What Are the Best Sounding Speakers UNDER $2,500 that You've Ever Heard.?

[ctsooner]

Of course you can use them but they are on sale for 1400 each. Personally I've heard many of the higher end class D amps with the 3.7 and not likes them at all. Just very dry with no texture to thee music. Again not the W4s amps.

 

Again they are stable but they don't fully double into even 4 ohms. Again they are 2800 a pair and not a budget amp plus you still need a pre amp to control the system.

 

 

 

 

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[ctsooner]

Oh, I just got my w4s LPS today so please done think I don't like the company. ?

 

 

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[rodrigaj]

Of course you can use them but they are on sale for 1400 each. Personally I've heard many of the higher end class D amps with the 3.7 and not likes them at all. Just very dry with no texture to thee music. Again not the W4s amps.

 

 

 

Again they are stable but they don't fully double into even 4 ohms. Again they are 2800 a pair and not a budget amp plus you still need a pre amp to control the system.

 

I neglected to mention that I got a used pair of W4S SX1000's for $1000. So I was thinking of used prices. W4S on the used market offers unbeatable cost/performance imho.

[ctsooner]

I neglected to mention that I got a used pair of W4S SX1000's for $1000. So I was thinking of used prices. W4S on the used market offers unbeatable cost/performance imho.

 

Yes, there are plenty of good cost/performance values of used gear. It's still hard to find amps that have enough drive to PROPERLY drive a pair of fuller size Maggies. I even heard someone from Maggie make that statement some years ago for the same reasons I post above. Again, not trying to argue and if you aren't playing your music loudly and you aren't listening to things that are dynamic, then there isn't a problem. I do know a few folks who have blown theirs because their amps chocked and passed distortion because they ran out of steam on orchestral music.

 

There are too many folks who buy used and don't always understand the correct stats to look at when putting systems together. With most dynamic speakers you don't have to worry the amps doubling into a halved load. Remember that even though a speaker is rated at 4 ohms, let's say, it's running around possibly 2 ohms at times. Ohms is just an average load as if you put a resistor into the circuit instead of a pair of speakers that fluid and every changing. There are plenty of amps that can handle these loads, but some do it better than others and certain types of speakers demand a much better and stable amp that can properly drive said speaker. That's one reason you find these speakers sold at stores and those stores all seem to carry the same or similar amps. Audio Research comes to mind as does Ayre, D'agastino, Bryston for lower cost options (to me these are not cheap amps) and Krell or Mac. Can you get sound out of lower priced amps (even going the used route)? Of course you can and good sound. My point I guess is that in order to really hit that magic spot that Maggies can give you, takes money and much more so than what say a Vandersteen needs to sound excellent. These posts take NOTHING away from how good a Maggie CAN sound. I have so many friends who have and love them. I have a buddy who's a jazz drummer out of NYC, Billy Drummond. He owns Vandersteens And Maggies and loves them both. That said, he is able to run the Vandersteens off a less expensive amp than the Maggies. He's using a class D amp that's pretty expensive (forget the name off hand, but it's rated highly for a class D amp) and personally I don't like it that much, but when he puts on the high current amps they sing in the mids as if you are there in the club. Just personally choices I guess, but to me any 'budget' gear needs to sound close to it's best with similarly priced gear. JMHO

[Ralf11]

NuPrime monoblocks for Maggies?

[beerandmusic]

I am surprised there isn't more love for B&W. I have listened to many of the speakers listed here (vandersteens, maggies, psb, esd, kef, paradigm) and hundreds more....none do it for me as much as B&W (either 700 or 800 series, or even older series for that fact).

[mav52]

NuPrime monoblocks for Maggies?

 

I kinda like the new Nords and their possible use for Maggies Nord Acoustics Hypex NCore NC500 NC400 Amplifiers

[realhifi]

I am surprised there isn't more love for B&W. I have listened to many of the speakers listed here (vandersteens, maggies, psb, esd, kef, paradigm) and hundreds more....none do it for me as much as B&W (either 700 or 800 series, or even older series for that fact).

 

Perfect example of "to each his own".

Also great example of the very different sonic "fingerprint" of different driver materials. You either like the sound of Kevlar or you don't. Some do, some don't.

[Ralf11]

I have a lot of respect for B&W

 

IIRC they were the first to use laser interferometry to look at cone breakup while driven

[mansr]

I have a lot of respect for B&W

 

IIRC they were the first to use laser interferometry to look at cone breakup while driven

Now that's measurement. Perhaps that's why to many "true" audiophiles disparaging B&W is a must.

[semente]

I have a lot of respect for B&W

 

IIRC they were the first to use laser interferometry to look at cone breakup while driven

And yet the seem unable to control the breakup of their kevlar cones.

