A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[Blake]

1 hour ago, R1200CL said:

 

https://www.ghentaudio.com/part/dc-gac4.html

 

Thanks for the link.  I just ordered one.  I only read a few pages of this thread but it seems like people are pretty jazzed about the improvements so hey, I'll roll the dice.

 

Next project, trying out the Sablon Audio USB cable and Ethernet cable.  The fun never ends in this hobby.

 

[Blake]

On 6/30/2018 at 2:45 AM, BigAlMc said:

 

Up until now my lack of technical chops had put me off. Though I need to admit being very intrigued by @austinpops efforts and method. More on that in a minute.

 

Just ordered two JSSG360 from Ghent. 

 

One standard DC-DC for my LPS-1.2 to TX-USBultra. 

 

The other DC to Hirose HR10 thingy for my SPS-500 to sCLK-OCX10 

 

Looking forward to trying out @lmitcheJSSG360 inspiration for myself.

 

Question for Larry, Rajiv or the gang. 

 

So it looks like I have the DC part covered but I've been thinking about the other obvious suspects. In my case that would be the 1 metre LAN cable between switch and server, the 2 x 1 metre USB cables from server to TX-USBultra and onwards to DAC. And the 1.5m clock BNC cable. 

 

Even with Rajivs simple method the lengths of the cables seems a bit daunting. Not to mention the concern over vandalising some fairly expensive (and attractive) cables. 

 

The ethernet cable is the Sablon which ironically just displaced the Ghent JSSG Lan cable that served me very well to date. 

 

The USB cables are the Curious and the Sablon Reserva. Both of separate the power from the data with a separate run. An exposed copper wire for the Curious. A separate covered run for the Sablon. If you look closely at pic there are two runs, each separately covered. 

 

Any thoughts on whether these USB cables having separate power and data runs is likely to be a factor if applying JSSG360 to them? 

 

Are my concerns on the length of the cables justified? 

 

Also Rajiv, how reversible do you think your JSSG360 approach is? These are fairly expensive cables if I botch it?

 

Cheers, 

Alan 

 

PS Ghent is a pleasure to deal with and very reliable, for those considering ordering from him. 

 

Alan, did you end up trying the JSSG360 methods on your Sablon Audio USB and Ethernet cables?  I have them both on demo now from Sablon and they are so damn good!  No way I am sending them back to Sablon.  Curious though if this process would further improve them (although I can't imagine it because they seem like absolute perfection "as is").

[Blake]

3 hours ago, jean-michel6 said:

Have you compared the sablon to the Lush ?

 

Hey Jean-Michel,  I have not.  I've had probably a dozen different usb cables over the years, but I've never tried the Lush.  The Sablon is significantly better than any other usb cable I've owned (Curious, TotalDac D1, Lightspeed 10G, Uptone USPCB, Mapleshade, Nordost Blue Heaven, iFi, Cardas, etc.). 

 

My Ghent Gotham DC cable is almost here.  Looking forward to comparing to my other Ghent DC cable (DC04- Canare 4S6). 

[Blake]

2 hours ago, jean-michel6 said:

Which sablon usb cable do you have ?

 

The lush is vastly superior to both of these  this is why I was curious of the comparison between the lush and the sablon. 

 

 

I have the powered Reserva.  I'm not sure if the powered Elite version will work with my Berkeley USB Converter.  i plan on asking Sablon before finalizing my purchase.

 

With respect to Sablon vs Lush comparisons, I am pretty sure I recall seeing a few comparisons by some users on another audio forum or even possibly CA??  Will update if I can remember where I saw them... 

[Blake]

9 hours ago, lmitche said:

If this is a Gotham cable it will take 48 hours to burn in.

 

My Ghent Gotham just arrived and is now in the system.  Do things continue to change in terms of sonics after 48 hours or is the sound stabilized at 48 hours?

 

[Blake]

On 7/12/2018 at 9:31 AM, Blake said:

 

Hey Jean-Michel,  I have not.  I've had probably a dozen different usb cables over the years, but I've never tried the Lush.  The Sablon is significantly better than any other usb cable I've owned (Curious, TotalDac D1, Lightspeed 10G, Uptone USPCB, Mapleshade, Nordost Blue Heaven, iFi, Cardas, etc.). 

