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A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming


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Most important: please realize this thread is about bleeding edge experimentation and discovery. No one has The Answer™. If you are not into tweaking, just know that you can have a musically satisfying system without doing any of the nutty things we do here.

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15 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Eric,

 

See my post immediately above. You're still locking in the sCLK-EX improvements.

 

The only thing you don't know is whether, in the future, if you buy an amazing master clock like the Ref 10, you will hear an additional improvement. That will determine whether the extra - what, $200? - you spent for the master clock inputs was worth it or not.

 

Yes, that's what I'm a little concerned about: did I throw away $400 on the master clock input on the dX and sMS-200 Ultra?

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18 minutes ago, limniscate said:

 

Yes, that's what I'm a little concerned about: did I throw away $400 on the master clock input on the dX and sMS-200 Ultra?

Read this press release from SOtM.  They are giving away the master clock connector free with upgrade of an sMS-200 to sMS-200Ultra!

http://www.sotm-audio.com/sotmwp/english/press-release-sms-200ultra/

 

It's a smart move for SOtM because it positions their customers to buy their upcoming master clock.  Maybe you can negotiate a better deal on your order.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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20 minutes ago, rickca said:

It's a smart move for SOtM because it positions their customers to buy their upcoming master clock.  Maybe you can negotiate a better deal on your order.

Like I said in an earlier post they should have included the master clock connector for customers buying the Ultra products.  I'm sure their master clock will cost north of $2K and they would have sold a lot more when the connector was already installed.

 

I purchased a SMS-200 Ultra and was going to purchase the whole Romaz chain and probably the master clock when it is released.  The fact they were charging $200 per device for a little cable and connectors stopped me pulling the trigger. :)  It is probably possible to buy a cable / connector and self install for a fraction of this amount.

 

The prices for using the extra clocks seems fair to me but not the master clock option.

 

 

SOtM sMS-200ultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

SOtM tX-USBultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Singxer SU-1 (7v SOtM sCLK-EX, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

W4S DAC2v2 SE (SOtM sCLK-EX silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Mutec REF 10, Bryston BP6, Trinnov Altitude 32, 9 x Bryston 7B³s, B&W 800D3s, B&W HTM1 D3, 2 x Arendal Sub 3,

SOtM dCBL-CAT7 (ISO-CAT6 SE), SOtM eABS-200 installed on all components, JCAT NET Card FEMTO, mRendu, dCS Rossini DAC, Chord Hugo 2, Schitt Yggy, Chord Qutest (ordered for home office), UpTone ISO Regen, 5 x UpTone LPS-1s, 4 x PH SR4s, 5 x UpTone LPS-1.2s

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8 minutes ago, Bamber said:

The prices for using the extra clocks seems fair to me but not the master clock option.

 

Well, I'm kind of questioning that as well.  Here's what I asked May

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/27617-sotm-sms-200-unveiled-at-munich-hi-end/?page=35#comment-670501

 

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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1 hour ago, austinpop said:

 

Eric,

 

See my post immediately above. You're still locking in the sCLK-EX improvements.

 

The only thing you don't know is whether, in the future, if you buy an amazing master clock like the Ref 10, you will hear an additional improvement. That will determine whether the extra - what, $200? - you spent for the master clock inputs was worth it or not.

@austinpop does the Ref10 need a master clock with 12v connector or 6-9v connector?

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2 hours ago, Johnseye said:

May emailed me that their upgrade program has started.  I purchased my sMS through Crux which offers free shipping back and forth.  It should take about 10 days and the offer is only good through July 7th.

 

http://www.sotm-audio.com/sotmwp/english/press-release-sms-200ultra/

 

The $300 modded switch is a D-Link 5 Port Gigabit DGS-105.

 

By the way, the upgrade until July includes the master clock interface for what that's worth.

 

Good points @austinpop.  The mod isn't a true master slave but a replacement through rewire.  That's more of a Frankenstein, but effective approach to clock replacement.  I still think they should just substitute the clocks and whatever else is needed on the actual sms-200 board as opposed to bootstrap an sclk board.

 

However if one uses the master clock option on the sms-200 that would be what is referenced in the article.

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21 minutes ago, rickca said:

Well, I'm kind of questioning that as well.  Here's what I asked May

Found this on their website, it looks out of date but shows how they price the clocks.

