SOtM smS-200 unveiled at Munich Hi-End

[PnL]

I did not find. Can you give a direct download link? Thank!

[89reksal]

11 hours ago, aslg said:

You use double values than mine: does your FW 4.56 stutter with these values?

Those values I tried were based on values that  5-pot-fan had posted after he had success with Squeezelite and 4.56. My 4.56 stutters no matter what settings I've tried. Here's the link to the thread:

My defaults are the same as what you posted (40/4/4096). The 30/3/4096 is just what I've been using for 4.22.

[tedwoods]

4.57 is working flawlessly for me in NAA mode.

The big surprise was the SQ up-lift when switching to 100Base-T !

This is a serious upgrade, not of the subtle kind, and it is especially prominent in the midrange.

Everything seems -for lack of a better term- more "relaxed" and enjoyable now and also the depth perception seems to have improved, but also there's a sort of  coherence to the sound.

Very nice!😊

 

[ronfint]

2 hours ago, tedwoods said:

The big surprise was the SQ up-lift when switching to 100Base-T !

This is a serious upgrade, not of the subtle kind, and it is especially prominent in the midrange.

Agreed!

[HeeBroG]

What’s 100Base-T?

[5-pot-fan]

100Base-T is your standard computer network when running at it's theoretical maximum bandwidth capacity of 100Mbps (100 mega bits per second). This limit is usually imposed by the type of network card(s) and network switch(es) that sit between your computer and the "other end". The type of cable involved is usually known as Cat 5, which is what you find in many existing business/commercial premises if installed a few years ago.

On the other hand, 1000Base-T is a network with a theoretical max of 1000 Mbps, and is also known as a Gigabit network. All the switches and network cards between your computer and the other end must be rated Gigabit. The cable can be Cat5, but in more recent systems it would be Cat6, or perhaps even Cat7. Both of these types are considerably more difficult to install in larger premises as they are stiffer and have stricter connection requirements. Frequently these are only installed if the client wants to attain 10Gigabit capacity, in which case the network cards and switches have to be uprated further (and they are more expensive).

Most home systems can easily achieve Gigabit capacity using Cat5 cable and medium-spec switches (eg Netgear GS108), and ensuring that the network cards in the computers are rated as Gigabit (almost all computers sold in the last 5 years will be).

It is perfectly possible to mix 100Base-T and 1000Base-T equipment in the same network, but you will only achieve the higher bandwidth if the source (eg your server or maybe your router) and your PC are rated as Gigabit and any switches in between are Gigabit also.

From an audiophile point of view some say that Cat6 and Cat7 cables are superior sonically compared to Cat 5, although personally I cannot tell the difference.

HTH

[PnL]

Installed update 4.57. I switched the network to 100Base-T mode - in Task Manager in W10, you can see that the transfer of information to SMS-200 occurs more smoothly than at 1000Base-T. I can see it well - SMS-200 is connected to a separate network board. And the sound has become even smoother, more analog. Perhaps filling and using the memory buffer in the SMS-200 proceeds more smoothly. But I have not tried to compare with 1000Base-T in the same version 4.57, perhaps it is something else..

[ktm777]

On 3/21/2019 at 4:09 AM, aslg said:

 

My Squeezelite app on both FW 4.22 and 4.56 has different default config values than yours (not sure way, could they be DAC dependent?)

• Buffer time: 40
• Internal buffer: 4096
• Period count: 4

With these default values Squeezelite on FW 4.56 stutters.

 

If I quadruple these default values:

• Buffer time: 160
• Internal buffer: 16384
• Period count: 16

FW 4.56 does not stutter anymore.
You use double values than mine: does your FW 4.56 stutter with these values?

 

@aslg @lasker98 

Are you using internal LMS on SMS-200 or separate computer with LMS instaled on it?

[HeeBroG]

3 hours ago, 5-pot-fan said:

100Base-T is your standard computer network when running at it's theoretical maximum bandwidth capacity of 100Mbps (100 mega bits per second). This limit is usually imposed by the type of network card(s) and network switch(es) that sit between your computer and the "other end". The type of cable involved is usually known as Cat 5, which is what you find in many existing business/commercial premises if installed a few years ago.