 

My Ghent Gotham DC cable is almost here.  Looking forward to comparing to my other Ghent DC cable (DC04- Canare 4S6). 

 

Ok, my Ghent Gotham is burned in so I thought I would post my thoughts, comparing the Gotham to my Ghent Canare 4S6 star quad (not JSSG):

 

There is a rather evident increase in clarity/transparency, which allows more subtle musical elements to be more distinct and audible and the sound stage to be more distinct.  For example, the softer bell or chime sound in this song that is set back in the sound stage is more apparent/easily discernable:

 

 

That part is great as I am constantly seeking to increase clarity.

 

Unfortunately, I am also experiencing some glare or hardness to the treble.  To be fair to the Gotham, I have extreme sensitivity to treble frequencies. For example some headphones (HE-400) or vacuum tube models (12au7 clear tops) have consistently given me an ear ache after only a couple of songs, so it is my unique hearing that is the culprit.  Again, using the above song as an example, the repeating "high-hat" cymbal sound is uncomfortable to listen to and that is the glare I am speaking of.  With my Canare in the system, that is not the case.  The high-hat is bright, but not uncomfortably hard. However, the Canare has less clarity.

 

I know this song is not the ultimate test material and not the finest in fidelity, but I am using it because it gives an example of both the positive and negative aspects (just my subjective opinion) to the Gotham.  These attributes were evident to me as I ran through my dozens of test tracks.

 

Now, taken in context, I am perhaps the lone dissenter on this cable and others love it, so it is just me and my unique characteristics.  The Gotham is my first JSSG cable, so now my question is, is the glare/hardness a result of the metallurgy of the Gotham or JSSG?  I am thinking it must be the Gotham and not JSSG, so I will try a different JSSG DC cable.

 

If anyone has ideas or suggestions, that would be terrific.  I do have a custom Revelation Audio Labs Parable CryoSilver Reference DC cable with additional silver that I would be willing to have someone JSSG to give it another shot.  Does anyone know a person or company who does JSSG treatment at a reasonable cost?

 

[Blake]

9 hours ago, jean-michel6 said:

Where in your system are you using the Gotham or canare DC cable ? 

 

Between my LPS 1.2 and UltraRendu

[Blake]

1 hour ago, lmitche said:

Blake, Have you treated your USB cable with JSSG 360? Larry

 

Hi Larry, I have not.  

[Blake]

16 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

Count me as a JSSG 360 fan. Nodded my two Lush cables just today. Really nice and assume it too will burn-in more in the next 48 hours. If not, I’m still happy. Thx for the step-by-step directions, Rajiv!

 

 

 

I have been searching this thread for a while and can't find the step by step instructions.  Can anyone link them?

 

 

[Blake]

3 minutes ago, rickca said:

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/30376-a-novel-way-to-massively-improve-the-sq-of-computer-audio-streaming/?do=findComment&comment=836649

 

 

Thanks!

 

[Blake]

1 hour ago, rickca said:

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/30376-a-novel-way-to-massively-improve-the-sq-of-computer-audio-streaming/?do=findComment&comment=836649

 

 

I assumed this process involved cutting/soldering/re-terminating.  Now, I see that you are simply sliding two layers of the Electriduct tinned copper braid over the existing cable and then twisting some of the braid strands together and then taping it together.  So that is why members are saying it is easily reversible.?

 

A few questions from this JSSG 360 diy noob:

 

1. Rajiv mentions twisting wires from the two tinned copper braids together.  Is he just separating out a few strands from each of the two braids and twisting them together, or does this tinned copper braid have an actual wire incorporated into the braid?

 

2. Does the tinned braid have to make physical contact with the plugs on the cable, without any tape between?

 

3.  For a usb cable with separate power/data legs, do you put two separate tinned copper braids on each leg?

 

4. For a usb cable like the Curious, which has a separate naked leg, is it OK for the tinned copper braid to be taped on to the naked leg?