 

Pricing and Availability You can easily reach to the completely new sound stage by a single sCLK-EX clock module. There is a cost difference depending on how many outputs you are able to enable, - 1 sCLK-EX output, the cost is US$700. - 2 sCLK-EX outputs, the cost is US$750 - 3 sCLK-EX outputs, the cost is US$800 - 4 sCLK-EX outputs, the cost is US$850 - Extra cost for Master clock option, the cost is US$150 - Extra cost required if you request us or a shop to modify your current system to work with sCLKEX. Min.US$25 per a point will be required

SOtM sMS-200ultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

SOtM tX-USBultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Singxer SU-1 (7v SOtM sCLK-EX, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

W4S DAC2v2 SE (SOtM sCLK-EX silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Mutec REF 10, Bryston BP6, Trinnov Altitude 32, 9 x Bryston 7B³s, B&W 800D3s, B&W HTM1 D3, 2 x Arendal Sub 3,

SOtM dCBL-CAT7 (ISO-CAT6 SE), SOtM eABS-200 installed on all components, JCAT NET Card FEMTO, mRendu, dCS Rossini DAC, Chord Hugo 2, Schitt Yggy, Chord Qutest (ordered for home office), UpTone ISO Regen, 5 x UpTone LPS-1s, 4 x PH SR4s, 5 x UpTone LPS-1.2s

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7 minutes ago, Bamber said:

Found this on their website, it looks out of date but shows how they price the clocks.

Yes, you need to do some more research.  SOtM wants $300 for a switch clock mod, and $150 for a 2nd clock point mod.  That's why I left that question for May asking what happened to $25 per clock point.  Start looking here:

https://sotm-usa.com/products/sms-200ultra-audio-network-player-mods

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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10 minutes ago, rickca said:

Yes, you need to do some more research.

Us buyers in the UK then end up having the $ sign changed to £.  The dealers don't convert the currency so we end up paying even more.

 

I think my interest in further SoTM products is near an end :)

SOtM sMS-200ultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

SOtM tX-USBultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Singxer SU-1 (7v SOtM sCLK-EX, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

W4S DAC2v2 SE (SOtM sCLK-EX silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Mutec REF 10, Bryston BP6, Trinnov Altitude 32, 9 x Bryston 7B³s, B&W 800D3s, B&W HTM1 D3, 2 x Arendal Sub 3,

SOtM dCBL-CAT7 (ISO-CAT6 SE), SOtM eABS-200 installed on all components, JCAT NET Card FEMTO, mRendu, dCS Rossini DAC, Chord Hugo 2, Schitt Yggy, Chord Qutest (ordered for home office), UpTone ISO Regen, 5 x UpTone LPS-1s, 4 x PH SR4s, 5 x UpTone LPS-1.2s

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45 minutes ago, rickca said:

Yes, you need to do some more research.  SOtM wants $300 for a switch clock mod, and $150 for a 2nd clock point mod.  That's why I left that question for May asking what happened to $25 per clock point.  Start looking here:

https://sotm-usa.com/products/sms-200ultra-audio-network-player-mods

 

An example of price by demand.  A "special" for those interested in upgrading.  They clearly expect people to flock to the upgrade special for one month only.  Their business, their rules.  One can always go elsewhere or just not buy.  Cries of injustice usually goes unheeded and action speaks louder than words.

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13 minutes ago, Johnseye said:

One can always go elsewhere or just not buy.

I'm perfectly capable of making my own decision.  No need to talk down to me.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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Just now, rickca said:

I'm perfectly capable of making my own decision.  No need to talk down to me.

 

Honestly that wasn't my intention, sorry you took it that way.  Notice I used the word "one" and not "you".  It was a general statement.  I guess the same could be said for your comment to do some more research to Bamber, but he didn't cry about it.  Jeez, touchy.

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2 minutes ago, Johnseye said:

Honestly that wasn't my intention, sorry you took it that way.

OK, peace!  I shouldn't have taken it personally.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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SOtM sMS-200ultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

SOtM tX-USBultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Singxer SU-1 (7v SOtM sCLK-EX, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

W4S DAC2v2 SE (SOtM sCLK-EX silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Mutec REF 10, Bryston BP6, Trinnov Altitude 32, 9 x Bryston 7B³s, B&W 800D3s, B&W HTM1 D3, 2 x Arendal Sub 3,

SOtM dCBL-CAT7 (ISO-CAT6 SE), SOtM eABS-200 installed on all components, JCAT NET Card FEMTO, mRendu, dCS Rossini DAC, Chord Hugo 2, Schitt Yggy, Chord Qutest (ordered for home office), UpTone ISO Regen, 5 x UpTone LPS-1s, 4 x PH SR4s, 5 x UpTone LPS-1.2s

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I'm sure SoTM probably have to do something to activate the master clock input.  I can borrow a master clock so it is worth trying.

