A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[mansr]

17 minutes ago, jabbr said:

No, the Micro has an OTG connector on the input and typically you plug a Type A USB into the computer. OTG to Type A (full sized) are not common. Female Type A connectors can be used but the outer diameter means the fit into the OTG socket is variable, hence the problem...

The Micro has a full-size male Type A connector. There is no full-size OTG (5-pin) connector, only mini and micro.

[Bruce Orr]

Yes. I got both from Jim. I’m sure you did as well. 

[Cornan]

21 minutes ago, jabbr said:

 

No, the Micro has an OTG connector on the input and typically you plug a Type A USB into the computer. OTG to Type A (full sized) are not common. Female Type A connectors can be used but the outer diameter means the fit into the OTG socket is variable, hence the problem...

 

USB A male screw terminal plugs are available. DC 2.1/5.5mm DC male plugs are available. DC 2.1/5.5mm to micro USB male adapters are available. Why not make your own short OTG? 

[Bruce Orr]

3 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Nice!

 

What outlet(s) are you going to use? Did you buy those from Jim?

 

Yes. Bought 2 from Jim. I’m sure you did as well. 

[jabbr]

31 minutes ago, mansr said:

The Micro has a full-size male Type A connector. There is no full-size OTG (5-pin) connector, only mini and micro.

The DAC has full sized Type A *Male* on the device which is recessed into a cutout intended to be used with the full sized end of an OTG cable as depicted here: https://forum.xda-developers.com/general/accessories/review-ifi-audio-micro-idsd-usb-otg-dac-t3350114

 

The full sized Type A female connector is purely so you can power an external item such as a phone, from the internal battery.

 

Point being you can’t use a normal USB cable to plug the DAC into a computer. You can, however, use an AQ Dragontail cable. 

 

Trust me. 

[mansr]

12 minutes ago, jabbr said:

The DAC has full sized Type A *Male* on the device which is recessed into a cutout intended to be used with the full sized end of an OTG cable as depicted here: https://forum.xda-developers.com/general/accessories/review-ifi-audio-micro-idsd-usb-otg-dac-t3350114

 

The full sized Type A female connector is purely so you can power an external item such as a phone, from the internal battery.

 

Point being you can’t use a normal USB cable to plug the DAC into a computer. You can, however, use an AQ Dragontail cable. 

 

Trust me. 

Yes, you need a cable with a female Type A connector. That may or may not be an OTG cable. If the other end is a full-size male Type A, it is not.

[Bricki]

2 hours ago, austinpop said:

 

Hi Bricki,

 

Very impressive. Please help me understand the process:

1. what tinned copper braid did you use? Link please?
2. what diameter?
3. Did you use the same diameter for both layers, or did you go to a larger dia for the outer layer?
4. Did you use heatshrink as the insulating layer, or something else? Keep in mind I don't have a heat gun, but can buy one. Recommendations welcome.
5. Did you put a final (insulated/non conductive) sleeve over the outer braid, or is the outer tinned copper braid the outer sleeve now?

Sorry for these stupid questions - this is still a bit daunting to me.

G'day Rajiv 

 

Here is a link to the 9.5mm(3/8") tinned copper braided sleeving that I used for all layers on both my supra cat8 and curious usb. It is a seller on the Australian ebay website and I think it shipped to me from Sydney. I'm sure you could find the same stuff from a US seller closer to you. 

I used heat shrink as the insulating layer. On the 1 meter supra the heat shrink is best cut into 2 shorter lengths and fed on from each end and then overlap slightly in the middle. Shrink the first length before feeding on the second length. 

 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com.au%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F331440774741

 

The heat gun I have is this one:

 

https://www.bunnings.com.au/ozito-2000w-variable-temperature-heat-gun_p6290265

 

It's good because it has a variable temperature so you can turn it down if working on a delicate cable. I'm sure there are better quality ones that cost more ?. 

 

The outer tinned copper layer is the outer layer now. 

 

With the off cuts (and just for giggles?) I made 2 mini jssg 360 shields over a PoE adapter that overlap. I didn't have long enough off cuts to go the full length. It sounds better than the standard PoE adapter and serves as a temporary solution until I can try the supra DAC that @Cornan has suggested or the gotham Gac. 

 

 

The PoE adapter looks a bit bodgy ?

 

[auricgoldfinger]

4 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

Thanks, Rajiv.  If all goes well by end of day Tues I will have 2 dedicated circuits.  Jim could never get his special wire but with his counsel I will be using 6/2 with 19 twisted strands and a solid core #10 ground wire.Really looking forward to listening.

Separately, have experienced a nice little SQ bump adding 2 Bybee iQSE blocks. I placed one on top of each of the LSP-1.2s powering the SoTM Ultra-tx and the clocked, modded switch. It took a 24 hour burn in.  