I haven't listened to the latest continuum cone but the peak hasn't disappeared from the measurements...

[semente]

Now that's measurement. Perhaps that's why to many "true" audiophiles disparaging B&W is a must.

 

 

What about this measurement?

 

[mansr]

What about this measurement?

 

Looks reasonable for a speaker.

[beerandmusic]

that is graph for cm...how about the b&w 800 series....and how does 800 series chart compare to other speakers ...i would be shocked if someone couldn't rip vandersteens graphs in comparison....i listened to them a/b and no comparison to my ears....and if graphs on 805 don't look superior to vandersteens, then i will have no trust in any graphs...

[semente]

that is graph for cm...how about the b&w 800 series....and how does 800 series chart compare to other speakers ...i would be shocked if someone couldn't rip vandersteens graphs in comparison....i listened to them a/b and no comparison to my ears....and if graphs on 805 don't look superior to vandersteens, then i will have no trust in any graphs...

How about this one:

 

 

 

B&W 800 Diamond, cumulative spectral-decay plot on tweeter axis at 50" (0.15ms risetime).

 

Read more at http://www.stereophile.com/content/bampw-800-diamond-loudspeaker-measurements

 

JA writes: "There is a slight ridge of delayed energy centered on 3.5kHz that coincides with the slight peak in the on-axis frequency response. The effect of this is difficult to predict, but I suspect that it might increase the feeling of increased resolution of detail."

 

If he were honest he would not have written "slight" but he must pretend that the effects are innocuous... You don't bite the hand that feeds you.

[realhifi]

Now that's measurement. Perhaps that's why to many "true" audiophiles disparaging B&W is a must.

 

Didn't realize it was a "thing" that "true" audiophiles disparaged B&W. Must not be a majority seeing as they are premium priced products and garner nearly universally positive reviews in the Audio press along with terrific sales.

 

I do believe they face far more competition from like priced products today than in the past and any time you get competition you're going to get more varying opinions on what is best, different tastes, polarization of opinion, etc. All Audio companies face that. It still comes down to one vote, the customers. If YOU like them, then that's really all that matters.

[ctsooner]

Some of you guys make me laugh. I've never seen so many obsessed with graphs and charts. It only tells part of the story. Many of you will die trying to get many to read graphs instead of listening and that your thing so it's fine. As much as I I've the sound of Vandersteen speakers and I don't like many of the other premium names speakers that doesn't make them inferior. I have plenty of friends who love other speakers and that means they are great speakers to them. So much goes into speakers and listening and there are no absolutes. Heck I've heard my favorite speakers sound like crap in systems. Not set up properly and with the wrong electronics. Happens all the time. I've heard speakers that I'd never ever own, even for free, sound pretty good in certain systems. We all sit and argue how speakers measure or B&W are better than Vandys but it's totally subjective and statements like that are wrong. I may have even posted something similar about Vandys killing another ( don't think so but I could have) and it's wrong. I just hope any newbies disregard so much of what many of us have posted and go listen and love their music and their gear. Off to go listen.

 

 

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[bobbmd]

hornytoad- I'll go abit further Henry Kloss's Cambridge Soundworks Ensemble's late 1980's (still have them) with passive subs-used later mid 1990's versions for my familyroom and they are still in use for 7.1 movie/tv system I then added progeny of the advents the Model Sixes with Towers and s300 satellites from early 2000's still use them as my main system and hooked the passive subs to the Towers and the model 6's. Overall great sounding speakers and you probably can find them on eBay/Amazon I'll bet dirt cheap. Very overlooked high quality speakers all of them.

bobbmd

[semente]

Some of you guys make me laugh. I've never seen so many obsessed with graphs and charts. It only tells part of the story. Many of you will die trying to get many to read graphs instead of listening and that your thing so it's fine. As much as I I've the sound of Vandersteen speakers and I don't like many of the other premium names speakers that doesn't make them inferior. I have plenty of friends who love other speakers and that means they are great speakers to them. So much goes into speakers and listening and there are no absolutes. Heck I've heard my favorite speakers sound like crap in systems. Not set up properly and with the wrong electronics. Happens all the time. I've heard speakers that I'd never ever own, even for free, sound pretty good in certain systems. We all sit and argue how speakers measure or B&W are better than Vandys but it's totally subjective and statements like that are wrong. I may have even posted something similar about Vandys killing another ( don't think so but I could have) and it's wrong. I just hope any newbies disregard so much of what many of us have posted and go listen and love their music and their gear. Off to go listen.

 

 

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The graphs I posted show the breakup resonances of BnW's kevlar cone.

 

I owned a pair of 802S3s and was very disappointed with the sound.

After some experimenting with test tones I nailed down the frequency and went looking for possible causes.

