Jump to content
The Computer Audiophile

Audirvana Plus 3 (official thread)

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

I believe that's incorrect. A+ "unfolds" Tidal Masters for my non-MQA DAC to 24/192 as appropriate (for example, Joni Mitchell's "Blue" album).

Do you have upsampling switched on in Audirvana?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
the hierachical process of genre/artist/album (and any additional categories desired)

see? "genre" comes first among your filing criteria

most of what I listen to is so "borderline across different genres" that genre is, in my collection, the least relevant criterion

 

but once all that is in specific file tags... everyone can sort his library according to whatever he values the most (and re-arrange it with a single click any time he changes his mind) ;)


Qnap HS-251+ NAS (powered by an HD-Plex 100w LPS) > Cirrus7 Nimbini v2.5 Media Edition i7-8559U/32/512 running Roon ROCK (powered by a ZeroZone 19v/5A LPS) > Lumin U1 Mini (powered by a Vinnie Rossi Mini Pure-DC-4EVR LPS) >  UpTone Audio ISO Regen (powered by an Uptone Audio UltraCap LPS-1.2) > Metrum Acoustics Adagio NOS digital preamplifier + First Watt SIT 3  power amplifier (or Don Garber Fi "Y" 6922 tube preamplifier + Don Garber Fi "X" 2A3 SET power amplifier, both powered from an Alpha-Core BP-30 Isolated Symmetrical Power Transformer) > Klipsch Cornwall III

 

headphones system:

Cirrus 7 > Lumin U1 Mini > Metrum Adagio > Pathos Aurium amplifier (powered by an UpTone Audio JS-2 LPS) > Focal Clear headphones

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
see? "genre" comes first among your filing criteria

most of what I listen to is so "borderline across different genres" that genre is, in my collection, the least relevant criterion

 

but once all that is in specific file tags... everyone can sort his library according to whatever he values the most (and re-arrange it with a single click any time he changes his mind) ;)

Not quite sure what you mean by "see"?

 

In my collection genre is a category because if I don't have a specific piece of music I want to listen to the first thing I do is think to myself, am I in a mood to listen to classical or rock music now? And from that decision I want to browse by viewing what I have. If you were filing your music, I assume you simply wouldn't include a category of genre - and that is your choice - but would make no difference, as if browsing by file structure it would be by whatever categories you choose for yourself, nothing needs to be preset in Audirvana.

 

Genre in my filing system (and a beauty of filing in this way is that it is entirely up to the person whose collection it is) is currently simply classical, opera, rock, world music and miscellaneous. And at any time if i felt that something better would be useful I could decide to split one, and move part of its contents in just a couple of minutes.

 

The manufacturer-assigned metadata of ripped CDs or downloaded music doesn't necessarily fit with my perception of genre, and in particular classical is often very inconsistent: you can have different recordings of the same piece of music, for which the genre for one might be assigned orchestral, another symphonic, another classical, making the assigned genre useless, unlike how I file for myself.

 

For clarity, I am not arguing against metadata or Audirvana using metadata as a tool for browsing: I readily recognise that metadata can indeed be a very powerful tool (though ONLY if it is correct and consistent), and in an ideal world all music would have matadata attached, maybe assigned according to a universal classification system. But what I have been requesting from @damien78 is that he includes an additional facility for browsing by file structure. That is not a fundamentally difficult concept, would engage all the people who, like me, have historically accumulated collections with bad and missing metadata and have been requesting this on the A+ website for a long time, and indeed would aid when something inexplicable happens as has happened in Audirvana with files that have indeed had consistent metadata..

Edited by Innocent Bystander

Mac Mini - late 2012: core i5/2.5GHz/16GB/2x1TB SSDs/El Capitan, headless - Audirvana optimised, dedicated USB bus - USB Regen - Chord Dave DAC - tri-amped with Bryston amps - PMC/ATC speaker combo. (Detail in my profile.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Poor metadata translates in a poor and almost useless music library

Yes, it does, when a piece of software relies wholly on the metadata to find the music. (But not if the software allows searching by where a file is located, i.e. the filing structure, unless the files are stored in an unstructured random manner.) Sadly, particularly with classical music, though also others, so much commercial music has inconsistent or incomplete metadata, meaning that to rely solely on metadata risks music being lost or unavailable through the library unless every individual person spends time with every file checking all the metadata before filing.

 

Implementing a means of browsing by filing system at least would provide a means of coping with collections having any files with poor metadata, and would add value to the music player - and surely is neither a difficult thing to add, nor in any way detrimental to metadata browsing and searching where metadata is adequate.


