UltraCap™ LPS-1 launch thread!

[mozes]

The only possible option I could think about that may give better SQ, is you could test the new Isotek Genesis 100W AC regeneration PS in front of the JS-2.

 

EVO3 Genesis One - IsoTek Systems

 

Also a quite expensive solution. (2K?)

 

Well this looks interesting, I haven't heard of isotek before, but too expensive at 2K.

[zegel]

Yes, it will work fine, and as I posted here, I did not hear a difference between the two. That's really the point of the LPS-1.

 

Thanks,

 

AJC

 

Alex,congrats with the succes of the Ultracap! I just found out my 9V IFI power supply has an 1.5A output, not the advertised 2.0A.

 

Will this work to power the Ultracap, of do I need to order the Meanwell ( I am in the first batch, but did not order the Meanwell)

[sandyk]

Also I think John has said the LPS-1 requires 3A so it's also not powerful enough anyway.

 

The power requirements are 12V/1.5A, 9V/2A, or 7.5V/2.5A

[R1200CL]

The iFi 9V wall wart power supply that I purchase as an option with the microRendu really doesn't have a place in HiFi. It's a noisy SMPS and created hum problems for me by simply being plugged into the wall despite not being connected to anything. Nice packaging and marketing though.. if you're into that sort of thing.

 

Also I think John has said the LPS-1 requires 3A so it's also not powerful enough anyway.

 

The requirements for the LPS-1 as I read in Uptone web is:

(12V/1.5A, 9V/2A, or 7.5V/2.5A)

 

The ifi supplies: [TABLE=width: 100%]

[TR]

[TD]5V/2.5A; 9V/2.0A; 12V/1.8A; 15V/1.2A

 

Your ifi will do. Yes it sends a bit noise back to the AC, as any smps do. A power conditioner can prevent that. I use "reasonable" priced versions from Isol-8 and Isotek.

 

Hum can be related to a DC component. Those are more expensive to get rid of. Isotek Syncro is one option.

 

Somewhere in the MicroRendu tread or maybe it was in the Ultracap tread, John some time last 2 months has write some interesting things about power. And a lot of which PS to use or can be used with the LPS-1. iFi being one of them.

 

[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

[Confused]

Very good question. I asked the technical reps from the cap company we are using that exact question. They said the lifetime is actually not determined by the number of cycles but by the voltage and temperature. At the voltage we are using and the actual measured temperature of the caps in the case it comes out to over 50 years of lifetime. I think that is not going to be much of a problem for anyone.

 

The rep said the number of cycles is just a quick way to get some idea of how hot the caps are going to get. If you are using lots of deep cycle charge and discharge cycles the caps will get pretty hot. We are actually not charging and discharging them very much each cycle, so the temperature does not get as high.

 

Strangely enough the only time the caps actually get hot is when you unplug it. There is a circuit that fully discharges the caps when it powers down (explaining why you need that is long and complicated), THAT is a full deep discharge and does heat them up a fair amount (but still well within the ratings). The initial charge rate when you turn it on is a little lower than normal so it won't heat them up as much.

 

John S.

 

Reading through this thread I notice a couple of issues. Firstly, the LPS-1 can run a little hot with a microRendu if the associated DAC is consuming power. The second issue is the one touched upon in the above quote, that is that the LPS-1 is best left 'powered up' 24/7. Currently I am using an iFi powered microRendu which feeds a Mutec MC3+USB. The Mutec's method of isolating the USB means that the Mutec pulls lots of power via the USB, so with the 9V iFi, the microRendu does get very hot. Because of this, if I know I am not using the system for a few days, I simply turn the mR off. So it does concern me a little that if I am powering the mR from an LPS-1, and the mR is providing lots of USB current to the Mutec, then both the mR and the LPS-1 are going to be running hot. (although hopefully the mR a little less hot with the 7V LPS-1 rather than with the 9V iFi). So with both mR and LPS-1 running hot, I would want the option to simply turn the whole lot off if I know I will not be using the system for a few days. Then reading the above, it would appear that powering down the LPS-1 is not the best idea!

