Popular Post asdf1000 Posted November 20, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 20, 2020 13 minutes ago, UkPhil said: Yes MQA has infected the Hifi tier big style in the last week, Tidals goal will be all MQA over coming months no doubt Well recently was due to the Warner announcement. But I'm noticing more non-Warner "MQA CD" releases. I can live with some types with MQA if forced (even though I'd prefer it disappears) ... but 'MQA CD' quality is a technical downgrade on the 'CD quality or better' Tidal HiFi subscription I signed up for and am paying for.... hmartin and UkPhil 1 1 Link to comment
KeenObserver Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 5 hours ago, FredericV said: This almost smells like a conspiracy theory, let's hope it does not become a scandal. We do not forget how they once tried to cripple redbook, now they may even remove redbook quality from streaming platforms, and replace it by batch processed crypto DRM'ed versions of the same, with the MQA sausage applied, and then suddenly it's called master quality. Let's all learn from the mistakes made in the past: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal If you read some of the statements made by some of the Sony hierarchy at the time you would be taken aback. It is as if they considered their customers as their chattel. Boycott Warner Boycott Tidal Boycott Roon Boycott Lenbrook Link to comment
Popular Post The Computer Audiophile Posted November 20, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 20, 2020 1 hour ago, asdf1000 said: Well recently was due to the Warner announcement. But I'm noticing more non-Warner "MQA CD" releases. I can live with some types with MQA if forced (even though I'd prefer it disappears) ... but 'MQA CD' quality is a technical downgrade on the 'CD quality or better' Tidal HiFi subscription I signed up for and am paying for.... Agree. MQA CD is such a joke. It’s even worse when offered without the restrictions of a physical medium. Sure, the real master may be 16/44.1, but then don’t create a lossy MQA version just for the sake of MQA. It’s only going to get worse. Trust me folks. UkPhil, asdf1000 and botrytis 1 2 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Popular Post KeenObserver Posted November 20, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 20, 2020 The answer for people that care for the future of music distribution and have a subscription to Tidal is to just cancel the subscription. Kyhl, MikeyFresh, UkPhil and 2 others 5 Boycott Warner Boycott Tidal Boycott Roon Boycott Lenbrook Link to comment
Popular Post The Computer Audiophile Posted November 20, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 20, 2020 People must also be very vocal. If you have social media accounts, you must tag/mention Tidal and the labels and demand things change. Start a hashtag #BoycottMQA #BoycottTidal #BoycottWarner etc... Most companies hate being called out in public. botrytis, troubleahead and MikeyFresh 2 1 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
asdf1000 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 18 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: It’s only going to get worse. Trust me folks. Can you expand. This is a serious issue. Link to comment
Popular Post The Computer Audiophile Posted November 20, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 20, 2020 Just now, asdf1000 said: Can you expand. This is a serious issue. Not right now. The communications I’ve received lately were in confidence. Stuff will come out. I’ll be able to post some in due time. I hate doing this but I keep my word with everyone. The manufacturers reading this can have confidence I won’t say a word until it’s appropriate. UkPhil, oneway23, botrytis and 3 others 6 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Rexp Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 13 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: People must also be very vocal. If you have social media accounts, you must tag/mention Tidal and the labels and demand things change. Start a hashtag #BoycottMQA #BoycottTidal #BoycottWarner etc... Most companies hate being called out in public. The Tidal store still sells FLAC downloads, no mention of MQA. So they must have both versions on their server? Link to comment
sp25 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 At best it would be good if we had the choice to listen in MQA or not ie there was a button to press to turn it off or on and those that like the sound can have it, or not. Same as at the moment I have a simple tube pre-amp because I like the sound, not true hi-fi but I can use it or not, or to give an even more obvious example I might like like to listen with my speakers facing me or turned out a bit. None of its like being in the studio but I can choose my best sound for me. Link to comment
KeenObserver Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 8 minutes ago, Rexp said: The Tidal store still sells FLAC downloads, no mention of MQA. So they must have both versions on their server? What's inside the FLAC carrier? Boycott Warner Boycott Tidal Boycott Roon Boycott Lenbrook Link to comment
