A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[asdf1000]

1 hour ago, romaz said:

In my experience, it is very hard (if not impossible) to be both George Foreman and Usain Bolt.  To be forced to choose one or the other results in significant compromises.  

 

Classic (and so true) 

[asdf1000]

On 6/8/2017 at 0:55 AM, Marcin_gps said:

Oh, it is coming very soon - still in June! 

 

Hi @Marcin_gps

 

Can you kindly share some details about this.

Is it going to be a high end switch (i.e. multiple ethernet ports) or a device with a single ethernet input and a single ethernet output?

 

And what features will it have? Linear regulators, re-clocking, signal integrity regeneration etc?

 

Cheers!

 

Sean

[asdf1000]

7 hours ago, Cornan said:

ith Tidal as the only source the Aqvox switch-8 have the best clock

 

Hi Cornan, what clock does their switch use? I've sent a few emails but no response.

 

Have you (or anyone here) ever taken a photo of the inside?

 

Does it use only ultra low noise linear regulators ?

 

Cheers

[asdf1000]

5 minutes ago, ElviaCaprice said:

Adding the USPCB from Uptone between the server and ISO Regen was huge (my last update, replacing a Supra USB chord), along with between the ISO Regen and DAC.

 

Thanks for sharing ! So having the computer/server so close to the DAC (with the very short USPCB) was the better compromise than using the longer Supra USB cable to feed the ISO REGEN?

 

Definitely the USPCB on the output of the ISO REGEN is almost a must but I would have thought some separation between the server and DAC is necessary. I guess like everything it's system dependent. E.g. if the server and DAC are both incredibly well shielded against RF/EMI that helps.

 

[asdf1000]

6 hours ago, BigGuy said:

He traps his own bass.

 

All gold but this 

[asdf1000]

Does anyone have a GS105 or GS108 that they could loan to John to see if these current production switches also block leakage current like the FS105/FS108?

 

If John were close to me I'd happily drop him one to look at but I'm on the other side of the world :-(

 

[asdf1000]

4 hours ago, mozes said:

do we really need all those long chains to enjoy music?

 

Absolutely not (in my opinion only). No 'need', definitely not to enjoy the music. I could seriously enjoy the music with just my Macbook > direct USB cable > Peachtree Nova 125se > LS50's (passive). 

 

The addiction we all suffer from results from when you tweak the chain and tweak (an addition or subtraction) that makes you enjoy the music even more. Then another thing gets tweaked and you enjoy it more again. 

 

And so down the rabbit hole we go lol.

 

2 hours ago, ElviaCaprice said:

I've never found an all in one system (same brand purchase) to be as good as separates.

 

As they say, there's no such thing as a free lunch. There's always trade-offs with the all-in-one approach, just as there are always trade-offs with adding more pasta to the spaghetti solution approach.

 

It's always a constant juggling act between trade-offs. That's the fun of it all though !  lol

 

 

[asdf1000]

27 minutes ago, Cornan said:

There is always trade offs when money is involved. No one is saying that the KEF wireless LS50 will concur a truly high end system or is without a trade off, but it sounds like high end in a simple package and atleast start my own dream for a simple solution where music is in absolute focus in a system that all my friends and family members knows how to use. ?

 

 

Well said Cornan!

 

The wireless LS50's sound amazing whichever input you use.

 

But you have the ultimate simplicity using a DLNA/UPnP/Roon Server which gives you nearly all of the software control options you could want - all played direct to the speakers.

 

[asdf1000]

26 minutes ago, ElviaCaprice said:

Compared to what?  

 

Hi mate. Not looking for a fight here.

 

I would hope that I am able to say that the wireless LS50's sound amazing, as a stand alone statement, without the need to compare it to anything? 

 

There doesn't always have to be a pissing contest to enjoy music, which is all that these last few posts have been discussing - enjoying music.

 

I should add that when I talk about my simple LS50's setup - that was a few years ago... My system if very different (and much more complicated) now. And when I talk about going down the rabbit hole and adding more pasta to the spaghetti solution - that includes me :-)

 

Noted though that it's probably off topic of this thread.

