hey, it's FREE (if you have a Tidal HIFi account).

[astrostar59]

Audirvana V3 operation niggles

 

So back to the operations of the new version. It is mainly all good news, but there are some issues on my Mac Mini 2015 8 Gig RAM, 500 meg SSD and ester Firewire drive running Mavericks.

 

1. The album view and track listing DOESN'T show the sample rate. Not an issue for many, but for me, I need to set the sample rate in my Rednet AOIP to either 96K or 44.1 before I play the album. Thus what I am doing is deciding to stick on Masters for a session, and set the sample rate on my Rednet to 96K which also sets Audio Midi at 96K as well. I then have to revert back to 44.1 setting to play Redbook in normal Tidal files or locally off my Ex drive.

 

2. I can view Masters in the drop down tab above album view, but I can't search say 'Eagles' in Masters, it searches the whole of Tidal and shows everything MQA or not. This make site search in Masters useless, and scrolling down is the only way to find an album you want to play.

 

3. The albums in masters are not in alphabetic order. Guess they are in release date? Makes scrolling for albums even more hassle.

 

4. The beach ball does spin for a couple of minutes if you have an album playing and click another album (without stopping the one playing). It looks like a software delay not network to me.

 

Can Damien clarify if, in my case, I set (in AV V3 General settings) max sample rate at 96K, and don't enable up sampling, the software will feed the file to my DAC at 96K if the MQA file is 96K, and if the file is 192K it will software downsample to 96K to then feed my DAC.

 

Also, what is it doing if with the above setting, I play an MQA which shows (top right) 24/44.1 but I have set max sample rate to 96K.

 

Audio Midi is also showing 96K as I have set that in Rednet which sets the Rednet virtual sound card for my DAC at 96K.

 

Anyway, the V3 is a great move forward on an already superb player software. Maybe the search bug I am talking about is really Tidal's fault? They do IMO need to add a blue square next to the MQA albums, and set up an advanced search to enable searching an artist inside the Masters listing. Maybe it is planned but as there is 'only' 500 albums right now, might happen when it is 5K+ albums?

[pabe12]

I am trying to use Qobuz for the first time.

 

I can browse and add qobuz music to my playlist. However, no streamed music has been able to load/play - I get an error message (cannot load file - or similar?).

 

I can stream qobuz from its iPad app. Local music still plays fine in A+3.

 

I imagine there is something basic I'm missing. Suggestions appreciated.

 

Merci Damien. I've long felt A+ improvements to be about the best bang for my audio buck. Kudos.

 

 

Mac mini -> Regen -> Burson CV2+ -> HD560

 

I had a similar problem with Tidal, a while back. Logging out (of Tidal; in your case Quboz) and back in again fixed it for me - have you tried that?

[astrostar59]

I have followed your posts for quite a while relative to iZotope settings in Audirvana. I use an Emotiva XMC-1 processor with a DSD 1796 Burr Brown DAC. Would you have any general "starting point" iZotope settings for a DAC like mine relative to Audirvana 3.0? I think there are many users that could benefit from a jumping off point for their specific DAC.

Have you tried feeding it as is? It will probably be dependant on your DAC, but try feeding it 96K or 192K as is, then let your DAC 'do it's thing'. The fact the MQA is in mosts cases a higher res file than Redbook should negate the logic in up sampling in the first instance.

 

Best do some tests and see how it sounds.

 

Upsampling in A+ then your DAC again (probably) oversampling may not be the best way?

 

I am on an old school R-2R DAC with NOS so not the 'expert' in this, but when I had the Naim I used to feed it at resident rate either 44/1 or 96K (if a HD download).

[astrostar59]

I had a similar problem with Tidal, a while back. Logging out (of Tidal; in your case Quboz) and back in again fixed it for me - have you tried that?

 

Also try a reboot on your Mac, and double check your network connection to Quboz in A+ streaming settings.

 

Ensure you are not running the old A+ at the same time as A+3 or the Quboz desktop app (if there is one).

 

Hope this helps.

[The Computer Audiophile]

@damien78 - I have a question about the MQA options.

 

When no MQA device is detected, A+ v3 give me the option to select (see screenshot). I'm guessing these options tell A+ how to handle MQA files for output.

 

1. Not MQA Device

2. MQA Renderer Device

3. MQA Decoder Device

 

 

 

 

I'm guessing if I select option 1, A+ handles software decoding of the core and option 3 just send MQA out bit perfect to the hardware decoder. But, what happens if I select option 2? Doesn't that also handle software decoding of the core just like option 1?

 

 

 

[fheller]

What is the difference beteween renderer and decoder device?

 

Thank you

[fbczar]

Have you tried feeding it as is? It will probably be dependant on your DAC, but try feeding it 96K or 192K as is, then let your DAC 'do it's thing'. The fact the MQA is in mosts cases a higher res file than Redbook should negate the logic in up sampling in the first instance.

 

Best do some tests and see how it sounds.

 

Upsampling in A+ then your DAC again (probably) oversampling may not be the best way?

 

I am on an old school R-2R DAC with NOS so not the 'expert' in this, but when I had the Naim I used to feed it at resident rate either 44/1 or 96K (if a HD download).

 

I am generally pleased with power of 2 upsampling. What I am interested in is the other settings in iZotope. In the forums I have seem a lot of folks are using NOS DAC's, but I am not. I seems to me the best starting point with Audirvana relates to the DAC. It would be nice users of various DAC's could chime in.

[The Computer Audiophile]

What is the difference beteween renderer and decoder device?

 

Thank you

 

Here is a little background - Computer Audiophile - MQA (for civilians)

[odelay]

Thanks pabe12 an Astrostar59. I had tried rebooting before. Just logging in and out didn't seeem to help either.

