NADAC vs. MSB vs. Playback Designs blind listening test

[danish]

You should be able to get the Emotion software from your NADAC dealer or from Merging directly.

I tried it here but ended up staying with JRiver Media Center 22.

 

Is there any particular reason that you stayed with MC22? I also tried Emotion, but I find MC22 way more user friendly.

[astrotoy]

Shoulda told me! I live just outside Geneva.

 

We spent (the operative word in Geneva) three fabulous days there. Dom Brulhart and his wife Irene hosted us for lunch at their home and we also had a good listening session comparing the NADAC (only the stereo version) with another Swiss made DAC. Geneva is an absolutely beautiful city. The lake is a marvel. We were in a nice hotel right on the lake. I was told before we arrived to be prepared for the sticker shock. However, it did prepare us for the next city on our trip - Oslo.

 

Will let you know the next time we are there. Thanks, Larry

[semente]

Pardon my ignorance but what do you mean by "sticker shock"?

[astrotoy]

Pardon my ignorance but what do you mean by "sticker shock"?

 

If you visit Geneva or Oslo, be prepared for the sticker shock of walking into an average restaurant, or staying in a decent hotel. Oslo and Geneva were rated as two of the three most expensive cities to visit in the world, and we did both cities on one trip!

 

Larry

[Keith_W]

"Sticker shock" refers to the shock of seeing the price on the sticker. I very much enjoyed my visit to Geneva as well, but all I could afford to eat were ham sandwiches.

[semente]

Haven't been there since the early 90's, I was in my late teens when I crossed a large part of Europe with an inter-rail pass.

It was already expensive then but I was saved by the endless fountains (a water bottle cost £1.50) and limited my staple diet to bread, cheese and fruit.

 

R

[wisnon]

"Sticker shock" refers to the shock of seeing the price on the sticker. I very much enjoyed my visit to Geneva as well, but all I could afford to eat were ham sandwiches.

 

LoL. Imagine if you have to live here...

[semente]

LoL. Imagine if you have to live here...

You'll probably get paid accordingly.

[mansr]

LoL. Imagine if you have to live here...

I thought the trick was to live across the border in France.

[MikeJazz]

You'll probably get paid accordingly.

 

Of course.

In Oslo you would also find that, in relative terms, services are more expensive than products.

I bought travel cases and clothes and a level of price comparable to Portugal, or Spain.

However, services incorporate more "man hours", so you pay it accordingly.

 

In the final mix of Services, Products and Income from Work, you can live better in Oslo than in the Iberian capitals.

You just have to adapt habits; of example, I can't dine out so many times...

[wisnon]

You'll probably get paid accordingly.

Unfortunately not.

[mansr]

Of course.

In Oslo you would also find that, in relative terms, services are more expensive than products.

I bought travel cases and clothes and a level of price comparable to Portugal, or Spain.

However, services incorporate more "man hours", so you pay it accordingly.

 

In the final mix of Services, Products and Income from Work, you can live better in Oslo than in the Iberian capitals.

You just have to adapt habits; of example, I can't dine out so many times...

In Oslo you do not live, you exist. Speaking as a former resident.

[wisnon]

Of course.

In Oslo you would also find that, in relative terms, services are more expensive than products.

I bought travel cases and clothes and a level of price comparable to Portugal, or Spain.

However, services incorporate more "man hours", so you pay it accordingly.

 

In the final mix of Services, Products and Income from Work, you can live better in Oslo than in the Iberian capitals.

You just have to adapt habits; of example, I can't dine out so many times...

Somewhat true but Germans on average have the best deal...Cheap as Spain with with near Swiss salaries.

 

Germans who work commute to Switzerland have the best deal of all.

[wisnon]

In Oslo you do not live, you exist. Speaking as a former resident.

 

 

Yup, tell them for me...its hard for outsiders to understand.

[wisnon]

I thought the trick was to live across the border in France.

 

 

France is only cheaper for housing...nearby France has only slightly lower prices...

[MikeJazz]

In Oslo you do not live, you exist. Speaking as a former resident.

 

I spoke from my own experience...and I "existed" there very happily for more than one year.

