SACD Ripping using an Oppo or Pioneer? Yes, it's true!

[homer_flagg]

I started the process of saving the dsf-files. The software created the main folder, but then it said: "Can't create stereo folder." and aborted

The same happened with the 5ch files.

Ripping as iso finished after 0 seconds (without saving anything, of course).

It's just this one disc, so it may be a bad pressing. If the automatically generated file names are too long, at least saving an iso should be possible, if I'm not mistaken? Other SACDs went just fine.

[[email protected]]

Any non-english or special character in the track name or album name?

[homer_flagg]

43 minutes ago, [email protected] said:

Any non-english or special character in the track name or album name?

Excellent point. It's very likely. Russian label, orchestra and composer.

[[email protected]]

Then there are some additional steps to rip the disc. Please see the very first guide for Sony bdp-s590.

[[email protected]]

5 hours ago, [email protected] said:

Then there are some additional steps to rip the disc. Please see the very first guide for Sony bdp-s590.

Extracted below:

 

PROCEDURE FOR ACCENTED CHARACTERS
If there are accented characters in the ISO name such as ö, ü, é, ñ, the PuTTY window might display "invalid argument" and ripping will not start. Here is a workaround:
• Re-paste the command ./sacd_extract_160 –I
• Add one space after –I and type two straight quotation marks
• Copy or type the ISO (album) name directly in between the quotation marks
• Delete the accented characters and type non-accented characters into the ISO name
• Hit Enter to start the SACD ripping process

[chichaz]

12 hours ago, [email protected] said:

Extracted below:

 

PROCEDURE FOR ACCENTED CHARACTERS

 

Most mastering engineers know to leave off non-ISO compliant characters these days. But there are probably a few hundred SACD releases over the years that had those characters before it became clear they can cause problems for end users. I'm glad there's a workaround for this particular problem. 

[joehirez]

@Nexus3

 

I've been using the amazing USB AutoRip and ripping through my SACD collection, but did run into one disk so far that won't rip.  After the tray opens and I insert the disc, the tray closes and disk spins briefly but then ejects.

 

When I remove the USB stick and just insert the disc in spins up fine and plays the SACD without a problem.  So the player doesn't seem to have any problem reading the SACD, but the AutoRip software might be handing up on it for some reason.

 

Any suggestions or workarounds most appreciated!

[Nexus3]

1 hour ago, joehirez said:

 

Any suggestions or workarounds most appreciated!

 

Might sound a bit strange but is the disc's bottom really golden? Or just name us the album / barcode.

[joehirez]

Actually, this disc is more gold in color now that you mention it.  The disc is Saint-Saens Organ Symphony with the Philadelphia Orchestra (Ondine ODE-1094-5).  I have a number of SACDs on this label and so far they have ripped without issue.  The ones that have worked appear to be a similar color (shade of gold).  So, maybe some issue with this disc in particular?

 

Thank you again for your help!

[MikeyFresh]

59 minutes ago, joehirez said:

Actually, this disc is more gold in color now that you mention it.  The disc is Saint-Saens Organ Symphony with the Philadelphia Orchestra (Ondine ODE-1094-5).  I have a number of SACDs on this label and so far they have ripped without issue.  The ones that have worked appear to be a similar color (shade of gold).  So, maybe some issue with this disc in particular?

 

Thank you again for your help!

 

Very likely this is an issue of special characters in the authoring of the metadata: Camille Saint-Saëns.

 

You can try to rip the same disc using the GUI, it contains a newer version of sacd_extract that will probably get around that issue.

 

This does not mean you are abandoning AutoRip, the two methods are not mutually exclusive, you can use both (I do). Prepare another USB flash drive with the appropriate AutoScript for your player, download/install and configure the GUI, and try to rip that same disc over the network.

[bernardl]

After extracting ISO files without problem using the latest AutoScipt on a USB stick on a Sony S6200, I am sometimes facing an issue with ISO2DSD that the last DSF file doesn't get generated successfully. I am using the latest OSX version (version 6).

