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A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

The Computer Audiophile

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Most important: please realize this thread is about bleeding edge experimentation and discovery. No one has The Answer™. If you are not into tweaking, just know that you can have a musically satisfying system without doing any of the nutty things we do here.

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7 hours ago, Energy said:

On ldovr.com LT3045 boards the ILIM is connected to GND since monitoring is not used. All the methods on the data sheet also suggest connecting it to GND.

 

If there was a way to cut the output impedance by half I’d do it to all of my LT3045 boards. Please enlighten us. I spent half an hour looking at the data-sheet :(

 

Probably not possible to implement as a mod to existing boards.

 

2 hours ago, bit01 said:

probably page 26 of the datasheet?

 

Bottom of page 25.  Only we don't use a resistor, just the calculated resistance of the trace between them for the ballast drop.

 

 

1 hour ago, henke said:

Got me wondering if the supposed LT3045 on my board are legit. It says:

"LGYP

N912
827"
On them not "LT3045" as my MPaudio board. 
Have anyone seen theese type LT3045 package that I have?

 

Those are just the 10-pad DFN package versions instead of the 12-lead MSOP.

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1 hour ago, Nenon said:

 

And that sounds much better than your NUC directly connected with USB to your DAC? And it sounds better than your NUC USB --> IsoRegen --> DAC? I am just trying to understand if your USB started to sound better than you I2S or your Antipodes Dxe sounds better than your NUC. How do you power the NUC?

Yes my Antipodes Dxe with just usb cable to my Dac. However I’m still evaluating as it’s such a shock.

 

I found that taking out all the spaghetti and add ons including NUC endpoint running AL ramboot, Isoregen and the Ultradigital all powered by PH SR4s got me back to a SQ that was equally detailed but without the harsh edge that had appeared. I cannot stand any edgeiness.

 

The Dac software upgrade (and its FREE) is such a shift that my whole system has been reconfigured. 


Tidal Streaming only: ATL DC Blocker > Topaz 2.5Kva Isolation Transformer > Sine SA5 Cryo 5 power strip > Aqvox 8 port network switch > Antipodes Dxe roon core> PS Audio Directstream Junior Dac 'Windom' > Decware SE84UFO3 Mono Amps > Omega Super Alnico Monitors.

PH SR4 power supplies

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Farad 19v to roon core and 12v to sms200ultra.
Will report back in a couple of days on results compared to uptone lps 1.2 and stock psu among other things.

Farad x2.jpg

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1 hour ago, tapatrick said:

Yes my Antipodes Dxe with just usb cable to my Dac. However I’m still evaluating as it’s such a shock.

 

I found that taking out all the spaghetti and add ons including NUC endpoint running AL ramboot, Isoregen and the Ultradigital all powered by PH SR4s got me back to a SQ that was equally detailed but without the harsh edge that had appeared. I cannot stand any edgeiness.

 

The Dac software upgrade (and its FREE) is such a shift that my whole system has been reconfigured. 

It is actually not so much of a shock and makes sense. I have had similar experience. I upgraded my server to using LPS. silent PC etc. and all the spaghetti like Igalvanic have been removed. I also removed a tube stage that used to make the sound less harsh but it blurs the details and so it is removed when I switched to balanced output.  I have only single USB (optical) with a Regen adaptor that blocks Vbus connected from Server directly to DAC.   The sound is much more open, less processed but yes, details are more prominent and if the recording is poor it stands out more. I see your Antipodes Dxe is pretty hardcore and from what I read, it aims to have as little noise as baseline and has no filters added so it probably is quite a revealing server. And with the revealing DAC then you have this result. If you notice your best recordings are now sounding amazing then you are on the right track! (since improvement in a noise-free environment is most noted often in high quality recordings).  If I am right that you have PS audio which only does DSD (all PCM ---> DSD), which means clock and  power supplies most important (and probably speed too) any crap un between the server and DAC can be detrimental. I find DSD improvement is simply jaw dropping amazing and I can only do DSD256 max in my DAC. (PS audio does like DSD x 10 upsample?)

It is possible that the NUC/AL is more noisy in general than the Antipodes in general, just my guess, and leads to more noise to the DAC which is now somehow very sensitive to impure signal (or jitter or whatever they call this), sorry for layman terms... 

 

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3 hours ago, Metnoc said:

Farad 19v to roon core and 12v to sms200ultra.
Will report back in a couple of days on results compared to uptone lps 1.2 and stock psu among other things.

Farad x2.jpg

  

First update, the sms200u as a roon endpoint is no longer unequivocally an improvement over than just using the usb output from the roon core when supplying the computer with a farad psu rather than the standard psu. Snappier transients with sms but also a “colder” sound and less “analogue”. But this might not come as a surprise to the folks in this forum. The roon core computer is a zotac 620 with a i3-8130U cpu, and no special upgrades such as hifi clocks.
Still prefer windows 10 with fidelizer over Audiolinux though, al sounds cleaner but also too thin.