[MikeJazz]

Going back to the interesting comparison made, and having myself the opportunity to listen to a nadac soon, does anyone know how the nadac 2 channel compares to the 8 channel in summation mode?

[mansr]

I spoke from my own experience...and I "existed" there very happily for more than one year.

I spent about two years there. I mostly enjoyed it, but it wasn't cheap. As you said, anything requiring manpower tends to cost a lot while physical stuff is more reasonably priced. Or one could argue that the rest of Europe doesn't value labour as highly as it should.

[astrotoy]

Of course.

In Oslo you would also find that, in relative terms, services are more expensive than products.

I bought travel cases and clothes and a level of price comparable to Portugal, or Spain.

However, services incorporate more "man hours", so you pay it accordingly.

 

In the final mix of Services, Products and Income from Work, you can live better in Oslo than in the Iberian capitals.

You just have to adapt habits; of example, I can't dine out so many times...

 

Good point. We are typically tourists and not shoppers (except for the occasional used vinyl), so the services part of the equation (hotels, restaurants, concerts) is a bigger part of our budget. Interestingly, the third city on the list of most expensive last year was London. However, with the plummeting pound, it is coming close to being reasonable.

 

Not sure whether new audio equipment made in Europe is cheaper in Europe or the US. I believe that people living in the E.U. countries or those who follow the E.U trade agreements have to pay the VAT. I know that if I am buying SACD's or R2R tapes from a European or UK company and I am in the US, I don't have to pay VAT, which is around 20% for many countries. However, in California where I live, the state does charge the equivalent of sales tax for equipment that gets shipped through customs into the US. I had to pay that for a piece that I bought from the manufacturer in Canada.

 

Larry

[Jud]

In Oslo you do not live, you exist. Speaking as a former resident.

I know many current and former residents who would disagree.

 

On the other hand, how anyone can eat lutefisk....

[mansr]

On the other hand, how anyone can eat lutefisk....

 

That's nothing compared to surströmming.

[astrotoy]

Going back to the interesting comparison made, and having myself the opportunity to listen to a nadac soon, does anyone know how the nadac 2 channel compares to the 8 channel in summation mode?

 

I have heard both, but not side by side. My understanding is that the engineering is identical. That is one reason that the mch NADAC is just a little more expensive (10% more IIRC) than the 2ch version.

 

Larry

[esldude]

Going back to the interesting comparison made, and having myself the opportunity to listen to a nadac soon, does anyone know how the nadac 2 channel compares to the 8 channel in summation mode?

 

The 8 channel to 2 channel summation should have 6 db more dynamic range. Should have better low level linearity. So one has 130 db dynamic range and the other has 124 db dynamic range. My guess is everything else is not quiet enough for this to matter.

[Sam Lord]

Just a procedure comment:

 

Given the resolution of these DACs, I think you need volume differences well below +-0.1dB. I suggest you run everything through HQPlayer, whether or not you chose to use its up-or-over sampling. Miska touts the extreme precision and accuracy of his software volume control, and he certainly has proven the abilities of HQP in performance. OTOH, you could simply use JMRC's volume control and would probably do fine.

 

Just to be extra fair and paranoid , make sure you change the volume of *every* device under test (DUT): don't leave any reference piece unmolested by volume control processing. And certainly leave the bit and sample rates as high as possible and equal for all DUTs. You must make sure that *either none or all* of the DUTs use the chosen rate as native, a mixed set could skew the results.

 

And as someone mentioned before, definitely measure output using VOLTAGES across a fixed, very stable load. A very accurate (6-1/2 digit) true rms desktop DMM can be had for not too much money and is very handy. You can rent -this Agilent unit- for (I expect) around $100-200 a month from Test Equity.

 

...On the other hand, how anyone can eat lutefisk....

 

Jud, at a stroke you became the most despised and adored man in Norway.

[Distinctive]

Start with geitost (brown cheese), then you should try smalahove (sheep head) - Norway's 'Haggis' with a bottle of akevitt (aquavit).

Makes up for the lutefisk every day of the week and twice on Sundays