 

Qobuz individual tracks are greyed out. Error message says they cannot be streamed. Rebooted modem earlier. Can stream fun in qobuz app...

 

Appreciate the help all the same [emoji120]

 

 

Mac mini -> Regen -> Burson CV2+ -> HD560

[quark]

Hi,anybody got a MQA DAC?my Mytek Brooklyn DAC isn't recognised in Audirvana 3 settings for MQA and DSD.

 

I set native DSD to "DSD over PCM standard 1.1" and the DAC displays DSD fine.

 

But there isn't any difference which MQA setting I select in settings, the top right constantly displays "FLAC MQA 24/96 kHz" with blue light on for each setting, decoder, renderer or not MQA device.

But top left displays DAC 32/48kHz when "MQA decoder device"is selected. But DAC 32/96kHz when renderer or not MQA device is selected.

My Brooklyn DAC displays 24/96 and blue light lit on all 3 MQA settings in Audirvana.

 

With very little knowledge of what's what with Audirvana 3, it seems to me that Audirvana is telling me that it is decoding the MQA file, but my Brooklyn DAC is saying the exact same thing?

Anybody have any ideas or experience with this so far?Anybody else with a MQA decoding DAC getting the message "no MQA device detected" in settings?

The flac MQA files are on my Mac Mini and not streamed.

[fheller]

Why cant you just explain the meaning of the tearms "renderer" and ""decoder" in context of Audirvana 3.

I have read so much "usefull" information on MQA, that I dont want to read another thread on the MQA Philosophy.

Just what these settings do in Audirvana 3 would make me happy, without reading ANYTHING more on MQA.

 

Thank you.

[jhwalker]

I have a couple of DSD64 files that played fine using A+ 2.6.6 but play at double speed using A+ 3.0. I tried changing all the setting that I could and it made no difference. Anyone else see this?

 

Yes, same problem here. Meridian Explorer 2, which indicates Audirvana must convert to PCM - plays back at double speed for DSD64. It also seemingly plays back at 4x for DSD128, and 8x for DSD256

[damien78]

@damien78 - I have a question about the MQA options.

 

When no MQA device is detected, A+ v3 give me the option to select (see screenshot). I'm guessing these options tell A+ how to handle MQA files for output.

 

1. Not MQA Device

2. MQA Renderer Device

3. MQA Decoder Device

 

 

 

 

I'm guessing if I select option 1, A+ handles software decoding of the core and option 3 just send MQA out bit perfect to the hardware decoder. But, what happens if I select option 2? Doesn't that also handle software decoding of the core just like option 1?

 

 

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]33872[/ATTACH]

 

That's correct:

1. A+ handles software core decoding, and any further audio processing (upsampling, audio units, ...) is available

2. MQA Renderer (e.g. Audioquest DragonFly) A+ handles software core decoding, but any further audio processing is disabled for MQA files

3. MQA Decoder (e.g. Meridian Explorer 2) No audio processing nor decoding. MQA files signal send bit perfect to the DAC that does all the MQA decoding and rendering

 

Audio processing is disabled for 2 & 3 so that the MQA DAC gets the MQA signal correctly and thus recognises it.

ReplayGain commands are then transmitted to the DAC for gain control in the DAC.

 

But note that for such gain commands to be send to the DAC, it needs to be detected as MQA DAC.

 

A USB connected MQA DAC is automatically detected as such. These manual settings are there only for the case a MQA DAC is connected through a unidirectional link (e.g. S/PDIF) and thus can't tell it is MQA.

@quark: you may want to check with Mytek if they have a firmware update with the MQA Device Management features

Non MQA files are not impacted with those settings.

[damien78]

Thanks pabe12 an Astrostar59. I had tried rebooting before. Just logging in and out didn't seeem to help either.

 

Qobuz individual tracks are greyed out. Error message says they cannot be streamed. Rebooted modem earlier. Can stream fun in qobuz app...

 

Appreciate the help all the same [emoji120]

 

 

Mac mini -> Regen -> Burson CV2+ -> HD560

 

Where are you located?

Qobuz may be enforcing more the restriction to allow streaming only from the countries where its service is available.

[fheller]

Thank you!

[odelay]

Silly me - should have checked!

 

I'm in Finland. As an Aussie, I'm used to being left out in the cold on these things. But assumed Qobuz was all over the EU (but hasn't been following).

 

Seems like tidal is available, so shall try that. Merci!

[damien78]

Yes, same problem here. Meridian Explorer 2, which indicates Audirvana must convert to PCM - plays back at double speed for DSD64. It also seemingly plays back at 4x for DSD128, and 8x for DSD256

 

Thanks for the report.

You can find get the fixed version here

[OneHandWaving]

Qobuz individual tracks are greyed out. Error message says they cannot be streamed. Rebooted modem earlier. Can stream fun in qobuz app.

 

Greyed out normally means that the album is available for download, but not streaming.

 

When you play it in the app does it play the whole track, or just the first 30 seconds? If it doesn't play the whole track it's just giving you a short preview.

[fheller]

If I buy a MQA file for 17€ and it gives me a 24bit/352kHz resolution, thats the same as a flac purchase of that same 24/352khz resolution? If i use a MQA Dac?

I ask, because storage requirement is less than the flac file.

Thank you

[dsimms]

I have a couple of DSD64 files that played fine using A+ 2.6.6 but play at double speed using A+ 3.0. I tried changing all the setting that I could and it made no difference. Anyone else see this?

 

I'm unable to play any native DSD files in 3.0 - whether from DSF or ISO files. Worked fine with v2.6.6.

 

Is anyone able to play such files?

 

Thanks

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Computer Audiophile