mevdinc Posted January 15, 2021 Share Posted January 15, 2021 22 hours ago, Miska said: T+A SDV 3100 HV? Also contains HQPlayer NAA endpoint capable of up to DSD1024... I did consider this DAC but it is way too expensive to be honest, I cannot justify paying that much. mevdinc.com (My autobiography) Recently sold my ATC EL 150 Actives! Link to comment
fds Posted January 15, 2021 Share Posted January 15, 2021 10 minutes ago, mevdinc said: exaSound S88 deos 8 channels and up to DSD 256 I think with XLR connections too. The S88 does look very, very interesting. Indeed I find that it is one of the most interesting DAC offerings available today including even HQPlayer NAA capabilities and working even up to DSD512 in its stereo setting. Would be very interesting to hear about first listening impressions ... ideally including a comparison of the S88 to the DAC8DSD with DSD512 files. The S88 seems to be based on the ESS 9038Pro, whereas the realism offered by the DAC8DSD seems to result from its propriatery 1-bit converter. If the S88 is able to match or even exceed the latter, that will be a striking archievement. Apple Powerbook G4 15\", iTunes, Metric Halo LIO-8, active speakers Link to comment
Gavin1977 Posted January 15, 2021 Share Posted January 15, 2021 I have not listened to exaSound before, but I have listened to ESS 9038... I don't think it would compare to DAC8 being fed DSD. ESS chips are not 'DSD Direct', so the sound quality is likely to be similar the PCM section of the DAC8 DSD. Would still sound jolly good of course. That's just my understanding. fds 1 Link to comment
mevdinc Posted January 15, 2021 Share Posted January 15, 2021 2 hours ago, fds said: The S88 does look very, very interesting. Indeed I find that it is one of the most interesting DAC offerings available today including even HQPlayer NAA capabilities and working even up to DSD512 in its stereo setting. Would be very interesting to hear about first listening impressions ... ideally including a comparison of the S88 to the DAC8DSD with DSD512 files. The S88 seems to be based on the ESS 9038Pro, whereas the realism offered by the DAC8DSD seems to result from its propriatery 1-bit converter. If the S88 is able to match or even exceed the latter, that will be a striking archievement. I agree, exaSound's new multichannel and stereo DACs look very promisng. I am also waiting for reviews. They offer everything and the previous versions were very well received. I think the implementation is more important than the DAC chip used. Not all AKM based DACs sound the same and I am sure the same must be true for the ESS based DACs. mevdinc.com (My autobiography) Recently sold my ATC EL 150 Actives! Link to comment
guiltyboxswapper Posted January 15, 2021 Share Posted January 15, 2021 1 hour ago, Gavin1977 said: I have not listened to exaSound before, but I have listened to ESS 9038... I don't think it would compare to DAC8 being fed DSD. ESS chips are not 'DSD Direct', so the sound quality is likely to be similar the PCM section of the DAC8 DSD. Would still sound jolly good of course. That's just my understanding. DSD is an improvement on ESS, but I found as I improved my source, my ESS based DAC couldn't keep up with the DAC8 DSD which just seemlessly scales based on its input. Which makes sense as the DAC8 DSD makes no attempts to process the incoming datastream, where as the ESS ICs still do a little processing if not as much as PCM mode. Link to comment
fds Posted January 15, 2021 Share Posted January 15, 2021 Appearantly, the Ayre QX-5/20 uses an ESS 9038 as well. When I had it in my system for testing, it had some aspects where it bettered my Metric Halo LIO-8. However, the differences were not so substantial so that I was happy to keep my LIO-8 for listening without any regrets. INote however that I did neither listen to DSD nor did I use the OpticalModule/Rendu at that time.) Now with the PCM DAC inside of the DAC8DSD only, my experience would have been similar I believe. With the DSD DAC inside of the DAC8DSD, one realizes immediately that something special is going on even at DSD64 or DSD128. Somehow it is as if a window/curtain between the performers and you is taken away. Somehow it is not really a gradual improvement over an existing decent DAC but a completely different level in particular at DSD512 and once burned-in. After experiencing that, it was impossible for me to return the DAC8DSD and to go back to the LIO-8. There is such a purity to the voices and other sounds that literally brought me to goosebumps and tears on certain tracks ... Hard to describe/communicate in words but if you experience it you will understand immediately. Now I do understand and can easily believe statements saying that the DAC8DSD is right up there with the Mola Mola Tambaqui or Chord DAVE. Personally, I would be very interested to compare the DAC8DSD to the Holo Audio May KTE sometime in the future. For now, however, I am still super happy and amazed each time I return from listening to the DAC8DSD. Apple Powerbook G4 15\", iTunes, Metric Halo LIO-8, active speakers Link to comment
