Article: Sonore microRendu Review, Part 1

[The Computer Audiophile]

You can view the page at http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content.php?r=698-Sonore-microRendu-Review-Part-1

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hi Guys - I originally wrote the review and sent it to Sonore prior to publication, like I do for all reviews, for fact checking. The company asked that I not reveal so many details about what it's doing to make this such a special product. Rather than just tell everyone that there's a lot more going on inside than I can say, I left the text in but redacted it. In essence, everyone can see there's a lot of proprietary things with this, but they can't see exactly what they are.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Sorry for the newbie question, but is there a way to use the Micro Rendu without a router? Mine is 50 feet away from my stereo, and there's no way to run ethernet that far. I'd love to simply connect a hard drive with my music on it.

There's a way to do anything. Not sure you'd want to use the microRendu this way though.

 

If you don't use a router, how do you envision connecting the microRendu?

[The Computer Audiophile]

Thanks for your response. I'm wondering whether perhaps there was a way to connect a hard drive directly and control it with an IOS device over inbuilt wifi or a dongle, a la Raspberry PI.

You'd really be swimming upstream attempting to go this route. You could connect it to a Ethernet - WiFi bridge, but using a hub to connect both a USB DAC and USB drive isn't recommended (although it's technically possible).

[The Computer Audiophile]

I've ordered a MicroRendu but am uncertain as to the best way to connect it via Ethernet.

I have a 3 TB LaCie Drive connected by Thunderbolt cable to my Macbook Pro (with Roon installed) which connects via USB to my Berkeley Alpha then Reference. A simple system with 2 Lacie backups that works very well, but I want the better sound quality of the MicroRendu.

What is the best way for me to install the ethernet connection for the MicroRendu?

Do I simply install a Thunderbolt to Ethernet adapter (which may degrade sound quality), switch to a hard drive with ethernet output or bite the bullet and install a NAS?

I do not anticipate ever needing more than 2-3 TBs. IF NAS is the best way to go, any recommendations as to a NAS that would sound best?

Thanks, Merek

Hi Merek - Not totally sure what your question is, but I've use a MacBook Pro with Thinderbolt Ethernet adapter to send audio from Roon to the microRendu to Alpha USB to RS.

 

Can an you just connect the microRendu to Ethernet and use the adapter for your computer? There's no reduction on sound quality with that thunderbolt adapter.

[The Computer Audiophile]

How does the bump in performance compare to putting that $2k into a better DAC or maybe better cabling? I know that's not the easiest question to answer, just trying to get a sense of the relative importance of a better supply. And maybe a sense too as to where diminishing returns will set in.

 

Is there any way you can provide a sense of the magnitude of difference between using the iFi supply vs the $2k supply?

There's no way to answer that question to make it relevant to you and your system.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hmmh, Sonore's page says it supports HQPlayer NAA, but that feature is not mentioned here...

What do you mean?

[The Computer Audiophile]

He means you didn't mention HQPlayer NAA mode in your part 1 review. Many of us will be evaluating the uRendu as an NAA (as well as an OpenHome ethernet renderer, Mpd client, etc).

That was my guess. But it's a bit premature to complain that I haven't used one's software, when the review is half way finished.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Could be added as a point (currently 5 of them) in the "What is the microrendu" section.

 

Agree. I could add many items to that list.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hmmh, Sonore's page says it supports HQPlayer NAA, but that feature is not mentioned here...

 

I look forward to seeing you in Munich at the event Friday night :~)

[The Computer Audiophile]

How does this fit in the audio chain? What can it do on its own? What I think would be beneficial for us less versed in this field is some pictures of how this is used with all the typical software and hardware components we all use. For instance, how do I seem tidal? Do I have to have the Tidal app or tidal web app residing on a separate computer or can this be done native?

patience sandston. part 2 will come soon enough :~)

[The Computer Audiophile]

I have actually. That's why I included Archimago's blog posting, to provide an alternative point of view.

Hi skikirkwood - Good post / questions. I think your comments are indicative of both sides of the wonderful hobby of ours. Some people have the skills, knowledge, time, desire to build a Pi based player. These people are also satisfied with forum only support for their self-built product. That's totally cool. The other side of the coin is most people who want to purchase a well built, well designed product from a reputable company who will call them up or remote connect if there is a problem, and these people believe in doing everything possible to squeeze every ounce of sound quality out of their systems.

 

Its cool when we can all use whatever device floats our boats and talk about the results and share great music. Nobody is right or wrong for selecting either type of product.

