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Discussion of AC mains isolation transformers

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Well it worked and it worked really well.

Added the following:
-Topaz 91001-41 for the AVR, 2 channel amplifier(for 2 height channels), 3 mono amplifiers(2 subwoofers, 1 tactile transducer system), and the fiber transmitters psu(jameco 12v1a lps)

-Topaz 91095-32 for the projector

-VH Audio Flavor 4 cabling to the projector and AVR

-Atlona AT-HDR-EX-70-2PS ethernet hdmi extender between the HTPC and AVR, transmitter powered by a jamevo 5v1a regulated lps, receiver powered by an Uptone Ultracap LPS at 7v with the ground shunted smps and Canare 4s8 dc cable. The ultracap and uptone smps are necessary to break all leakage.

-AV Access 4KEX300-F om3 fiber hdmi extender between the AVR and projector. transmitter powered by a jamevo 12v1a regulated lps, receiver powered by an Uptone Ultracap LPS at 12v with the ground shunted smps and Canare 4s8 dc cable. The ultracap isnt required for leakage loops here because of the optical connection.

-Replaced front left/right and center speaker wire from bargain 16awg to canare 4s8.

Audio(Denon X4200W and Polk LSIMs):
Sibilance gone, prodigous bass, immediately had to turn the subs down, extension is better? how thats possible is beyond me, i would use a loudness eq curve(denon dynamic eq) to get better bass extension and had to turn it off. imaging is just incredible, overhead localization is much more pronounced. Atmos content is just unreal now. Voices are so much more natural, as I said there was heavy sibilance with the polks, and female voices had a very boomy quality, all alleviated. Music sounded meh before now it sounds more or less perfect for the hardware used.

Video(Benq W1070, 1080p60hz rgb full signal)
Lower black level(i think more just a noise free image makes the blacks more solid and appear lower), better shadow detail, better bit depth, colors, and sharpness, image is significantly more stable, easier to focus on, incredible really. I was very curious what the effects on video would be, being limited to an idea of a washed out image with less than perfect signal integrity. Really looking forward to a 4k projector with a better lense now.

So ya... any surround sound enthusiasts and tinkerers out there, putting your AVR and display on a line noise suppressor, isolating from a htpc with a fiber hdmi extender(or ethernet with ultracap lps and uptone smps), providing excellent signal integrity and ultra clean power makes a huge difference, despite not using audiophile class a nonfeedback current signal amplifiers ;]

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were the 3 mono amplifiers Denons?  or what brand/model?


"The overwhelming majority [of audiophiles] have very little knowledge, if any, about the most basic principles and operating characteristics of audio equipment. They often base their purchasing decisions on hearsay, and the preaching of media sages. Unfortunately, because of commercial considerations, much information is rooted in increasing revenue, not in assisting the audiophile. It seems as if the only requirements for becoming an "authority" in the world of audio is a keyboard."

-- Bruce Rozenblit of Transcendent Sound

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1 minute ago, Ralf11 said:

were the 3 mono amplifiers Denons?  or what brand/model?

No, 2 are Bash subwoofer plate amplifiers(built into the subwoofers) and 1 is a dayton subwoofer plate amplifier for the tactile transducerss(bass shakers).

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On 6/3/2019 at 8:37 AM, One and a half said:

Where, when did you receive the Accuphase cables? The 40th anniversary models.

They're from Aliexpress...cheapo and effective powercords. On crisp electronics can make some good differences (well, my Denafrips Ares sound more civilized with one of this...)

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On 7/9/2019 at 1:35 PM, elpampeano said:

They're from Aliexpress...cheapo and effective powercords. On crisp electronics can make some good differences (well, my Denafrips Ares sound more civilized with one of this...)

Thanks , asked since the Japan site had cables listed (as well as pro gear) but have gone by the wayside. Enjoy!


AS Profile Equipment List        Say NO to MQA

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6 hours ago, One and a half said:

Thanks , asked since the Japan site had cables listed (as well as pro gear) but have gone by the wayside. Enjoy!

The real ones are bloody expensives. Sure they're work...but worth the money ? Maybe i will choose a power cord for a specialized, non-magic brand. 