 

Where are you sourcing the 6/2 wire with 19 twisted strands?

 

You may want to try the iQSE blocks in your electrical panel.

[Bruce Orr]

My electrician is sourcing it locally I believe. Will find out and share. 

 

Thx. Once the new circuits are in place I’ll try the iQSEs in the main box. Good idea. 

 

Thanks

[austinpop]

3 hours ago, Bricki said:

G'day Rajiv 

 

Here is a link to the 9.5mm(3/8") tinned copper braided sleeving that I used for all layers on both my supra cat8 and curious usb. It is a seller on the Australian ebay website and I think it shipped to me from Sydney. I'm sure you could find the same stuff from a US seller closer to you. 

I used heat shrink as the insulating layer. On the 1 meter supra the heat shrink is best cut into 2 shorter lengths and fed on from each end and then overlap slightly in the middle. Shrink the first length before feeding on the second length. 

 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com.au%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F331440774741

 

The heat gun I have is this one:

 

https://www.bunnings.com.au/ozito-2000w-variable-temperature-heat-gun_p6290265

 

It's good because it has a variable temperature so you can turn it down if working on a delicate cable. I'm sure there are better quality ones that cost more ?. 

 

The outer tinned copper layer is the outer layer now. 

 

With the off cuts (and just for giggles?) I made 2 mini jssg 360 shields over a PoE adapter that overlap. I didn't have long enough off cuts to go the full length. It sounds better than the standard PoE adapter and serves as a temporary solution until I can try the supra DAC that @Cornan has suggested or the gotham Gac. 

 

 

The PoE adapter looks a bit bodgy ?

 

 

Thanks, mate! Based on your details, and some advice from @mozes, I am putting in an Amazon order for:

• both the 1/4" and 3/8" sizes of this one: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MEG9V2R
• both 3/8" and 1/2" of this for the outer sleeve: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071WF5NTN
• this to seal the ends where the inner and outer braids fuse: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HWRO744
• and, good old electrical insulation tape in lieu of heat shrink: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BQWOKW

This should allow me to build JSSG 360 without a heat gun. Once the goodies arrive, I will see how I get on and keep y'all posted.

[sandyk]

19 minutes ago, austinpop said:

This should allow me to build JSSG 360 without a heat gun.

 

Does your Wife/GF have a hair dryer ?

[jean-michel6]

1 hour ago, austinpop said:

 

Thanks, mate! Based on your details, and some advice from @mozes, I am putting in an Amazon order for:

• both the 1/4" and 3/8" sizes of this one: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MEG9V2R
• both 3/8" and 1/2" of this for the outer sleeve: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071WF5NTN
• this to seal the ends where the inner and outer braids fuse: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HWRO744
• and, good old electrical insulation tape in lieu of heat shrink: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BQWOKW

This should allow me to build JSSG 360 without a heat gun. Once the goodies arrive, I will see how I get on and keep y'all posted.

Rajiv 

You may want to try this https://www.amazon.com/Everflow-812-Thread-Plumbers-White/dp/B06XCWQ4D2/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1529299525&sr=8-4&keywords=teflon+plumbers+tape&dpID=41VecOG9clL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

it is very easy to work with it just need to be .2 mm thick. 

The sticky electric tape will make your cable somewhat stiffer. 

I am using the Teflon tape , no tools needed and it work real welll .

[TheAttorney]

3 hours ago, austinpop said:

This should allow me to build JSSG 360 without a heat gun. Once the goodies arrive, I will see how I get on and keep y'all posted.

 

I'm also trying to avoid getting a heat gun for my first experiment. So I'll be trying a hairdrier (which may not get hot enough) and am still deliberating whether it would be brave, or foolish, to put the cable in an oven fo the shortest possible time. The temperature range required tends to be between about 70C - 120C (presumably the highest temp for maximum shrinkage). If I chicken out of the oven option, then the teflon tape idea sounds very promising to maintain flexibility and easy to apply/remove.

 

One thing to consider when ordering the copper braiding: the circular tube size typically relates to its diameter, whereas the flat variety you have linked relates to the width of the flat sleeve, which will be overall smaller for the same quoted value. 

[Cornan]

1 hour ago, TheAttorney said:

I'm also trying to avoid getting a heat gun for my first experiment. So I'll be trying a hairdrier (which may not get hot enough) and am still deliberating whether it would be brave, or foolish, to put the cable in an oven fo the shortest possible time. The temperature range required tends to be between about 70C - 120C (presumably the highest temp for maximum shrinkage). If I chicken out of the oven option, then the teflon tape idea sounds very promising to maintain flexibility and easy to apply/remove.