 

The first ones taken roughly 10s per def file, but the last one never completes, or at least not in 30+ minutes.

 

This doesn't happen on all ISO images, just on some.

 

Is this a known issue and is there a way around it?

 

Cheers,

Bernard

 

[bradandbree]

Before I begin my story and ask my question, I want to thank the users/readers here for the wealth of information that is available. I have learned much by reading and searching here.  And I will try to be as concise as possible.

 

I have ~100 SACDs in my collection, which I am successfully converting to ISO files through an Oppo BDP-103 using the iso2dsd GUI app v.6 found in this forum.  No problems there at all under macOS Mojave, storing the ISO files on a Mac Pro. Thank you so much for this.

 

Initially, I was using the same app to create .dsf files from the .iso file, but was having an issue with popping noises between tracks.  Dutifully checking the forum for solutions, I came across a different SACDExtractGUI. The included version readme file lists the following:

SACDExtractGUI v0.1-7-g135cbd5d

sacd_extract version 0.3.9@setmind-13-g58db5f16fcf410ae4d6aeca226a067b37ade136a

 

I am using JRiver Media Center 25 on the MacPro as a DLNA server, to either a Yamaha CX-A5100 directly (wired connection), or to the Yamaha through an Oppo UDP-203 (also wired).  Both devices can find the DLNA server, but neither can play the ISO files directly. And the Yamaha doesn't like multichannel .dsf files fed directly to it from the server, but like the .iso playback issue, this is known.

 

My first issue is that even though I have playback in MC25 set to gapless, I still have pauses between tracks under any configuration I've tried: pushing, pulling, USB, etc.  This forum does not seem to have found a way around that, correct?

 

My next issue is the popping noise.  I was delighted when my re-converted .dsf files had just the slightest noise when changing tracks, although the combination of the non-gapless and noisy transition from movement 3 to 4 of Beethoven's 5th is almost enough to make me scrap my project altogether. However, I've noticed that when the tracks are multichannel, the popping noise is terrible, and happens both at the end of one track and the beginning of the next.

 

I've tried to be as diligent as possible about looking through the forums for answers, but I don't recall seeing anyone pointing out the difference between stereo and multichannel .dsf files with respect to the popping noise when everything else is the same. And my searches keep running in circles, often jumping from 2014 to 2018 and back and it's getting difficult to keep everything straight.

 

So I think it's time for me to emerge from the shadows and just ask for help.  What's the latest on gapless dsf playback with JRiver MC, and what's the latest with the intertrack popping noise?

 

Thank you all for your guidance, advice, and patience.

-Brad

 

[Kal Rubinson]

6 hours ago, bradandbree said:

I am using JRiver Media Center 25 on the MacPro as a DLNA server,

AFAIK, it is a DLNA problem and that is why I don't use it.

[BluRay444]

7 hours ago, bradandbree said:

I am using JRiver Media Center 25 on the MacPro as a DLNA server, to either a Yamaha CX-A5100 directly (wired connection), or to the Yamaha through an Oppo UDP-203 (also wired).  Both devices can find the DLNA server, but neither can play the ISO files directly. And the Yamaha doesn't like multichannel .dsf files fed directly to it from the server, but like the .iso playback issue, this is known.

If I understand you correctly both of the above connections are DLNA only... and I'll assume that playback works correctly when playing in JRMC, unless you respond otherwise... if you haven't done so already, I would pose this question at the JRiver interact/ network and remotes/ media network/ forum - first, to see if JRMC 25 mac has the capability to do what you're trying to do (be sure to mention you're using the OSX version MC25 because as you may already know the Mac and PC capabilities don't always track together), and second, to see if your DLNA output settings in JRMC are correct for what you're trying to do. Given the current issues with covid-19, I wouldn't necessarily expect a quick response... 

[bradandbree]

2 hours ago, Kal Rubinson said:

AFAIK, it is a DLNA problem and that is why I don't use it.

