A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[matthias]

27 minutes ago, guiltyboxswapper said:

 

If you are capable of basic DIY, the MPAudio LSIB with 7VA traffo improved on the 7v Farad Super3 (with SRB fuse, Furutech etc...) with quite some ease.  Blacker backgrounds (!), less hash, richer tones and at ease in comparison to the Farad yet would swing hard when music called upon it. 

This was with the oR as the test subject.

 

Thanks for sharing, but 7VA traffo, no typo?

 

Matt

[guiltyboxswapper]

Just now, matthias said:

 

Thanks for sharing, but 7VA traffo, no typo?

 

Matt

 

7VAC output windings, 60VA total capacity.

[matthias]

1 minute ago, guiltyboxswapper said:

 

7VAC output windings, 60VA total capacity.

 

Did you get the traffo from MPAUDIO too?

 

Thanks

 

Matt

[guiltyboxswapper]

4 minutes ago, matthias said:

 

Did you get the traffo from MPAUDIO too?

 

Thanks

 

Matt

 

Yes, snubber then comes configured for PSU.

[bodiebill]

7 hours ago, seeteeyou said:

 

While we're aware that WTFplay couldn't support any network connections yet and having an active network adapter might also affect the SQ to a certain extent, wouldn't it be nice to take advantage of Intel AMT instead since it's always on once we've got that enabled on specific motherboards?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_AMT_versions

 

Basically we just need to get any NUC models listed below or simply take a look at the list linked above, we could simply get any motherboards with one of those "C" / "Q" / "W" series chipsets as well as Intel Core / Xeon processors that are eligible for vPro Platform

 

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000031997/intel-nuc.html

 

We could actually mount an ISO image remotely and then network boot was working just fine as shown below

 

 

Radmin

https://support.radmin.com/index.php?/Knowledgebase/Article/View/9/9/How-to-set-up-Intel-AMT-features

 

Remote Desktop Manager

https://blog.devolutions.net/2016/12/intel-amt-on-rdm-for-mac-ios-android

 

VNC Viewer Plus

https://www.realvnc.com/en/connect/_downloads/VNC_Viewer_Plus_User_Guide.pdf#page=41

 

Intel AMT / vPro KVM without proprietary RealVNC Viewer Plus

https://www.scivision.dev/intel-amt-vpro-full-remote-kvm-control-without-proprietary-realvnc-viewer-plus/

 

MeshCmd, also called “MeshCommand” is a open source command line tool that runs on both Windows and Linux and used to perform many tasks related to computer management.

https://www.meshcommander.com/meshcommander/meshcmd

https://meshcentral2.blogspot.com/2018/11/meshcmd-new-intel-amt-command-line-tool.html

 

How to install wsmancli/wsman on Linux to access KVM

https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/remotely-access-intel-amt-kvm-linux-desktop/

 

No need for monitors / keyboards/ USB sticks, get the playlist loaded and then we could even unplug the Ethernet cable afterwards.

 

Most likely there will be some BIOS options to allow booting without any monitors attached, otherwise it's also quite easy to find a dummy plug like this

 

https://www.amazon.com/CompuLab-fit-Headless-Display-Emulator/dp/B00FLZXGJ6

 

---

 

And then it's also interesting to experiment with getting past POST successfully without an integrated / external GPU whatsoever, not sure if there were any Xeon motherboards that could offer BIOS settings for such setup. We're getting vPro configured properly by connecting a monitor to the PCI-e display card first, then we'll change certain BIOS settings and remove that display card accordingly.