 

One thing to consider when ordering the copper braiding: the circular tube size typically relates to its diameter, whereas the flat variety you have linked relates to the width of the flat sleeve, which will be overall smaller for the same quoted value. 

 

I can highly recommend the Dremel 2000-6 kit that I use for all of my DIY purposes. It has tips for most normal uses, inkl soldering tip, heat cutter tip & heat gun tip. Works a charm and does’nt cost a fortune! ?

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Dremel-Versatip-2000-6-Soldering-Accessories/dp/B000QGC6XW

 

[One and a half]

1 hour ago, TheAttorney said:

I'm also trying to avoid getting a heat gun for my first experiment. So I'll be trying a hairdrier (which may not get hot enough) and am still deliberating whether it would be brave, or foolish, to put the cable in an oven fo the shortest possible time. The temperature range required tends to be between about 70C - 120C (presumably the highest temp for maximum shrinkage). If I chicken out of the oven option, then the teflon tape idea sounds very promising to maintain flexibility and easy to apply/remove.

 

One thing to consider when ordering the copper braiding: the circular tube size typically relates to its diameter, whereas the flat variety you have linked relates to the width of the flat sleeve, which will be overall smaller for the same quoted value. 

A heat gun melts heat shrink where you want it shrink. A hair drier is not hot enough and doesn’t concentrate in the one area.

 

Also possible to use a soldering iron barrel with some distance, but a heat gun is on for 20s or less and they are cheap enough.

[Bricki]

BTW. I was going to mention in my previous post but ran out of time.

 

The reason I have 5kg door stoppers on top of each component is not because I'm insane, but rather I am using them to balance each component on top of 2 small constrained layer dampening discs. The manufacturer says to put 2 of them under the feet of each component but I have had better results with them in direct contact with the chassis and you only need 2 for each component. They come in boxes of 16 and are far more affordable than most other vibration control systems. Once you get them under every component and your speakers and amp - the difference is enormous. Image focus is greatly improved. On my amp I only use 3 sets of 2 on little wooden blocks from my kids toy box with the discs in direct contact with the bottom of the chassis. Much better bass, much smoother and cleaner treble extension and space between images. 

They even make a difference under my modem/router for tidal streaming. My theory is that they are helping to stabilise the oscillators. But I have had the best results with them under my speakers (between the tops of my stands and the bottom of my speakers). Much better image focus and a much cleaner edge on vocals and blacker backgrounds. 

 

And of course the other advantage of 5kg door stoppers is to hold each component down when using thicker cables and the cable wants to tell the component where to go. The door stopper makes the component boss again ?

 

[Cornan]

10 minutes ago, Bricki said:

BTW. I was going to mention in my previous post but ran out of time.

 

The reason I have 5kg door stoppers on top of each component is not because I'm insane, but rather I am using them to balance each component on top of 2 small constrained layer dampening discs. The manufacturer says to put 2 of them under the feet of each component but I have had better results with them in direct contact with the chassis and you only need 2 for each component. They come in boxes of 16 and are far more affordable than most other vibration control systems. Once you get them under every component and your speakers and amp - the difference is enormous. Image focus is greatly improved. On my amp I only use 3 sets of 2 on little wooden blocks from my kids toy box with the discs in direct contact with the bottom of the chassis. Much better bass, much smoother and cleaner treble extension and space between images. 

They even make a difference under my modem/router for tidal streaming. My theory is that they are helping to stabilise the oscillators. But I have had the best results with them under my speakers (between the tops of my stands and the bottom of my speakers). Much better image focus and a much cleaner edge on vocals and blacker backgrounds. 

 

And of course the other advantage of 5kg door stoppers is to hold each component down when using thicker cables and the cable wants to tell the component where to go. The door stopper makes the component boss again ?

 

 

No, you’re not insane! ? I use 18 pcs Entreq Catfoot’s all over the place with great results (under and over equipment). Perticularly effective between my Atacama SL400i speaker stands top plate (w/IKEA bamboo butcher board base) and my Gibson Les Paul 8. ? 

 

 

[asdf1000]

12 hours ago, jabbr said:

Its really hard to find OTG to USB 2.0 cables (not Micro!!!).

 

https://artsexcellence.com/ifi-otg-usb-c-adapter.html

[Bricki]

14 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

No, you’re not insane! ? I use 18 pcs Entreq Catfoot’s all over the place with great results (under and over equipment). Perticularly effective between my Atacama SL400i speaker stands top plate (w/IKEA bamboo butcher board base) and my Gibson Les Paul 8. ? 

 

 

Fantastic! ?. I have seen a number of photos of your equipment and can only imagine how it all must sound. Vibration control certainly can make a significant difference in a system. Those speakers look amazing too ?