Hi Kal,

Thanks for replying.  I gathered from some of your other posts that you were an active JRMC user; are you saying you use something different as your DLNA server but JRiver as your media manager?  If so, how do you deliver your multichannel, hi-res files from a hard drive to your preamp/receiver?

Best,

-Brad

[bradandbree]

1 hour ago, BluRay444 said:

If I understand you correctly both of the above connections are DLNA only... and I'll assume that playback works correctly when playing in JRMC, unless you respond otherwise... if you haven't done so already, I would pose this question at the JRiver interact/ network and remotes/ media network/ forum - first, to see if JRMC 25 mac has the capability to do what you're trying to do (be sure to mention you're using the OSX version MC25 because as you may already know the Mac and PC capabilities don't always track together), and second, to see if your DLNA output settings in JRMC are correct for what you're trying to do. Given the current issues with covid-19, I wouldn't necessarily expect a quick response... 

Hi BluRay444,

Thanks for your help with this.  Yes, you're correct that when I use JRMC to simply play files on and from my computer, it works.  I can't test the multichannel capability, but the multichannel files do play in stereo from my computer.  And I will take your suggestion and post on the JRiver forums since it appears this may be an issue with them.

Just out of curiosity, if JRiver cannot do what I want it to do (deliver .dsf files gapless and without pops between tracks to my primary system), what are the group's recommendations for something that will?

Best,

-Brad

[BluRay444]

I can't really help as much as others might to your questions about DLNA... I used DLNA for a short period of time and was not satisfied with it (that was. a few generations earlier of JRMC than what you're using- (things are constantly evolving there, so your issues, if they're not simply getting all the settings right, might have been resolved already... also although I have a master license, I am currently using only the Windows version, and the Mac version always lags behind a bit and sometimes features in Windows aren't always inherited by the Mac version due to differences in the capabilities of the 3 operating systems (the third being Linux). Because wanted more than what DLNA could provide, I built 4 smallish mini-ITX computers, installed JRMC on them all and after giving the media on my main JRMC server UNC names, the 4 mini's connect to the server's library and treat it like the files are local... that way I see all of my hi-rez FLAC's, SACD's, Blu Rays, UHD Discs, and various file based media in their full glory without any transcoding.

[EugenF]

12 hours ago, bradandbree said:

 

My next issue is the popping noise.  I was delighted when my re-converted .dsf files had just the slightest noise when changing tracks, although the combination of the non-gapless and noisy transition from movement 3 to 4 of Beethoven's 5th is almost enough to make me scrap my project altogether. However, I've noticed that when the tracks are multichannel, the popping noise is terrible, and happens both at the end of one track and the beginning of the next.

Dear Brad,

The crackles/pops noises of dsf files is indeed a real problem.  
This is specially very annoying when tracks has no pauses in between and the level of audio signal is high.

In my opinion, here are the main causes:

a) by definition, dfs files has ID3 tags located at the end of files. Players spend more time seeking and reading at the end of file then came back at the beginning of file to start playing. Dsf files are large ones. Multichannel dsf files are bigger. For a network transfer is a big stress. Even local transfer has problems with large file manipulations.
b) huge ID3tags with lots of information to process at playing time;
c) dsf files have incorrect data in dsd header, audio streams or ID3 tags;
d) dsd audio data stream is improper processed by players.

 

To reduce pops/crackles you can try made DSF files:
-  first test your player with DSF files having no ID3 tags. In this way it reveals if pops/crackles are caused by the player itself;
-  with minimal ID3V2.3 tags, the benefit is smaller ID3 data to process; 
-  with minimal ID3V2.4 tags, here the benefit is using syncsafe integers (of ID3 frame size) which will not interfere with audio data stream;
-  with padding-less option activated; 
-  concatenate dsf files.

 

You can try do all these by using this sacd_extract client app (Linux and Window - and in near future MAC version):

https://github.com/EuFlo/sacd-ripper/releases/tag/0.3.9.3

 

[Kal Rubinson]

5 hours ago, bradandbree said:

I gathered from some of your other posts that you were an active JRMC user; are you saying you use something different as your DLNA server but JRiver as your media manager? 