Mac Mini - late 2012: core i5/2.5GHz/16GB/2x1TB SSDs/El Capitan, headless - Audirvana optimised, dedicated USB bus - USB Regen - Chord Dave DAC - tri-amped with Bryston amps - PMC/ATC speaker combo. (Detail in my profile.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Do you have upsampling switched on in Audirvana?

 

Yes, to DSD256.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile


One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> wi-fi to router -> EtherREGEN -> microRendu -> USPCB -> ISO Regen (powered by LPS-1) -> USPCB -> Pro-Ject Pre Box S2 DAC -> Spectral DMC-12 & DMA-150 -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been running 2.6.x for a few months. But I didn't create any playlists, I just select the music I want to hear when I listen. Is this the playlist file, and since I didn't have any there was nothing to delete?

 

My trial upgrade went smoothly and I'm thoroughly enjoying the improved SQ. Thanks Damien! And thanks RunSlowHome for the "starting from scratch" details.


2012 Mac Mini, Mac Sierra OS, Audirvana 3.x, WireWorld Ultraviolet 7 USB Interconnect, Benchmark DAC2 L, Wireworld Equinox 7 Balanced XLR Interconnect, Belles 350A Amp, DIY Speaker Cables (18 strands of 22awg wire in circular array), DIY Carver Ribbon Speakers & Dayton Woofers

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
if you didn't have A+ installed once, it should not be there..., but if you have it before it is strange to have nothing.

if all went well, don't bother, but now if you quit A+ and look back it should have one...

 

Probably didn't make sense without the attached quote.....duh

 

-----------------------

 

I've been running 2.6.x for a few months. But I didn't create any playlists, I just select the music I want to hear when I listen. Is this the playlist file, and since I didn't have any there was nothing to delete?

 

My trial upgrade went smoothly and I'm thoroughly enjoying the improved SQ. Thanks Damien! And thanks RunSlowHome for the "starting from scratch" details.


2012 Mac Mini, Mac Sierra OS, Audirvana 3.x, WireWorld Ultraviolet 7 USB Interconnect, Benchmark DAC2 L, Wireworld Equinox 7 Balanced XLR Interconnect, Belles 350A Amp, DIY Speaker Cables (18 strands of 22awg wire in circular array), DIY Carver Ribbon Speakers & Dayton Woofers

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I've been running 2.6.x for a few months. But I didn't create any playlists, I just select the music I want to hear when I listen. Is this the playlist file, and since I didn't have any there was nothing to delete?

 

That file is only for the preferences of the software, it means when you make your choices in the Preferences Menu of A+... your dac, memory... volume... library...

 

See mine... every software that you have in your mac have that file there... Since now it is working, it should be there. If not, i don't know, strange. Your A+ application is copied in your Applications folder?

 

Snapz001.jpg


If You Got Ears, You Gotta ListenCaptain Beefheart

 

MacMini, i5, 2.5GHz, SSD, 16Gb, 10.15 > Audirvana Plus 3.5.33 > Wyred DAC2 DSD Special Edition >
Proceed AMP2 > Focal Cobalt 826 Signature Series > Audirvana Remote > iPhone 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I think the 'incorrect' values are the MQA correct and they're showing the resolution of the MQA tracks. If you've not got an MQA DAC then the software decoding in Audiovana has a maximum resolution of 24/88.2-96. If you had an MQA DAC you'd see 24/192 etc. on the DAC (assuming the MQA file is being passed to the DAC without any software decoding).

 

Thanks for the correction, your explanation makes complete sense! :)


Audirvana+3.0 / TIDAL HiFi / Mac Mini (256GB SSD - 16GB RAM)

Lindemann Musicbook: 20 DSD, ATC EL 150ASL

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I believe that's incorrect. A+ "unfolds" Tidal Masters for my non-MQA DAC to 24/192 as appropriate (for example, Joni Mitchell's "Blue" album).

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile

 

My understanding is that Audirvana and other players are only allowed to unfold in software to 1st level which can only be either 88.2 kHz or 96 kHZ. So, the explanation of @OneHandWaving does make sense to me.

 

Like I said my DAC only displays the incoming MQA tracks as either 24/88.2 or 24/96 regardless of what Audirvana displays. This further supports @OneHandWaving's explanation.

I'm not doing any up-sampling with Audirvana at the moment as my DAC does a great job of up-sampling to DSD 256!


Audirvana+3.0 / TIDAL HiFi / Mac Mini (256GB SSD - 16GB RAM)

Lindemann Musicbook: 20 DSD, ATC EL 150ASL

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I managed to run the dac, maybe it was the audiofamily file, sorry to bother you, I noticed an error when audirvana3 itunes is under the master volume drops to 0dB with the Mac keyboard, but you have to manually lower it with the mouse, with the version 2.6.6 this does not happen.


iMac,Audirvana,Ampli-Dac RME ADI-2, Marantz SA-KI Pearl Lite, Primaluna PLTwo, Sennheiser HD800S e Focal Utopia, Adam S3V.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes, to DSD256.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile

 

Turn off the upsampling and see what it outputs on that track? I don't think you'll see anything higher than 24/96.