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After reading the IT approach with an IT before the power strip and every component connected to the same power strip advocated by John Swenson in one of the first posts of this thread, I have the following question. 


Wouldn't using a separate IT per component and plugging these separate ITs in to the same power strip lead to the same advantage of cutting down impedance, lowering noise generated by leakage loops? If this is the case, the additional benefit of separate isolation would be that noise between components is also blocked. This seems to be the approach of German manufacturer Audioplan
(https://www.audioplan.de/mainspower-en/powerstar-en/?lang=en), when you would ignore the filtering before the power strip. 
 

If my question is considered too off topic for this thread, feel free to remove my post. 

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The advantage of a large Isolation Transformer (3000 to 5000VA) is:

It can be wired as a Separately Derived System. This means that the paths of the Safety Grounds/Protective Earths and the Neutral to the components and to each other can be kept very short.

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Could you please recommend some isolation tansformers soch as elgar or topaz models 

for the 230 / 240 v mains ?

I am from Europe.

 

it could be current model or old .

price is not as important . Willing to pay much more if the quality will be excellent.

 

thank you 

 

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2 hours ago, cool_chris said:

Could you please recommend some isolation tansformers soch as elgar or topaz models 

for the 230 / 240 v mains ?

I am from Europe.

 

it could be current model or old .

price is not as important . Willing to pay much more if the quality will be excellen

2 hours ago, cool_chris said:

thank you 

 

7CFEF6AD-CBF4-439A-B51E-D7F7BF5B4920.thumb.jpeg.7182d57fed528ad89eeba9dca1e8dca4.jpeg


elgar iso tran(2.5kVa, .0005pfd)>consonance pw-3 boards>macmini (16gb ram-ssd-js2 psu-mmk)[hd(naq psu)]>netgear gs105 switch[clones psu])>ghent js ethernet>ultraRendu(js-2)>uspbc>iso regen(lps-1/naq psu)>curious link>rme adi-2 dac>cawsey cables>naquadria sp2 passive pre> 1.naquadria lucien mkII.5 power>elac fs249be + elac 4pi plus.2> 2.perreaux9000b(mods)>2xnaq12” passive subs.

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3 minutes ago, cool_chris said:

Also any current models are available ?

are any better than the listed above , or this is the one ?

Newer is not necessarily better. This is not software with bugs at every corner, but established engineering and production that last years. 

Look for the models with the 0.0005 pf between windings or less.


AS Profile Equipment List        Say NO to MQA

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Thank you 

tried to find elgar but this is not available.

there are few 500 usd offers that expired.

I could pay much more than that .

Where to find it ?  

Is enyone willing to sell me one ?

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How to mesure the interwinding capacitance ? ( isolation) 

I got the Topaz 5kv  120/ 240  - 12/240 but the sticker with serial number and capacitance number is not there.

I took a risk , because it was offered 110 usd only. 

This kind of stuff is usually in 1500 usd area....

Can I mesure the interwinding capacitance myself ?

 

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What is the isolation | sound quality difference when isolating trafo is :

 

0.005 pf

0.001 pf

0.0005 pf 

 

I know the lower the better, but 

Do you still get the SQ benefit of if it is in higher numbers?

 

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3 hours ago, cool_chris said:

 Do you still get the SQ benefit of if it is in higher numbers?

 

I think it's about 125db common node noise rejection for the .005 and 145db for the .0005.  I have a couple .005 units and they still greatly benefit sound quality.

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How to mesure the interwinding capacitance ? ( isolation) 

I got the Topaz 5kv  120/ 240  - 12/240 but the sticker with serial number and capacitance number is not there.

I took a risk , because it was offered 110 usd only. 

This kind of stuff is usually in 1500 usd area....

Can I mesure the interwinding capacitance myself ?

 

Who knows how this is should be done ?

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you would need to own a capacitance meter, to start with...


"The overwhelming majority [of audiophiles] have very little knowledge, if any, about the most basic principles and operating characteristics of audio equipment. They often base their purchasing decisions on hearsay, and the preaching of media sages. Unfortunately, because of commercial considerations, much information is rooted in increasing revenue, not in assisting the audiophile. It seems as if the only requirements for becoming an "authority" in the world of audio is a keyboard."

