T+a dac 8 dsd

[edn4x4]

16 hours ago, guiltyboxswapper said:

Yes I've done this, though had to turn off a few background task timers for it to be stable (i.e. not blip every hour or less).  Solid after that.

Is this with the stock T+A firmware?

[guiltyboxswapper]

6 hours ago, edn4x4 said:

Is this with the stock T+A firmware?

With the latest Amanero Linux compatible firmware.  

[edn4x4]

6 hours ago, guiltyboxswapper said:

With the latest Amanero Linux compatible firmware.  

Thanks.

[Daveyu]

How do I tell which version of the firmware is installed on the T+A Dac 8 Dsd ?

[Gavin1977]

Reporting back:

 

 

[mevdinc]

I'd say this is quite an impressive achievement for T+A DAC 8 DSD considering it's been around for a while. It does deserve an upgrade along with a better volume control/preamp section.
 

[jft]

Having two pops sometimes when songs start using Audirvana Plus DSD512, DSD256 as well on Windows 10.

[jft]

2 hours ago, jft said:

Having two pops sometimes when songs start using Audirvana Plus DSD512, DSD256 as well on Windows 10.

 

[barrows]

25 minutes ago, jft said:

 

Are you always running DSD 256 or DSD 512, or are you asking the dAC to switch sample rates?  Sometimes pops can be avoided y always lowering the volume control before the DAC needs to switch sample rates, and if you always just input DSD 256, or 512 there may be no pops at all.  It is challenging for many days to playback, for example, a mixed playlist where it is changing from PCM to DSD in the midst of a playlist.  Also, if your playback software allows for it, sometimes it is helpful to set a delay when changing sample rates, Roon has this feature, I am not sure if Audirvana has it.

[jft]

Just received the DAC. I am streaming Qobuz from PC, and it happens sometimes switching from one band  to another singer for ex.  In this case, it happened a few times playing DSD 512 for one hour I guess.

I assume the PC is OK: AMD Ryzen5-2400G 3.6Ghz, 16 MB RAM.

Upsampling

SoX to DSD512 with filter type B 7th order
SoX filter parameters
Bandwidth at 0dB = 99.5
Filter max length = 30000
Anti-aliasing = 100
Phase = 66

Might try HQ Player, love AV+ simplicity though.

This Bricasti M3 has been calling me  ;-))

Thank you.

 

[fds]

Just joined the party ... although rather late. Still I am enjoying the T+A DAC8DSD with DSD512 a lot. I believe that the unit is still improving as burn-in continues. Nevertheless, I am experiencing an amazing SQ when using it together with my OpticalModule/OpticalRendu (after flashing a recent Amanero firmware to the DAC8DSD without experiencing any problems). Also my high-end preamp (Ayre KX-5) seems no longer needed. I get better results when using the DAC8DSD set to fixed line level directly connected to my monos. Although I had tried software control and bypassing the preamp before, now it is for the first time here running extremely well. The DAC8DSD in this setting brings realism in my listening room to a completely new level. I have the feeling that I am listening directly to a live performance as opposed to listening to a good recording thereof. The tonality is spot on, performers have body, instruments the proper size, brass has punch and wonderful texture, ... really stunning. Many thanks to all the DAC8DSD users posting here on this wonderful page that motivated me to get this outstanding unit to my listening room!!!

 

PS For other potential late comers to the party, I strongly recommend to make sure that you will be testing either a well burned-in DAC8DSD or to be patient to give it sufficient time to burn in. Also the XLR outputs seem to be the recommended setting. Using its on-board volume control I found inferior to setting it to line level and to using software volume control. While DSD128 can be quite nice already, its full magic seems to appear for DSD512 as reported by many others. Oh, and as stressed many times before, its internal PCM DAC is quite good, but it is its DSD DAC that is exceptional when receiving DSD512 material obtained from PCM files upsampled via software inside the computer.

 

 

[mevdinc]

2 hours ago, fds said:

Just joined the party ... although rather late. Still I am enjoying the T+A DAC8DSD with DSD512 a lot. I believe that the unit is still improving as burn-in continues. Nevertheless, I am experiencing an amazing SQ when using it together with my OpticalModule/OpticalRendu (after flashing a recent Amanero firmware to the DAC8DSD without experiencing any problems). Also my high-end preamp (Ayre KX-5) seems no longer needed. I get better results when using the DAC8DSD set to fixed line level directly connected to my monos. Although I had tried software control and bypassing the preamp before, now it is for the first time here running extremely well. The DAC8DSD in this setting brings realism in my listening room to a completely new level. I have the feeling that I am listening directly to a live performance as opposed to listening to a good recording thereof. The tonality is spot on, performers have body, instruments the proper size, brass has punch and wonderful texture, ... really stunning. Many thanks to all the DAC8DSD users posting here on this wonderful page that motivated me to get this outstanding unit to my listening room!!!

