SACD Ripping using an Oppo or Pioneer? Yes, it's true!

pabe12 · July 28, 2016

Could someone please confirm if this works on Pioneer BDP LX58? So far i only see success on Oppo and CA, and Pioneer 160 and 170. Thanks

I've tried it on a BDP-LX88 which is the luxurious version of the BDP-LX58. Does not work. USB stick is recognised, but tray does not open, and sacd_extract is not able to contact the player.

pabe12 · July 28, 2016

I'd recommend keeping the ISO files (though you could, of course, re-rip) as every extraction to DSF, DFF and such is not reversible.

If you ever want to burn a disc you would need the ISO.

Audirvana+ can read and play from the ISO directly, though sometimes the metadata on the disc is incomplete/wrong, and then Audirvana won't show the tracks correctly either.

For other applications that can't play straight from the ISO, I recommend converting to DSF (and then to FLAC, ALAC etc.) if said application can't handle DSF. Oh, and use a tag editor like YATE or MP3TAG to fix the metadata, it usually can do with a bit of cleaning-up...

pabe12 · July 29, 2016

Could be because of a read error on one of the machines, PS3 or Oppo.

I know I have one SACD that is quite particular as to what machine I put it in; My Oppo and Pioneer read it ok, but a high-end Marantz SACD player did not like the disc one bit.

pabe12 · August 1, 2016

First of all, this is great news! My PS3 is getting old so a new method is very welcome.

Has anyone encountered the following error (within the ISOtoDSD gui)... and if so, how did you fix the problem?

Failed to connect

libsacdread: Can't open 10.0.0.90:2002 for reading.

Other info...

Using an Oppo 105 with latest beta firmware. I got the tray to open once I inserted the loaded USB drive, but when I proceed to using the ISOtoDSD gui, choose Server Input, put in the correct IP address for my Oppo (confirmed in Network setup in the Oppo and through my router's connected devices list), along with the port number 2002, choose Dual, Raw ISO, then Execute and the message appears shortly thereafter.

My computer recognizes the 105 as a media device within the Network. I've tried it on 2 computers, and I've even made sure the connection (ethernet, not wireless) between computer and Oppo was directly through the router (no switches/wall runs/etc. in between).

I've also tried using sacd.cmd & sacd_extract - I run the sacd.cmd and I get a command prompt box pop up but then get a message saying sacd_extract has stopped working. I'm assuming it's encountering the same problem as above.

Any ideas? It seems like some sort of network issue, but I can't figure it out.

Also,

- Can you ping your Oppo from your PC?

- Once you close the drawer, wait a few seconds for the Oppo to recognize the SACD as an SACD disc

- Have you disabled Autoplay? In order to rip it, the disc must not be playing

pabe12 · August 5, 2016

up to disc 57 now, just a bit over 1800 to go. All being stored over the network to a raid10 nas box.

Good grief - 1800 SACD's? You must have every SACD known to mankind... ;-)

pabe12 · August 25, 2016

The files that you end up with on your Mac, do the filenames end in .dsf?

Where are you streaming from, directly from the Mac (in which case, which streaming server do you use) or from a hard disk attached to the Auralic streamer (in which case I guess you use Lightning server)?

What type of Auralic streamer do you use - one with a built-in DAC?

In case of no built-in DAC, what port do you use, USB or something else?

Many many options - they all must gel in order for this to work ;-)

pabe12 · August 25, 2016

I'm using the exact same environment: Synology 1513 NAS (MinimServer) -> Auralic Aries (AES) -> Metrum Pavane DAC.

Since the Metrum DAC does not understand DSD, a conversion has to take place. Until now, even though Auralic advertises the fact that they can convert DSD, in reality they don't. It's only since literally yesterday that this has become available in their BETA firmware, 4.0Beta7:

New Features since Version 4.0.Beta6:

DSD to PCM resampler (disable DSD over PCM option) is now working with DSD64 (convert to 88.2K PCM). Resampling of DSD128 and DSD256 is not supported.

For this to work, you must disable the DoP option in the Aries.

In any case, the filenames MUST LITERALLY END in ".dsf" for the streamer to recognize the files. The Mac's KIND designation is totally irrelevant - your files aren't on the Mac anymore anyway.

Since this hasn't worked before, I tend to convert any DSD format files to PCM myself, using either XLD or DSDMaster. And I use 176kHz/24 bit, I found 88Khz lacking a bit in PRaT. Big files...

pabe12 · August 25, 2016

Hi, it is .dsf! So it may actually be the Metrum DAC not recognising the files?

Fed directly to the DAC without conversion to PCM, no. Metrum DACs do not handle DSD data - period.

You must either convert the data beforehand, or let the Auralic Aries convert them on the fly (which apparently they only do with the newest beta firmware.)

pabe12 · August 25, 2016

I tried to convert them with XLD and DB power amp but they couldn't open the files. Maybe I did something wrong or the mac version of these programs can't convert dsd to pcm. I guess I'll try the firmware. Thanks

Version 20151214 (149.1) of XLD CAN convert DSD files; see if you have a XLD menu item called "DSD Importer Settings...".

If you do, then in the dialog box that comes up choose a suitable samplerate (I choose 176400, and SOX VHW Minimum Phase, 24-bit, but that's my personal choice; choose 88200 and leave the rest default to start with I'd say.)

If not, get a newer version of XLD.