-- Bruce Rozenblit of Transcendent Sound

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5 hours ago, cool_chris said:

How to mesure the interwinding capacitance ? ( isolation) 

I got the Topaz 5kv  120/ 240  - 12/240 but the sticker with serial number and capacitance number is not there.

I took a risk , because it was offered 110 usd only. 

This kind of stuff is usually in 1500 usd area....

Can I mesure the interwinding capacitance myself ?

 

Who knows how this is should be done ?

 

Capacitance meters are often inaccurate and expensive. To measure the value of capacitance, you can use a multimeter capable of measuring frequency, and current in the microamp region. From this video on YouTube, connect the microA meter in circuit like this.

 

image.thumb.png.bed49ca440fcb62d1d99628c883da714.png

 

For the Topaz, connect X1 to the + of the meter -ve to the ground. This is the tricky bit. Remove all internal grounding type wires from the Topaz. Join them altogether temporarily and connect to the -ve side of the meter and leave them not connected to the chassis of the Topaz.

 

Connect the 120/240 to the transformer with earth ground as shown H1 Hot, H4 Neutral, Ground to a chassis point. Earlier in this thread are several OPTIONS to connect the Topaz for different voltages.

 

Take the reading of the current in AC. Example 22 uA AC

Disconnect the power, and remove the meter, and place it across X1 to X4. Change to measuring AC Volts, usually can also read Hz.

Re-apply AC and measure the frequency in Hz, eg 50.03 Hz. Measure the volts eg 230V AC across X1 to X4.

Switch everything off.

 

Calculator time

 

Z = 1/(2 x PI x f x C)

Z = V/I

 

V/I = 1/(2 x PI x f x C)

V = 230

I = 22 x 10 ^-6

PI = 3.14159.... that pi not pie (apple)

f = 50.03

Solve for C and you have the capacitance value of the Topaz in Farads to the accuracy of your meter.

 

Tip : Fingers to terminals when powered on = 2' - 60cm. Use clips on the meter to take measurements.

 

For $100, you might be lucky and score a low value, like 0.0001 pf :)

 

 


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1 hour ago, One and a half said:

For $100, you might be lucky and score a low value, like 0.0001 pf :)

 

 

Hell, a 5kv .005 unit for $100 is amazing too...

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On 8/6/2019 at 3:06 AM, One and a half said:

 

Capacitance meters are often inaccurate and expensive. To measure the value of capacitance, you can use a multimeter capable of measuring frequency, and current in the microamp region. From this video on YouTube, connect the microA meter in circuit like this.

 

image.thumb.png.bed49ca440fcb62d1d99628c883da714.png

 

For the Topaz, connect X1 to the + of the meter -ve to the ground. This is the tricky bit. Remove all internal grounding type wires from the Topaz. Join them altogether temporarily and connect to the -ve side of the meter and leave them not connected to the chassis of the Topaz.

 

Connect the 120/240 to the transformer with earth ground as shown H1 Hot, H4 Neutral, Ground to a chassis point. Earlier in this thread are several OPTIONS to connect the Topaz for different voltages.

 

Take the reading of the current in AC. Example 22 uA AC

Disconnect the power, and remove the meter, and place it across X1 to X4. Change to measuring AC Volts, usually can also read Hz.

Re-apply AC and measure the frequency in Hz, eg 50.03 Hz. Measure the volts eg 230V AC across X1 to X4.

Switch everything off.

 

Calculator time

 

Z = 1/(2 x PI x f x C)

Z = V/I

 

V/I = 1/(2 x PI x f x C)

V = 230

I = 22 x 10 ^-6

PI = 3.14159.... that pi not pie (apple)

f = 50.03

Solve for C and you have the capacitance value of the Topaz in Farads to the accuracy of your meter.

 

Tip : Fingers to terminals when powered on = 2' - 60cm. Use clips on the meter to take measurements.

 

For $100, you might be lucky and score a low value, like 0.0001 pf :)

 

 

 

Thank you.

this looks impressive.

I think I am not going to do it myself.

Will adk someone to do it for me.

I was thinking this is easy. Not so easy.

 

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