On the other hand, 1000Base-T is a network with a theoretical max of 1000 Mbps, and is also known as a Gigabit network. All the switches and network cards between your computer and the other end must be rated Gigabit. The cable can be Cat5, but in more recent systems it would be Cat6, or perhaps even Cat7. Both of these types are considerably more difficult to install in larger premises as they are stiffer and have stricter connection requirements. Frequently these are only installed if the client wants to attain 10Gigabit capacity, in which case the network cards and switches have to be uprated further (and they are more expensive).

Most home systems can easily achieve Gigabit capacity using Cat5 cable and medium-spec switches (eg Netgear GS108), and ensuring that the network cards in the computers are rated as Gigabit (almost all computers sold in the last 5 years will be).

It is perfectly possible to mix 100Base-T and 1000Base-T equipment in the same network, but you will only achieve the higher bandwidth if the source (eg your server or maybe your router) and your PC are rated as Gigabit and any switches in between are Gigabit also.

From an audiophile point of view some say that Cat6 and Cat7 cables are superior sonically compared to Cat 5, although personally I cannot tell the difference.

HTH

Thanks for the reply.

G

[aslg]

2 hours ago, ktm777 said:

@aslg @lasker98 

Are you using internal LMS on SMS-200 or separate computer with LMS instaled on it?

I use a LMS installed in a Synology NAS.

[ktm777]

3 minutes ago, aslg said:

I use a LMS installed in a Synology NAS.

Where do you change Buffer time, Internal buffer, Period count? On Eunhasu I have only DAC informations in Squeezelite section. 

[89reksal]

3 hours ago, ktm777 said:

@aslg @lasker98 

Are you using internal LMS on SMS-200 or separate computer with LMS instaled on it?

I'm using LMS installed on a separate computer. I find it much quicker and more responsive than using the internal one. I use iPeng on iPod Touch for remote control. I'm afraid to even say this but I also believe there's an audible improvement from not having SMS-200 running LMS. Maybe same idea as the less processes running on an audio pc, the better.

 

15 minutes ago, ktm777 said:

Where do you change Buffer time, Internal buffer, Period count? On Eunhasu I have only DAC informations in Squeezelite section. 

 The settings are entered in the same page in Eunhasu. I found it can take a while for the page to completely load with these recent firmware upgrades, but it has always loaded eventually. By a while I mean seconds, not minutes. Maybe try powering off and restarting your SMS-200 if the page won't load? Another thought is it may be browser related. SoTM recommends using Chrome if I remember right. Also make sure your browser cache has been emptied recently. Not sure about the browser being a potential problem but just another idea to try.

[5-pot-fan]

I agree with Lasker98 - all those values should show up but make take 5 - 20 seconds to get there.

Do click on the DAC information line and check the DAC details - these values may be helpful in setting up your config page - vital in my case.

[ktm777]

@lasker98 thanks, you were right, using Chrome browser solved the problem, I don’t know why, but it did:-). 

[Abyss Man]

Hi Guys,

Have sotm pulled the plug on ver4.57? It shows server maintenance when u go into the update icon. I had downloaded the 4.57 on 1 card. I do have another scan disk card with 4.56 which needs updating to 4.57. Can anyone enlighten? Thank you very much guys.

[kelvinwsy]

Hey Abyss man I just (past 1 hour) downloaded from http://docs.sotm-audio.com/doku.php?id=en:eunhasu:burn_sdcard_image 4.57 image written onto a new 16gb microsd and loaded in onto the Ultra Neo. Run thru the installation (HQPlayer NAA for me) and ran Eunhasu Homescreen .. It stutters a slight bit if u use Safari on your iphone.. If not glorious DSD512x48k on my SMSL VM D1 using latest XMOS USB Board.. SQ with 100Mbps connection is rich and full bodied.. No stuttering👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

[kelvinwsy]