Oh, and you need to drag-and-drop the files onto the XLD icon, otherwise it won't work.

pabe12 · November 14, 2016

Players using the MT8580 chip are in a different price league (600€ and more). It's the Oppo 103/105 (all regional variations and Darbee chip players) and players based on the Oppo (Cambridge Audio 752bd/cxu, maybe others, generally more expensive than the Oppo), the Arcam CDS27 (CD/SACD/file player) and the top range Pioneer players BDP-LX58 and BDP-LX88.

Other more rare players have also been mentioned in this thread, but I don't remember the models

I have both an Oppo BDP-105EU (works) and a Pioneer BDP-LX88 (DOES NOT WORK). Pioneer BDP-LX58 likely won't work either, but Oppo BDP-103 (D or EU) does work.

pabe12 · February 1, 2017

How are people converting these days?
PS: OS is Mac OS-X

Easiest is probably DSDMaster (in the Mac's App store). XLD works too.

pabe12 · February 1, 2017

Good question, I never bother with multichannel. You may have a problem though converting to WAV, I believe that's a stereo-only file format.

pabe12 · February 17, 2017

Possibly duplication of the IP address on your network? Does the PC, by any chance, somehow have the same IP address as your media server?

pabe12 · February 17, 2017

You cannot have two devices with the same IP address in your network - and the solution is simple enough: change one of the two (the PC, for example).

pabe12 · February 22, 2017

There are THREE different quantities here:

1. Genuine SACDs. These are similar to DVDs (same density, same laser wavelength to read them) BUT they have an extra, encrypted section that cannot be burned to a DVD-R or DVD+R

2. SACD-R. This is a ripped SACD ISO burned to a DVD-R or DVD+R.

3. DCD Disc. This is a DVD-R or DVD+R filled with DSF format files, with a text file in a certain format that acts as a kind of table of contents. This is a format that originates in Japan, and is supported by for example Accuphase.

pabe12 · February 23, 2017

I refer you to for example the Wikipedia entry on SACD:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Audio_CD

This encrypted section only contains key information, used by the SACD extraction firmware in an SACD player to decrypt the DSD audio data; and is OUTSIDE the area that you can write to in writable DVDs.

pabe12 · February 23, 2017

1. SACD-R capable players read burned SACD ISO images other way than standard SACD

(such player must recognise non standard SACD-R disk and know what to do with it),

Yeah, don't know what triggers it. Could be the absence of the encrypted key section, or perhaps the player detects that the DSD content is formatted like an SACD, but unencrypted.

SACD ISO image contains decrypted data (I don’t consider DST compressing as encoding here) and SACD-R capable players may read the data without decryption,

The SACD-ripping process actually decrypts the data, courtesy of the key exchange between the SACD disc and the SACD player. So, the resulting SACD ISO on your hard drive is an image of an UNencrypted SACD.

2. Ordinary SACD player can’t found encryption key on SACD-R and report about error,

I don't think that's it, I think most SACD players could easily support SACD-R. Consider: our beloved Oppo 105 used to be able to detect and play SACD-R's, but Sony found out about it and and pressured Oppo to DISABLE this functionality. I guess those SACD players that still can read SACD-R's are either not upgradable, or Sony hasn't bothered to lean on the manufacturer to release new firmware with the SACD-R facility disabled.

pabe12 · August 18, 2017

On 13/08/2017 at 6:48 PM, Kal Rubinson said:

Beat me to it. Agreed.

Precisely. In principle, a 24/88.2k envelope should be big enough to contain all that is in a DSD64 signal, but I was missing something when I tried this. It sounded a bit flat and lifeless - which I regained by using 24/176k.

pabe12 · August 28, 2017

On 19/08/2017 at 7:05 PM, JediJoker said:

I think that has a lot more to do with your DAC than anything inherent to the file.

Possibly - but I rather think it's the conversion program/routine that is to blame here.

I have RIPs from CDs (at a much lower rate, 44.1k/16) that do possess those qualities that I miss in my 88k DSD conversions. Whereas my 176k conversions sound fine.

pabe12 · May 13, 2018

6 minutes ago, Phthalocyanine said:

By the way, what software do you use for your server method ripping under Linux?

Why not use the same tools as for Windows and Mac - they do exist? (sacd_extract and iso2dsd)

pabe12 · August 7, 2018

I also think you’re not precise enough when using the command line method; remember that case and spaces are extremely important!

Your command should look like the one listed under step 7 in the text file:

.\sacd_extract -i {BDP_IP_ADDRESS}:2002 -P -I

Note that the first i is lower case, and there’s no space between the - and the i; also there’s no space between the IP address and the :2002.

pabe12 · June 12, 2020

13 hours ago, obscuredXclouds said:

1) Do I need to re-rip any ISO's I have made using this program? 2) To get the most out of SACDExtractGUI for pops/click and such should I enable the no-pad option (-z) and pauses (-b)?

Once you have the ISO extracted and safely stored, you've extracted all there ever is going to be from that SACD - so no, no need to re-rip. As for the extracted DSF files, try those -z and -b options; some DACs require it, some don't. If you hear artefacts, you can always re-extract from the ISO file.

pabe12 · July 26, 2020

Same here, and I DO have multi-region firmware on my 105. No problems at all with SACD ripping.

SACD Ripping using an Oppo or Pioneer? Yes, it's true!

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