What Are the Best Sounding Speakers UNDER $2,500 that You've Ever Heard.?

[limniscate]

I would probably agree with the Magnepan 1.7i's or the Vandersteen 2ce Signature II's. They do sound very different. Do not get the Magnepans if you can't get them at least 5 ft. from the front wall and 4 ft. apart. Most Magnepan owners probably shouldn't own Magnepans. There are better speakers for confined spaces such as the Vandersteens. My brother has the Treo in a small room with only ok electronics (~$2k) and no room treatments, and I'd say that his setup easily rivals my 3.7i's with $13k worth of electronics, $2k worth of room treatments and an amazing room. My 3.7i's are 9' and 7' off the front wall. The Treos are very good.

[Sam Lord]

I would audition these: ATC Loudspeakers SCM12 Pro - Pair - Vintage King Audio

 

or if you can stretch another 500 these: ATC Loudspeakers SCM20PSL MK2 - Pair - Vintage King Audio

 

... when you first hear ATCs it's a revelation.

 

... but the passive ones do need good amps.

As I have the 20s, I heartily agree. My amps (c. 200W@6 Ohms) give out before the speakers. Oddly ATC never provides sufficient amp power for the active versions: each woofer should get clean 400+W.

 

I love almost every Magnepan I've heard, same with Sonus Faber. I want to hear Dalis, I think midrange domes are really ideal. Yet I think the big B&W midrange cones are fantastic, as are Cabasse foam drivers.

 

IME, in almost every case speaker placement and time alignment in a room is far more important than the room's acoustics, ànd somewhat more important than the speakers' inherent performance.

 

I'm struck by the quality of some inexpensive gear these days. I just ordered Micca MB42X speakers and a TEAC 301 dac/preamp/amp for a bedroom system for just $440. Insane quality for the money. An embarrassment of cheap riches surrounds us: the ELACs, JBL LSR305s, Schiit electronics...this is a new golden age.

[ctsooner]

The new Vander Steen signatures are well worth the price differential if you can afford it. I too have the trios I'm going to be selling them in order to buy the Quatro's. i'm running an Ayre a AX5 20 integrated along with the new Ayre digital analog converter QX 5/20. With every upgrade I've done in my system big or small, I hear the difference. It's the most detailed speaker in regards to micro and macro detail I have heard on the market recently. It's one of the few speaker lines that will give you all the detail along with the emotion and musicality that most of us are looking for.

 

 

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[r_w]

Tend to agree, that's why I use 80hz HPF from the Revel subs, that takes away a massive amount of work from the ATCs and you can clearly hear the benefit.

 

ATC would likely say that for 'ultimate active performance' you would use their P4 monoblocks.

 

:-)

 

As I have the 20s, I heartily agree. My amps (c. 200W@6 Ohms) give out before the speakers. Oddly ATC never provides sufficient amp power for the active versions: each woofer should get clean 400+W.

 

[bluesman]

I disagree. I have found that a speaker that someone likes (they are SUCH a personal choice) in a showroom will still be preferred in their own room. Yes, there are some (rare in my experience) room / speaker interactions that will change a speaker enough to make it unsuitable for certain rooms but I still think a better speaker will sound....better.

There's another factor that's far more important. Listening to speakers in a room in which there are many other speakers causes significant aberrations, because all those other drivers are passive radiators that are resonating with the sonic output of the speakers being auditioned. Those connected to internal crossovers or to amplifier output terminals are damped by the output impedance on the other end of their wires, but all of them are resonating to some degree and producing audible contributions to the sound you think is only coming from the speakers being auditioned. It may be complementary, e.g. when those passive radiators are accidentally (and luckily) damped perfectly to reinforce the bottom or when dissipation of highs softens a hard edge. But in my experience, it's almost always detrimental.

 

This was particularly apparent when I used to bring my LS3/5as in to my dealer's showroom to compare them with the latest and greatest - having other speakers anywhere close to them really spoiled their outstanding imaging (which, BTW, is a major part of why I put them on the best sounding speakers lists along with the natural character of their limited bass).