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3 hours ago, Chopin75 said:

It is actually not so much of a shock and makes sense. I have had similar experience. I upgraded my server to using LPS. silent PC etc. and all the spaghetti like Igalvanic have been removed. I also removed a tube stage that used to make the sound less harsh but it blurs the details and so it is removed when I switched to balanced output.  I have only single USB (optical) with a Regen adaptor that blocks Vbus connected from Server directly to DAC.   The sound is much more open, less processed but yes, details are more prominent and if the recording is poor it stands out more. I see your Antipodes Dxe is pretty hardcore and from what I read, it aims to have as little noise as baseline and has no filters added so it probably is quite a revealing server. And with the revealing DAC then you have this result. If you notice your best recordings are now sounding amazing then you are on the right track! (since improvement in a noise-free environment is most noted often in high quality recordings).  If I am right that you have PS audio which only does DSD (all PCM ---> DSD), which means clock and  power supplies most important (and probably speed too) any crap un between the server and DAC can be detrimental. I find DSD improvement is simply jaw dropping amazing and I can only do DSD256 max in my DAC. (PS audio does like DSD x 10 upsample?)

It is possible that the NUC/AL is more noisy in general than the Antipodes in general, just my guess, and leads to more noise to the DAC which is now somehow very sensitive to impure signal (or jitter or whatever they call this), sorry for layman terms... 

 

Yes I agree the Antipodes plus PS Dac are a great combo (I have had them for some years). All the benefits of my server and Dac were available before I went down the NUC route with other add ons. These made significant improvements to my original set up, which now are detracting from the over all SQ. The software upgrade has moved the goal posts considerably and it's very interesting how much potential there is in FGPA software over hardware. 


Tidal Streaming only: ATL DC Blocker > Topaz 2.5Kva Isolation Transformer > Sine SA5 Cryo 5 power strip > Aqvox 8 port network switch > Antipodes Dxe roon core> PS Audio Directstream Junior Dac 'Windom' > Decware SE84UFO3 Mono Amps > Omega Super Alnico Monitors.

PH SR4 power supplies

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BTW, I have ordered the ECC memory Marcin mentioned through my connection. I was planning to test it, compare with the other memory I have (Apacer and non-Apacer) and post more about it. I will have a couple of extra pieces. PM me if you are looking for it, so we don't go offtopic here. 

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3 hours ago, phusis said:

 

I now intend to upgrade the software part as well, to JPLAY FEMTO for music-only duties, and remain on the JRiver MC25 platform for movies (@Marcin_gps, I'll be looking for your server-tips and the innards to be used here). Used to run JPLAY (Classic?) through JRiver, but that ended with the latter's support withdrawal of the former - not that there really was any to begin with. Being I'm a JPLAY owner though will make use of the price reduction on the FEMTO. 

We will be very interested to hear about how things sound as you go forward!

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30 minutes ago, elan120 said:

 

This JSSG360x2 is quite interesting and I decided to give it a try with the materials just arrived to one of my Lush^2 cable.  So far, with about an hour of playing time, it is clear that I have my new favorite.  Now I am going to modify my other Lush^2 cable to this configuration (A: Y-W,  B: R-B).

 

Here is a picture of my modified Lush^2:

20191011_123217.thumb.jpg.32e6ac920be22428b7d978e690c6ca7f.jpg

Awesome! My next step is to try this jssg360x2 on my ethernet cable 😁👍

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3 hours ago, Bricki said:

Awesome! My next step is to try this jssg360x2 on my ethernet cable 😁👍

Thank you for the experiment result.  I completed the second Lush^2 cable modification earlier, been listening the music for the past two hours and the result is even more evidence.  I also plan to experiment more configurations especially JSSG360x2link and JSSG360x2bullseye mentioned by @ray-dude, but as of now, this is the best configuration I have experienced.

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Im wondering if one stick of RAM will sound better than 2 sticks in dual channel? I have 2× 4GB at the moment but I dont need the performance of dual channel I think and only 2.5GB is used. Has anyone any experience of 1 vs 2 sticks?

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28 minutes ago, henke said:

Im wondering if one stick of RAM will sound better than 2 sticks in dual channel? I have 2× 4GB at the moment but I dont need the performance of dual channel I think and only 2.5GB is used. Has anyone any experience of 1 vs 2 sticks?

Try it, listen and switch a couple of times between one and two sticks.

But don’t forget to power down the steamer, disconnect power cord and discharge yourself on something that goes to earth.

 


Meitner ma1 v2 dac,  Sovereign preamp and power amp,

DIY speakers with scan speak illuminator drivers.

