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The End of America?


kilroy
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It happened last night. As a fairly apolitical and middle-of the-road American and my nose kept to the grindstone to survive despite a higher education, that's how the day dawned for me.

No personal attacks please, just polite conversation if it's at all possible.

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As an external observer from Europe: We'll see in four years.

 

From my understanding (and past experience) even the president of the US does have to deal with political realities and the division of power.

 

Other countries have seen populist politicians rising and then often observed the shortcomings in terms of actual delivery to their own promises.

 

The US is a pretty strong country and will certainly survive four years of Trump, pretty much no matter what he ends up actually doing.

 

The problem is that beyond "building a wall" Trumps entire campaign has been rather fuzzy so far, so we really don't know what his concrete plans actually are.

 

Let's wait and see what his administration will look like.

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I think this sums it up for me (From the NYT editorial):

 

The unexpected turn in the election tallies immediately raised questions about the value of modern polling: Can it accurately capture public opinion when so many people are now so hard to reach on their unlisted cellphones?

 

And...

 

And that’s why the problem that surfaced on Tuesday night was much bigger than polling. It was clear that something was fundamentally broken in journalism, which has been unable to keep up with the anti-establishment mood that is turning the world upside down.

 

"The function of music is to release us from the tyranny of conscious thought", Sir Thomas Beecham. 

 

 

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My feeling is "wait and see". Will the real President Trump step forward. Is the true Trumo represented by his victory speech or his campaign?

 

One observation that was made on British TV... the time that the president really has power is when he's woken at 3 in the morning and a decision on some immediate crisis or another. How Trump reacts then if the real test.

Eloise

---

...in my opinion / experience...

While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing.

And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism.

keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out.

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Here's what's in the NYT this morning:

 

"We don’t know how Mr. Trump would carry out basic functions of the executive. We don’t know what financial conflicts he might have, since he never released his tax returns, breaking with 40 years of tradition in both parties. We don’t know if he has the capacity to focus on any issue and arrive at a rational conclusion. We don’t know if he has any idea what it means to control the largest nuclear arsenal in the world.

 

Here is what we do know: We know Mr. Trump is the most unprepared president-elect in modern history. We know that by words and actions, he has shown himself to be temperamentally unfit to lead a diverse nation of 320 million people. We know he has threatened to prosecute and jail his political opponents, and he has said he would curtail the freedom of the press. We know he lies without compunction.

 

 

He has said he intends to cut taxes for the wealthy and to withdraw the health care protection of the Affordable Care Act from tens of millions of Americans. He has insulted women and threatened Muslims and immigrants, and he has recruited as his allies a dark combination of racists, white supremacists and anti-Semites. Given the importance of the alt-right to Mr. Trump’s rise, it is perhaps time to drop the “alt.” David Duke celebrated Mr. Trump’s victory on Tuesday night, tweeting, “It’s time to TAKE AMERICA BACK!!!”

 

When Mr. Trump has looked beyond our borders, he has said that he would tear up the agreement to prevent Iran from building nuclear arms and that he would do away with the North American Free Trade Agreement. He has said that he would repudiate last December’s Paris agreement on climate change, thereby abandoning America’s leadership role in addressing the biggest long-term threat to humanity. He has also threatened to abandon NATO allies and start a trade war with China."

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I look at other countries and I have lived in a few,( Great Britain, Spain, France and Germany) and I'm not impressed. I would still live right here in the good old US of A anytime or any day. The US gave Obama a chance, time to give Trump a chance.

 

So the disappointed Hillary voters can ramble on, it will not do any good, the election is over, its time to live with what you have or move to another country like some of these black leaders and celebrities have publicly noted in the press.

The Truth Is Out There

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My feeling is "wait and see". Will the real President Trump step forward. Is the true Trumo represented by his victory speech or his campaign?

 

One observation that was made on British TV... the time that the president really has power is when he's woken at 3 in the morning and a decision on some immediate crisis or another. How Trump reacts then if the real test.