 

I've had many high end dealers try to demo equipment for me in rooms with a dozen or more sets of speakers. To my ears, this affects the sound quality, which is why I far prefer to listen in my own home if I can't get the dealer to remove all other speakers from the listening room. The encounter I remember best is the time I bought a pair of Klipsch Heresies (maybe 35 years ago) because they sounded so good to me at Bryn Mawr Stereo when it was a high end shop. I got them home, set them up, and got hit in the face with strident highs that were apparently dissipated by the many speakers in their showroom - and I was driving them with my late beloved Marantz 7 & 8b, a system that was anything but a fast ball pitcher. They went immediately back!

[realhifi]

 

There's another factor that's far more important. Listening to speakers in a room in which there are many other speakers causes significant aberrations, because all those other drivers are passive radiators that are resonating with the sonic output of the speakers being auditioned. Those connected to internal crossovers or to amplifier output terminals are damped by the output impedance on the other end of their wires, but all of them are resonating to some degree and producing audible contributions to the sound you think is only coming from the speakers being auditioned. It may be complementary, e.g. when those passive radiators are accidentally (and luckily) damped perfectly to reinforce the bottom or when dissipation of highs softens a hard edge. But in my experience, it's almost always detrimental.

 

 

Absolutely. I was assuming it was a good dealer and showroom where there is one pair of speakers at a time in the room. Although....way back in the day I heard a pair of those wonderful little LS3/5's demoed with an Audio Pro sub in a large room that also had a few other speakers in it including a pair of Acoustats. Unbelievable sound. HUGE sound stage, superb dynamics, wonderful strings, fully 3d sound. Still one of those memories that doesn't fade.

 

PS. I've probably owned 10 or more pairs of LS3/5's over the years, Rogers, Spendor, Chartwells, you name it. All were terrific.

[wisnon]

If you count sale price, this is! Cyber Monday Trenner and Friedl Arts – stereodesk

 

Stereodesk is selling a pair of Trenner&Freidl Art's for 50% off (with stands) for Black Friday. That's $2,500!

 

Quote: "The problem with these speakers is that people in our lab are supposed to work and yesterday everybody spent all day on listening to the trenner&friedl little ART suckers.. amazing"

[wisnon]

Kef ls50 without a subwoofer

 

 

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Or the ACTIVE ones: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M65KZ5Q

[semente]

Or the ACTIVE ones: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M65KZ5Q

I wonder if they have solved the exaggerated tweeter output problem with the active version...

Have you seen any measurements?

The remaining measurements are first class (though I'd still not use them without a pair of subs).

 

R

[wisnon]

This is very nice too:

 

http://precide.ch/test/Heil/e_AV%20MAX_India%202013_Heil%20AMT%20Aulos_w_note.pdf

and in French:

http://precide.ch/test/Heil/f_aulos%20BS_stereoprestigeimage%2055.pdf

[wisnon]

I wonder if they have solved the exaggerated tweeter output problem with the active version...

Have you seen any measurements?

The remaining measurements are first class (though I'd still not use them without a pair of subs).

 

R

 

No idea.

 

However, these new ones are set up for easy sub insertion and there as a free smartphone app for sub integration.

[Nelson_de_Leon]

Anybody here tried Aurum Cantus speakers?

 

http://www.aurumcantus.com

 

I have the older model, 103 melody FS. Definitely for keeps. The highs are to die for.

 

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[beetlemania]

Vandersteen 2 series, and second place is not close. They were well below $2500 at the various times I've heard (and owned) them, though they have recently edged up to $2560. Guessing you could pretty easily find a retailer who would discount them to below $2500.

 

Yes, the latest 2 Ce Sig IIs are a must-audition at this price point unless you need a small monitor or have 8W SET amps.

[Blake]

This is a bit of a tangent from the topic of this thread but I do think it is relevant. I view speakers as being mostly about implementing solid engineering principles backed by research and design, materials and manufacturing expertise. As such, I tend to focus on somewhat larger companies for speakers (those focused on sound quality, not just the bottom line, although I have no problem with any company making money).

 

I often wonder how some of the very small speaker companies can remain competitive with the bigger companies that have access to more resources (R&D facilities, engineering staff, ability to leverage economies of scale)?

