Active Kef LS50

[DarwinOSX]

I have had these speakers for a few weeks now. I replaced my entire 5.1 system with them for home theater and for music. I felt the need to streamline all of that for various reasons.

Of course they sound amazing. I have them connected to my Samsung JS 9000 TV by optical and the TV has an Apple TV connected to it's one connect box so I can Airplay to it. I have also used the Kef app to play from iTunes and Flac files from Plex via DLNA. I have also connected directly from my MacBook Pro using a USB cable with Tidal MQA which really sounds great. Next I'm connecting my Meridian Explorer Dac which I just got to the Analog ports so I get the full MQA unfold.

I talked to Kef technical support with some questions and they said that MQA and Roon support are coming and that alot of people have asked for both. So that will be awesome and I think Im going to have to get a bedroom set when it does. I've been using Vanatoo one speakers and a 3rd gen Apple TV connected by optical to airplay to it in the bedroom but those sound muddy and indistinct now compared to the Kefs.

[DarwinOSX]

plus a sub

 

I haven't connected a sub to mine yet and the Dar Ko review indicated he didn't think it was really needed. Mine sodas great without one but I have an SVS SB1000 I am going to try with it mostly for home theater not music.

[DarwinOSX]

I finally got around to connecting my SVS sub and didn't hear enough difference to feel like it was needed so I disconnected it.

I also played Tidal MQA through a Meridian Explorer 2 DAC to get the full MQA unfold....amazing sound quality..

[DarwinOSX]

You fed the analogue output of the (MQA) DAC to the analogue input of the KEF actives?

 

Yes. Like this;

 

Between A/D and D/A: the power of pragmatism | DAR__KO

[DarwinOSX]

Still it doesn't make much sense logically.. It seems the only way to find out if this really works, would be to buy the active KEFs and try it. Hm..

 

I already did :-)

[DarwinOSX]

Deleted

 

You deleted your post so maybe you gave up on the Kefs but read the FAQ they put up shortly after these speakers were released. You have to use specific wifi channels. There is an entire section on wifi.

http://us.kef.com/ls50-wireless

Avoid locating your router network on Channel 1 of a 2.4Ghz network.

LS50 Wireless only supports 5.2 GHz Channel 36, 40, 44, 48 (in Taiwan 5.8GHz Channel 149, 153, 157, 161, 165).

[DarwinOSX]

On 3/12/2017 at 11:26 AM, Toolio said:

 

Roon integration would solve that problem, and allow easy NAS connectivity. I sincerely hope this is under consideration.

 

I asked Kef support about Roon and Tidal/MQA integration and they claimed both were under consideration.

I also bitched about the app and remote and asked if could use another remote like a Logitech harmony and they said I could but I haven't tried it yet.

I did do a direct connect Tidal/MQA with a Meridian Explorer 2 attached to the RCA ports and it sounded amazing. I'm pretty much all in on MQA and hope it becomes a thing with streaming etc.

 

[DarwinOSX]

1 hour ago, realhifi said:

They simply need a "wake on lan" setting in the software. Samsing tvs resisted this for years until they finally woke up and realized what being a network controlled device really is. I find it odd that a forward thinking company like KEF doesnt have that enabled on these. 

 

It is incredibly annoying along with the inability to detect and switch sources.

[DarwinOSX]

3 minutes ago, Rezseeker said:

KEF says they're working on improving the speakers, but won't say what specifically they'll  address in any future updates. This seems like an absolute no-brainer (though it should have been a no-brainer during development).

 

There is plenty of room for improvement. The speakers sound amazing but they need to keep this going with improving functionality.

Wake up on lan and auto switching of sources re basic and much needed.

MQA and Roon would be awesome..and would spur me to buy another set or two.

[DarwinOSX]

7 minutes ago, http404 said:

Apologies if this has been asked and answered before, but can the LS50w volume only be controlled via the KEF app / physical buttons, or does software volume control via an NAA (microRendu / sMS-200) work as well?