 

PS For other potential late comers to the party, I strongly recommend to make sure that you will be testing either a well burned-in DAC8DSD or to be patient to give it sufficient time to burn in. Also the XLR outputs seem to be the recommended setting. Using its on-board volume control I found inferior to setting it to line level and to using software volume control. While DSD128 can be quite nice already, its full magic seems to appear for DSD512 as reported by many others. Oh, and as stressed many times before, its internal PCM DAC is quite good, but it is its DSD DAC that is exceptional when receiving DSD512 material obtained from PCM files upsampled via software inside the computer.

 

 

Software digital volume control has improved quite a lot recently. But I'm surprised the internal volume control isn't as good. Does DAC 8DSD also use a digital volume control?
I can't tell what active speakers you use but I always obtained best results going direct from DAC to my actives, thus doing away with a sperate pre altogether.
I am still waiting an updated version of this great DAC, hopefully with an analog volume and a  built-in streamer. :)

[sbenyo]

52 minutes ago, mevdinc said:

Software digital volume control has improved quite a lot recently. But I'm surprised the internal volume control isn't as good. Does DAC 8DSD also use a digital volume control?
I can't tell what active speakers you use but I always obtained best results going direct from DAC to my actives, thus doing away with a sperate pre altogether.
I am still waiting an updated version of this great DAC, hopefully with an analog volume and a  built-in streamer. :)

From a few listening tests I did, I haven't heard any significant difference between volume control or line in. For convenience, I keep using the remote control for now. It will be good to know if anyone has difference experience and if it's recommended to use software volume control. I will run a few more tests to be sure.

[fds]

2 hours ago, mevdinc said:

But I'm surprised the internal volume control isn't as good. Does DAC 8DSD also use a digital volume control?

 

Actually, I did not spend too much time on the internal volume control. Thus, there may again be the aspect of burn in the analog volume control of the DAC8DSD. When first eliminating my preamp, I had been using the internal volume control first. While I was immediately impressed at how well this setting was working, I still got the slight impression that something wasn't quite right after several hours of listening. Then when setting the switch on the DAC8DSD to its fixed volume setting (Line) and using software volume controll, everthing fell into place.

 

My next step was to check my Metric Halo LIO-8 (again with its internal analog volume control and with software volume control) directly on my Mark Levinson 434 monos (i.e. no active speaker setup in my main listening room). Since my last check of this setting was prior to using the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu, I was wondering whether this made my preamp superfluous somehow. However, when bringing in the Ayre KX-5 pre, there was a clear improvement with the LIO-8, i.e., bass got more weight/substance, voice did sound more relaxed and human etc. ... Thus, I realized that with the LIO-8, my preamp remained to be a crucial component in my system. Still even with this LIO-8 optimized setting, I found the LIO-8 to sound somewhat artificial. That was a new experience for me. Prior to my DAC8DSD encounter, I had found the LIO-8 to be a very natural sounding DAC (e.g. when comparing it to the RME ADI-2 DAC or the Ayre QX-5/20).

 

When switching back to the DAC8DSD with the KX-5 preamp included, there was already this amazing realism. Still I found again something not as pure as I had experienced before. After eliminating the KX-5 again, the purity returned along with the realism. This was the point when it was fully clear to me that I would keep the DAC8DSD. Interestingly, at that point, I had only used DSD128 files via my OpticalModule/OpticalRendu or DSD512 files via an ordinary Win10 PC connected directly via USB to the DAC8DSD. Only after it was clear to me that I would keep the DAC8DSD, did I flash the Amanero USB driver which paved the way to play DSD512 via the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu setup.

 

Once you have flashed the Amanero USB driver, the DAC8DSD has to go back to the T+A factory to be set back to its stock USB driver optimized for Win10 usage. Thus, I had to rely on extrapolating between my Win10 PC experiences with DSD512 and the DSD128 experiences with the OpticalModule/OpticalRendu, to decide on my purchase ... and yes, DSD512 now via OpticalModule/OpticalRendu offers my SQ benchmark so far.