 

While all Intel Core processors with an "F" suffix (i.e. graphics-disabled parts) aren't any good for vPro at all, some Xeon processors and motherboards turned out to be fine with vPro and they didn't come with any integrated graphics to begin with

 

https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/intel/xeon_e3/e3-1240l_v5

 

However, definitely RTFM and make sure that BMC (baseboard management controller) from ASPEED etc. wasn't built right in

 

https://www.aspeedtech.com/support.php

 

For instance, P10S-M-WS/IPMI-O on the left (with an extra line 1 x Aspeed VGA header) should be different from P10S-M-WS on the right

 

https://dlcdnets.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/socket1151/P10S-M_WS/Manual/E13681_P10S-M_WS_Series_UM_V4_WEB.pdf#page=11

 

Also take a look at the block diagram and pay attention to the chipset, it must be C236 or else no love for vPro

 

https://dlcdnets.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/socket1151/P10S-M_WS/Manual/E13681_P10S-M_WS_Series_UM_V4_WEB.pdf#page=140

 

There's another similar model P10S-M (without WS) from Asus and that particular one actually came with C232 without vPro

 

https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/P10S-M/specifications/

 

---

 

For a much faster processor that could still be passively cooled, stuff like E-2224 should do the trick without breaking the bank

 

https://www.provantage.com/intel-bx80684e2224~7ITEP6L7.htm

https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/intel/xeon_e/e-2224

 

The motherboard looked somewhat tricky again, we definitely want that cheaper WS C246M PRO without ASPEED AST2500 BMC

 

https://dlcdnets.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/socket1151/WS-C246M-PRO/Manual/E15306_WS_C246M_PRO_UM_V4_WEB.pdf#page=115

 

WS C246M PRO for $226 (without ASPEED AST2500 BMC)

 

https://www.amazon.com/Workstation-Motherboard-Motherboards-C246M-PRO/dp/B07H8KTG8G

 

WS C246M PRO/SE for $311

 

https://www.amazon.com/WS-C246M-PRO-SE-Motherboard/dp/B07Y66185T

 

---

 

A 100% headless system might sound even better, both DAC and external storage could be connected to JCAT USB Card XE simultaneously via the same CPU-direct PCI-e slot. Of course we've gotta contact the manufacturer first in order to confirm which motherboard model(s) could handle POST without a display card.

 

The networking components are only exposed to the BIOS / Intel Management Engine firmware level, therefore WTFplay shouldn't be affected as long as we're disconnecting the Ethernet cable.

 

Wow, looks pretty complex to me. I think I will continue with networkless wtfplay and unplug the monitor and remote keyboard for really serious listening.

 

Are their settings in the BIOS to minimize the effect of an attached monitor on SQ?

[luisma]

On 5/22/2020 at 11:45 AM, ASRMichael said:

Hi, thoughts I would share my new build

I'm surprised no one have asked what material you are using to block EMI at the front of the chassis, could you please share?

 

[ASRMichael]

1 hour ago, luisma said:

I'm surprised no one have asked what material you are using to block EMI at the front of the chassis, could you please share?

 

Hi, I use this i side the case, also on the inside of the lid! Really deadens the sound of the case. Add mass! 

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Noico-deadening-Automotive-Insulation-dampening/dp/B01KZ5X7KO

[luisma]

1 minute ago, ASRMichael said:

Hi, I use this i side the case, also on the inside of the lid! Really deadens the sound of the case. Add mass! 

Ah, thank you, it blocks vibrations and resonance but not EMI/RFI

[Exocer]

9 hours ago, guiltyboxswapper said:

 

If you are capable of basic DIY, the MPAudio LSIB with 7VA traffo improved on the 7v Farad Super3 (with SRB fuse, Furutech etc...) with quite some ease.  Blacker backgrounds (!), less hash, richer tones and at ease in comparison to the Farad yet would swing hard when music called upon it. 

 

This was with the oR as the test subject.

 

Edit: Super3 7v is very decent as is, so was surprised it was an improvement to be honest.

 

Intrigued by the MPAudio LSIB solution.

 

Which enclosure did you use and is there a build thread for this? Thanks in advanced.

[Johnseye]

2 hours ago, ASRMichael said:

Hi, I use this i side the case, also on the inside of the lid! Really deadens the sound of the case. Add mass! 