Gavin1977 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 T+A made any progress with a formal Firmware release yet...? I've been running CPLD_1081_DSDSWAPPED and 2006be11 for some time now and have been flawless under both Windows and Linux. Link to comment
musicbuff Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 mevdinc, I agree, $37,000 is steep and I'm sure the T + A SDV 3100 HV is worth it, but I'll stick with the DAC8DSD (and be super satisfied). I had to replace my original desktop to be able to play DSD 512 files through HQ Player. I can only wonder what kind of monster computer you'd have to buy to utilize DSD 1024. One thing I've experienced with most upgrades...I'd wonder "how can it get better than this?" Then I'd put the upgrade in and most of the time, SQ improved to some degree. Sometimes a lot sometimes minimally. I'd like to hear a 1024 file someday, but if it's not affordable, I won't, neither will I care. Link to comment
blue2 Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 I'm sure the HQPlayer 4 Pro trial version will let you create some DSD1024 samples. 🎸🎶🏔️🐺 Link to comment
mevdinc Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 On 1/19/2021 at 7:47 AM, musicbuff said: mevdinc, I agree, $37,000 is steep and I'm sure the T + A SDV 3100 HV is worth it, but I'll stick with the DAC8DSD (and be super satisfied). I had to replace my original desktop to be able to play DSD 512 files through HQ Player. I can only wonder what kind of monster computer you'd have to buy to utilize DSD 1024. One thing I've experienced with most upgrades...I'd wonder "how can it get better than this?" Then I'd put the upgrade in and most of the time, SQ improved to some degree. Sometimes a lot sometimes minimally. I'd like to hear a 1024 file someday, but if it's not affordable, I won't, neither will I care. Diminishing returns kick in at some point :) Mytek is bringing out cost no object Empire DAC/Preamp/.. for around $20,000. mevdinc.com (My autobiography) Recently sold my ATC EL 150 Actives! Link to comment
matthias Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, mevdinc said: Mytek is bringing out cost no object Empire DAC/Preamp/.. for around $20,000. Money Making 😀 Matt "I want to know why the musicians are on stage, not where". (John Farlowe) Link to comment
barrows Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, matthias said: Money Making 😀 Matt Actually, this is not really accurate. Most "cost no object" type of designs from most manufacturers are not what they make money on. Manufacturers sell few of their top level products, and the cost to make them can be astronomically high, so the amount of money made on such designs is usually a fairly low percentage of a companies overall profits. Most manufacturers make these top level designs because they become a "statement" type product, which can be good for the company's reputation (resulting in more sales of the lower level units), because they can use the "statement" design process as a way to learn about technological advances which can later trickle down to more affordable models, and because design engineers often want to have the opportunity to discover what is possible if cost restraints are lifted. MarkusBarkus 1 SO/ROON/HQPe: DSD 512-Sonore opticalModuleDeluxe-Signature Rendu optical with Well Tempered Clock--DIY DSC-2 DAC with SC Pure Clock--DIY Purifi Amplifier-Focus Audio FS888 speakers-JL E 112 sub-Nordost Tyr USB, DIY EventHorizon AC cables, Iconoclast XLR & speaker cables, Synergistic Purple Fuses, Spacetime system clarifiers. ISOAcoustics Oreas footers. SONORE computer audio | opticalRendu | ultraRendu | microRendu | Signature Rendu SE | Accessories | Software | Link to comment
