SOtM smS-200 unveiled at Munich Hi-End

[5-pot-fan]

On 3/4/2019 at 4:43 PM, lasker98 said:

Has anyone managed to get Squeezelite working flawlessly with any of these firmware upgrades? I've given up trying myself after a couple attempts with 4.56. I'm currently still on 4.22.

Hi,

Squeezelite is currently working perfectly for me on v4.56. It works as v4.22 did, but to me it sounds better.

This was not achieved without 2 sessions of having SoTM logged into my system, over a 2-3 week period. I am grateful to them for the amount of effort taken to deal with just this 1 customer!

Firstly they corrected an odd problem caused by the way their software reads my DAC ID (it is a Furutech ADL GT40a), and the peculiar value that my DAC sends back. This meant I was never able to write anything to the sms-200 (except the library location!). Having resolved this I can now edit all the config options.

I think they also made some other changes (possibly to the ALSA config), but their programmers are so quick on the screen I could not be sure exactly what other sections they edited, if any!

Both Squeezelite and MPD/DLNA currently work as they should - and absolutely no stuttering in Squeezelite.

I run LMS on  a separate Windows server, with the music held on a USB disk attached to it. I also run everything over Netgear Powerline devices and standard Netgear gigabit switches - no dropouts and still (IMHO) an improvement over v4.22.

I understand that the issues regarding my DAC will be implemented in v4.57, and I guess SoTM had already fundamentally resolved the Squeezelite stuttering problems before tackling my system. Nonetheless I have duplicated my unique version of v4.56 onto a fresh stick, and will be equally careful before my next update.

If it is any help my Squeezelite settings are now:

Sample format = 24-3; DSD Mode = none; Max samplerate = 192000; Buffer time = 320; Internal buffer = 32768; Period count = 32.

Regards

[5-pot-fan]

14 minutes ago, SYM said:

Thanks @5-pot-fan for sharing your experience 

As seen in your settings - you’ve disabled DSD. Can I ask if this is by choice or just simply a limitation of SOtM?

It's mainly because my DAC does not handle DSD. I bought it primarily for digitising my vinyl, and am happy with both the recording and the playback SQ. When that job is done I may get another DAC, one that handles DSD, but one step at a time!

I do intend to test changes to the Squeezelite config settings, and will report back when done.

 

[5-pot-fan]

24 minutes ago, lasker98 said:

Thanks 5-pot-fan. That sounds promising. I did try 4.56 after you posted in the "Praise For SOtM" thread about your success. I notice with your current settings you posted above, you have doubled the Internal Buffer from 16348 ( I assumed this was a typo and should have been 16384) to 32768. Was this because you had more issues after your posts in the other thread?

 

Your setup sounds quite similar to mine. I also have LMS on a separate computer so it's not running on sms 200. My dac also has no DSD.

 

Hopefully there will be a 4.57 released soon.

Now you mention it, SoTM made a change at the end of their 2nd login (during which they tested their DAC ID-related edits). I don't know why they did it, and frankly never checked back against the previous settings, because it all still worked! Perhaps the settings are not that crucial in my system, but I will make some other edits, and record what I do.

[5-pot-fan]

Ok, I have done a few more tests on my sms-200,changing the Squeezelite config settings.

All the changes were made by first saving the changes then doing a reboot.

Changing the sample format setting from 24_3 to 16 made no difference, possibly because these 2 values appear in my DAC information within the config page. Setting it to 24 or to 32 gave bad stuttering.

Leaving the sample format at 24_3, the max sample rate at 192000 (also a setting shown in the DAC information page), and DSD at None, I then changed the buffer time, internal buffer and period count as follows:

Starting at 320, 32768 and 32 respectively, i halved these values at each further step.

Step 1 (original values as above): all OK

Step 2 : all OK

Step 3 : occasional dropouts

Step 4 : bad stuttering and variations in apparent speed of replay

Step 5 : bad stuttering and the music was slowed down.

I suppose I could try testing changes to these 3 values individually but that might be another 12 tests, and another 2 -3 hours. Next time I have paint drying maybe...

Once back to the original values I then tried switching DSP mode between None and DOP. I have only 2 or 3 files in .dff or SACD format but these played fine (I have appropriate plugins installed in LMS). I assume these files were played through the DAC in PCM format, but they played as expected.

I then tried some .wav files with DOP and None selected and could not detect any differences between them and they all played OK.

The only minor issue, as reported by others, is that I cannot reboot directly from the System Settings page, but can do so from the System Settings/System Config page - not a major issue for me during these tests.

I don't know if this info will be of use to anyone, but it's free!