Not 100% serious side comment: maybe there's hope if the US election follows the Brexit logic, given that Nigel Lafarge resigned after winning his referendum.

 

I'm still not sure Trump really expected to win when he ran in the first place. Maybe he tires from the responsibility sooner than you think.

 

Parenthesis closed.

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My feeling is "wait and see". Will the real President Trump step forward. Is the true Trumo represented by his victory speech or his campaign?

Well said. Some journalists say he won't be able to sustain the immediate post-election nice guy we've seen in the past few hours.

 

"We'll see" are the operative words.

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From all I have seen and read of Mr Trump, I will credit him with wanting to implement something approaching his more "radical" statement policies - if for no other reason than he will not want the clamour from his acolytes that he lied to them. Therefore, it will be interesting to see if the Republican controlled House and Senate will seek to exercise some control, or will look to jump on his popular coat tail.

David

 

MacMini, Mytek Manhattan I DAC, Avantone The Abbey Monitors, Roon

 

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It's the End of the world as we know it ...

 

Nobody can reasonably foresee what will happen now. It has never happened before that such a politically unexperienced and erratic man has lead the most powerful country in the world.

 

Trump has to fulfill at least part of his mostly unrealistic promises, although he doesn't know how. He might try some very stupid plans (like the Mexico wall), or blame other countries for Americas problems and alienate his international partners. With the sanctions on Putin, or the Brexit, we've seen that governments are sometimes driven to decisions which are economically harmful for everybody.

 

One of the most important challenges of humanity (but which Trump supporters refuse to acknowledge) is climate change and the management of natural resources. If the US doesn't want to participate in agreements to reduce global warming, the other big polluters won't either, and nothing will be done about it.

Claude

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After the Brexit vote we all aired our thoughts about the events. Although it wasn't related directly to audio, I felt it was important to let members of the CA Community have their voices heard. This US election is no different. It's not directly related to audio, but I know the Community will have a lot of comments on the situation. What better than to discuss this event than amongst friends? Well, not so fast. We all know this thread will eventually turn into a $#!t show. That said, the floor is open for the time being. Turn this thread ugly and it will be closed quickly.

Founder of Audiophile Style

Announcing The Audiophile Style Podcast

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Although it wasn't related directly to audio, I felt it was important to let members of the CA Community have their voices heard.

But audio does have a role to play for us, because our pleasures will help us accept and adapt to whatever's in store now. My wife and I had great difficulty watching election coverage last night, so she went to sleep and I put on my headphones for some soul soothing. And the sun rose this morning like it always does. The groove is still as deep, the music's just as sweet, and my espresso's so fine! With pleasures like these, we're better able to make the best of whatever life throws at us. I suspect my audio systems will become even more important to me in the near future, as I'm one of those who's not thrilled with what's happened - but it is what it is and our country's still our country.

 

Put it on, crank it up, and may the music lift each of us to a higher level!

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It's the End of the world as we know it ...

 

Nobody can reasonably foresee what will happen now. It has never happened before that such a politically unexperienced and erratic man has lead the most powerful country in the world.

 

Trump has to fulfill at least part of his mostly unrealistic promises, although he doesn't know how. He might try some very stupid plans (like the Mexico wall), or blame other countries for Americas problems and alienate his international partners. With the sanctions on Putin, or the Brexit, we've seen that governments are sometimes driven to decisions which are economically harmful for everybody.

 

One of the most important challenges of humanity (but which Trump supporters refuse to acknowledge) is climate change and the management of natural resources. If the US doesn't want to participate in agreements to reduce global warming, the other big polluters won't either, and nothing will be done about it.

 

Yes, climate change is a very, very big one. To save this planet, we have to act now. American action on climate change will end now. I think that you are absolutely right - if America backs out of the Paris Accords, so will India, and so will a number of other countries. We almost had a majority of humanity onboard with the Accord - gone now.

