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A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming


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Most important: please realize this thread is about bleeding edge experimentation and discovery. No one has The Answer™. If you are not into tweaking, just know that you can have a musically satisfying system without doing any of the nutty things we do here.

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6 minutes ago, austinpop said:

I think it's been confirmed that the sMS-200Ultra, like the tX and dX, just includes the sCLK-EX board, which has 4 taps. 2 of these are used internally, and the remaining 2 are available to clock other things.

 

Yes, I also confirmed it myself from SOtM.  The sMS-200Ultra will contain 4 clocks.

 

6 minutes ago, austinpop said:

Oh cool. But hmm, I don't see it. Which website? Can you post a link?

 

https://sotm-usa.com/collections/ultra-series-mods/products/sms-200ultra-audio-network-player-mods

 

For AUS and US customers only.  Otherwise, add $25 for international shipments.

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1 hour ago, TopQuark said:

SOtM now offers a new configuration that includes the sMS-200Ultra and the switch mod.

If I'm using the network bridge 'direct attach' for the sMS-200ultra, where does a switch with a clock upgrade fit into the configuration?  Can someone provide either a description or a diagram, please?

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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Just now, rickca said:

If I'm using the network bridge 'direct attach' for the sMS-200ultra, where does a switch with a clock upgrade fit into the configuration?  Can someone provide either a description or a diagram, please?

 

The network interface set-up can be kept as it is.  Here's how other had it set-up:

 

NAS (fileserver) ► Switch ► Roon Server ► sMS200Ultra ► tX-USBultra (optional) ► DAC

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The trade in value appears to be low if the unit was bought from a European dealer with tax added on top. But it appears to be 40% of the value of a new sms200.

 

In that case, if the unit was bought from a UK dealer for £450, the trade in value should equate to £180 (or $235). This is almost the cost of modification, so I might as well ship them my sms200 in exchange for the modification cost of my newly acquired sms200Ultra (serial number 003 :) )

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8 minutes ago, rickca said:

If I'm using the network bridge 'direct attach' for the sMS-200ultra, where does a switch with a clock upgrade fit into the configuration?  Can someone provide either a description or a diagram, please?

You should just add a switch in between and still use the bridged mode through the modded switch.

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1 hour ago, TopQuark said:

 

SOtM now offers a new configuration that includes the sMS-200Ultra and the switch mod.

I see the price on this is $1500, so $300 more than just the sMS-200Ultra.  I don't recall how much @romaz said he paid for the switch mod, but IIRC it was considerably less than $300.  Does this new configuration includes a switch sourced by SOtM?  In any case, Roy used a very inexpensive switch.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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2 minutes ago, rickca said:

I see the price on this is $1500, so $300 more than just the sMS-200Ultra.  I don't recall how much @romaz said he paid for the switch mod, but IIRC it was considerably less than $300.  I suppose this new configuration includes a switch sourced by SOtM, but they are really inexpensive.

 

I believe he paid like $200 for the mod if I'm not mistaken but that didn't include the switch. SOtM price includes the switch.  Shipping the switch to Korea and back can easily cost $100.  Factor in a 10% discount that is currently offered and it makes it more reasonable.

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11 minutes ago, AmusedToD said:

You should just add a switch in between and still use the bridged mode through the modded switch.

OK thanks!  @TopQuark I do not have a NAS, nor do I use Roon.  My music files are hosted on the Windows 10 machine which has the bridged network connection.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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1 minute ago, rickca said:

OK thanks!  @TopQuark I do not have a NAS, nor do I use Roon.  My music files are hosted on the Windows 10 machine which has the bridged network connection.

 

If that's the case, you can add the switch after the Windows machine but I'm not sure how much the SQ will improve at that point.

 

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13 minutes ago, TopQuark said:

SOtM price includes the switch.

Actually, the web page just says 'include Ethernet switch modification'.  SOtM should explicitly say the price includes a switch and the make/model of the switch.  The way it's currently described makes it sound like the price includes only the clock mod.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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2 hours ago, austinpop said:

 

Eric, 

 

This is speculative, but here is what I take away from Roy's remarks on the Mutec and upcoming SOtM master clocks.

 

If, for example, you get a dX Ultra, with the Master Clock input option, AND the mods to clock the swtich and sMS-200 with SMB connectors, then...

  1. you would immediately benefit from the trifecta, AND
  2. This is the speculative part. Once an even better master clock than the sCLK-EX from Mutec or SOtM is available, you could use this master clock to drive the dX Ultra, and presumably, the benefits of this master clock would flow to the switch and the sMS.

You should confirm this with SOtM.

 

Assuming my understanding is correct, then the extra $200ish for the master clock option may be a worthwhile investment. Of course, it will be a long time before I will be able to justify a $3000+ master clock in my system, but it may make sense to future proof your setup.