SOtM sMS-200ultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

SOtM tX-USBultra (12v, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Singxer SU-1 (7v SOtM sCLK-EX, silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

W4S DAC2v2 SE (SOtM sCLK-EX silver internal DC cable, 75Ω external clock input),

Mutec REF 10, Bryston BP6, Trinnov Altitude 32, 9 x Bryston 7B³s, B&W 800D3s, B&W HTM1 D3, 2 x Arendal Sub 3,

SOtM dCBL-CAT7 (ISO-CAT6 SE), SOtM eABS-200 installed on all components, JCAT NET Card FEMTO, mRendu, dCS Rossini DAC, Chord Hugo 2, Schitt Yggy, Chord Qutest (ordered for home office), UpTone ISO Regen, 5 x UpTone LPS-1s, 4 x PH SR4s, 5 x UpTone LPS-1.2s

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Hi all, i hope this question hasn't already been answered -- i was following this thread for a while until the forum software change locked me out of tapatalk and the CA app on my iPhone. So i have missed activity in this thread over the past month or two.

 

OK, so I installed a second Ethernet card in my PC, and did a fresh install of Windows Server 2016. I'm running hqplayer and roon server on this PC, serving a uRendu via a switch.

 

All good, so before i change any physical connections, with everything working as it should, i just bridged the two Ethernet cards and manually set the IP address to the bridged card to the IP address of the connected card prior to bridging (which is a fixed address set in my router based on the card hardware address).

 

As soon as I do this, the networking generally seems fine (eg, i can see roon server on the PC from my iPhone), BUT: hqplayer cannot find the uRendu NAA, even though i have not changed any physical connections at all.

 

Just for laughs, i then tried directly connecting the uRendu to the second card, but it still wouldn't work (not surprisingly).

 

I haven't seen any mention of anyone else having this problem. Suggestions welcome!

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When all else fails, reboot mR.  To me, the mR is the weakest link in my system in regards to ONLY Linux stability.  

Ryzen 7 2700 PC Server, NUC7CJYH w. 4G Apacer RAM as Renderer/LPS 1.2 - IsoRegen/LPS-1/.2 - Singxer SU-1/LPS1.2 - Holo Spring Level 3 DAC - LTA MicroZOTL MZ2 - Modwright KWA 150 Signature Amp - Tidal Audio Piano's.  

.

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2 hours ago, xiddox said:

Hi all, i hope this question hasn't already been answered -- i was following this thread for a while until the forum software change locked me out of tapatalk and the CA app on my iPhone. So i have missed activity in this thread over the past month or two.

 

OK, so I installed a second Ethernet card in my PC, and did a fresh install of Windows Server 2016. I'm running hqplayer and roon server on this PC, serving a uRendu via a switch.

 

All good, so before i change any physical connections, with everything working as it should, i just bridged the two Ethernet cards and manually set the IP address to the bridged card to the IP address of the connected card prior to bridging (which is a fixed address set in my router based on the card hardware address).

 

As soon as I do this, the networking generally seems fine (eg, i can see roon server on the PC from my iPhone), BUT: hqplayer cannot find the uRendu NAA, even though i have not changed any physical connections at all.

 

Just for laughs, i then tried directly connecting the uRendu to the second card, but it still wouldn't work (not surprisingly).

 

I haven't seen any mention of anyone else having this problem. Suggestions welcome!

This won't work because the urendu needs a DHCP server to assign it an IP address.  Some people have had success installing and running a DHCP server program on Windows, not sure about Server though.  Another trick that may work is connect your urendu into your switch it router so that it gets an IP address.  Without powering it off, switch the connection to your bridged network card.  Kind of hokey but it works for some people.  Btw, bridging won't work in Server core mode.