 

 

[5-pot-fan]

Lasker98, 

I agree with your comments about settings, as far as v4.22 is concerned. My system works fine with the default settings in 4.22. This has not been the case with 4.51 onwards.

It was at around v4.5xx that (if memory serves) changes were made to the Squeezelite kernel in some way, or perhaps in the way it interacts with the rest of the SOtM sms-200 software, and it is from then that these problems arose - as I'm sure you know.

One of the reasons for getting the sms-200 rather than my previous preference was due to issues that product was facing with Linux-related updates, so it has not surprised me that some problems have occurred for SOtM in similar circumstances. How these have been tackled, and the improved quality of the sound, leaves me glad about my choice.

Looking forward to 4.57 now!

[5-pot-fan]

100Base-T is your standard computer network when running at it's theoretical maximum bandwidth capacity of 100Mbps (100 mega bits per second). This limit is usually imposed by the type of network card(s) and network switch(es) that sit between your computer and the "other end". The type of cable involved is usually known as Cat 5, which is what you find in many existing business/commercial premises if installed a few years ago.

On the other hand, 1000Base-T is a network with a theoretical max of 1000 Mbps, and is also known as a Gigabit network. All the switches and network cards between your computer and the other end must be rated Gigabit. The cable can be Cat5, but in more recent systems it would be Cat6, or perhaps even Cat7. Both of these types are considerably more difficult to install in larger premises as they are stiffer and have stricter connection requirements. Frequently these are only installed if the client wants to attain 10Gigabit capacity, in which case the network cards and switches have to be uprated further (and they are more expensive).

Most home systems can easily achieve Gigabit capacity using Cat5 cable and medium-spec switches (eg Netgear GS108), and ensuring that the network cards in the computers are rated as Gigabit (almost all computers sold in the last 5 years will be).

It is perfectly possible to mix 100Base-T and 1000Base-T equipment in the same network, but you will only achieve the higher bandwidth if the source (eg your server or maybe your router) and your PC are rated as Gigabit and any switches in between are Gigabit also.

From an audiophile point of view some say that Cat6 and Cat7 cables are superior sonically compared to Cat 5, although personally I cannot tell the difference.

HTH

[5-pot-fan]

I agree with Lasker98 - all those values should show up but make take 5 - 20 seconds to get there.

Do click on the DAC information line and check the DAC details - these values may be helpful in setting up your config page - vital in my case.

[5-pot-fan]

ASLG asked whether various behaviours are related to the LMS setup and/or your DAC.

 

I do not know if this applies to everyone, but I know that one value in the Squeezelite config page definitely affects playback for me.

Here is my DAC info as presented through the Squeezelite config page:

Playback:
  Status: Running
    Interface = 1
    Altset = 2
    Packet Size = 204
    Momentary freq = 44110 Hz (0x5.8383)
    Feedback Format = 16.16
  Interface 1
    Altset 1
    Format: S16_LE
    Channels: 2
    Endpoint: 4 OUT (ASYNC)
    Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000
    Data packet interval: 500 us
  Interface 1
    Altset 2
    Format: S24_3LE
    Channels: 2
    Endpoint: 4 OUT (ASYNC)
    Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000
    Data packet interval: 500 us

 

You may see that there are 2 different values for "Format" (my font editing)- and these correspond to 2 of the Squeezelite config values available in the sms200. Only values of 16 and 24_3 work for me - 32 and 24 do not and I get bad stuttering if I choose either of them in config.

I would be interested in learning if / how the Data Packet Interval  and the Packet Size values are related to any of the other values in the Squeezelite config page.

Has anyone got any observations or information on this?

NB - I have not experienced any differences between running LMS on the sms200 or from a remote device, but perhaps my ears are too degraded now!

[5-pot-fan]

Having a good sound with v4.56 did not prevent me from updating to v4.57.......

Sensibly i did this using a separate SD card with a newly-downloaded image of v4.56 on it, because unfortunately the recent mods in v4.56 made for my DAC didn't quite make it through into v4.57, and I ended up with no sound and no ability to change any config values. Still, I had my special v4.56 to return to, and then I emailed May@sotm.

They logged into my system 2 days later and re-did the corrections for my DAC, and followed up overnight with a new update which I was able to install with the update procedure. This now reads v4.58 and - after 2 hours testing - works a treat. Thank you guys!

I started with the new default Squeezelite values (192000/160/8192/16). I did have to change my Sample Rate value to 24_3 as per my DAC information, and changed the DSD value to DoP for my few .dff files, but have left the other defaults alone so far and have not heard anything in the overall sound that I did not like. I can only assume that these new defaults work for the majority of systems SOtM have tested so far with the current iteration of Squeezelite.