 

The concept behind the LPS-1, clean power, total isolation etc., appeals to me enormously. However, I am beginning to wonder if used with a microRendu +Mutec combination, a conventional LPSU might be the better option?

[Speedskater]

The supplied Mean Well "energizing" supply--the only piece that plugs into the wall--has almost a dozen certificates and certifications, including UL and CE.

 

The UltraCap LPS-1 DC>DC unit does not have any certificates, nor does it really need any. We may eventually waste a bunch of money on CE, but the only country where than has been any bother (with the REGEN) is Germany--and ironically that has only been when local customs offices look at the Mean Well and don't believe its legitimate CE cert. (Now for Germany-bound REGENs we put extra commercial invoices on the outside of the box and Frankfurt airport customs clears it, thus skipping the petty local customs offices and saving a lot of time).

The answer to my question is:

Yes, it's AC input module is safety tested and certified.

 

This is the modern way to build all kinds of low power appliances and entertainment equipment. Rather than safety testing every product, you use a (universal) AC module that has been safety tested. I would list safety tested as an assist, not all audiophile equipment is tested.

[R1200CL]

The UltraCap LPS-1 DC>DC unit does not have any certificates, nor does it really need any. We may eventually waste a bunch of money on CE

 

I think you may have misunderstood the CE requirements. As I see it, it can only benefit Uptone Audio to add CE marking to their products.

 

And it does not cost you anything. (Except the cost of adding that sticker to the print board and the case.)

And add a CE declaration on your website.

 

If I understand this correctly the CE sticker is something you add your self to a product, in order to state your product is within the CE requirements.

 

https://ec.europa.eu/growth/single-market/ce-marking_en

[pl_svn]

https://ec.europa.eu/growth/single-market/ce-marking_en

 

"Please note that a CE marking does not indicate that a product have been approved as safe by the EU or by another authority."

 

so... glad to learn a CE sticker doesn't actually mean a thing! LOL

 

[MikeyFresh]

It is on the box ( and on the website where I purchased it: probably an older model?? I will look for another power supply as it won't meet the required specsIFI AUDIO IPOWER 9V (1.5A)

 

€49,00

 

 

The folks at iFi had explained this some time back in one thread or another.

 

They indicated all iPower units no matter what the packaging says are identical. Initially they listed the current spec conservatively because more stringent 3rd party certification testing had yet to be completed at the time of the product launch.

 

Once that certification testing was done, they were able to change the listed spec on the packaging to a more robust current rating.

 

So the new listed current specs apply to all older iPower units, but not their original ULN power adapter which is an entirely different and separate product with different specs.

 

I don't have any affiliation with iFi, nor do I officially speak for them, so it might be a good idea to confirm the information above directly with iFi, they are pretty responsive from my experience.

[Blake]

#4236

 

My "El Cheap-O LPS"* has been shut away in a closet, waiting so long to fulfill its special purpose (injecting power into the LPS-1) and now, that moment has finally arrived.

 

For those living under a rock over the past year, the El Cheap-O is a 9V/3.3A Chinese-made LPS wonder that can only be described as Der Spitzenklasse!!

 

*Trademark 2015, 4est

 

[audiocrazy]

MicroRendu will make your system fly especially with LPS1 but the iFi is a stone that will sink it.

Shouldn't be used in any HiFi system.

I did not order Meanwell SMPS with LPS1 as I was planning to use iFi. This comment worries me and want to order Meanwell SMPS.

 

Is it possible to add Meanwell SMPS to the existing order?

[kissov]

My PayPal account was debited does that mean my LPS1 has shipped?

[genjamon]

We have not yet planned out a whole line of UltraCap™ supplies, so that future could be quite a ways off (we have one or two other product launches planned to come before).

 

As mentioned, two LPS-1 units in series--one set for 7V, one set for 5V--will give 12V, but that's not cheap for what will still be a 1.1A max current.