Under development:

NUC7i7dnbe, Euphony Stylus

Clock modded FS105 v3, Clock modded Isoregen, Lush^2

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29 minutes ago, RickyV said:

Try it, listen and switch a couple of times between one and two sticks.

But don’t forget to power down the steamer, disconnect power cord and discharge yourself on something that goes to earth.

 

Yes maybe I will do that :) thought I ask so I know if it's worth trying out. Kind of hard to A/B:ing the change also

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14 hours ago, ray-dude said:

 

I was able to add a fourth shield layer to my Lush^2 cables earlier this week, and I agree that JSSG360x2 is a definite new favorite (absolutely dark backgrounds, no loss of real detail or resolution, very very relaxed and stress free presentation)  Coming from a JSSG360^3 config, impact was immediate and obvious. Thank you @Bricki for doing the additional experiment and reporting your findings!

 

I have a bunch of configurations I plan to test this weekend, mixing and matching the 4 shield layers in different ways

 

For the Lush^2, assuming these wires (from most inner shield to outside shield):

 

1 (White)

2 (Yellow)

3 (Red)

4 (new - block/stripe)

 

I will be testing these configs:

 

JSSG360^3+              A: 1-2-3, 4   B: 1-2-3, 4

JSSG360x2                 A: 1-2, 3-4   B: 1-2, 3-4

JSSG360^3.5             A: 1-2-3, 4   B: 1-2-3-4

JSSG360^4                A: 1-2-3-4   B: 1-2-3-4

 

And for fun:

 

JSSG360x2link          A: 1-3, 2-4   B: 1-3, 2-4

JSSG360x2bullseye  A: 1-4, 2-3   B: 1-4, 2-3

 

Hard to imagine something better than what I'm hearing with 360x2, but very excited to find out!

 

Obviously very effective and efficient shielding works wonders. Possibly why Synergistic Research  Atmosphere X Ref USB cables sound so good, given the very effective shield materials they tell us they use 

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On 10/8/2019 at 1:12 AM, Marcin_gps said:

Those of you who are looking at Apacer industrial ECC RAM, make sure to order the brand new model with Samsung IC:

D31.23185S.001  DDR4 4GB ECC UDIMM 2666 CL19 WT

 

I saw that you're also quite fond of SLC CF cards from Apacer

 

http://jplay.eu/forum/index.php?/topic/2413-apacer-cf-card-extended-range-temperature-as-ssd/#entry41693

http://jplay.eu/forum/index.php?/topic/1141-guide-how-to-properly-set-up-windows-server-2012-on-a-cf-card/page-3#entry41542

 

Their latest model should be CS710-CF and 32GB ones are about $330 on Mouser, did you try previous generations yourself and just wondering if the impact were as significant as what ECC RAM could bring to the table?

 

https://industrial.apacer.com/en-ww/SSD/CS710-CF

https://www.soselectronic.com/products/apacer/ap-cf032grhns-etnrk-320536

https://www.mouser.com/Semiconductors/Memory-ICs/Memory-Modules-Memory-Cards/Memory-Cards/CS710-CF-Series/_/N-fb8vi?P=1y8f0ve

 

Since not all motherboards are compatible with CF-to-SATA adapters these days, their SLC SSDs might seem to be a better to me

 

https://industrial.apacer.com/en-ww/SSD/SS130-25

https://www.soselectronic.com/products/apacer/aps25hu7032g-ktwf-322963

 

SS130-25 was released several months ago and therefore it should be fairly new.

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On 10/8/2019 at 5:14 AM, Superdad said:

The technique is hiding in plain site in the data sheet.  9_9 John has wired LT3045s both ways and measured about half the output impedance when it is done right.  For some reason Alexy at ldovr does not believe it. Oh well...

possible reasons

it is almost useless
it is harmful

i belive that you can get lower impedance with ILIM circuit, but i prefer have lower noise 

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23 minutes ago, Bricki said:

When my Etheregen arrives in January I'm going to need more weights to hold it down 🤣

I've actually been considering flat ethernet cables for the EtherREGEN to keep it from moving around.  Congratulations on some really good experimentation.


NUC7PJYH/AL --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10 Version 1903/HDPLEX 200W/HDPLEX 400W DC-ATX --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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2 hours ago, rickca said:

I've actually been considering flat ethernet cables for the EtherREGEN to keep it from moving around.  Congratulations on some really good experimentation.

If some of your smaller components have a tendency to move around then grab some $5 1kg door stoppers and show those pesky fat cables who's boss. They're also a great conversation starter 🤣IMAG0360.thumb.jpg.dc0404e1643e9b8dc4eacda5ffb08777.jpg

This is an old pic of my system before the days of NUC. If you zoom in you can see the only thing I have in contact with the component chassis are very thin vibration dampening discs👍.  

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