 

Trump has to reward the coal miners - that's an instant disaster for the planet. He'll immediately build oil pipelines thus increasing our reliance on hydrocarbons. As a Canadian, I've watched the increasing cooperation between the American EPA and our Great Lakes authorities. That cooperation took money and Obama put tons of money into it - gone now.

 

of course none of this even speaks to the probability of 'stop and frisk' Gulliani becoming the US Attorney General. There's going to be war in the inner cities because Trump thinks that you address poverty with more policing.

 

'Something that I didn't know, until last night, is that the Presidency is not covered by any conflict of interest legislation. I'm thinking that there will be no more mention of Trump's taxes and grossest of all that Tump will become even richer while in power. No legislation stops him from running his business while running the country. In his business practices, he's a crook and that's not going to get any better.

 

one question that I have is whether sycophancy will take over from this morning. Will many of those who withdrew their support for Trump come running back for crumbs from his table.

Music Server(s): Aurender N100H, Digital to Analog Converter(s): Audio Research DAC 8, Digital to Digital Converter: Bryston BUC-1, Preamplifier: Ayre K-5xeMP, Amplifier(s): Ayre V-5xe, Loudspeakers: Revel Ultima Salon 2, Interconnects: Kimber PBJ, Cardas Clear, Bryston AES/EBU, Loudspeaker Cables: Kimber PR8, Miscellaneous: Oppo BDP 95 disk player, CJ Walker turntable Jelco SA-750D tone arm, Ortofon 2M black cartridge, Magnum Dynalab tuner, Dream System: I've got it!, Headphones: Sennheiser HD600, Grado PS500e, Headphone Amplifier(s):Graham Slee Novo

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End of America? I doubt it as the Constitution will now continue to live as it was "meant"

 

If one looks at the history of America, which few on these threads know much about, the US Constitution began being shredded in earnest since the FDR era. Most of us Constitutional Conservatives believe this election was most important strictly regarding the restoration of the Supreme Court to one of an originalist court rather than a activist court.

 

Many of us here believe and cherish our Constitution and the Framer's intent and the rules set by the same which many of you abroad have a hard time understanding.

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My uk view is you got the American dream... There are people on the top doing very well and making sure they stay there....... Either depression or glut war or peace the rich do very well thank you... 2 party politics just slightly leans on what side the crumbs fall off the table. But we will never sit up there.

But neither will half the world. It seems the top half give the impression of a Las Vagas casino.... but the house always win in the end.... House of Parliament. .House of Representatives ?. . . Brexit has me worried... I hope Trump is a wake up call and the post Trump presidential term is just bad headlines and not leaving you guys in a mess....

Good luck to us all....

 

 

Sent from my SM-G900F using Computer Audiophile mobile app

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But audio does have a role to play for us, because our pleasures will help us accept and adapt to whatever's in store now. My wife and I had great difficulty watching election coverage last night, so she went to sleep and I put on my headphones for some soul soothing. And the sun rose this morning like it always does. The groove is still as deep, the music's just as sweet, and my espresso's so fine! With pleasures like these, we're better able to make the best of whatever life throws at us. I suspect my audio systems will become even more important to me in the near future, as I'm one of those who's not thrilled with what's happened - but it is what it is and our country's still our country.

 

Put it on, crank it up, and may the music lift each of us to a higher level!

 

It's posts like this one that brighten my day.

 

No matter what side of this election one is on, the value of our audio systems, our favorite music, and this wonderful hobby is much grater than the price tag. Music can sooth our souls or energize a victory party.

 

Maybe we can all be kinder to each other today (winner or loser), and recommend some great music to finish this election period. Soothing, energizing, or whatever, great music is great music.

 

Thanks so much @bluesman

Founder of Audiophile Style

Announcing The Audiophile Style Podcast

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No matter what side of this election one is on, the value of our audio systems, our favorite music, and this wonderful hobby is much grater than the price tag. Music can sooth our souls or energize a victory party.