I have also swapped the Link value between 100Base-T and 1000Base-T but cannot be sure I hear any difference between the two.

The system now reboots and also shuts down as expected from the System Setup/System Config icons.

Finally, although it takes 20 to 40 seconds to load the config pages in Squeezelite and MPD, it returns to the main page from the config pages in both within 5 seconds.

Oh, and the activity LED still flashes almost continually when the Enhasu main page is left open but stops if a config page stays open instead.

I do not know if the software I have will be officially released as v4.58, but overall I would say that SOtM have made some useful updates for the system in the way I use it (which excludes DSD).

I hope others are finding the same.

[5-pot-fan]

36 minutes ago, kelvinwsy said:

Loaded 4.58 and find that on my Netgear switch I need to connect my server and SM200 Ultra Neo to the 3 ports marked 10M and all connects  to Hqplayer NAA mode. Connecting direct to my ASUS AC65u 1000 mbs ports dont connect to my HQPlayer Server 😅🤨 

NOW my 6700k server plays ALL filters up to DSD512 even in 48k family with Polysinc xrt -2s

ASDM7+512

Glorious SQ

Thank SOTM for getting it right finally

Will try 4.59 next on another microsd card

If 4.59 works for you as well as 4.58 does, dare we think that Squeezelite, Roon, MPD and HQPlayer are all working well?? If this is the case, then I hope the long journey from 4.22 (and earlier), with the improving SQ, will have been worth it for more users than just me.

And if this is so, then perhaps SOtM will be able to add 4.59 alongside 4.22 and identify them both as 'stable', and start to mark future releases as 'beta' for those of us content to try them out and report our findings in a managed way.

[5-pot-fan]

1 hour ago, ferenc said:

I tried to upgrade my SMS200 Neo to the latest 0.4.59 fw from .56, and when it completed the upgrade process the rebooting just takes ages and did not want to finish. After waiting an hour or so for the rebooting  I disconnected the unit and connected back after few minutes but nothing happens. There is some network traffic but no blinking lights on the faceplate and it just does not work. I have written a new SD card with the 0.4.59 fw ISO but no boot again with it. 

 

Any idea what to do to get it work again?? 

I suggest you download and burn the 4.22 ISO image. This is stable and if it does not work for you then the fault may lie with the SD card. If you use Windows (as I do) then try reformatting the card before burning the 4.22 image.

I also once had a problem that seemed the same, but it was because I had inserted the card incorrectly into the sms200 - easy to do if you cannot see the back of the unit!

This does not answer the instance of the upgrade not working, but other people have reported similar issues without any obvious cause coming to light. I have found that even if the upgrade screen shows only 98% completed the card still worked when back in the unit.

If 4.22 works for you then you may have to sit through a series of online upgrades as the f/w steps up from 4.22 towards 4.59.

Also, if you do not have one, get a spare SD card. I keep the working one out of the unit when doing an upgrade so I have something to go back to in the event of failure.

Good luck!

[5-pot-fan]

10 minutes ago, guillaume31 said:

Hi,

 

I have not been able to access Eunhasu for a while on my sMS-200 Ultra....for some reason the IP address changes from time to time and I'm not able to access it through the sotm-audio.com/my link anymore....I'd appreciate any idea that'd allow me to access Eunhasu (I believe I'm on 0.4.57 or so....)

 

Thanks,

If the sms unit is set to DHCP for networking then it could indeed change it's IP address from time to time.

Assuming you have a Windows computer available download and run 'Advanced IP Scanner'. This will find the device and show the current IP address. Other software should be available for Macs, etc.

Once accessed change the network settings from DHCP to Static, giving the unit its own IP address within your network range.

HTH

[5-pot-fan]

Glad I waited before jumping in on this new upgrade!

SOTM have pulled upgrades before, as you may know, but it usually comes back in good order.

A further SQ improvement is always welcome, if true.

I would also like to say publicly what good customer service SOTM provides, even in these times - thank you!

 

[5-pot-fan]

I have taken the plunge and updated the firmware and run a kernel check.

Both appear to have succeeded without problems, and the system functions.

However .... in the System Config page the eunhasu web interface version is shown as 'undefined' and the change log only refers to v0.4.7. In the Upgrade page it shows I have v0.4.81, but the change log still shows only v0.4.7.   Neither can I see the kernel version anywhere (but that might just be me not looking in the right place as usual).

Nonetheless, does anyone else have this anomaly?