 

 

[asdf1000]

On 05/02/2018 at 10:11 AM, JohnSwenson said:

As a side point to all this I am just starting some fundamental research into how phase noise from clocks in different parts of a system interact and move around a system. The ultimate goal is to figure out how to prevent any of this from getting into a DAC, which make all of this irrelevant.

 

Hi John @JohnSwenson

 

While it's complicated stuff for sure, it's kind of semi intuitive for a layman like me to understand that it's possible phase noise (or something else that isn't leakage currents) along the chain can interact and move around the system into your DAC. How phase noise moves around and how it interacts is the complicated stuff, for smart people like you.

 

BUT, from my layman perspective - how does a wireless (WiFi) networked USB endpoint fit into this picture? Is the phase noise of this wireless/mobile USB endpoint now the only phase noise that matters feeding the USB DAC input, since there is no electrical connection with the upstream components?

 

I guess the obvious silly question I'm asking is, does this problematic phase noise you're studying, travel over WiFi? LOL it sounds like such a silly question even reading it back to myself but I need to ask. If a WiFi USB endpoint is running off batteries, then you have no leakage currents involved in that path. No such thing as a free lunch of course, since you have potential RF/EMI issues.

 

But for these questions, just putt aside potential for RF/EMI issues with wireless transmissions and assume bit perfect playback of course.

 

Cheers!

 

[asdf1000]

1 minute ago, JohnSwenson said:

The answer is "I don't know". That is why I am doing the research, to find out what is going. Before I do that, ANYTHING is purely a guess.

 

Six months to a year from now I will be able to answer that question, but as of now, no idea.

 

John S.

 

Thanks John. This makes me feel a little better , that the question "can phase noise travel over WiFi" isn't as silly a question as I first thought.

 

[asdf1000]

https://www.audiostream.com/content/barn-gigafoilv4-–-inline

 

Their "FOIL" trademark stands for fiber optic isolation link so I assume it really is fiber optic.

 

This is a brochure for their older model:

https://www.djmelectronics.com/GigaFOILv3 Brochure.pdf

 

They even appear to have a high speed USB 2.0 isolator that uses optical isolation (apparently) which I've never heard of before:

 

https://www.djmelectronics.com/usb-emi-rfi-filter.html

 

Has anyone had any experience with any of their products?

 

I've mentioned this in another forum also but I can't find a single review anywhere and the price but that could be because they appear to supply industrial and military industries, not audiophile specifically.

 

[asdf1000]

31 minutes ago, BigGuy said:

and whether any commercial cables satisfy it?! 

 

A couple of High Speed Certified USB 2.0 cables:

 

https://www.startech.com/Cables/USB-2.0/USB-2.0-Cables/6-ft-High-Speed-USB-20-Cable~USB2HAB6

 

http://www.jenving.com/products/view/usb-2.0-a-b-1001908381

 

Some have the High Speed Certified logo on the packaging, some have writing printed onto the cable itself.

 

[asdf1000]

12 hours ago, jabbr said:

Its really hard to find OTG to USB 2.0 cables (not Micro!!!).

 

https://artsexcellence.com/ifi-otg-usb-c-adapter.html

[asdf1000]

2 hours ago, look&listen said:

 

But JSSS & JSSS-360 shielded cables not grounded (by design)

 

The 360 method is a community tweak but regarding John’s original DIY method there’s no strict requirement to have the shield floating. You can have the shield connected to ground. So when you say “by design” I’m not sure where this was mentioned to be a requirement.

 

Again, I’m only talking about John’s method, not the 360 community tweak.

[asdf1000]

5 minutes ago, lmitche said:

John was explicit in his original post that JSSG be floating, not grounded.

 

Can you share where he was explicit?

 

"If you add the external wire connected to the shield at both ends, then you CAN connect one or both sides of the shield to the signal ground or some other ground, but you don't NEED to for effective shielding. You will find that in many cases leaving the shield completely disconnected from the rest of the circuit is the best way to go, you get the benefit of properly working shielding without any interaction of the shield with your system. You may wind wind up with static charges on the shielding so a resistance from the shield to ground may be useful in some cases in order to dissipate static charges."

 

Once again, there is no explicit recommendation to have the shield and loop wire floating. You can, but it's not a strict requirement.