Hey Abyss man I just (past 1 hour) downloaded from http://docs.sotm-audio.com/doku.php?id=en:eunhasu:burn_sdcard_image 4.57 image written onto a new 16gb microsd and loaded in onto the Ultra Neo. Run thru the installation (HQPlayer NAA for me) and ran Eunhasu Homescreen .. It stutters a slight bit if u use Safari on your iphone.. If not glorious DSD512x48k on my SMSL VM D1 using latest XMOS USB Board.. SQ with 100Mbps connection is rich and full bodied.. No stuttering👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏 

 

PS: Spoke too soon ..  Ocassional stuttering at upsampling extreme like 96khz to 24mhz DSD512 ASDM7+Dsd512 polysinc xtr-2

More adjustmts needed🤨🤔

[Abyss Man]

6 hours ago, kelvinwsy said:

Hey Abyss man I just (past 1 hour) downloaded from http://docs.sotm-audio.com/doku.php?id=en:eunhasu:burn_sdcard_image 4.57 image written onto a new 16gb microsd and loaded in onto the Ultra Neo. Run thru the installation (HQPlayer NAA for me) and ran Eunhasu Homescreen .. It stutters a slight bit if u use Safari on your iphone.. If not glorious DSD512x48k on my SMSL VM D1 using latest XMOS USB Board.. SQ with 100Mbps connection is rich and full bodied.. No stuttering👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏 

 

PS: Spoke too soon ..  Ocassional stuttering at upsampling extreme like 96khz to 24mhz DSD512 ASDM7+Dsd512 polysinc xtr-2

More adjustmts needed🤨🤔

Hi Kelvin,

I just updated as well, works wonderfully. As you say, the 100Mbps is awesome man. A nice upgrade indeed. Thanks to soTm again.

[kelvinwsy]

On 3/22/2019 at 2:49 AM, tedwoods said:

4.57 is working flawlessly for me in NAA mode.

The big surprise was the SQ up-lift when switching to 100Base-T !

This is a serious upgrade, not of the subtle kind, and it is especially prominent in the midrange.

Everything seems -for lack of a better term- more "relaxed" and enjoyable now and also the depth perception seems to have improved, but also there's a sort of  coherence to the sound.

Very nice!😊

 

Hi Tedwoods do you experience stuttering still with 4.57 just like earlier versions. I hv a case of stuttering with my new SMSL VMV D1 Dac from my HQPlayer Server .. 6700k /nvidia 970 .. with the SM200 Ultra Neo as NAA 

Strange using my 8650u minipc as NAA I can upsample even 96khz to DSD 512 - 24mhz smooth as can be.. So it has to be the SM200 ??

Setting to Ds7 and polysinc ext2 did not help even Dsd256 ! still stutters ??

Thx

 

[aslg]

On 3/21/2019 at 9:42 AM, lasker98 said:

Those values I tried were based on values that  5-pot-fan had posted after he had success with Squeezelite and 4.56. My 4.56 stutters no matter what settings I've tried. Here's the link to the thread:

My defaults are the same as what you posted (40/4/4096). The 30/3/4096 is just what I've been using for 4.22.

 

I do not understand the reason for the different behavior. I tested carefully again today:

• FLAC 16bit, 41.1Khz
• FLAC 24bit, 192Khz
• DSF x64

and they do not stutter with 160/16/16384.
Maybe this problem is also influenced by the LMS setup and the DAC? I have LMS installed on a Synology NAS in a gigabit ethernet network. My DAC is a Brooklyn DAC+.

[tedwoods]

13 minutes ago, kelvinwsy said:

Hi Tedwoods do you experience stuttering still with 4.57 just like earlier versions. I hv a case of stuttering with my new SMSL VMV D1 Dac from my HQPlayer Server .. 6700k /nvidia 970 .. with the SM200 Ultra Neo as NAA 

Strange using my 8650u minipc as NAA I can upsample even 96khz to DSD 512 - 24mhz smooth as can be.. So it has to be the SM200 ??

Setting to Ds7 and polysinc ext2 did not help even Dsd256 ! still stutters ??