matthias Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 51 minutes ago, barrows said: Actually, this is not really accurate. Most "cost no object" type of designs from most manufacturers are not what they make money on. Manufacturers sell few of their top level products, and the cost to make them can be astronomically high, so the amount of money made on such designs is usually a fairly low percentage of a companies overall profits. Most manufacturers make these top level designs because they become a "statement" type product, which can be good for the company's reputation (resulting in more sales of the lower level units), because they can use the "statement" design process as a way to learn about technological advances which can later trickle down to more affordable models, and because design engineers often want to have the opportunity to discover what is possible if cost restraints are lifted. Thank you for the lecture. I know about this topic and would surely not put other devices in this price range in this category. You can regard this as gut feeling or personal opinion or dislike of this brand. Thats all. Matt MikeJazz 1 "I want to know why the musicians are on stage, not where". (John Farlowe) Link to comment
georgios Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Finally joined this club and I’m happy. Had a quick listen and first impression was really good, not overwhelmed though. Very clean and great instrument separation, great soundstage width and depth. Bass is a little shy, I assume break-in can improve that? Or because my PAD Diamond 30th Anniversary Silver USB cable? Currently my i7 6700 computer can only do ASDM7EC DSD128, I’m thinking, should I get a M1 chip Mac and use this computer as NAA or stick to this computer and upgrade USB Card/PSU? Anyway, this DAC is great. Link to comment
fds Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Congratulation! Actually in my system and with DSD512 I would not call the DAC8DSD bass shy at all. When using it on a normal Win 10 PC (i.e. before using it on the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu), I had the feeling that there was plenty of bass (maybe even a bit too much) but that it could have been a bit faster. Then at some point when switching to the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu and with DSD128, I indeed remember that I had the feeling of the bass being somewhat slim. Nevertheless, with DSD512 via the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu everything was fine. There is punch and weight down low. My PC allows for poly-sinc-ext2/ASDM7 at DSD512 which I found superior to ASDM7EC at DSD128. Note that my current USB cable is the Sablon USB 2020 which arrived basically together with the DAC8DSD. Thus, I cannot say for certainty whether some suboptimal aspects noticed during the the burn-in phase were due to the new USB cable or due to the new DAC. Apple Powerbook G4 15\", iTunes, Metric Halo LIO-8, active speakers Link to comment
Popular Post georgios Posted January 21, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted January 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, fds said: Congratulation! Actually in my system and with DSD512 I would not call the DAC8DSD bass shy at all. When using it on a normal Win 10 PC (i.e. before using it on the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu), I had the feeling that there was plenty of bass (maybe even a bit too much) but that it could have been a bit faster. Then at some point when switching to the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu and with DSD128, I indeed remember that I had the feeling of the bass being somewhat slim. Nevertheless, with DSD512 via the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu everything was fine. There punch and weight down low. My PC allows for poly-sinc-ext2/ASDM7 at DSD512 which I found superior to ASDM7EC at DSD128. Note that my current USB cable is the Sablon USB 2020 which arrived basically together with the DAC8DSD. Thus, I cannot say for certainty which aspects noticed during the the burn-in phase were/are due to the new USB cable and which due to the DAC. I also found poly-sinc-ext2/ASDM7 at DSD512 is superior and using this configuration at the moment. jiminlogansquare and Allan F 2 Link to comment
georgios Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Ok, after some break-in and uninstalling some unnecessary apps on computer, I feel this DAC is the best I’ve ever had, combined with Roon/HQplayer, it delivers super clarity with strong 3D presentation. I’m just connecting onboard USB port and entry level Corsair PSU. Can’t imagine how sound would be if I upgrade those two. Very very happy for this DAC change. Link to comment
SMSWAP Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 This have been my findings on the sonic performance of the exasound s88: Link to comment