12TB NAS >> i7-6700 Server/Control PC >> i3-5015u NAA >> Singxer SU-1 DDC (modded) >> Holo Spring L3 DAC >> Accustic Arts Power 1 int amp >> Sonus Faber Guaneri Evolution speakers + REL T/5i sub (x2)

 

Other components:

UpTone Audio LPS1.2/IsoRegen, Fiber Switch and FMC, Windows Server 2016 OS, Audiophile Optimizer 3.0, Fidelizer Pro 6, HQ Player, Roonserver, PS Audio P3 AC regenerator, HDPlex 400W ATX & 200W Linear PSU, Light Harmonic Lightspeed Split USB cable, Synergistic Research Tungsten AC power cords, Tara Labs The One speaker cables, Tara Labs The Two Extended with HFX Station IC, Oyaide R1 outlets, Stillpoints Ultra Mini footers, Hi-Fi Tuning fuses, Vicoustic/RealTraps/GIK room treatments

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I have been struggling to bridge my HQPc to my minipc NAA . Tried every trick on the book .. finally spotted this on EBay: Unitek Y 3463 USB 3.0 dual Ethernet Gigabit adapter with auto hardware bridging or 2 PCs : 

it comes with win 8.1 driver .. compatible with WIN 10..

i installed it on the HQpc and NAA PC was bridged with auto IP addressing .. painless

Hqplayer found the NAA easily but u still need to power up the HQPC holding the dual adapter first and then the NAA PC .. run the DAC USB driver and then the net audio software then start up HQ player in that order.. very stable NA connection.. a record of 5-6 hours without stopping connection as long music is playing as normal 

try it.. good luck

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I have been struggling to bridge my HQPc to my minipc NAA . Tried every trick on the book .. finally spotted this on EBay: Unitek Y 3463 USB 3.0 dual Ethernet Gigabit adapter with auto hardware bridging or 2 PCs : 

it comes with win 8.1 driver .. compatible with WIN 10..

i installed it on the HQpc and NAA PC was bridged with auto IP addressing .. painless

Hqplayer found the NAA easily but u still need to power up the HQPC holding the dual adapter first and then the NAA PC .. run the DAC USB driver and then the net audio software then start up HQ player in that order.. very stable NA connection.. a record of 5-6 hours without stopping connection as long music is playing as normal 

try it.. good luck

 

An additional networking tweak

i found a cheaper version to Icron or PS LAN over USB EXTENDER Over the Ethernet 

found it on Lazada:: MT-VIKI USB 2.0 300 meter extender over 10/100 megabit network  (Icron had USB 3.0 version but is700Usd I think).. this is only about 45usd

i take the USB 3.0 output from my NAA try a Douk Audio USB 3.0 filter then into the local MT-VIKI Unit .. output is Ethernet .. I use a Cat 5e cable to the remote MT-VIKI  unit which takes the Ethernet and outputs USB 2.0 signal.

i power this remote MT-VIKI unit with a 5v from my linear D.C. Psu.. then into a LH REVIVE reclocker regen USB unit and into my iDSD Micro

 

Sound Quality is a giant improvement then before..

 

i have tried the MT-VIKI Unit direct connection to the HqPC USB 3.0 output .. without the NAA

GREAT improvement over direct USB output 

The USB Power filter and LH LABS revive re locker chain is constant in all cases 

 

SQ is still a bit less Calm and Quiet compare to NAA without using the MT-VIKI

 

The complete USB bridge and USB-Ethernet extender chai gives the best SQ

 

Just Sharing

 

Happy listening 

 

 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, kelvinwsy said:

have been struggling to bridge my HQPc to my minipc NAA .

Interesting that you had issues since you are using a PC as the NAA.  It should be as easy as assigning a fixed IP to the NAA and maybe setting the priority of your network card.  Either way, glad you got it figured out.

12TB NAS >> i7-6700 Server/Control PC >> i3-5015u NAA >> Singxer SU-1 DDC (modded) >> Holo Spring L3 DAC >> Accustic Arts Power 1 int amp >> Sonus Faber Guaneri Evolution speakers + REL T/5i sub (x2)

 

Other components:

UpTone Audio LPS1.2/IsoRegen, Fiber Switch and FMC, Windows Server 2016 OS, Audiophile Optimizer 3.0, Fidelizer Pro 6, HQ Player, Roonserver, PS Audio P3 AC regenerator, HDPlex 400W ATX & 200W Linear PSU, Light Harmonic Lightspeed Split USB cable, Synergistic Research Tungsten AC power cords, Tara Labs The One speaker cables, Tara Labs The Two Extended with HFX Station IC, Oyaide R1 outlets, Stillpoints Ultra Mini footers, Hi-Fi Tuning fuses, Vicoustic/RealTraps/GIK room treatments

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Thx

yes assigning static IP address is the way to go but my problem is that I switch off everything when I am not listening esp my tube monblic Amps powering my HD800 Hp

so this dual Ethernet adapter with auto bridging us just so convenient and easy 

the MT - VIKI USB extender is cheap and great for SQ 

thanks 

I learn so so much from this CA Forum

where I can contribute in my small way I will always do so

 

thanks again

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