 

12V in one unit, and with greater current capability? That means a great many more and larger ultracapacitors, a much bigger chassis (at least 4 times the size), and a higher price. Back about a year ago, John and I sketched out a design for a monster--4-output, 6-10 amp, 5-18 volt--unit, code named "Dominator." But it would be about the size of two JS-2s (not LPS-1s)--and I can't remember if that even included the feeder PS. Napkin addition said it would sell for almost $3K.

 

I am sure we could do something in-between, but for right now we are concentrating on making the LPS-1 a success and trying to keep most everyone happy.

 

I'm very excited about the two LPS-1's I just ordered - perfect for my microRendu and also powering the one end of my optical fiber converter feeding microRendu.

 

However, if your power needs are more than these little ancillaries, and until Uptone comes up with a more powerful product, people might want to check out Vinnie Rossi over on Audiocircle - who has just announced a more powerful similar supercapacitor product to be available in the not so distant future. But it's double the price of the LPS-1, probably larger, and voltage output is not switchable. But it is capable of 12V, and can be returned to Vinnie to set a different output voltage later if you wish. Maybe it would be better just to purchase two LPS-1's and put them in series for the 12V.

[MikeyFresh]

I did not order Meanwell SMPS with LPS1 as I was planning to use iFi. This comment worries me and want to order Meanwell SMPS.

 

Is it possible to add Meanwell SMPS to the existing order?

 

I would not worry at all. That comment is one person's opinion, and while they are most certainly entitled to it, many others including myself are not getting that kind of bad result with the iPower and microRendu. I'm very pleased with the iPower's performance on both an absolute basis and especially in relation to it's $49 price.

 

Is it as good as my battery supply sonically? No it isn't, but that doesn't mean it sucks either. Additionally, the whole point of the LPS-1 is to to galvanically isolate the mains supply from the connected device, and in turn prevent ground loop and leakage current, while providing low noise stable voltage. In doing so it largely makes the quality of the energizing supply a non-issue.

 

Neither the Meanwell nor the iPower is fantastic, nor are they terrible, but in this case it hardly even matters unless you think one or the other will pollute your AC mains with less noise backwash.

[esmit]

I said First Batch ( so I'm inbetween 1 and 150!)! So I'm sorry- but I am not your doppelganger - so keep on searching!

 

It must be hornytoad

[audiocrazy]

I would not worry at all. That comment is one person's opinion, and while they are most certainly entitled to it, many others including myself are not getting that kind of bad result with the iPower and microRendu. I'm very pleased with the iPower's performance on both an absolute basis and especially in relation to it's $49 price.

 

Is it as good as my battery supply sonically? No it isn't, but that doesn't mean it sucks either. Additionally, the whole point of the LPS-1 is to to galvanically isolate the mains supply from the connected device, and in turn prevent ground loop and leakage current, while providing low noise stable voltage. In doing so it largely makes the quality of the energizing supply a non-issue.

 

Neither the Meanwell nor the iPower is fantastic, nor are they terrible, but in this case it hardly even matters unless you think one or the other will pollute your AC mains with less noise backwash.

Thanks for the assurance. I'll rest easy now.

I use iFi with Furman IT-Ref20i Power Conditioner with isolated Bank and have not noticed any hum. I also have HDPlex LPS as a backup source.

[Superdad]

My PayPal account was debited does that mean my LPS1 has shipped?

 

No. As indicated on the product order page, your UltraCap LPS-1 will ship in October (by the 14th or the 30th depending upon if your order number is above or below #4176).

 

Logistically--and here at launch--financially, it is very difficult for us to just do pre-authorizations on orders and to make the final charge at ship time.

 

This is the closest you are likely to ever see UpTone getting to "crowdfunding" (or as I like to refer to it crowd fleecing). While it goes against my moral fiber to take money from people more than a week or two in advance, in the case of the costly LPS-1 circuit boards (close to $150 each; plus $50 in other parts) we were initially only in a position to buy 150 boards (our board house is 100% pre-pay).

 

So now, based on the strong initial demand--and the proceeds from yesterday--we have gone ahead and ordered another 350 boards (that includes the 100 coming mid-October for the October 30th-promised people), plus another 250 cases, etc.

This is $50-70K flowing between accounts and vendors, etc. And if anybody thinks all this high-finance does not make me nervous they are mistaken.