It was only after looking at the measurements that I finally understood what was happening.

 

I generally avoid reviews but the seriousness of the problem made me investigate it further and I learnt that some reviewers do mention this problem in a dismissing, camouflaged way.

This is one of the reasons why I avoid reviews... Sometimes you can dig some important information on shortcomings but we are forced to learn how to read between the lines.

 

 

 

People can enjoy whatever they wish but some products outperform others and these products are better or higher fidelity (at reproducing the recorded signal).

This accuracy may or may not please the listener but that is a matter of taste; it has nothing to do with being good.

At least in my perspective.

 

R

[ctsooner]

I agree that accuracy is important. After speaking with a few world known designers and sharing much of this thread all said that most of the measuring isn't as accurate as it's needs to be to show the information they would need to help in the design of a speaker. No I don't pretend to be able to make any measurements. I have read Harley's reviews for many years and see his testing and do feel that there is a ton of validity to it. Many of you are trained engineers im sure and you and you may even have the gear that the professionals are using but do you have the same controls etc. My point is that some of the graphs that have been shared are not accurate compared to what has been published my RH and or some of the manufacturers whom I trust more. That's all. The bottom line though is that even totally accurate tests still can't full tell you how a speaker will sound. You or someone else said not to listen to the VANDERSTEEN on this thread or may be another one I'm reading this week because they don't measure good. The measurements that were posted were not accurate according to Vanderteeens graphs and what's been reported on. That's where you lost me but it's fine. You believe in your stats and making decisions to audition or not based on them and some of us audition anything to see what we do and don't like. Either way we are all doing it our way and having fun. That's what makes the hobbby part fun

 

 

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[semente]

I agree that accuracy is important. After speaking with a few world known designers and sharing much of this thread all said that most of the measuring isn't as accurate as it's needs to be to show the information they would need to help in the design of a speaker. No I don't pretend to be able to make any measurements. I have read Harley's reviews for many years and see his testing and do feel that there is a ton of validity to it. Many of you are trained engineers im sure and you and you may even have the gear that the professionals are using but do you have the same controls etc. My point is that some of the graphs that have been shared are not accurate compared to what has been published my RH and or some of the manufacturers whom I trust more. That's all. The bottom line though is that even totally accurate tests still can't full tell you how a speaker will sound. You or someone else said not to listen to the VANDERSTEEN on this thread or may be another one I'm reading this week because they don't measure good. The measurements that were posted were not accurate according to Vanderteeens graphs and what's been reported on. That's where you lost me but it's fine. You believe in your stats and making decisions to audition or not based on them and some of us audition anything to see what we do and don't like. Either way we are all doing it our way and having fun. That's what makes the hobbby part fun

 

 

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It is because I am really convinced that you can learn how to correlate measurements with listening that I use measurements for shortlisting but listening impressions take precedence when it comes to deciding what to keep.

 

R

[beerandmusic]

It is because I am really convinced that you can learn how to correlate measurements with listening that I use measurements for shortlisting but listening impressions take precedence when it comes to deciding what to keep.

R

 

so what measurements did you use in deciding to buy the b&w 802? seems like a lot of money to spend to decide after you bought them that you don't like them...yawn.

[semente]

so what measurements did you use in deciding to buy the b&w 802? seems like a lot of money to spend to decide after you bought them that you don't like them...yawn.

They cost me about £1k, not really expensive.

 

I had listened to previous versions a few times (and the 801F many times) with the same amplification but could not find them for that amount.

Those Matrix', with the silk dome tweeters, sound better with the high pitched colouration less obvious.

Still, now I wouldn't buy them.

 

Post Nautilus (including) models are worse in this respect since the first order low pass exposes the breakup even more whilst exaggerating the length and depth of the trough in the presence region, as can be seen in the measurements of any 800 series model from the 90s onwards.

 

Some people like both the apparent/subjective increased resolution that results from both breakup and recessed presence...

 

R

[blownsi]

I am surprised there isn't more love for B&W. I have listened to many of the speakers listed here (vandersteens, maggies, psb, esd, kef, paradigm) and hundreds more....none do it for me as much as B&W (either 700 or 800 series, or even older series for that fact).

 

I don't understand the love for B&W, KEF or really any of the British speakers that I've heard. We all have our preferences, this is why there are so many to choose from.

[Ralf11]

I don't understand the love for B&W, KEF or really any of the British speakers that I've heard. We all have our preferences, this is why there are so many to choose from.

 

so tell me, who do you love?

 

 

 

 

 

 

my apologies to The Sapphires -- I am wondering what factors in the sound from speakers you are after, or at least what brands

 

personally, if I were restricted to buying all my components from a single country, it might be England (despite being taught to dislike the English and yankees as a child)