[The Computer Audiophile]

I am, however, questioning whether the "purpose built" approach that is being advocated by Sonore provides any better audio quality. I don't believe it does. Apparently the engineers at Bryston agree with me, with their approach of using the Raspberry Pi 2 and HiFiBerry Digi+ board as the core of their new BD-Pi.

 

I hope you realize the breakdown in your logic.

 

Your opinion = Purpose built component isn't better than Raspberry Pi 2 and HiFiBerry Digi+ board

Bryston selected the Raspberry Pi 2 and HiFiBerry Digi+ board for one of its products

Thus, Bsyston agrees with you that purpose built products don't provide better audio quality.

 

 

That makes no sense.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am also questioning the longer term approach of packaging a bunch of open source modules with a proprietary hardware product like this and how future-proof it will be. Actually, I'm questioning how usable is the current software packaged with the Sonore unit compared to integrated Linux distros such as Volumio and Moode. Yes, Squeezelite is one option for the microRendu, but the piCorePlayer platform incorporates the latest releases of Squeezelite with other options and software (e.g. Shairplay), providing what I am guessing (since I haven't used the Sonore software) is a more integrated, functionally complete and easy to use interface. Third party apps that control the Linux MPD player (an option for the microRendu) are pretty weak, whereas Volumio, Moode and Rune offer highly usable UI's that run in standard web browsers but with CSS tuned to smart phones and tablets above and beyond PC's.

 

Nothing is future-proof.

 

You're making comments about software you've never seen and it's showing. microRendu has Shairplay.

 

 

 

 

 

 

And regarding Doak's comment that I'm not welcome here...

 

Everyone is welcome here as long as they are respectful. You've been very respectful with your comments so far, although I don't agree with them. No big deal.

 

 

 

 

 

Now, to end here by adding more fuel to the fire ...I'm sure the above two Medium postings will provide a bunch of you with a lot more ammo for snarky comments. Bring it on.

 

This makes me think you came here with a hidden agenda and weakens any arguments you tried to make. Bummer. I thought some of your comments were worthy of discussion, but it appears you were really interested in an open discussion.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hi skikirkwood - One last thing after reading about your disdain for high end publications and including Computer Audiophile in your list of publications (slightly implying CA is like the rest of them).

 

We've been talking about using Raspberry Pi and Beaglebone Back's for years. Here are a couple articles that didn't please any advertisers -

 

Computer Audiophile - Geek Speak: Raspberry Pi HiFi Is Here

 

Computer Audiophile - Geek Speak: How To Build A UPnP / DLNA / OpenHome Renderer For Less Than $100

 

 

In addition we actually educate around here as well -

 

Computer Audiophile - CA Academy

[The Computer Audiophile]

Yes, I am making comments about software I haven't seen, but have read the description from Sonore's site. And in that description, it appears that the only software contribution Sonore has made here is the "Audio App Switcher", that lets you choose between 5 different output modes. And it appears these modes are exclusive of each other - you can only choose one at a time. Meaning that I have to choose say between SqueezeLite Output mode and ShairPort Output mode. You've used this software Chris, so am I correct?

 

If I am, then yes, I'm saying this approach of having to choose between one of a number of exclusive modes is vastly inferior in terms of user experience to any of the integrated audiophile tuned Linux distros, with Volumio being my favorite, but Moode looking increasingly interesting, and piCorePlayer being a good choice for those migrating from the Squeezebox Touch. That's the whole point behind these efforts and the hard work of the hackers evolving these systems is to add a layer of integration on top of the low level single purpose open source packages.

 

So this point is not about commercial vs. DIY, it's not about cost, it's about user experience. Since I don't have access to a microRendu, I would be interested in hearing from someone who does, and also has experience with Volumio/Rune/Moode, to compare the end user experience of operating the unit. As someone who closely follows both Volumio and piCorePlayer, I believe the effort of adding value and integration on top of the individual packages such as SqueezeLite and ShairPort provide you with a much more enjoyable experience of accessing your music - for those who don't want to make the investment in Roon that is.

 

Regarding the future-proof comment, yes, nothing is future-proof, but some things are more than others. Take the apps within smart TV's. If you bought a LG TV a few years ago, by now the majority of the apps in that TV no longer work. If you buy a Roku or other streaming device and hook it up to your TV, you are going to almost always have the most up to date apps, as well as the largest selection of them. That's because the TV manufacturers are hardware companies, and want you to upgrade to a new TV versus putting the effort into retrofitting their older hardware models with the latest software. Yes, Roku is a hardware manufacturer too, but compared to virtually all TV manufacturers they've ensured their older models will support the newest versions of apps on their platform.