 

By "very small" I am thinking of companies smaller than, say, Zu. I am not talking about Vandersteen, Magnepan, etc.. I try to keep an open mind, but to be honest I would be rather skittish about pulling the trigger on a speaker from a very small company. I have this vision of the company owner tinkering around in his garage with parts combinations, designs based upon a dream he had last night, etc., and crossing his fingers he stumbles upon a good combo.

 

Thoughts?

 

P.S. I am aware that much of the speaker selection process comes down to auditioning and personal taste, so I am not looking to re-tread those concepts and no offense intended to those that enjoy speakers from the tiny boutique companies. I am just curious to hear from others on the speaker company size/resources issue.

[lmitche]

I think of most speaker manufacturers as cabinet makers, as the components are very often sourced elsewhere. There seems to be a little, some, but little real research happening with speakers these days. It seems like a mature industry to me especially compared to the digital audio side.

[Ralf11]

Blake, I dunno, but perhaps the large co.s are doing the R&D and the smaller ones are copying?

 

It costs a lot of moola to do laser interferometry studies on cones (B&W).

 

Then there are ideas or theory that can be applied by one guy working out things with paper or computer models then moving into tart mode and trying it - examples may include: time alignment for minimizing phase delays, bass reflex design and the acoustic suspension design (tho that predates modern finite element techniques).

 

If this takes off, it should be in a sep. thread...

[semente]

I think of most speaker manufacturers as cabinet makers, as the components are very often sourced elsewhere. There seems to be a little, some, but little real research happening with speakers these days. It seems like a mature industry to me especially compared to the digital audio side.

And yet many speakers don't perform as well as they could (should?)...

Makes you wonder.

 

R

[esldude]

This is a bit of a tangent from the topic of this thread but I do think it is relevant. I view speakers as being mostly about implementing solid engineering principles backed by research and design, materials and manufacturing expertise. As such, I tend to focus on somewhat larger companies for speakers (those focused on sound quality, not just the bottom line, although I have no problem with any company making money).

 

I often wonder how some of the very small speaker companies can remain competitive with the bigger companies that have access to more resources (R&D facilities, engineering staff, ability to leverage economies of scale)?

 

By "very small" I am thinking of companies smaller than, say, Zu. I am not talking about Vandersteen, Magnepan, etc.. I try to keep an open mind, but to be honest I would be rather skittish about pulling the trigger on a speaker from a very small company. I have this vision of the company owner tinkering around in his garage with parts combinations, designs based upon a dream he had last night, etc., and crossing his fingers he stumbles upon a good combo.

 

Thoughts?

 

P.S. I am aware that much of the speaker selection process comes down to auditioning and personal taste, so I am not looking to re-tread those concepts and no offense intended to those that enjoy speakers from the tiny boutique companies. I am just curious to hear from others on the speaker company size/resources issue.

 

Actually cross over design, speaker and cabinet design along with available quality drivers can be done to a much higher level of refinement than ever before by small companies. Because software modeling and raw driver quality is so good. The software doesn't cost a fortune like it once did.

 

Having said that if they apply resources well, a big company still can do better work than a smaller company. They can push the edge of things more. But DIY speakers that make use of modern tech can let even garage operations make excellent speakers.

[limniscate]

I want to hear Dalis, I think midrange domes are really ideal. Yet I think the big B&W midrange cones are fantastic, as are Cabasse foam drivers.

 

I heard the Epicon 6, and they sounded great even though they were terribly setup. They may be a little too bass-heavy though.

[lmitche]

Actually cross over design, speaker and cabinet design along with available quality drivers can be done to a much higher level of refinement than ever before by small companies. Because software modeling and raw driver quality is so good. The software doesn't cost a fortune like it once did.

 

Having said that if they apply resources well, a big company still can do better work than a smaller company. They can push the edge of things more. But DIY speakers that make use of modern tech can let even garage operations make excellent speakers.

Lol, my experience is that there is an inverse relationship between the size of a company and innovation. The largest US audio company is now owned by the Koreans, so we will see what happens.

 

https://www.engadget.com/2016/11/14/samsung-buys-harmon-auto-audio/

 

Financial engineering beats electrical engineering, just nauseating.