 

Until I heard the trifecta in my system, I had never really appreciated the value of excellent clocks.

So I only need one device to have the external clock option or both?

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3 hours ago, semajm85 said:

I'm confused about the switch modification. 

 

So for the price of  $1500 I get the sms200 ultra as well as a modified switch?

 

It clearly shows it in the site now.  Yes, it does include a switch sourced by SOtM.

network player modification.png

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I have made a preorder for boths sms-200 Ultra AND the tx-usb ultra. Just after reading on this fine forum.

I have not been able to follow all thats been said when it comes to the different clocking options and outputs/taps and so on. One reason is It seems a bit too much tinkering and DIY- not for me.

BUT now on the other hand I could add 300 usd to my order and get the modded switch as well. Do you think I should go for it? Does anybody know how many ports on the switch I would get for example? What would I gain SQ wise?

I use a 3G/4G router from ASUS that is like a combined router/switch. In my potential new setup would this ASUS router also benefit from having a upgraded clock?

 

ASUS AC 68 Router ----  modded switch sotm----  SMS-200 Ultra ---- tx-usb ultra ----- Vinnie Rossi Lio DAC

 

My server is this one from Audiostore UK ( Vortexbox UK) http://www.vortexbox.co.uk/Audiostore_Prestige_2/p317978_16932231.aspx

Unfortuneately it seems not that I can use it in bridged mode as it is now

 

Thanks !!:)

 

Magnus

 

Vinnie Rossi LIO integrated amp with DAC, Sotm SMS-200 ultra/TX USB ultra, powered by an Uptone LPS-1 Audiostore Roonserver powered by a  HD plex PS. ASUS router AC 68 powered by a Teddy pardo PS, 

Speakers are standmounts Klångedang T1 with external crossover , Rega Planar 3 Lejonklou Slipsik phonostage

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On 5/20/2017 at 7:26 PM, lmitche said:

The Adnaco works at the PCIE bus level and at 10gb fiber speeds, so is a very different animal then the FMCs used in our early, failed, fiber FMC experiments.

 

Larry, what failed in the early FMC experiments?

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12 hours ago, limniscate said:

So I only need one device to have the external clock option or both?

 

You only would need the master clock input on the Ultra device. This is for the future case where you use an external master clock like the Mutec or future SOtM master clock to improve even further on the sCLK-EX.

 

Regardless of whether you choose the master clock input on the Ultra device, you still need the clock mods, and SMB connections, to send the clock from the Ultra device to other modded devices.

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2 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

You only would need the master clock input on the Ultra device. This is for the future case where you use an external master clock like the Mutec or future SOtM master clock to improve even further on the sCLK-EX.

 

Regardless of whether you choose the master clock input on the Ultra device, you still need the clock mods, and SMB connections, to send the clock from the Ultra device to other modded devices.

Which Ultra device?  I plan to get the dX-USB Ultra and sMS-200 Ultra.  

 

When Roy said that SOtM will remove the first regulator, did he mistype that the tX-USB Ultra works best at 6V?  Earlier in the post he said Lee thinks 9V is the best.

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1 hour ago, ted_b said:

 

Larry, what failed in the early FMC experiments?

Ted, I think most of us that used the externally powered standalone FMCs have all retired them in favor of internal fiber nic cards or direct bridged connections with or without isolation transformers.  Lastly in this thread, it seems to me that copper is preferred with an externally clocked Ethernet switch between NAS and renderer.

Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio

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On 2017-5-21 at 9:05 PM, romaz said:

This will effectively be my last post, at least for the foreseeable future.  As I stated previously, after Munich, I am committed to signing off for a while from public forums and I need to honor this commitment and so forgive me if I don't respond to public or private queries for a period of time.  Once my system is complete, I will attempt to resurface to share my findings for those that are interested but that may not happen soon.  I've enjoyed this thread very much.  I hope it continues.  Thank you all for your friendship.

Hi Roy,

 

Go in peace to honor your commitment.  We'll lots of new disdcvovery to welcome you back.

 

Cheers,

Leo

 

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On 21.05.2017 at 2:57 PM, romaz said:

 

Adnaco makes the JCAT USB card and I have looked at it.  I believe not all regulators on this card are linear.  The SOtM card uses one switching regulator out of necessity while the rest are linear but Lee did his best to filter out its negative impact.  If you are using a high quality PSU like the LPS-1 or if all you have is the LPS-1, then I would probably ask Lee to remove the first stage regulator so that you can power it directly with 5V instead of 9V but then take care to use a well insulated (and as short as possible) DC cable.

 

There are no switching power supplies on the JCAT USB Card FEMTO

 

BR, 

Marcin

JPLAY & JCAT Founder

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