 

So far, I am still using the trial version of HQP desktop which allows for 30 minutes of playback before shutting down automatically. There my PC allows to use the poly-sinc-ext2 filter along with the ASDM7 modulator at DSD512. However, for my early DSD128 tests, I was able to use the sinc-M filter along with the ASDM7EC modulator. The HQP software is really wonderful with its great digital volume control. Although it is a no brainer puchase, I still have to decide whether to buy HQP desktop or whether to first get a better Linux server to run HQP embedded. Really great that HQP offers such a convenient trial version that allows us to fully experience its power beforehand.

[guiltyboxswapper]

2 hours ago, mevdinc said:

Software digital volume control has improved quite a lot recently. But I'm surprised the internal volume control isn't as good. Does DAC 8DSD also use a digital volume control?

It is reasonably good analog vol control, but do remember that the 8 DSD isn't their "top end" product and as a result they didn't use top grade resistors for the volume array. 

 

After a certain point of your source etc being good enough the built in vol control becomes a bottleneck.  For me, that was opticalRendu + opticalModule level of source onwards.

 

PS: those using HQPlayer, there's a "half buffer" option that makes the volume control changes much more responsive, worth trying.  Requires a recent version of HQPlayer.

[mevdinc]

Thank you everyone for the input.

My DAC has a very good analog volume control and it's certainly better than the software one, although I use the excellent Audirvane player.
My next DAC has to have a very good volume control for starters.

[jft]

I fixed issue with the two pops when upsampling to DSD 512 on Audirvana.  Buffer issue.  Removed preamp and quite happy with the analog volume control on the DSD 8.  PCM 384 is really nice but DSD 512 brings music to a different level.  I need to use the volume control on the DAC when pushing music to DSD, the volume control on PC goes away with Audirvana.  I started to play with HQPlayer 4, need to find an app to add Qobuz to it.  All integrated in Audirvana.

[barrows]

9 minutes ago, jft said:

I started to play with HQPlayer 4, need to find an app to add Qobuz to it

That would be Roon+HQPlayer.

[fds]

14 hours ago, mevdinc said:

My next DAC has to have a very good volume control for starters

 

That is exactly what I had thought and was fully convinced of ... even more surprised I was and still am at how well the HQP volume control is working when upsampling red book PCM to DSD512. I strongly recommend to give the DAC8DSD a try in this setting. Of course, when using software control, one has to be very careful, e.g., such that other computer generated sounds will not be played back at full volume and thereby fry your tweeters (and/or your ears).

 

The (analog) volume control of my Ayre KX-5 is of very high quality along with its other features such as output stage. I believe that anything of similar quality will be very hard to find in a DAC below say 5K. Not sure about the Bricasti M3 but the Mola Mola Makua preamp with inbuilt (basically Tambaqui) DAC upgrade will certainly be up to it ... now - in light of this - using the DAC8DSD direct to power amp with HQP volume control feels a bit like cheating. Looking at the posts of @Gavin1977 here comparing the DAC8DSD to the Mola Mola Tambaqui for example, I get the feeling that I get a performance very close to the Mola Mola at a fraction of the price ... or basically for free when considering that now I could basically sell my preamp along with the extra footers/power cord/XLR cable pair.

 

[Gavin1977]

1 hour ago, fds said:

 

That is exactly what I had thought and was fully convinced of ... even more surprised I was and still am at how well the HQP volume control is working when upsampling red book PCM to DSD512. I strongly recommend to give the DAC8DSD a try in this setting. Of course, when using software control, one has to be very careful, e.g., such that other computer generated sounds will not be played back at full volume and thereby fry your tweeters (and/or your ears).

 

The (analog) volume control of my Ayre KX-5 is of very high quality along with its other features such as output stage. I believe that anything of similar quality will be very hard to find in a DAC below say 5K. Not sure about the Bricasti M3 but the Mola Mola Makua preamp with inbuilt (basically Tambaqui) DAC upgrade will certainly be up to it ... now - in light of this - using the DAC8DSD direct to power amp with HQP volume control feels a bit like cheating. Looking at the posts of @Gavin1977 here comparing the DAC8DSD to the Mola Mola Tambaqui for example, I get the feeling that I get a performance very close to the Mola Mola at a fraction of the price ... or basically for free when considering that now I could basically sell my preamp along with the extra footers/power cord/XLR cable pair.

 

Spot on - the main difference with the Mola Mola was better imaging.

 

Also, you can set the start-up volume and also a volume limit if you use HQPlayer (embedded version in my case) which should help prevent any issues.

 

My search still continues...  I have more feedback coming...  including one configuration that does incorporate a preamp that I rather like.