 

So when i look at offerings such as what Sonore is providing here - a hardware company providing a software solution of separate open source packages with no value added or integration - I wonder a year or two how many of the latest versions of those packages will be available and supported on the microRendu. That's a very valid question to ask, as I've been personally burned by buying expensive hardware units such as Tivo devices, only to be forced to purchase a newer model to have access to software features that certainly could have been added to my older device. But that wouldn't provide motivation for a hardware upgrade, the core of Tivo's (or any consumer hardware) business model.

It's not my place to defend Sonore, so I won't. but you've got much of this wrong. I have a feeling your bent against HiFi, as evidenced by your Medium posts, has clouded your judgement.

 

Sonore and Small Green Computer have made so many behind the scenes software contributions that most people will never realize. I get it you overlooked my comments about this in the first part of this review, but it's true.

 

The customer for this device wants exclusive mode only. The rest of your suggestions that an approach is better or worse is purely based on your use of the product and your understanding of a different market.

 

I still don't get your idea about no support and using the TV industry as an example. It's not relevant here. Please be specific with this product in your examples.

 

Sonore is the hardware company and Small Green Computer is the software company.

[The Computer Audiophile]

I was going to purchase an Audiophonics I-Sabre DAC ES9023, which some have said has a slightly better sound than the TI PCM-5122 DAC chip used in the IQAudio.

Measurements, or the difference doesn't exist. Only kidding. I couldn't resist. :~)

[The Computer Audiophile]

I disagree. If the customer wants to use it as a Roon endpoint yes. But many people will want to use SqueezeLite output or MPD output in conjunction with the ShairPort Airplay emulator. You're listening to your music collection on a network share streaming to the microRendu running MPD and may want to fire up a Tidal or Spotify app on your smartphone or tablet and beam it to the Airport emulator. That should be seamless, which it is with Volumio/Rune/Moode, but it sounds like with the microRendu I have to invoke the Audio App Switcher and change output modes. Not having seen this I don't know how it works, but it certainly doesn't sound seamless as it is with these audiophile distros whose primary purpose is to provide an integrated experience of using several packages without changing "output modes". Another example is adding tracks to a playlist, where those tracks can come from your network share, Spotify, Tidal, etc. Sounds like I can't do that in MPD Output mode on the Sonore.

 

The customers of Volumio/Rune/Moode are by and large audiophiles who use these distributions because they provide a better end user experience than any one open source module in exclusive mode. I believe they are exactly the same market Sonore is targeting with the microRendu.

Based on my experience reading hundreds of thousands of posts, running CA since 2007, talking to hundreds of audiophiles all over the world, I will respectfully disagree with you.

 

Not many people even use AirPlay anymore. I think the market for your seamless AirPlay / MPD integration is a tiny but very vocal minority.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hi Guys - I know these are interesting topics, but that's what the entire forum is for. Please discuss non-microRendu related topics in another thread or risk having your comments deleted.

[The Computer Audiophile]

I was going to do a fairly long post about how awesome the microRendu/sonicTransporter combo is (which it indeed is) but why bother. This and many other CA threads have become polluted with side arguments and other typical troll behavior to the point where it bears no resemblance to the topic at hand. There seems to be a desire to argue for the sake of arguing and it makes it very difficult to extract any useful info. Who really wants to sift through hundreds of posts when most are long diatribes and many are off topic in pursuit of something about the product.

 

Chris, Please get this under control. Other websites and forums are taking a much more aggressive posture and it has made them much more civil and useful.

So where is your long post?

[The Computer Audiophile]

All redacted content in the review has been cleared for publication. Please re-read the review for additional information.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Thanks Chris. When is the Part 2 expected ?

It will probably be a couple weeks. I'm headed to Northern California Monday through Thursday and will likely finish writing part 2 soon after I return.

[The Computer Audiophile]

I think Chris mentioned it would be up in around 2 weeks

Yes. I just wrapped up my west coast trip tonight and will return to Minnesota tomorrow. Will finish the review soon.

 

I was able to listen to the microRendu on an extremely high end system over the last three days. Wow this thing is good.

[The Computer Audiophile]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_of_Paris_(wine)

 

I have no concerns regarding being inescapably educated by audio reviewers. Most do not write what I would consider to be educational or informative reviews. Instead, they provide an efficient marketing channel for their advertisers and continue to spread Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt to gullible individuals, which in turn enables AudioQuest to sell $1000 Ethernet cables and Shunyata Research to sell the same fools $1000 power cords.

Calling someone gullible and a fool for purchasing something they want to purchase is quite strange to me. It suggests that you don't really know what your talking about and really don't have friends in this hobby who've purchased such goods. I know plenty of people who you would label as gullible and fools, who are neither gullible nor fools. In fact they run some pretty incredible companies and are some of the smartest people I know.