I do not use DLNA.  For wireless, I use Roon.

5 hours ago, bradandbree said:

If so, how do you deliver your multichannel, hi-res files from a hard drive to your preamp/receiver?

I use wired ethernet between my NAS and my streamer.

I use a USB cable from my streamer to my DAC.

[EugenF]

Now we have macOS version of improved sacd_extract 0.3.9.3-71 (build for macOS with help of @Nexus3. Thank you!):

 

https://github.com/EuFlo/sacd-ripper/releases/tag/0.3.9.3

 

Also there are binaries for Windows and Linux too.

 

Revision 0.3.9.3-71 has an updated ID3tag character encoding.

[pl_svn]

25 minutes ago, EugenF said:

macOS version of improved sacd_extract 0.3.9.3-71

 

question:

this is the one to place inside the folder I'm ripping to (using Terminal) whilst on the USB key I keep the old one (for Oppo), right?

 

thanks

[EugenF]

29 minutes ago, pl_svn said:

 

question:

this is the one to place inside the folder I'm ripping to (using Terminal) whilst on the USB key I keep the old one (for Oppo), right?

 

thanks

This is the client app which runs on desktop/terminal/laptop. Can work with Sonore ISO2DSD or SACDExtractGUI.

Not the one on usb key.  

[joehirez]

@MikeyFresh @Nexus3

 

Thank you again for your help, but I'm still having some challenges that I could use more assistance with.

 

I've ripped about 20 SACDs up to this point and am noticing that with about half of them, AutoRip is completing and ejecting the disc successfully, but when I copy the ISO to my PC to extract the DSF files, the extract fails to fully complete and only part way through the last track of the multi-channel files.  It extracts all the 2-channel tracks without any problem.  

 

Based on the errors, it is looks like the AutoRip is not getting a full copy of all the sectors on the SACD in the iso.

 

>>

 

Processing [BEETHOVEN Symphony No 7, Triple Concerto\5ch\06 - Triple Concerto, Largo.dsf] (6/7).. 
Completed: 100% (file sectors processed: 103572 / total sectors:103572), Total: 81% (total sectors processed: 1281849 / total sectors: 1565448)  
 Processed 22576 audioframes. Duration specified: 22576 (05:01:01 [mins:secs:frames]) 
 
Processing [BEETHOVEN Symphony No 7, Triple Concerto\5ch\07 - Triple Concerto, Rondo alla Polacca.dsf] (7/7).. 
Completed: 57% (file sectors processed: 163955 / total sectors:283599), Total: 92% (total sectors processed: 1445804 / total sectors: 1565448)  
 Error:blocks_readed =0, current_lsn:2097151, end_lsn:2216795, block_size:512  
 
Completed: 57% (file sectors processed: 163955 / total sectors:283599), Total: 92% (total sectors processed: 1445804 / total sectors: 1565448)  
 Warning:! Number of processed audioframes (34403) is smaller than number of frames in duration (59424)  
 
  
 Processed 34403 audioframes. Duration specified: 59424 (13:12:24 [mins:secs:frames]) 
 
 ...stop processing 
 
 
 Ended at: Sun Jun 21 09:31:51 2020 
 [elapsed: 00 hours:22 minutes:47 seconds] 
 
 

 We are done exporting DSF..                                                           
 
Program terminates! 
 
Warning: can't read Area 2 (MULCHTOC) TOC-2 !! There are some errros on disc ! 

 

>>

 

I tried re-ripping with a different USB stick, still same result on this disc.  Fails at 57% on track 7 of 7.

 

I grabbed the latest version of sacd_extract from the recent post (v. 0.3.9.3) and tried again, same result.  

 

The Pioneer BDP-80FD plays track 7 of the multi-channel mix all the way through without a problem, so doesn't seem like there is any issue with the disc itself or the player's ability to read it.  Given that I'm seeing this issue on about half of the SACDs I've ripped, different labels and titles, I'm guessing there is some issue with the AutoScript ISO creation process that is failing.

