A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[austinpop]

1 minute ago, octaviars said:

 

Perhaps a side track but did the music sound different during the 5 minutes it was playing without the LAN cable connected compared to when it was connected?

 

Good question, but very hard to say!

 

Now this is really a sidetrack, but I have been doing a lot of A/B comparisons of late, and I find that I do a much better job distinguishing differences when I play a snippet in config A, then swap to B, then play the same snippet. And often these snippets need to be 30 seconds or less.

 

On the other hand, if I swap back and forth between config A and B wile a track continues to play, I have a really, really hard time distinguishing anything.

 

Because of this, can you think of a methodology to test what you're asking?

[BigGuy]

On 7/29/2018 at 1:40 PM, elan120 said:

I am using ELECAUDIO DC 5.5/2.1mm connector.  They are well made, very good quality.

 

Here is the link where I purchased mine:  https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/connecteurs-jack/elecaudio-dc-21g-gold-plated-connector-jack-dc-55-21mm-p-9822.html

 

It should be noted that these barrel connectors are NOT Oyaide but Audiophonics labeled...and less expensive than Oyaide by about 1/2 from what I can tell.

[lmitche]

Over here the Oyaides are only used for the lps1 and lps1.2 end of things as the other ends are directly connected to the lt3045 cards via screw type blocks. My sigma 11s mostly have gx16 connectors which are easier to work with.

[Johnseye]

11 minutes ago, lmitche said:

Over here the Oyaides are only used for the lps1 and lps1.2 end of things as the other ends are directly connected to the lt3045 cards via screw type blocks. My sigma 11s mostly have gx16 connectors which are easier to work with.

 

Do you have a good source for the Oyaides or did you get them from eBay?

[lmitche]

2 minutes ago, Johnseye said:

 

Do you have a good source for the Oyaides or did you get them from eBay?

My source has dried up. Sorry.

[Ralf11]

[A] comparing a shorter cable with a longer one introduces another variable (or 2), and it may be a relatively important one - Sandy has has made the same point several times 

 

- but the problem is that there are 2 possible effects and they are countervailing - longer allows better attenuation of EM noise in the source, but also creates a longer antenna to pick up RF noise

 

and speaking of RF noise... I am not sure that a better electrical conductor (silver) will pick up more RF noise - what is the basis for that?

 

[Solstice380]

I

7 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

[A] comparing a shorter cable with a longer one introduces another variable (or 2), and it may be a relatively important one - Sandy has has made the same point several times 

 

- but the problem is that there are 2 possible effects and they are countervailing - longer allows better attenuation of EM noise in the source, but also creates a longer antenna to pick up RF noise

 

and speaking of RF noise... I am not sure that a better electrical conductor (silver) will pick up more RF noise - what is the basis for that?

 

 

I’m looking through my references for metals RFI/EMI susceptibility and found this tech note on electronics. 

 

http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/AppNotes/00001767a.pdf#utm_source=&utm_medium=MicroSolutions&utm_term=&utm_content=MSLD&utm_campaign=AN1767

 

I will see what else I can find. 

[octaviars]

2 hours ago, austinpop said:

Because of this, can you think of a methodology to test what you're asking?

 

No I dont have any good methodology to do a test of this as my system needs a switch between server and endpoint so I can only disconnect the LAN from router so ethernet will perhaps still have som sort of effect on things in my system.

 

The question is when you use a server that is directly connected to a DAC that to me in most cases with Roon seems to buffer the Tidal stream (I have tested and my NUC with ROCK buffer the whole song even if they are more than 10 minutes) and plays from the buffer how anything upstream the LAN connection can/will affect the outcome from the server to the DAC when music (that is streamed) still plays without the LAN connection?

 

Much of the talk regarding LAN is related to groundloops, leakage, clocks and so on that perhaps affects the outcome in different ways but that is only when the LAN cable is connected.

[Solstice380]

16 minutes ago, Solstice380 said:

I

 

I’m looking through my references for metals RFI/EMI susceptibility and found this tech note on electronics. 

 

http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/AppNotes/00001767a.pdf#utm_source=&utm_medium=MicroSolutions&utm_term=&utm_content=MSLD&utm_campaign=AN1767

 

I will see what else I can find. 

 

Here is some interesting info (and a lot of equations) on preventing interference in components.

 

https://www.ieee.li/pdf/viewgraphs/emc_design_fundamentals.pdf

 

Silver "should" have a higher susceptibility because it is higher conductivity than copper. (if I recall correctly)

[Ralf11]

which of the 13 pages of text were you looking at on the App. Note?

 

also don't forget that even if silver picks up EM noise more than copper, the signal may well experience less attenuation (tho the conducted noise would too)

[Solstice380]

3 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

which of the 13 pages of text were you looking at on the App. Note?

 

also don't forget that even if silver picks up EM noise more than copper, the signal may well experience less attenuation (tho the conducted noise would too)

 

The summary LOL !!!  

 

hard to tell which would win.... less signal attenuation or less conducted noise.

[Ralf11]

are we looking at the same thing?  The link to that App. Note does not mention silver per se (search fn) and there is a Conclusion but no Summary.

 

It is about hardening chips for "harsh EMI" env.s (e.g. military etc.)

 

 

anyway, you'd have to measure the effects under the range of control variables expected to see which predominates

[Solstice380]

14 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

are we looking at the same thing?  The link to that App. Note does not mention silver per se (search fn) and there is a Conclusion but no Summary.