asdf1000 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 12 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Stuff will come out. Without going into what this stuff is at all , are you expecting this stuff to come out before the end of 2020? Link to comment
The Computer Audiophile Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 5 minutes ago, asdf1000 said: Without going into what this stuff is at all , are you expecting this stuff to come out before the end of 2020? My guess is there will be some around the first of the year. Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
KeenObserver Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 One should look at the tot system or dop plan of South Africa. One should look at the source of the Billions behind the MQA sponsors. Warner and Mqa and Tidal's actions are derivative. botrytis 1 Boycott Warner Boycott Tidal Boycott Roon Boycott Lenbrook Link to comment
asdf1000 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: My guess is there will be some around the first of the year. First month of 2021? Link to comment
The Computer Audiophile Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 7 hours ago, asdf1000 said: The labels have a stake in MQA Ltd? If they do and they decide to go full throttle with MQA (still yet to be seen though), then millions of non-MQA tracks that Qobuz currently streams may switch over to MQA only (like 2L recordings). Oh yes, both the labels and people who work at the labels have an individual stake. For example, Warner Music, and Atlantic Records (Owned by Warner) CEO Craig Kallman have stakes in MQA. Have a look. application-pdf.pdf Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
asdf1000 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Oh yes, both the labels and people who work at the labels have an individual stake. For example, Warner Music, and Atlantic Records (Owned by Warner) CEO Craig Kallman have stakes in MQA. Have a look. application-pdf.pdf 73.17 kB · 0 downloads Yikes... financial incentives for them to push it hard then... The Computer Audiophile 1 Link to comment
KeenObserver Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 If the MQA scheme is implemented then MQA becomes wealthy and the music consumer has contaminated brandy forced on them. Another metaphor. Boycott Warner Boycott Tidal Boycott Roon Boycott Lenbrook Link to comment
botrytis Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 9 hours ago, KeenObserver said: MQA and Warner's plan to force the music consumer to accept MQA is reminiscent of the Dop Plan. Forcing workers to accept brandy made from rejected wine and rejected and previously used grapes. Did Jay Z give any thought as to who he was getting in bed with? I am sure he did - he cares about making money and I bet that was all part of the calculation. Current: Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590 Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects Link to comment
sp25 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 I expect this has been done already, but for any boycott Tidal, boycott MQA campaign to gather ground there needs to be a relatively non-technical summary of this that I and other enthusiasts who haven't time or patience to read and absorb the finer details can understand, and also an easily accessible location point eg on this site. Both sides of the debate can too easily blind with science/BS!. Education, Education, Education. While we are at it can we have a boycott compression campaign too LOL The Computer Audiophile 1 Link to comment
UkPhil Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 1 hour ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Not right now. The communications I’ve received lately were in confidence. Stuff will come out. I’ll be able to post some in due time. I hate doing this but I keep my word with everyone. The manufacturers reading this can have confidence I won’t say a word until it’s appropriate. I shudder to think 😢 Link to comment
KeenObserver Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 There is tremendous pressure being put on music producers to implement MQA. If there continues to be Hi Rez music out there it will make it impossible for MQA to claim that MQA is better than the original. If there is only MQA music out there, there will be nothing to compare it to. Right from the beginning there was a bad smell about MQA. Boycott Warner Boycott Tidal Boycott Roon Boycott Lenbrook Link to comment