[mevdinc]

4 hours ago, fds said:

 

That is exactly what I had thought and was fully convinced of ... even more surprised I was and still am at how well the HQP volume control is working when upsampling red book PCM to DSD512. I strongly recommend to give the DAC8DSD a try in this setting. Of course, when using software control, one has to be very careful, e.g., such that other computer generated sounds will not be played back at full volume and thereby fry your tweeters (and/or your ears).

 

The (analog) volume control of my Ayre KX-5 is of very high quality along with its other features such as output stage. I believe that anything of similar quality will be very hard to find in a DAC below say 5K. Not sure about the Bricasti M3 but the Mola Mola Makua preamp with inbuilt (basically Tambaqui) DAC upgrade will certainly be up to it ... now - in light of this - using the DAC8DSD direct to power amp with HQP volume control feels a bit like cheating. Looking at the posts of @Gavin1977 here comparing the DAC8DSD to the Mola Mola Tambaqui for example, I get the feeling that I get a performance very close to the Mola Mola at a fraction of the price ... or basically for free when considering that now I could basically sell my preamp along with the extra footers/power cord/XLR cable pair.

 

I'm in the 'less is more' camp when it comes to adding pre between DACs and power amps, especially since I only listen to digital.
A long time ago I did use software volume with both Audirvana and JPlay and results were satisfactory. Digital volume has improved even more recently.

But I am looking for an all-in-one DAC solution with a good analog volume, built-in streamer and preferably just one analog input (for home cinema use).
There are some decent all-in-one solutions from COS and others including Lindemann Source (which is an upgrade to my existing DAC).



 

[Miska]

20 hours ago, mevdinc said:

But I am looking for an all-in-one DAC solution with a good analog volume, built-in streamer and preferably just one analog input (for home cinema use).
There are some decent all-in-one solutions from COS and others including Lindemann Source (which is an upgrade to my existing DAC).

 

T+A SDV 3100 HV? Also contains HQPlayer NAA endpoint capable of up to DSD1024...

 

[fds]

Experiencing the wonderful DAC8DSD right now, I am wondering whether it can get substantially better than this? Hard to imagine ... but I had been at this point several times before of course. Indeed, it would be very interesting to hear about listening experiences from comparing the DAC8DSD with the SCV3100HV, although the latter would be far outside of my budget.

 

The main aspect that I am missing with the DAC8DSD it that it is not an 8-channel DAC (or 6-channel at least). In my books, a multi-channel version of the DSD DAC inside of the DAC8DSD allowing for 8-channel DSD512 playback would be the ultimate endgame DAC. Ideally, with fully symmetrical design, normal XLR outputs (i.e. no adapters required), and with onboard HQPlayer NAA endpoint ... needed since multi-channel DSD512 bandwidth size will require one to go beyond USB class compliant input ... It would be terrific to have the SQ of the DSD DAC of the DAC8DSD with additional capabilities to play multichannel DSD files, to integrate subs optimally, to do digital room correction with active crossovers, to set up multiple-sub arrays, etc.

[guiltyboxswapper]

9 minutes ago, fds said:

Experiencing the wonderful DAC8DSD right now, I am wondering whether it can get substantially better than this?

It can, the opticalRendu and opticalModule is a very good level of performance but (with some effort) a single optimised PC with a dedicated USB card (JCAT XE in my case) and good quality power takes the same DAC to an entirely new level.  

 

It's a lot more effort though, and certainly not as elegant as the oR/oM combo.  

[mevdinc]

21 hours ago, fds said:

Experiencing the wonderful DAC8DSD right now, I am wondering whether it can get substantially better than this? Hard to imagine ... but I had been at this point several times before of course. Indeed, it would be very interesting to hear about listening experiences from comparing the DAC8DSD with the SCV3100HV, although the latter would be far outside of my budget.

 

The main aspect that I am missing with the DAC8DSD it that it is not an 8-channel DAC (or 6-channel at least). In my books, a multi-channel version of the DSD DAC inside of the DAC8DSD allowing for 8-channel DSD512 playback would be the ultimate endgame DAC. Ideally, with fully symmetrical design, normal XLR outputs (i.e. no adapters required), and with onboard HQPlayer NAA endpoint ... needed since multi-channel DSD512 bandwidth size will require one to go beyond USB class compliant input ... It would be terrific to have the SQ of the DSD DAC of the DAC8DSD with additional capabilities to play multichannel DSD files, to integrate subs optimally, to do digital room correction with active crossovers, to set up multiple-sub arrays, etc.

exaSound S88 deos 8 channels and up to DSD 256 I think with XLR connections too.