 

It's also interesting that it is only the last track on the multi-channel files that fails to complete.

 

With AutoRip I can't see any error messages during that process.  The disc just ejects and I get the .iso file on the USB.

 

I've tried again to extract the iso over the network via the server method, but still can't connect to the Pioneer over port 2002...

 

>>

 

sacd_extract 0.3.9.3 enhanced by euflo ....starting! 
 
Found configuration 'sacd_extract.cfg' file... 
    Artist will be added in folder name (artist=0) no 
    Performer will be added in filename of track (performer=0) no 
    Padding-less (nopad=0) no 
    Pauses included (pauses=0) no 
    Concatenate (concatenate=0) no 
    ID3tagV2.4 (id3tag = 4) yes 
 
Program terminates! 
 
Failed to connect 
libsacdread: Can't open 10.0.1.20:2002 for reading 

 

>>

 

I have validated that the player's IP address is correct and I can ping it.

 

>>

C:\Users\Joe>ping 10.0.1.20

Pinging 10.0.1.20 with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 10.0.1.20: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 10.0.1.20: bytes=32 time=7ms TTL=64
Reply from 10.0.1.20: bytes=32 time=4ms TTL=64
Reply from 10.0.1.20: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64

Ping statistics for 10.0.1.20:
    Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 1ms, Maximum = 7ms, Average = 3ms

C:\Users\Joe>telnet 10.0.1.20
Connecting To 10.0.1.20...Could not open connection to the host, on port 23: Connect failed

C:\Users\Joe>telnet 10.0.1.20 2002
Connecting To 10.0.1.20...Could not open connection to the host, on port 2002: Connect failed

C:\Users\Joe>

 

>>

 

Using the telnet port specification method, it looks like whatever Linux daemon is supposed to be running and listening on port 2002 is not working.

 

For the server method I'm using the files on my USB stick from this link posted by @MikeyFresh

 

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/gnpma48ceil80w5/AACzL4md_mFP7-gmbpsx1kFSa/AutoScript?dl=0&subfolder_nav_tracking=1

 

Screenshot of my USB folder attached.

 

AutoScript file contents...

 

>>

 

#MTKAT 0.xx script
 
CLI(CLI_exec cp /mnt/sda1/AutoScript/sacd_extract_160 /)
CLI(CLI_exec insmod /lib/modules/2.6.35/BDP/splitter.ko)
CLI(CLI_exec /sacd_extract_160 -S &)
CLI(CLI_drv.ir.rx.sq 0xaf000)

 

>>

 

I still have one SACD which will not go with AutoRip that I'd like to try if I can get the network script working.

 

Trying to figure out what I'm missing, but stumped!

 

Any help greatly appreciated!!

 

Oh, one last silly question, does anybody with the BDP-80FD know how to get the disc track number to show up on the front panel display?  All it shows is just the elapsed time, not the track number.  It can be shown in the OSD but really don't want the TV on to see what track is playing.  I have two other Pioneer players (BDP-23FD and BDP-85FD) and they show track numbers on the front display as one would expect.  Some firmware glitch with the 80FD or Pioneer just designed this model that way?  Weird!

 

Cheers!

 

[Nexus3]

Hello @joehirez,

 

please download foobar2000 & its SACD plugin, then drag your ripped ISOs into the fb2k playlist in order to checkout the last MCH tracks.

 

Warning: can't read Area 2 (MULCHTOC) TOC-2 !! There are some errros on disc !

How large is your USB flash memory's capacity and what filesytem has it been formatted after?

[obscuredXclouds]

I would like to thank EugenF for the Apple version of the client app. I was looking in to compiling it myself. I still might, just for learning purposes. It is working like the other versions. One thing though and this is happening to all versions of the programs. I am trying to rip using ISO+DSF or ISO+DFF and the app fails. I will document this and make a post later today.