 

 

Anything attached by optical doesn't work for volume control.  Not sure about the microrendu but I bet it won't work..

I'm using a Logitech Harmony 650 remote with mine since I can't stand the standard remote.

[DarwinOSX]

6 minutes ago, http404 said:

microRendu and sMS-200 connect via USB only

Oh right,,,,and the other end is ethernet?  Good way to make a Roon endpoint with these speakers.

[DarwinOSX]

45 minutes ago, erniejade said:

I just use the nice small remote that comes with the speakers for volume.  

It's a terrible remote. The buttons are awful and not backlit. Cheap creaky plastic. It really is an afterthought and doesn't do justice to these speakers. 

 

[DarwinOSX]

1 hour ago, http404 said:

 

Exactly - especially since the microRendu is designed small and light enough to just suspend from a short USB cable such as a Curious Regen link. 

I've been looking  at this and the Bluseound Node 2 which was also give me Roon AND MQA through Tidal. 

[DarwinOSX]

1 hour ago, Arcus said:

I can also use the Roon app to control the volume of my Raspberry Pi /Hifiberry combo connected to the speakers. Hopefully, Roon support will be added soon so we can eliminate the need for any of these other devices.

You use the Pi as a Roon endpoint?  Connected how?

[DarwinOSX]

58 minutes ago, erniejade said:

I tried a node2 for about a week and returned it. To me, the soundstage shrunk several feet and it sounded constricted. This followed using the built in dac or my external dac. My wife and I both agreed the laptop going through a w4s recovery to the dac sounded much better. For the money, it is a good unit but, if you want something that is a little better for the same money especially using an  external dac , try the Aries mini. You can put a hard drive inside of it, output from USB right to the Kef, supports tidal but, you need to have a Mac product to run the software.

 

Thanks, I think if you use the RCA from the Node 2 to the Kefs it uses the Kef dac but then you get the digital to analog conversion.

I thought about the Aries mini but I feel that anything I get has to support MQA too.  If the Aries mini connects by usb which dac does it use?  It's own or the Kefs?

 

 

[DarwinOSX]

3 minutes ago, Arcus said:

My understanding is that you are using the KEF DAC regardless of what input you use. I did read one review where the author used an external DAC and reported some subtle changes to the sound even though the KEF DAC was also used so your mileage may vary. I have a Yggdrasil DAC but haven't bothered to see if there is any noticeable difference yet.

 

I remember now what I was thinking...if you use optical you don't get the full MQA unfolding but with RCA you do.  I connected my Meridian Explorer 2 to the Kefs using RCA and MQA sounds amazing.

My TV is connected to the Kefs by optical so I can't really use the optical port for anything else unless that device has the TV connected to it instead and then to the Kef's.

I hear a very noticeable difference with MQA to the point where it may make my vinyl collection superfluous if we get more MQA tracks.  With two of the three major studios signed on it looks like we will.

Kef told me they. are looking at both Roon and MQA for these speakers but who knows if it will actually happen.

 

 

 

[DarwinOSX]

16 minutes ago, Arcus said:

IMO, the Raspberry Pi/Hifiberry is an inexpensive way to get things working until Roon support is built-in. I bought the LPS-1 for mine but haven't had a chance to test it yet as I'm waiting for the USB adaptor to arrive.

As for MQA support, I was reading a blog recently where some testing was done and in those tests there was no measurable difference with MQA so I'm skeptical.

 

There is a lot out there about MQA and I have never seen anyone say it doesn't sound great and a noticeable difference.  Plus there is a lot of data showing this.

http://www.tonepublications.com/review/why-mqa/

 

[DarwinOSX]

14 minutes ago, Arcus said:

Check this out: http://archimago.blogspot.ca/2017/04/comparison-mqa-authentication-sound.html

 

I saw that one.  He is comparing an MQA track that is not the full MQA.  Like so many other formats not all MQA is created equal and it depends on the origin source.  He should also be comparing a lot more tracks and in general makes a lot of assumptions admitting he doesn't really know all the details.