 

This is why we would not accept a single order until the product engineering was 100% complete and I had a bulletproof, fully programmed board in my hands--one that is exactly as the production will be. John spent a lot of programming time to be sure that it will tolerate all sorts of things: being hooked up backwards, switching the output switch in use, overcorrect protection, etc.

The board I have has been running continuously under load for 5 days without incident.

 

While the above gives me confidence that the whole launch will go smoothly and everyone will be happy, I'd be lying if I said I didn't have major butterflies in my stomach. The adrenaline and the many tasks at hand are what's keeping me going. That and the kind support and enthusiasm from all of you fine folks.

 

Best,

--Alex C.

[R1200CL]

I did not order Meanwell SMPS with LPS1 as I was planning to use iFi. This comment worries me and want to order Meanwell SMPS.

 

Is it possible to add Meanwell SMPS to the existing order?

 

I would not worry to much. This is one person. Hum is normally caused by the DC component in you AC main. He may have other equipment very sensitive to the the smps noise sent back on the mains.

So what I'm saying is that it may not affect the MicroRendu at all, but depending on your other items in your systems, they may be sensitive to a or any smps.

 

I suggest you email Alex, and ask if you can add the $15 to your order. It's a very cheap insurance to pay.

[Superdad]

I think you may have misunderstood the CE requirements. As I see it, it can only benefit Uptone Audio to add CE marking to their products.

 

And it does not cost you anything. (Except the cost of adding that sticker to the print board and the case.)

And add a CE declaration on your website.

 

If I understand this correctly the CE sticker is something you add your self to a product, in order to state your product is within the CE requirements.

 

https://ec.europa.eu/growth/single-market/ce-marking_en

 

Thanks.

I have understood the process and requirements for many years (went through it with Hovland Company), and I keep up-to-date with changes in the regulations. Don't kid yourself about there not being significant costs--even to self-certify. If and when it becomes a real issue we will deal with it. But the AC-connected unit is fully certified, and the LPS-1 itself is in a sealed box, so nobody need worry about safety.

[Superdad]

Gents:

I removed a few of today's posts regarding the iFi iPower. This thread should not be used to disparage the function or performance of other manufacturers' devices.

 

The 9V iFi iPower units that John and I have seem to work fine energizing the UltraCap LPS-1. When used for this purpose there seems to be zero sonic difference between it and the 7.5V/2.93A Mean Well tabletop that normally comes with the LPS-1. Since there is only a $15 difference between buying the LPS-1 with or without the Mean Well, perhaps some of you will find a better use for the iPower in your systems.

 

Fo those of you who wish to add the Mean Well back to your order, this afternoon I will look into devising a logistically easy way to handle those requests. Lot's else to do, so give me a little time.

 

Lastly, I see ALL of your e-mails, and I will respond--to urgent ones first and then others as the days go. Client correspondence is VERY important to me, but it is also the least productive third of my days.

 

Thanks,

 

--Alex C.

[Astralark]

Well. I think for a complete isolation, it doesn't matter what kind of power supply to feed LPS1.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile

[YashN]

#4236

 

My "El Cheap-O LPS"* has been shut away in a closet, waiting so long to fulfill its special purpose (injecting power into the LPS-1) and now, that moment has finally arrived.

 

For those living under a rock over the past year, the El Cheap-O is a 9V/3.3A Chinese-made LPS wonder that can only be described as Der Spitzenklasse!!

 

*Trademark 2015, 4est

 

 

Balakay, can we get your impressions after you wire everything up? Thanks.

[Blake]

Balakay, can we get your impressions after you wire everything up? Thanks.

 

Will do

[YashN]

Will do

 

Cheers, Balakay

[sandyk]

If you guys are referring to the attached, it's NOT suitable to use with the LPS1 !!!

It's fine for the Regen though, which needs no more than around 500 mA

Do yourselves a favour and pay a little more for the Meanwell as well.

You can try suitable Linear PSUs later.

Alex

 

High-end 30W DC9V HiFi Linear power supply Regulated PSU for DAC headphone amp