 

I still don't understand this restriction though. I'm sure Audirvana would have no problem unfolding the whole thing if allowed. You just couldn't do the last step of matching to the DAC. And even then, if MQA provided the DAC profiles, the software could do that on the matched DACs. Really thinks it's to get you to buy a new DAC. See how good this sounds at 24/96, it would sound even better at 24/192.

 

But unfolding to 24/96 and then further upsampling to DSD makes the need for a MQA DAC less needed. And still looking at a very small percent of albums even encoded in MQA at the moment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have up-sampling turned off but I can see as high as 352.8 kHz as displayed by Audirvana, see post #334, which probably means that Audirvana is just displaying the maximum MQA file resolution as reported by TIDAL.

 

My understanding is that MQA file unfolding involves a bit more than up-sampling as it actually stores the original resolution in a specially compressed format.

So, in practice the MQA capable DAC is just unfolding the original file rather than up-sampling which in theory should result in better sound. How much better that's a different question.

I'm sure some users will be comparing software unfolding to 96 kHz and then software up-sampling to 384 kHz with an MQA capable DAC doing all the unfolding of the original 384 kHz MQA file.


Audirvana+3.0 / TIDAL HiFi / Mac Mini (256GB SSD - 16GB RAM)

Lindemann Musicbook: 20 DSD, ATC EL 150ASL

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@AudioDoctor

My Luxman DA06 is from 2014

 

Regarding to A+ v3 compabilty with some DACs, now I realized that in A+ download site has a disclaimer talking about it that includes Luxman' DAC, Teac, and others. There as special A+ v3 version, AudirvanaPlus_3.0.0.1-teac.dmg, to workaround but didn't worked to Luxman too.

 

I had to rolled back to version 2.6.6 and everything is working fine again with Luxman DA06.

 

I have already bought A+ v3 upgrade from v2, so I hope @damien78 could solve this issue as soon as possible!


mgaluzzi[br] MBP early 2011 Yosemite, DAC Luxman DA06, USB Cable Light Harmonics, Luxman L590-AX Integrated, Acrolink Interconnects, Kubala and Acrolink Power cables, ELAC 249 LoudSpeakers with ASI Liveline biwire

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
That would be great. Always looking for an improvement, but all the tweaking in Audirvana and Dirac can take its toll.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Computer Audiophile

 

Do yourself a favor and forget about upsampling. Just enjoy the organic sound of the native file. Won't be long before upsampling is filed away with "loudness buttons" and graphic equalizers.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile


Tidal / Qobuz--> Roon--> Fios Gigabit--> Netgear Prosafe GS105 --> AQ Vodka --> microRendu 1.4 / CI Audio LPS --> USPCB --> Schiit Eitr --> AQ Coffee --> Hegel HD25 --> AQ Water --> Belles Aria Integrated--> AQ Robin Hood--> Kudos Super 20's

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A+ is unfolding MQA files to 88.2/96kHz, but is displaying (on the right) the max resolution of the file, meaning from 44.1kHz up to DXD (352.8kHz).

 

Without upsampling I get:

MQA 352.8kHz track plays at 88.2kHz

MQA 44.1kHz track plays at 88.2kHz

 

There are wonderful test tracks at 2L. Size performance of MQA is hard to believe: a 9:24 file in DXD is 760MB, the same with MQA 98MB !!!


IsoTek evo3 Sirius⎪Late 2009 27" iMac 20GB w/SSD, 10.10.x ➤Audirvana Plus 3.0.x (Exclusive Direct Integer Mode 1, NOS) & Qobuz HiFi Sublime+ ➤Curious Cables ➤UpTone Audio ISO REGEN (UpTone Audio UltraCap LPS-1 (Breeze Audio R-Core Linear PSU)) ➤UpTone Audio USPCB ➤iFi micro iDAC2 running v5.2a (Bit-Perfect) serving:

➤Nobsound SE OTL headphone amp on Herbie's Soft Tenderfoot (selected tubes with Herbie's UltraSonic Rx) with IsoTek evo3 Premier power cable⎪Audez'e LCD-2 Rev. 2 on Moon Audio Silver Dragon V3 Premium cable

➤Audioengine A5+ with AudioQuest Power NRG-1 cable

➤iFi micro iTube2 ➤Denon AVR-A100 100th Anniversary Edition with IsoTek evo3 Premier power cable on IsoTek evo3 Aquarius⎪B&W 804 D3 bi-amped on Inakustik cables

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I do agree. The latest bottom end lost some body but it's better controlled overall.