 

It is about hardening chips for "harsh EMI" env.s (e.g. military etc.)

 

 

anyway, you'd have to measure the effects under the range of control variables expected to see which predominates

 

Here is a better article on shielding materials, including silver....  It would look like silver may be ~5% more effective - in certain applications.

 

http://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1757-899X/200/1/012045/pdf

[look&listen]

45 minutes ago, Solstice380 said:

found this tech note on electronics. 

 

http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/AppNotes/00001767a.pdf#utm_source=&utm_medium=MicroSolutions&utm_term=&utm_content=MSLD&utm_campaign=AN1767

 

"it is important to note that it is always essential that a Faraday shield be grounded. A floating or open-circuit shield almost invariably increases capacitively coupled noise."

 

But JSSS & JSSS-360 shielded cables not grounded (by design). Any theories why they so effective?

[ElviaCaprice]

2 hours ago, octaviars said:

 

No I dont have any good methodology to do a test of this as my system needs a switch between server and endpoint so I can only disconnect the LAN from router so ethernet will perhaps still have som sort of effect on things in my system.

 

The question is when you use a server that is directly connected to a DAC that to me in most cases with Roon seems to buffer the Tidal stream (I have tested and my NUC with ROCK buffer the whole song even if they are more than 10 minutes) and plays from the buffer how anything upstream the LAN connection can/will affect the outcome from the server to the DAC when music (that is streamed) still plays without the LAN connection?

 

Much of the talk regarding LAN is related to groundloops, leakage, clocks and so on that perhaps affects the outcome in different ways but that is only when the LAN cable is connected.

Won't matter, that streaming data in memory seems to retain any phase noise from clocking?  I find that good power and clocking on a server makes it immune or insignificant to any software tweaks or tricks of memory playback.

[asdf1000]

2 hours ago, look&listen said:

 

But JSSS & JSSS-360 shielded cables not grounded (by design)

 

The 360 method is a community tweak but regarding John’s original DIY method there’s no strict requirement to have the shield floating. You can have the shield connected to ground. So when you say “by design” I’m not sure where this was mentioned to be a requirement.

 

Again, I’m only talking about John’s method, not the 360 community tweak.

[mozes]

10 hours ago, Johnseye said:

 

Is the Oyaide DC connector the best available, and does anyone have a good North American source?  They're available on Ebay for about $17 ea.

Be careful when you buy as there is a lot of fake stuff on eBay. Get something that ships from Japan

 

[lmitche]

1 hour ago, Em2016 said:

 

The 360 method is a community tweak but regarding John’s original DIY method there’s no strict requirement to have the shield floating. You can have the shield connected to ground. So when you say “by design” I’m not sure where this was mentioned to be a requirement.

 

Again, I’m only talking about John’s method, not the 360 community tweak.

John was explicit in his original post that JSSG be floating, not grounded.

[asdf1000]

5 minutes ago, lmitche said:

John was explicit in his original post that JSSG be floating, not grounded.

 

Can you share where he was explicit?

 

"If you add the external wire connected to the shield at both ends, then you CAN connect one or both sides of the shield to the signal ground or some other ground, but you don't NEED to for effective shielding. You will find that in many cases leaving the shield completely disconnected from the rest of the circuit is the best way to go, you get the benefit of properly working shielding without any interaction of the shield with your system. You may wind wind up with static charges on the shielding so a resistance from the shield to ground may be useful in some cases in order to dissipate static charges."

 

Once again, there is no explicit recommendation to have the shield and loop wire floating. You can, but it's not a strict requirement.

 

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/31554-diy-dc-power-cables/?page=9&tab=comments#comment-659092

 

[lmitche]

I guess I read "leaving the shield completely disconnected from the rest of the circuit is the best way to go" as the best way to go.

 

 

[asdf1000]

24 minutes ago, lmitche said:

I guess I read "leaving the shield completely disconnected from the rest of the circuit is the best way to go" as the best way to go.

 

 

 

No worries. Reading what I quoted on the whole, I don't read it as a strict requirement.

 

Absolutely no big deal though, this is just a minor thing.

 

[lmitche]

Ok, I'll say it, " there is more than one way to skin a cat!"

 

You are right of course.

 

Lol, enjoy!

 

Larry

[asdf1000]

Just now, lmitche said:

Ok, I'll say it, " there is more than one way to skin a cat!" You are right of course.

 

Lol, enjoy!

 

Larry

 

Hehe

[tims]

On 7/29/2018 at 2:41 AM, Bruce Orr said:

The metal braid for the Lush was 3/8". 

The Braided black/red sleeve was 3/4"  The next-smaller size red/black sleeve was too small and while I was able to get it about half-way down the cable it was not easy. I decided the risk of damaging the Lush by pulling and tugging on the the sleeve braid was too great. I cut it off, and ordered the 3/4'" red/black sleeve.

I'm not sure what to buy for the metal braid for the lush cable; is this flat braid (@ 3/8") the right one to get to jssg360 the lush?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MEG9V2R/ref=twister_B00M8MEPB8?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

 

Thanks

[Bruce Orr]

38 minutes ago, tims said:

I'm not sure what to buy for the metal braid for the lush cable; is this flat braid (@ 3/8") the right one to get to jssg360 the lush?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MEG9V2R/ref=twister_B00M8MEPB8?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

 

Thanks

 

Yes. This is exactly what to order. Just order enuff for the length of your Lush times 2 since there are two sleeves to put over the Lush.