 

[5-pot-fan]

3 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

You can find the updated change log link at the very bottom of your eunhasu system config page

Hi,

Thanks for that. I have looked there and I have this:

System information

Detail system informationDAC informationEunhasu Web interface version : undefinedNetwork Information

eth0 || 02:8C:0A:82:9F:9A - 192.168.xx.xx - STATIC - UP

Tag ID : eb269c4

Eunhasu information

AboutChange Log

 

and the change log shows

Version : V0.4.7
  - Date : 03-11-2019

even though I am on v0.4.81 - i.e.  it does not detail the changes made in this new version.

I only mentioned this because it seems to be an anomaly - and I have repeated both the upgrade and the kernel check. Perhaps the upgrade has not happened - although the System Upgrade page indicates it has.

 

Re SQ - I have not heard a change after the upgrade, but do think there is a difference between running LMS(remotely) with Squeezelite on the sms200, and MPD/DLNA wirh Foobar (on laptop). Bass guitars seem more pronounced and 'raspy' (think Jack Bruce) in MPD, which I rather like. Overall the output from the sms200 continues to be very enjoyable.

Any other comments on SQ ?

 

[5-pot-fan]

2 hours ago, ClothEars said:

Yes, this update appears to have no bugs and works fine.

I can't detect any change in sound though - which is probably a good thing seeing v4.81 sounds so good!

Agreed - straightforward update, minor oddities from v4.81 sorted, and all sounds good in MPD/DLNA + Squeezelite. Thanks SOTM!

[5-pot-fan]

9 hours ago, creativepart said:

I was running 4.9v on my SoTM SMS200 Ultra and updated a few minutes ago to 4.91v. All went well and I rebooted the system when done.

 

After the reboot finished I reloaded Eunhasu and clicked on the config "gears" icon to be sure nothing was different. There it said I was running 4.90v and not 4.91v.

 

So, I brought up the Update page again and it shows 4.91 available and says I'm running 4.90v.

 

I'm rerunning the upgrade to see what's happening.

 

OK, the second time it went fine again only this time it now says I'm at 4.91v. I'm not sure what happened that first time. I had no issues either time I applied the update. I don't know if this was limited to me or if it is a recurring issue for others. Perhaps everyone should check the version number AFTER updated to 4.91v.

I saw from this forum that 4.91 was available, so ran it and the kernel check  - all successful on the first pass, and the correct versions are displayed in config.

I also decided to read the change log and saw that I needed to uninstall and reinstall both MPD and LMS/Squeezelite to update these, which I did without problems.

SQ remains unchanged and good (to my ears). I would still like some other system upgrades (a subwoofer, better power supplies, etc) - but I suspect we all suffer from upgradeitis!

 

[5-pot-fan]

3 hours ago, audiobomber said:

According to the update log, you don't need uninstall/install the individual programs yourself. It is done automatically as part of the update.

 

System config page
– Upgraded below apps by uninstalling and installing in Eunhasu
-> Logitech Media Server to the version 7.9.3
-> MPD to the version 0.21.21
-> Upmpdcli(DLNA renderer) to the version 1.4.7
-> HQplayer NAA to the version 4.1.1
-> Shairport to the version 3.3.5
-> LibreSpot to the version 1.1.0
-> BubbleUPnP Server to the version 0.9.update37

Hi,

I thought that was the case, also, but I checked the version numbers of LMS/Squeezelite and MPD after the main update to 4.91 and they had not changed from the older versions. On re-reading the changelog I think it means that these services are to be updated individually, by uninstalling and re-installing them as separate actions.

This is what happened for me, anyway. After doing so they showed the updated version numbers, so I felt my interpretation was the right one.

Does anyone else have experience on this, or could SoTM advise which approach is correct?

[5-pot-fan]

42 minutes ago, bmoregnr said:

I ended up with a networking connection issue somehow and have re-established things but now I can’t seem to close down MPD/DNLA app as it just seems hung up.  I assume people shut this down each end of listening session.  I can refresh the Enhusa (how I spell it) page and then close MPD and it seems to stick on that second attempt.  Has anyone run into this and found a fix or am I missing something?

I'm not sure if this is the same as your issue but seems similar.

When I try to close LMS/Squeezelite and start MPD it hangs until I reboot.

I can swap from MPD to Squeezelite without issues.

I have also removed most other bits of software from sms200.

As this is the only bug that I encounter I will live with it as the system is otherwise working and sounding OK.

Let us know how you get on.

[5-pot-fan]

On 6/20/2020 at 3:16 PM, MGX-UK said:

This is driving me insane. Different sound quality streaming from Roon updates.  