Thx

 

I'm currently doing 48x256 /DSD7 256+fs /poly-sinc-shrt-mp , on a i7-8700K/nVidia GTX-1080 machine through the Holo Spring II without any stuttering...

[5-pot-fan]

ASLG asked whether various behaviours are related to the LMS setup and/or your DAC.

 

I do not know if this applies to everyone, but I know that one value in the Squeezelite config page definitely affects playback for me.

Here is my DAC info as presented through the Squeezelite config page:

Playback:
  Status: Running
    Interface = 1
    Altset = 2
    Packet Size = 204
    Momentary freq = 44110 Hz (0x5.8383)
    Feedback Format = 16.16
  Interface 1
    Altset 1
    Format: S16_LE
    Channels: 2
    Endpoint: 4 OUT (ASYNC)
    Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000
    Data packet interval: 500 us
  Interface 1
    Altset 2
    Format: S24_3LE
    Channels: 2
    Endpoint: 4 OUT (ASYNC)
    Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000
    Data packet interval: 500 us

 

You may see that there are 2 different values for "Format" (my font editing)- and these correspond to 2 of the Squeezelite config values available in the sms200. Only values of 16 and 24_3 work for me - 32 and 24 do not and I get bad stuttering if I choose either of them in config.

I would be interested in learning if / how the Data Packet Interval  and the Packet Size values are related to any of the other values in the Squeezelite config page.

Has anyone got any observations or information on this?

NB - I have not experienced any differences between running LMS on the sms200 or from a remote device, but perhaps my ears are too degraded now!

[aslg]

1 hour ago, 5-pot-fan said:

ASLG asked whether various behaviours are related to the LMS setup and/or your DAC.

 

I do not know if this applies to everyone, but I know that one value in the Squeezelite config page definitely affects playback for me.

Here is my DAC info as presented through the Squeezelite config page:

Playback:
  Status: Running
    Interface = 1
    Altset = 2
    Packet Size = 204
    Momentary freq = 44110 Hz (0x5.8383)
    Feedback Format = 16.16
  Interface 1
    Altset 1
    Format: S16_LE
    Channels: 2
    Endpoint: 4 OUT (ASYNC)
    Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000
    Data packet interval: 500 us
  Interface 1
    Altset 2
    Format: S24_3LE
    Channels: 2
    Endpoint: 4 OUT (ASYNC)
    Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000
    Data packet interval: 500 us

 

You may see that there are 2 different values for "Format" (my font editing)- and these correspond to 2 of the Squeezelite config values available in the sms200. Only values of 16 and 24_3 work for me - 32 and 24 do not and I get bad stuttering if I choose either of them in config.

I would be interested in learning if / how the Data Packet Interval  and the Packet Size values are related to any of the other values in the Squeezelite config page.

Has anyone got any observations or information on this?

NB - I have not experienced any differences between running LMS on the sms200 or from a remote device, but perhaps my ears are too degraded now!

 

Hoping this can help finding the reason for the stuttering, here is my working 4.57 (just updated today) Squeezelite config with no stuttering issues:
 

and my DAC Infos when playing FLAC 16bit - 41.1 Khz, FLAC 24bit - 192Khz, and DSF x64:

 

FLAC 16bit - 41.1 Khz

 

 

FLAC 24bit - 192Khz

 

 

DSF x64

 

 

 

[kelvinwsy]

10 hours ago, tedwoods said:

I'm currently doing 48x256 /DSD7 256+fs /poly-sinc-shrt-mp , on a i7-8700K/nVidia GTX-1080 machine through the Holo Spring II without any stuttering...

Reply .. Ohh so I think I need a more powerful PC and a RTX 2080.. just so I can upsample with the SMS200 Neo??? Forget it my 8650 u on Win2019 GUI With AObeta36 sounds AS GOOD and can upsample my 96khz HDtrack files to DSD512 24mhz!!!

My SOTM SM200 Ultra Neo is FOR SALE!

Thx

[kelvinwsy]

And the 8650u setting is On Polysinc xtr-2 ans ASDM7+512!😅