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Noico-deadening-Automotive-Insulation-dampening/dp/B01KZ5X7KO

 

2 hours ago, luisma said:

Ah, thank you, it blocks vibrations and resonance but not EMI/RFI

 

Depending on what kind of foil is being used it could provide some EMI/RF blocking

 

[guiltyboxswapper]

1 hour ago, Exocer said:

 

Intrigued by the MPAudio LSIB solution.

 

Which enclosure did you use and is there a build thread for this? Thanks in advanced.

 

One from Modushop - they do custom rear plates if you need them pre-drilled.

 

Build thread - not much to it, tbh.  The hardest bit is making sure you size transformer / load correctly to avoid excessive wastage (heat), but MP can help with that, plus there's a table on their website.

[sandyk]

12 hours ago, R1200CL said:

Maybe you’re both correct 😀

 

Can the explanation be that SMPS affects systems in other ways ? Maybe small EMI or whatever demons produced by the SMPS create something we’re not so aware about yet ?

 

Can extensive use of JSSG360 techniques and power conditioners make the demons vanish ?

 

I guess this is a discussion for another tread, but still you are both correct 😀

 

I suppose if @Superdad wants to, if not already done, he can present diagrams based on a JS-2, battery, and the SMPS powering the LPS-1.2. But will it help, if problem is outside his control ?

I found a worthwhile improvement with my STB's  Coax SPDIF Out ,after earthing the STB's case.

(The STB has an internal SMPS PSU) However, after doing a series of further small improvements including internal earthing improvements in other gear including the DAC and Preamplifier, I realised that I may have inadvertently been also causing a small Earth Loop as my 15W/Ch. Class A amplifier uses a 3pin IEC mains socket.

 I then inserted a 10 ohm resistor in the Earth to the STB case with a further small improvement.

Each small improvement that I made, was in itself barely audible, and I would have had trouble verifying the improvements with DBT, however the total effects were additive and  quite worthwhile.

 

Alex

[Peter Avgeris]

On 5/23/2020 at 12:07 AM, dctom said:

Thanks for this.

Thought I would give the TP-Link 3468 v.3 a try as it is such a low cost. Unfortunately it seems to create a hardware conflict with my Z390 phantom MB and OS. I am running audiolinux are you using windows?

 

 

 

 

 

No. I am using Euphony Linux. Not a conflict in 4 systems! 

[HeeBroG]

17 hours ago, guiltyboxswapper said:

 

One from Modushop - they do custom rear plates if you need them pre-drilled.

 

Build thread - not much to it, tbh.  The hardest bit is making sure you size transformer / load correctly to avoid excessive wastage (heat), but MP can help with that, plus there's a table on their website.

 

As a electronic nube, I would really appreciate it if you could share some internal photos of your finished power supply. 

 

[elan120]

30 minutes ago, HeeBroG said:

 

As a electronic nube, I would really appreciate it if you could share some internal photos of your finished power supply. 

 

I put one together short time ago with different enclosure, and here is the post with one internal picture.

[dctom]

7 hours ago, Peter Avgeris said:

No. I am using Euphony Linux. Not a conflict in 4 systems! 

Thanks - have got it to work now - however , strangely, I need to start up with ethernet cable disconnected, then plug it in when computer is up and running. Otherwise the system will not recognise my internal NVMe internal library storage?

[jean-michel6]

5 hours ago, elan120 said:

I put one together short time ago with different enclosure, and here is the post with one internal picture.

Hi Kevin  

I see that there is an evox capacity on the picture of your psu . Where is it used ? At the output of the mp audio module ? 
Does it helps with sq ?

Thank’s 

[elan120]

15 minutes ago, jean-michel6 said:

I see that there is an evox capacity on the picture of your psu . Where is it used ? At the output of the mp audio module ? 
Does it helps with sq ?