KeenObserver Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 30 minutes ago, sp25 said: I expect this has been done already, but for any boycott Tidal, boycott MQA campaign to gather ground there needs to be a relatively non-technical summary of this that I and other enthusiasts who haven't time or patience to read and absorb the finer details can understand, and also an easily accessible location point eg on this site. Both sides of the debate can too easily blind with science/BS!. Education, Education, Education. While we are at it can we have a boycott compression campaign too LOL Put in its simplest terms, MQA wants to control the music distribution chain, and you will pay them for this. You will get no benefit from this. They will tell you that there is all kinds of magic that they perform that makes it better than the original, but it is all BS. They want to eliminate non MQA music so you will not be able to compare. If you are not a MQA believer Tidal has become totally useless. Warner seems to be the spearhead behind the push to force MQA on the music consumer. MQA needs the clout of the studios to be able to force MQA on the music consumer. Jbara moved to MQA from Warner. Concentrating on Warner and not diluting the action elsewhere would have the best effect. A strong and effective boycott Warner movement would send a message. This thread has a wealth of information on MQA. It is long but it shows MQA's actions through time. Boycott Warner Boycott Tidal Boycott Roon Boycott Lenbrook Link to comment
John Dyson Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 40 minutes ago, KeenObserver said: There is tremendous pressure being put on music producers to implement MQA. If there continues to be Hi Rez music out there it will make it impossible for MQA to claim that MQA is better than the original. If there is only MQA music out there, there will be nothing to compare it to. Right from the beginning there was a bad smell about MQA. I agree about the poor basis of comparisons. We ALREADY have that problem, our basis of comparisons are already not very good. My point is about the relative importance of various MQA issues, and a few low order bits on already damaged material isn't all that worrisome to me. Access controls of one kind or another DO worry me, and the technology is a good first step towards that horrible goal. Take a look at the comparison (over in the FA decoder subject) of a relatively clean copy vs. HDtracks version. This is an example, NOT on pop, about how muffeled our recordings really sound to people who haven't accomodated to them. My example is NOT of perfection, but instead how distorted our recordings ALREADY ARE. There ARE good recordings out there, but there is also a huge amount of garbage, and you cannot tell before hand when you try to purchase your favorite song. This is an example of 'not so good' from a moderately high end supplier. Of course, the example argues for two things: that high-res isn't all that meaningful, and secondly the we are talking about 'angels on the head of a pin' when worrying about MQA quality loss. I am more worried about possible access controls, not the relatively secondary quality loss... Below are my examples -- just to clarify what I am talking about. MY EXAMPLE IS NOT PERFECT (I have troubles with the correct EQ settings), again shows that fuzzy stuff is already being sold to us all. We have already lost control of any basis of good quality. 03-Take Five-HDtracks-snippet-48k.flac 03-Take Five-DECODEDC-snippetA-48k.flac lucretius 1 Link to comment
Tintinabulum Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 17 minutes ago, KeenObserver said: Put in its simplest terms, MQA wants to control the music distribution chain, and you will pay them for this. You will get no benefit from this. They will tell you that there is all kinds of magic that they perform that makes it better than the original, but it is all BS. They want to eliminate non MQA music so you will not be able to compare. For balance, innocent readers may want to see the other side of the argument, which is the opposite of what you said above. All innocent readers get is the tired views of anti-MQA campaigners who have been at it for years/become jaded/done no good/are in it to the death/make stuff up. By all means take Warners down. lucretius, yahooboy and Currawong 3 Link to comment
sp25 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 18 minutes ago, KeenObserver said: Put in its simplest terms, MQA wants to control the music distribution chain, and you will pay them for this. You will get no benefit from this. They will tell you that there is all kinds of magic that they perform that makes it better than the original, but it is all BS. They want to eliminate non MQA music so you will not be able to compare. If you are not a MQA believer Tidal has become totally useless. Warner seems to be the spearhead behind the push to force MQA on the music consumer. MQA needs the clout of the studios to be able to force MQA on the music consumer. Jbara moved to MQA from Warner. Concentrating on Warner and not diluting the action elsewhere would have the best effect. A strong and effective boycott Warner movement would send a message. This thread has a wealth of information on MQA. It is long but it shows MQA's actions through time. Thanks for the summary, maybe it would be useful for there to be a web page or site dedicated to explaining the issues, not many are going to wade through it all and we all have different technical knowledge. One of the main problems is actually getting to hear MQA, I haven't because I don't have the hardware, but its a point of principle not to filter our great music (or compress it first!) without giving us the choice. Link to comment
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