[austinpop]

7 hours ago, TheAttorney said:

I'm also trying to avoid getting a heat gun for my first experiment. So I'll be trying a hairdrier (which may not get hot enough) and am still deliberating whether it would be brave, or foolish, to put the cable in an oven fo the shortest possible time. The temperature range required tends to be between about 70C - 120C (presumably the highest temp for maximum shrinkage). If I chicken out of the oven option, then the teflon tape idea sounds very promising to maintain flexibility and easy to apply/remove.

 

Yes, me too. I plan to experiment with both electrical tape and the aforementioned teflon tape.

 

7 hours ago, TheAttorney said:

One thing to consider when ordering the copper braiding: the circular tube size typically relates to its diameter, whereas the flat variety you have linked relates to the width of the flat sleeve, which will be overall smaller for the same quoted value. 

 

Ugh, you are correct, I missed that. @Bricki, @d_elm, you were the folks who mentioned using 3/8" braid for the Supra Ethernet cable. Was that the specified diameter, or the flat value?

[austinpop]

14 hours ago, Bricki said:

Here is a link to the 9.5mm(3/8") tinned copper braided sleeving that I used for all layers on both my supra cat8 and curious usb.

 

Sorry - I should have looked more carefully. You did indeed order by diameter not flat.

 

Time for another Amazon order.

[sig8]

This is the heat gun I have and it works well on heat shrinks, just to serve as an example:

https://www.amazon.com/Wagner-0503040-Digital-Settings-250%E1%B5%92F-1350%E1%B5%92F/dp/B00BV14VMA/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1529337902&sr=8-5&keywords=wagner+heat+gun

 

I received Electriduct braid over the weekend, and compared to Belden tinned braid which I had, Belden is of much higher quality, though little more expensive, but in scheme of things something to consider. While shielding; better shield should yield better results in my opinion. Belden 8669 is a 1/2" dia, and they come in several sizes.

 

Alos, I did not find good selection of heat shrinks on Amazon, so this s a very good source for heat shrinks, I use their basic, non-glued 3-1 with good results. Glued gets very stiff and may never come-off, and knowing our track record, we might be doing something else on our cables in two months:

 

https://www.cableorganizer.com/heat-shrink/heat-shrink3.htm

[Johnseye]

4 minutes ago, sig8 said:

This is the heat gun I have and it works well on heat shrinks, just to serve as an example:

https://www.amazon.com/Wagner-0503040-Digital-Settings-250ᵒF-1350ᵒF/dp/B00BV14VMA/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1529337902&sr=8-5&keywords=wagner+heat+gun

 

I received Electriduct braid over the weekend, and compared to Belden tinned braid which I had, Belden is of much higher quality, though little more expensive, but in scheme of things something to consider. While shielding; better shield should yield better results in my opinion. Belden 8669 is a 1/2" dia, and they come in several sizes.

 

Alos, I did not find good selection of heat shrinks on Amazon, so this s a very good source for heat shrinks, I use their basic, non-glued 3-1 with good results. Glued gets very stiff and may never come-off, and knowing our track record, we might be doing something else on our cables in two months:

 

https://www.cableorganizer.com/heat-shrink/heat-shrink3.htm

 

Awesome.  This is great info on the shrink wrap.  3:1 and color options.  Not a bad price for length either.

 

Thanks!

[BigGuy]

5 minutes ago, sig8 said:

This is the heat gun I have and it works well on heat shrinks, just to serve as an example:

https://www.amazon.com/Wagner-0503040-Digital-Settings-250ᵒF-1350ᵒF/dp/B00BV14VMA/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1529337902&sr=8-5&keywords=wagner+heat+gun

 

I received Electriduct braid over the weekend, and compared to Belden tinned braid which I had, Belden is of much higher quality, though little more expensive, but in scheme of things something to consider. While shielding; better shield should yield better results in my opinion. Belden 8669 is a 1/2" dia, and they come in several sizes.

 

Alos, I did not find good selection of heat shrinks on Amazon, so this s a very good source for heat shrinks, I use their basic, non-glued 3-1 with good results. Glued gets very stiff and may never come-off, and knowing our track record, we might be doing something else on our cables in two months:

 

https://www.cableorganizer.com/heat-shrink/heat-shrink3.htm

Another vry good source for all things wire-ey...

 

https://www.wirecare.com/

[Johnseye]

4 minutes ago, BigGuy said:

Another vry good source for all things wire-ey...

 

https://www.wirecare.com/

 

 

Hello!  EMI shield shrink tube!

 

https://www.wirecare.com/manufacturer/shrinkflex/shrinkflex-emi-shielding