 

5. What size tinned copper braid do people buy to fit over a usb cable?

 

6. Would it matter if the tinned copper braid is substantially larger in diameter than the cable?

 

  

[Blake]

7 hours ago, Bricki said:

Have fun and let us know what you reckon ?

 

 

 Hey Bricki/Austinpop, many thanks for the assistance!

[Blake]

13 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

I would love love to hear if the Gotham can top that, but I’m just hopelessly confused by the Gotham JSSG 360 process. If someone wants to lend me their JSSG 360’d Gotham for a week or so to audition I wouldn’t say no!

 

 

 

I will lend you my Ghent JSSG 360 Gotham. Check your pm.

[Blake]

35 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Second, I don't know if the Gotham has had any burn in at all. @Blake?

 

I'll let the Ghent Gotham cable burn in for the next couple days, and retry the test. Stay tuned.

 

It had about one week of "power on" time before I sent it to you.

[Blake]

7 hours ago, Johnseye said:

 

Thanks.

How can someone determine whether the connectors are counterfeit or real?

 

Patrick at Cullen Cable told me in February he was not able to find any Oyaide connectors anywhere for a DC cable he was working on for me.  He said all he could find were knock off's.  I did some searching after hearing that and couldn't find any suppliers.

 

Of course, Ghent seems to be able to get them but perhaps they really stocked up before the shortage hit?

[Blake]

Regarding the experimental nature of this thread overall, many of our greatest ideas came about through accidents

 

 

[Blake]

10 minutes ago, tapatrick said:

The most striking quality is an ease that is very satisfying. There is a tremendous amount of detail arising in a deep rich black landscape with a more distinct 3D soundstage and well defined individual musicians and instruments. I had enough detail already with my set up but it's the EASE that strikes me the most with the NUC. Emotionally I find this very satisfying and compelling.

 

 

Thanks for posting your feedback.  One follow-up question- are you hearing more detail, or the same amount of detail, just presented in a more relaxed manner?

[Blake]

3 hours ago, austinpop said:

Is this the conclusion? For me and many of us here - you know it isn't! I have zero doubt we will learn more, and we will continue to improve the SQ of our systems. Ultimately this thread stays popular because a critical mass of people try these findings for themselves and report their findings. As Larry pointed out, not everyone hears the same effect, or even a positive change. That's OK too. We all start from a different baseline, and we all hear things differently. 

 

The only "conclusion" is to ask what people are using currently, and I'll post a diagram soon, but my system is till in flux. 

 

Well stated.  This should be a sticky!  This area is rapidly changing.  At some point, you have to decide whether you want to continue to spectate, or jump on board and buy/try something.  The only thing certain is that a year from now, all will likely have changed to something else.

 

For me personally, I have decided to continue to monitor things until a friendly consumer version is available that will not require frequent visits to the NUC/AL troubleshooting thread.  

 

Oh, and the other thing that jumps out to me- be cautious about spending a lot of money on this part of your system or servers, clocks or DACs for that matter.  Things are changing too quickly and today's treasure is tomorrow's "meh" product and the value of used items plummet.  Very much like computers.

 

However, that is what is great about this NUC/AL solution- this stuff is cheap if you are DIY.

 

 

[Blake]

3 hours ago, afrancois said:

These have been my dream speakers for many years. Literally sound and vision. Beautiful to watch and lovely to listen to.

 

Off Topic:  The Music Room has brand new Diablo III's at 50% off (very tempting).

 

Back to Topic:  Larry makes a great point- it seems one area of reported improvement with the NUC+AL solution is with respect to improved soundstaging/imaging/layering.  Headphones have great qualities, but in terms of revealing soundstaging/imaging/layering, headphones cannot even begin to compare to speakers which excel in terms of those sonic aspects, that are properly positioned in an acoustically treated room, particularly in a more "nearfield" setup. Of course, certain speaker types which are jammed against the wall (unless specifically designed to be placed there), will also be deficient. 

 

If a reviewer is only using headphones, I personally take this into account when considering reviews.  Optimally, a reviewer should use both headphones and speakers.