 

Maybe we can all be kinder to each other today (winner or loser), and recommend some great music to finish this election period. Soothing, energizing, or whatever, great music is great music.

And I have a turntable...

30843300056_f75a906cf2_k.jpgDSC_9183.jpg by Eloise, on Flickr

Eloise

---

...in my opinion / experience...

While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing.

And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism.

keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out.

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In my adult life I have been surprised twice. Once when the Berlin Wall came down, and again last night. I must say that the news media and the pollsters were very big losers last night.

 

Not only is "wait and see" the best course of action. It is just about the only course of action we have.

 

 

Now that Republicans will gain control of the government, will FOX News go out of business?

In any dispute the intensity of feeling is inversely proportional to the value of the issues at stake ~ Sayre's Law

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My uk view is you got the American dream... There are people on the top doing very well and making sure they stay there

As an American it saddens me to acknowledge the truth in this observation.

 

If Trump wants to "make America great again" he will denounce the racist, homophobic, and misogynistic sentiments upon which he rose to power. If he did that I, for one, would line up right behind him.

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We'll be fighting in the streets

With our children at our feet

And the morals that they worship will be gone

And the men who spurred us on

Sit in judgment of all wrong

They decide and the shotgun sings the song

 

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution

Take a bow for the new revolution

Smile and grin at the change all around

Pick up my guitar and play

Just like yesterday

Then I'll get on my knees and pray

We don't get fooled again

 

The change, it had to come

We knew it all along

We were liberated from the fold, that's all

And the world looks just the same

And history ain't changed

Cause the banners, they are flown in the next war

 

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution

Take a bow for the new revolution

Smile and grin at the change all around

Pick up my guitar and play

Just like yesterday

Then I'll get on my knees and pray

We don't get fooled again

No, no!

 

I'll move myself and my family aside

If we happen to be left half alive

I'll get all my papers and smile at the sky

Though I know that the hypnotized never lie

Do ya?

 

There's nothing in the streets

Looks any different to me

And the slogans are replaced, by-the-bye

And the parting on the left

Are now parting on the right

And the beards have all grown longer overnight

 

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution

Take a bow for the new revolution

Smile and grin at the change all around

Pick up my guitar and play

Just like yesterday

Then I'll get on my knees and pray

We don't get fooled again

Don't get fooled again

No, no!

 

Yeah!

 

Meet the new boss

Same as the old boss

 

 

 

[video=youtube_share;zYMD_W_r3Fg]

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My personal opinion is that she lost this election all on her own. I voted for hope and change when Obama first got in office and I did it again when I voted for Trump. I think Hillary missed out on votes like mine by not addressing all of the things we aren't happy with. People are fed up with Obamacare and other things related to the current democratic presidency. She needed to explain why we needed another democrat not just blast Trump or boast about how she would continue Obama's policies.

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In my adult life I have been surprised twice. Once when the Berlin Wall came down, and again last night. I must say that the news media and the pollsters were very big losers last night.

 

Not only is "wait and see" the best course of action. It is just about the only course of action we have.

 

 

Now that Republicans will gain control of the government, will FOX News go out of business?

I agree, some big losers were the "news" media and pollsters. I don't know how many times over the last several months, I looked at the New York Times section that said Hillary's chance of winning was between 80-90%. Heck, even 538, who predicted all 51 "states" in the last election, got many wrong this time.

 

I frequently tell my friends that the President doesn't have too much power in our democracy. It's designed this way. And, not much will change between now and the next election, that's directly related to the President. Sure, the President appoints judges and can enter or remove us from partnerships, but Congress is where the real power is located. I said this for the last several elections and I think it still holds up.

 

Without a dictator who is in office for decades, the US will never be doomed because of a single President. Life is a very long journey, not a sprint. We select a captain to steer the ship every four years. Some of us will be happy with the direction it's steered while others will suggest a different course. Four or eight years is a blink of the eye in the long run.

Founder of Audiophile Style

Announcing The Audiophile Style Podcast

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