My system Windows enterprise running Roon only i7 pc

End point via Cat 6 Sms-200 ultra/Meridian director DAC &LPS Sbooster

Up to Roon 1.7 (Build 536) all sounded good

Roon 1.7 (Build 537) sounded slightly muffled with reduced high frequency 

Roon 1.7 (Build 555) sound excellent again.

Roon 1.7 (Build 571) sounds the same as (Build 537) slightly muffled with reduced high frequency.

Anyone here experiencing the same problems?

I’m going to scrap Roon altogether and try to set up (Eunhasu Music Player) for my media collection on a nas and tidal. Any one kindly enough to explain to me how I can achieve this on my SMS-200?

Hi,

If I understand correctly I think you will need:-

a music(data) server;

a music (data) store;

a device+software to control the server;

a network to connect the server to your sms200+DAC.

 

You probably know all this, but I put it in for clarity!

 

I use :

a Raspberry Pi4 running piCoreplayer 6 as my server;

a 2Tb hard disk in a mains-powered caddy as my store - this connects to the Rpi4 via USB;

a laptop (but mobile would work) running a web browser, and also foobar2000, as the controller.

 

The Rpi4 connects to the rest of the network, including the sms200, via Cat5 and a simple switch.

 

Picoreplayer on the Rpi4 includes Logitech Media Server (LMS), which I access via the browser. LMS sees the copy of Squeezelite that I run on the sms200, and also sees the music store (which is configured as NTFS and is seen by the server over SMB).

Foobar on the laptop also sees the sms200 when that is running MPD/DLNA, and sees the music store as a mapped network drive. I use foobar/MPD to see/hear any differences with Squeezelite, and also because it makes me update the tags on the music!

This setup also gives me access to my Sonos.

The costs were pretty low - £50 for the rpi4 + case, £30 for the hard disk caddy - the hard drive was effectively free - £20/£30 for some 16gb cards for the Rpi4.

This setup will not do all that Roon does, and may not provide the quality that some versions of Roon have given you, but it is very stable, and not expensive to trial.

The overall music quality is OK to me, and is probably limited by my listening room and my ears, so although I will continue to make small changes it would need a large dollop of cash to get much improvement.

HTH to answer part of your query.

[5-pot-fan]

Hi

I upgraded to v.5.0 yesterday with no issues and no subsequent apparent problems.

Started with the Kernel check, then the f/w upgrade. On checking the system details I currently have Kernel =4.18.19-216.fc27.armv7hl (SMP) armv7l

Slight difference with Bmoregnr's details above.

No difference in sound to my ears - just continues to be enjoyable!

[5-pot-fan]

On 11/9/2020 at 12:02 PM, PnL said:

Hello. Updated to version 5.0 like everyone else - first checked the system kernel, then the update. Looked at the kernel version - .18.19-215.fc27.armv7hl. Today I repeated the kernel check in the system update - 215. The "start update" button is no longer active.

If you have not solved this already ......

In 'System Setup' click on the system update up arrow even though it is not yellow, then the next screen should give you the option to run a kernel check even though the system update option is missing. Normally this will allow you to re-run the kernel check/update.

If you still have a problem, post back here.

[5-pot-fan]

10 hours ago, PnL said:

Thank you for your participation. I updated the system twice, each time I rebooted SOtM, but the system version did not change - 4.18.19-215.fc27.armv7hl (SMP) armv7l.

If you have no other issues with your sms200 then, if it was mine, I would ignore it. if you do have other problems then try a fresh SD card.

Perhaps not a very helpful suggestion, but I have had 2 instances with my sms200 where anomalies have disappeared after using a new card.

[5-pot-fan]

As I use Windows I can only respond the qu 5.

You will lose all your settings because you intend to do a fresh install.

If you attempt to do an in situ upgrade this would preserve your settings. However it may work only if your existing version is reasonably close to v5 - perhaps v4.7. Why not do both - make a copy of the existing SD card first, try the upgrade, then do the new install if you want to?

 

[5-pot-fan]

To the best of my knowledge sotm usually provide only 2 images for downloading at any one time. Recenty these have been 4.2.2 (quite good and very stable) and the latest known working one. I asume this is so they don't have to handle problems and queries across multiple versions and only have to run maintenance on 1 version at a time.

I recall that 4.2.2 and 4.9.0 were shown together in the recent past, as I downloaded 4.9.0 as a test (even though I ended up doing an in situ upgrade). I did not look afterwards, but assume that 4.2.2 and 4.9.1 were shown together subsequently.

I have also had confusion with Balena Etcher and use WinDiskImager when I want to make a copy/image for backup purposes. Not directly helpful to you I realise, but perhaps there is an equivalent alternative for the Mac? Clonezilla is an option shown when I googled 'Windiskimager for Mac'

HTH