He has a lot of detail in here but it seems like he was trying tp prove something he already believed.

If you haven't heard it for yourself try it and see what you think.

Back to the Aries Mini, I think it is a full Round endpoint now not just an Airplay endpoint?  Auralic said that would not happen with the Mini but it seems they relented.

 

OK found it,  Roon and MQA on the Aries Mini :-)

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/auralic-new-beta-firmware-5-0-support-in-house-mqa-decoding-web-browser-interface-and-roonready-for-aries-mini/24267

Apparently Aurilac is somehow reverse engineering MQA decoding themselves.

[DarwinOSX]

34 minutes ago, http404 said:

 

I'm not sure that Auralic is saying they have their own way to unfold MQA or reverse engineer it. Most of the Roon community posts start based on the Darko post below, which also has good news for folks who don't want to add the cost of an apple device to the purchase price of an Auralic product. 

 

IMO, for the money, there's not much that can touch the Aries mini for value and flexibility now that Roon endpoint support is on the table and less expensive control methods are finally becoming reality.

 

http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2017/04/auralic-firmware-v5-0-adds-dsp-engine-web-browser-control/

 

 

 

Aurilac has specifically made the statement that they are creating their own method rather than pay licensing fees and will use no MQA code.  It's on their Facebook page among other things and it seems pretty clear from Darko's post too.

The Aries Mini is pretty tempting right now.  I think it still comes with a full year of Tidal too?

 

[DarwinOSX]

46 minutes ago, Arcus said:

Yes, having both Airplay and Roon support is really helpful. Currently, I'm using my Transporter via optical for Roon and then unplugging it and plugging in my old Apple TV via optical for Apple Music. It sounds like the Aries would eliminate that hassle.

Having said that, is there any noticeable difference outputting optical via RCA to the speakers? I'm curious if using two DACs in sequence changes anything.

On another note, too bad my LPS-1 isn't sufficient to power the Aries Mini

 

46 minutes ago, Arcus said:

Having said that, is there any noticeable difference outputting optical via RCA to the speakers? I'm curious if using two DACs in sequence changes anything.

I've seen people say different things about that on other forums.  RCA vs optical.  It sounds like the digitization isn't obvious but it's a subjective thing.

[DarwinOSX]

1 minute ago, Arcus said:

From what I can tell, it seems like the 1 year Tidal subscription offer in the US @ $549 has now expired. In Canada, they only came with a 3 month subscription.

 

Yeah looks like it.  I get Tidal for a military discount so it doesn't cost me much anyway.  I also have subs ti Apple Music and Pandora.  Even Pandora sounds great through the Kefs.

[DarwinOSX]

3 minutes ago, Arcus said:

At $499 it's still a very good option with Airplay and Roon. I've been reluctant to pay $20 per month for Tidal HiFi when we have a family Apple Music sub although I really love the Roon integration.

I got it for MQA,

 

[DarwinOSX]

On 10/31/2016 at 2:47 PM, Abtr said:

Some may argue that it's not a good idea to build a DAC inside a speaker because of vibrations..

 

I'm pretty sure Kef has that figured out.

[DarwinOSX]

4 minutes ago, Toolio said:

Much of what is wrong with software and music access could be improved with Roon compatibility. I'm waiting to see that before I purchase.

I think I mentioned it another post but Kef told me they are looking at both MQA and Roon but no promises.

I'm looking at using a Bluesound Node 2 using optical between my TV and the speakers for both MQA and a Roon endpoint.  I've direct connected a Meridian Explorer 2 to the speakers to play MQA and it sounds amazing.

[DarwinOSX]

12 minutes ago, gbryant said:

The KEF app sucks!!!!! 

 

KEF .... put a little effort into it...please!

It does suck.  They should not have put it out in this state.  The remote sucks too but I'm using a Logitech Harmony 650 instead.

I also want auto-switching of inputs which seems like sorting that should have been there too.

Good thing these speakers sound so good....lots of room for usability improvements.