Yes, I placed it right at the output connector between the pos and neg legs.  It does help the SQ and I am experimenting more on my current power supply build (in another thread) using different bypass cap.

[jean-michel6]

Thank’s , what is the reference of the thread where you report your experiment ?

[elan120]

27 minutes ago, jean-michel6 said:

what is the reference of the thread where you report your experiment ?

This is the thread I started yesterday to share a power supply build project, and a different output bypass cap will be incorporated at the end of this build.

[Peter Avgeris]

7 hours ago, dctom said:

Thanks - have got it to work now - however , strangely, I need to start up with ethernet cable disconnected, then plug it in when computer is up and running. Otherwise the system will not recognise my internal NVMe internal library storage?

So strange! 

Do you notice anything better with this little card? In my systems it was a clear winner in every aspect. 

[Metnoc]

Bought a D-LINK GO-SW-16G 16-PORT GIGABIT switch just for fun, I've posted about it just a couple of days ago. I've put it between my roon core and endpoint, as a cheap "reclocker" if you will.

Tried powering it with a sbooster linear psu, it makes it sound more "analogue" as in some roughness is gone. However you also lose some snappiness.

I'll get a proper hifi switch some time in the future, got other hifi priorities now.

Digital signal chain: Router -> Supra cat8 -> switch 1 (a "regular" 8 port with standard psu) -> supra - > roon core server ethernet port 1 -> Supra from roon core server ethernet port 2 -> D-Link GO‑SW‑16G, port 1 -> Supra from D-Link GO‑SW‑16G, port 16 -> endpoint.

 

 

[bodiebill]

On 5/20/2020 at 11:57 PM, bodiebill said:

Trying to simplify my setup and minimize the number (and maximize the quality) of linear power for my single PC with wtfplay, I am now making good use of the dual HDPlex 800W:

 

Paul Hynes SR4-19 => HDPlex 800W DC-ATX group 1 => motherboard + 12V EPS/CPU

Keces P8 dual rail 20V  => HDPlex 800W DC-ATX group 2 => 12V usb HDD + 5V Elfidelity usb card

Keces P8 dual rail 9V => LDOVR DXP-1A5DSC 7.1V => ISO Regen

 

That is, I started using the second group of the HDPlex to get multiple voltages (motherboard, CPU, HDD and usb card) from my best LPS's.

 

Happy with the result re SQ.

 

Correction to the above:

 

I compared two ways to power the Elfidelity usb card:

 

(1) Keces P8 dual rail 9V  =>  MPAudio DLS-HPULN 7V => Chinese LT3045 5V => DIY Supra DC cable => Elfidelity

(2) Paul Hynes SR4 19V  => HDPlex 800W DC-ATX 5V => cheap DC cable => Elfidelity

 

and (1) is way superior. (2) sounds strident and fatiguing.

 

I know that the SR4 is a great PSU, so is the HDPlex messing things up? Hard to imagine it is just the cheap DC cable...

 

 

[lmitche]

47 minutes ago, bodiebill said:

 

Correction to the above:

 

I compared two ways to power the Elfidelity usb card:

 

(1) Keces P8 dual rail 9V  =>  MPAudio DLS-HPULN 7V => Chinese LT3045 5V => DIY Supra DC cable => Elfidelity

(2) Paul Hynes SR4 19V  => HDPlex 800W DC-ATX 5V => cheap DC cable => Elfidelity

 

and (1) is way superior. (2) sounds strident and fatiguing.

 

I know that the SR4 is a great PSU, so is the HDPlex messing things up? Hard to imagine it is just the cheap DC cable...

 

 

What else is being powered by the Hdplex 800 DC to DC-ATX?

[bodiebill]

Just now, lmitche said:

What else is being powered by the Hdplex 800 DC to DC-ATX?

 

- SR4 19V => HDPlex group 1 => various motherboard + 12V EPS/CPU

- Keces P8 20V => HDPlex group 2 => 12V external usb HDD