[esldude]

Lol, my experience is that there is an inverse relationship between the size of a company and innovation. The largest US audio company is now owned by the Koreans, so we will see what happens.

 

https://www.engadget.com/2016/11/14/samsung-buys-harmon-auto-audio/

 

Financial engineering beats electrical engineering, just nauseating.

 

I mostly agree with that sentiment. You however picked one of the best possible counter-examples. I too worry what Samsung will do with it. They wanted Harman for the automotive side of things. If they leave the home speaker side alone it won't matter. Of course almost universally when mergers happen they are going to leave everyone alone to continue the good work........and within a year or two at the most that goes out the window. There is the slightly hopeful rumor that Samsung had sights on entering quality home audio, and were doing similar testing to Harman on speakers for home and car. Maybe they'll find it simper/cheaper to just keep the Harman process they now own without monkeying with it too much.

[ctsooner]

Lot's of facts and lot's misinformation. I too stay away from smaller companies. I've been burned enough over the years by getting a wonderful component only to have it need work and the company goes under within ten year or less. It happens in the speaker industry even more than electronics. Yes, there are many companies who just source drivers from a company or do very small and easy mods. Many top manufacturer's do that and they charge over 100k for some of these speakers. That doesn't mean the speakers aren't really good, just a bit over priced as the drivers and components don't even cost that much considering.

 

Companies like Vandersteen actually build many of their drivers and send them for finishing to their own specs to a large manufacture. That way they have drivers that no one else has and they build their cabinets to match. It's expensive, but it's the way they get pistonic movement of their drivers and that lowers distortion and smearing. It's not until they came out with more expensive speakers (yr 2000) that they even worried about cabinets and that's why their speakers with socks on them compete with speakers that are more than twice the price as cabinets finished are very expensive when done correctly.

 

Someone mentioned well engineered, good spec'd and measured etc... I don't know of any good speaker that isn't designed and built that way. Even some speakers I don't love the sound of as much as Vandersteen, Tidal and some others are top speakers and built this way. I get really upset with companies like Wilson who basically buy off the shelf drivers and throw them into nice heavy cabinets and market the hell out of them. They are dynamic and Wilson lovers love them because they are dynamic and tipped up a few db's on top and sound exciting compared to speakers that are much more accurate.

 

In the under 2.5k speakers there are so many choices, but personally I won't touch a speaker that isn't fuller range as I miss so much of the music with bookshelf speakers. The footprint of most floor standers is the same or similar than a speaker using a stand so why not use that extra space and get some bass! Yes, of course room and acoustics are the most important thing, but it's not that hard to get a room tamed and it's also not expensive.

 

As for Samsung and Harmon, no one really know what's going to happen there. I personally don't like any of the Harmon products to date, but they are a huge name. I can't see them tinkering much with the brand. Many were concerned when they purchased Levinson and I personally think they ran that brand into the ground. It's only recently that they are trying to bring it back. I hope that they invest and leave it alone. Maybe just share engineering as they do now.

[bluesman]

LYes, there are many companies who just source drivers from a company or do very small and easy mods. Many top manufacturer's do that and they charge over 100k for some of these speakers. That doesn't mean the speakers aren't really good, just a bit over priced as the drivers and components don't even cost that much considering.

There's a classic old story about a very wealthy woman who goes to a famous New York milliner for a new hat. She selects one and is told it costs $10,000, to which she responds "That's outrageous! It's nothing but a piece of felt!"

 

The milliner goes into the back of her shop, returns with a piece of felt, and says "No problem, madame. This piece of felt will cost you $25, and you can make your own hat."

[Rt66indierock]

For this price range I would choose either the AR LST/2 or stacked Advents. Speakers aren't really that hard of a purchase if you restrict yourself to models made for at least ten years substantially unchanged. Really good AR LST speakers are crossing the $2,500 barrier.

 

Never forget there are thousands of bad speakers to choose from, none were made for ten or more years. You take a pretty big chance on any speaker that hasn't been sold for at least five years.

[ctsooner]

Are you being serious or just kidding? Maybe models numbers have been around for years but great speakers evolve especially with the newer materials they can use to get substantially better sound and it's not even debatable. I may have misread your post though.

 

 

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