 

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/31554-diy-dc-power-cables/?page=9&tab=comments#comment-659092

 

[asdf1000]

24 minutes ago, lmitche said:

I guess I read "leaving the shield completely disconnected from the rest of the circuit is the best way to go" as the best way to go.

 

 

 

No worries. Reading what I quoted on the whole, I don't read it as a strict requirement.

 

Absolutely no big deal though, this is just a minor thing.

 

[asdf1000]

Just now, lmitche said:

Ok, I'll say it, " there is more than one way to skin a cat!" You are right of course.

 

Lol, enjoy!

 

Larry

 

Hehe

[asdf1000]

44 minutes ago, sandyk said:

 

My understanding was that the shield was meant to be left floating, NOT earthed, with (originally) a single strand of a reasonable gauge wire connecting both ends of the braid.

A length of enamelled copper wire would have been ideal for this purpose.

 

Not that it's a big deal but see the later discussion, including John's post.

 

I've seen people on other forums saying it must explicitly be floating but that's not true if you read John's actual post.

 

I think both floating and signal grounded can be effective if you read John's words.

 

These things can be like the fun game of Chinese whispers, with the method changing from person to person, but I like to go to the original source.

 

 

 

[asdf1000]

1 minute ago, sandyk said:

I was talking about John's original posts in this area.

 

Yes and I quoted and linked to it..

 

Anyway it's there just a few posts above, for people to read and interpret their own way. No gains in arguing too much about it.

 

[asdf1000]

47 minutes ago, look&listen said:

Grounding can bring noise & drain it. Bigger antenna for noise? Drain impedance?

 

If this were true then John would be explicit and would say don't connect the shield and loop wire to ground. He says you can connect both ends to ground, you can even connect a single end to ground or you can float, for the shielding to work.

 

The key is the loop wire of course, not just the shield alone.

 

I really don't want to make a big deal of this so will leave it for now. But my only point was it's not correct to say that you absolutely must use a floating shield for it to follow John's shielding guideline.

[asdf1000]

38 minutes ago, flkin said:

Ghent made me a USB JSSG,

 

I asked him last year but his custom made USB cables are not spec compliant. 

 

This may not be an issue for most people but I've had compatibility issues with my DACs in the past with non spec compliant USB 2.0 cables so I stay away from audiophile cables these days.

 

 

 

[asdf1000]

6 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

 

I am not sure the networx cable doesn't fit the bill?

 

It does if it says it's certified... as is the StarTech cable @lmitche already linked you to...

 

Per austinpop's method, you slide everything over the existing cable... his method is non-destructive.

 

What I mentioned above is completely different.. Last year when I contacted Ghent I was wanting to get a USB 2.0 cable made using John's original shielding method. This would need soldering a wire to the metal connectors though.

[asdf1000]

27 minutes ago, octaviars said:

 

Do you know what was not up to spec!

 

I use Ghent USB cables without any problems between SOtM sMS-200ultra -> SOtM tX-USBultra -> TAD D1000mk2 DAC

 

As I mentioned, ‘not to spec’ can still work for many people. Just depends if source+DAC like it - case by case. If it works for you great.

 

BigGuy answered it though, regarding DIY cables and 90 ohm impedance spec.

 

You can ask Ghent again though, maybe things have changed. 

 

[asdf1000]

2 hours ago, lmitche said:

The July NUC announcements include 8th generation $500 NUCs with a quad core i7 processor capable of 4.5ghz at 28 watts and Optane capable. More than enough for hqplayer upsampling. Combined with an emmc NUC and an EtherRegen

 

If the eMMC NUC is for use as a HQP NAA/endpoint (or RoonBridge), I've been using an Allo USBridge with eMMC for a few months with great results.

 

Handles DSD512 with both NAA and RoonBridge really well. The USBbridge would have a much lower noise output than a NUC... specs and some measurements are published on Allo's website.

 

I need to keep things fanless since my Roon Core and HQPe server are in the listening room (not idea but has to be that way for now). I haven't seen a fanless NUC build yet that can do all the poly-sinc-2s filters to DSD512. We might be a year or two away, but it will come. This one can though, 35W max:

 

https://www.atlastsolutions.com/fanless-tx-series-pc-core-i7-7700t-kaby-lake-8gb-250gb-860-evo-ssd-asus-h110t/