 

There's nothing worse than an uncontrolled bottom, is there my friend?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile


Tidal / Qobuz--> Roon--> Fios Gigabit--> Netgear Prosafe GS105 --> AQ Vodka --> microRendu 1.4 / CI Audio LPS --> USPCB --> Schiit Eitr --> AQ Coffee --> Hegel HD25 --> AQ Water --> Belles Aria Integrated--> AQ Robin Hood--> Kudos Super 20's

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I have up-sampling turned off but I can see as high as 352.8 kHz as displayed by Audirvana, see post #334, which probably means that Audirvana is just displaying the maximum MQA file resolution as reported by TIDAL.

 

My understanding is that MQA file unfolding involves a bit more than up-sampling as it actually stores the original resolution in a specially compressed format.

So, in practice the MQA capable DAC is just unfolding the original file rather than up-sampling which in theory should result in better sound. How much better that's a different question.

I'm sure some users will be comparing software unfolding to 96 kHz and then software up-sampling to 384 kHz with an MQA capable DAC doing all the unfolding of the original 384 kHz MQA file.

 

Unfolding is upsampling. Compressed information tells the renderer what resolution to upsample/unfold to, among other things.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile


One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> wi-fi to router -> EtherREGEN -> microRendu -> USPCB -> ISO Regen (powered by LPS-1) -> USPCB -> Pro-Ject Pre Box S2 DAC -> Spectral DMC-12 & DMA-150 -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Do yourself a favor and forget about upsampling. Just enjoy the organic sound of the native file. Won't be long before upsampling is filed away with "loudness buttons" and graphic equalizers.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile

 

That is certainly one point of view. :)

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile


One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> wi-fi to router -> EtherREGEN -> microRendu -> USPCB -> ISO Regen (powered by LPS-1) -> USPCB -> Pro-Ject Pre Box S2 DAC -> Spectral DMC-12 & DMA-150 -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
How do you think a DAC normally works?

 

Personally speaking, I could care less. My views are totally based on the music I hear. I find upsampling alters or reconstructs the sound in an artificial manner that has limited appeal.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile


Tidal / Qobuz--> Roon--> Fios Gigabit--> Netgear Prosafe GS105 --> AQ Vodka --> microRendu 1.4 / CI Audio LPS --> USPCB --> Schiit Eitr --> AQ Coffee --> Hegel HD25 --> AQ Water --> Belles Aria Integrated--> AQ Robin Hood--> Kudos Super 20's

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Personally speaking, I could care less. My views are totally based on the music I hear. I find upsampling alters or reconstructs the sound in an artificial manner that has limited appeal.

 

With very very few exceptions, DACs upsample, so unless you are listening with a non-upsampling override setting (which will sound horrible due to aliasing and other artifacts), your expectation bias is what you are hearing. Having software do so instead (or in addition) simply gives you more control. If you don't like those options, no one is suggesting you have to use them, but telling other people that it is damaging to the music is kind of ill-informed, despite the fact that you "could [sic] care less."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
@AudioDoctor

My Luxman DA06 is from 2014

 

Regarding to A+ v3 compabilty with some DACs, now I realized that in A+ download site has a disclaimer talking about it that includes Luxman' DAC, Teac, and others. There as special A+ v3 version, AudirvanaPlus_3.0.0.1-teac.dmg, to workaround but didn't worked to Luxman too.

 

I had to rolled back to version 2.6.6 and everything is working fine again with Luxman DA06.

 

I have already bought A+ v3 upgrade from v2, so I hope @damien78 could solve this issue as soon as possible!

 

I have other users with the Luxman DA06 and it works with the special build.

But after installing it in place of the regular version 3, you need to reboot, and to unplug then replug the DAC USB cable to ensure its USB interface has restarted.


MBP 15"/Mac Mini, Audirvana Plus, Audioquest Diamond USB, AMR DP-777, exD DSD DAC (for DSD), Pioneer N-70AE, Audioquest Niagara balanced/Viard Audio Design Silver HD, Accuphase E-560, Cabasse Sumatra MT420

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's the issue with Teac DACs? I can't seem to find it on the website (and I have a Teac NT-503 fwiw).

 

Nevermind; I found it:

 

MARANTZ, TEAC, DENON, LUXMAN, SONY, YAMAHA DACS: SPECIAL BUILD

 

There is currently a compatibility issue between some TEAC, Marantz, Denon, Luxman, Sony DACs with the MQA device detection routine.

This causes the DAC USB interface to fail to initialize.

If you have a DAC from a brand above, you should get the special build that is not including the MQA device detection routine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...