 

As such, I would think that NUC+AL differences may not be as dramatic for headphone users.

 

 

 

 

[Blake]

26 minutes ago, Advieira said:

 @bobfa said NUC (without mods and adds) is much better than MicroRendu ("a very big yes", he said in preference between them). If a fanless case and a LPS give a big impact too, the conclusion is very easy: a NUC fanless + LPS ($1k) is completely, massively and unquestionably superior than Ultrarendu/JS2 ($2k).

 

This makes it seem like you are cheering for your favorite sports team.  😁

 

It may well be that after enough members have directly compared the NUC+AL against the UR, we have a consensus, or perhaps not.  Ideally, we need lots of input from members with differing systems before statements like yours should be made IMHO.

 

 

[Blake]

1 hour ago, mikicasellas said:

Yes they are very good, i have the one to connect the ISO REGEN to LPS-1 with also great results

 

Has anyone in the forum heard how better in terms of performance do the ones with the JSSG360 compared with the standard Canare 4S6 DC cable without JSSG360?:

 

DC-J01 Teflon Silver-Plated Star Quad DC(JSSG360) Cable

DC-GAC4 Gotham GAC-4/1 11301 UltraPro Star Quad DC(JSSG360) Cable

DC-7N16C Neotech UPOCC 7N Copper 16AWG DC(JSSG360) Cable

 

I bought the Gotham JSSG360 cable as well as the Canare 4S6 (not JSSG) DC cables from Ghentaudio.com and compared them to my Revelation Audio Labs Passage Cryosilver DC cable. Comparatively speaking, I thought the Gotham had a better soundstage than the Canare with more air and delineation, while the Canare had a more full, round and meaty sound. 

 

However, I thought the Gotham had some glare in the high frequencies that made it fatiguing for me, so I sold it and kept the Canare for my office system.  I do like the Canare.

 

Overall, the Revelation Audio Passage Cryosilver bettered both of them and it is staying put in the main rig.  I think this is all system dependent and you need to try for yourself as YMMV.   

[Blake]

I've been running the Sablon Reserva usb and ethernet cable and love them.  I've been running Sablon power cords to all of my components for a very, very long time (a number of years ago I had borrowed a 6 or so power cables from the Cable Company, together with about another half dozen power cords I had acquired and took a week to extensively compare them head-to-head and Sablon beat them all). 

 

Mark is a great guy.  I placed my order for his new 2020 usb cable.  I'll put my current 2017 Reserva in my second system.  2017 Reserva beat out many usb cables in my head to head comparisons (Light Harmonic 10G, 2G and 1G, Curious, Nordost Blue Heaven, Mapleshade Clearlink, King Rex uArt, iFi Gemini, Cardas, AudioQuest, and TotalDac).  TotalDac is a very good cable as well, but Sablon for me is tops.

 

[Blake]

ignore, error

[Blake]

1 hour ago, ASRMichael said:

Hi Blake, I’m awaiting mine also. The fact it compares to Intona Ultimate which cost 4 times the price, really makes this a bargain. Question, do you use Sablon ethernet cables or have you? How do they compare to others? 

 

Hi, yes I am using the Sablon Panatela Ethernet cable. However, I only compared the Sablon ethernet to two other cables- a generic one, and a Blue Jeans Cable.  

[Blake]

On 2/2/2020 at 1:03 AM, seeteeyou said:

 

FYI - Roy compared Intona Ultimate to the latest 2020 model of Sablon Audio Panatela Reserva Elite

 

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/sablon-usb-cable-2020-model.29912/page-2#post-625197

 

It's starting at $650 for the unpowered version and $750 for the power version respectively

 

http://www.sablonaudio.com/index.php/signal

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/sablon-usb-cable-2020-model.29912/#post-622874

 

 

I am loving my 2020 Sablon Reserva Elite usb!.  Transparency, air, resolution seem limitless, and it is all presented in a very natural organic way.  The sonic improvement is significant. Mark is really on to something here.  I will get a review in the epic usb cable comparison thread at a later date. In case anyone is wondering about that thread:

 

 

If you are on the search for a new usb cable give this one a try.