jiminlogansquare Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 On 1/21/2021 at 3:51 PM, georgios said: I also found poly-sinc-ext2/ASDM7 at DSD512 is superior and using this configuration at the moment. I just want to add another vote in favor of this configuration of HQPlayer with the DAC 8 DSD. I tried various combinations of EC modulators (ASDM5EC, ASDM7EC) and DSD speeds (128, 256), but in the end it was DSD512 that had the greatest and best effect on SQ. Of course, my server doesn’t have the processing power to try EC modulators at DSD512, but the dynamics, air around instruments, soundstage size, and precise placement of instruments within the soundstage (what overall I might call the stereo sound illusion) I think are better at DSD512 with the ASDM7 modulator than at any bitrate with the EC modulators. All of the above upsampling Qobuz streaming files in real time. Link to comment
georgios Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 6 hours ago, jiminlogansquare said: I just want to add another vote in favor of this configuration of HQPlayer with the DAC 8 DSD. I tried various combinations of EC modulators (ASDM5EC, ASDM7EC) and DSD speeds (128, 256), but in the end it was DSD512 that had the greatest and best effect on SQ. Of course, my server doesn’t have the processing power to try EC modulators at DSD512, but the dynamics, air around instruments, soundstage size, and precise placement of instruments within the soundstage (what overall I might call the stereo sound illusion) I think are better at DSD512 with the ASDM7 modulator than at any bitrate with the EC modulators. All of the above upsampling Qobuz streaming files in real time. Totally agree. Ext2-DSD512-ASDM7 are good enough and easy to use for my i7 6700. Also, I found jriver playing SACD ISO is also very very good, in most cases seem to be even better than HQP up sampling red book. Link to comment
ericuco Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Does anyone, located in the US, have one of the cables required to upgrade the firmware on the DAC8 DSD? If so, I would like borrow or buy it from you. I have been trying to setup a fitlet2 computer running Win10 Pro but am having technical issues in getting it setup. So my Plan B is to upgrade the DAC8 DSD firmware (currently at 2.3) then upgrade the Amanero firmware which allows DSD512 using my opticalRendu (Linux-based). Thanks in advance for any assistance. Eric Audio System Link to comment
jiminlogansquare Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 Based on the T+A Service Note regarding updating the firmware (attached below), the cable you need is just a standard RS232 cable (DB9 to RJ11), see picture below of a representative example. Maybe one of these at Amazon will work, at around $10 or $12. Edited to add: You'll need to confirm whether you need a male or female RS232 jack based on your PC. S0126_DAC8DSD_FW_Update.pdf ericuco 1 Link to comment
ericuco Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 1 hour ago, jiminlogansquare said: Based on the T+A Service Note regarding updating the firmware (attached below), the cable you need is just a standard RS232 cable (DB9 to RJ11), see picture below of a representative example. Maybe one of these at Amazon will work, at around $10 or $12. Edited to add: You'll need to confirm whether you need a male or female RS232 jack based on your PC. S0126_DAC8DSD_FW_Update.pdf 180.38 kB · 3 downloads Thanks. Got a cable ordered. Also ordered a RS232 to USB adapter. Do you where the firmware (DAC_8_DSD_Vxxx.txt) can be downloaded? I need version 2.7. I didn't see anything on the T+A website. Eric Audio System Link to comment
ericuco Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 11 minutes ago, ericuco said: Thanks. Got a cable ordered. Also ordered a RS232 to USB adapter. Do you where the firmware (DAC_8_DSD_Vxxx.txt) can be downloaded? I need version 2.7. I didn't see anything on the T+A website. Nevermind. Found it at https://github.com/OE333/DAC8-Service-Tool jiminlogansquare 1 Eric Audio System Link to comment
Gavin1977 Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 7 hours ago, jiminlogansquare said: Based on the T+A Service Note regarding updating the firmware (attached below), the cable you need is just a standard RS232 cable (DB9 to RJ11), see picture below of a representative example. Maybe one of these at Amazon will work, at around $10 or $12. Edited to add: You'll need to confirm whether you need a male or female RS232 jack based on your PC. S0126_DAC8DSD_FW_Update.pdf 180.38 kB · 5 downloads You’ll need to rewire this according to T+A’s documentation. Link to comment
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