T+a dac 8 dsd

[christoph]

On 13.6.2017 at 1:05 PM, volpone said:

Thank's @bibo01,

Finger crossing for the "slight clock problem" !

for how many months has it been "just this close" over and over again???

[richard kimber]

20 hours ago, christoph said:

for how many months has it been "just this close" over and over again???

It's the hi-fi industry. That's how it works

[4est]

On 5/31/2017 at 4:29 AM, bibo01 said:

UPDATE -

I just spoke to Amanero. He is really close. His T&A DAC is all opened and he's trying the new code on it. There is still something little to be fixed for which he is in touch with T&A tech dept.

 

Forgive me if this was already stated, but will Amanero(Domineco?) be releasing linux drivers/firmware/??? for the general public, or just for T&A owners?

[bibo01]

53 minutes ago, 4est said:

 

Forgive me if this was already stated, but will Amanero(Domineco?) be releasing linux drivers/firmware/??? for the general public, or just for T&A owners?

For the general public.

Amanero/Domenico will post it on github. 

[4est]

Just now, bibo01 said:

For the general public.

Amanero/Domenico will post it on github. 

Great! TY!!!!

[eternaloptimist]

On 2017-6-24 at 7:17 PM, volpone said:

 

From your hears JRIVER upsampling (PCM352) is quite different from ROON PCM upsampling ?

Not significantly different. JRiver is perhaps a little "brighter" but I don't think I would be able to tell them apart in a blind test. 

[bibo01]

On 6/25/2017 at 8:15 PM, 4est said:

 

Forgive me if this was already stated, but will Amanero(Domineco?) be releasing linux drivers/firmware/??? for the general public, or just for T&A owners?

It seems that we are finally getting there!

Just published on github:

Amanero: hello, there is online firmware_2000 it supports DSD512, just compiled and verified only with an oscilloscope. May you check if it's ok on DSD512/DSD256? For now it's Little Endian but if ok it can be changed in BE.

Tomorrow i'll test all the options and on a DAC, so don't worry if it's not working. But from the signals i have on the oscilloscope it seems running at DSD512 (player Daphile Native mode )

[volpone]

On 28/06/2017 at 7:42 AM, bibo01 said:

It seems that we are finally getting there!

Just published on github:

Amanero: hello, there is online firmware_2000 it supports DSD512, just compiled and verified only with an oscilloscope. May you check if it's ok on DSD512/DSD256? For now it's Little Endian but if ok it can be changed in BE.

Tomorrow i'll test all the options and on a DAC, so don't worry if it's not working. But from the signals i have on the oscilloscope it seems running at DSD512 (player Daphile Native mode )

 

Yes @bibo01 , seems there is a good step forward.

Now is up to us (users community) to test and give feedbacks to Domenico (AMANERO).
 

Personally i will wait some advices from experienced users because i'm not well aware of the DAC8DSD Firmware update procedure (via Amanero OEMTool 117 ?).

Other solution would be to send back the device to maker for service but no proposal from T+A yet.

I think they are waiting to know if the new FW is really OK.

[sbenyo]

I just got a second hand DAC8DSD.

 

For some reason I can't get it to work with the volume control. If it's set to LINE it works fine (USB). If it's on VRBL there is no sound. How can I make it work?
 

Regardless of this, my first impression after a few hours of listening to PCM  (redbook, hires) using mainly BEZ2 filter and WIDE setting is not so good. It sounds different and less impressive than my older cheaper EE minimax plus DAC. It is too forward in mid, the bass is too aggressive/dominant and the tweeter sparkle is missing. It sounds somewhat dull and missing the finesse and sparkle l have in my older DAC.

I did see comparisons to well known and respectable DACs so it is strange to me that it is not performing any better than my previous DAC.  I wonder if anyone else has similar impressions.

 

[CatManDo]

15 hours ago, sbenyo said:

For some reason I can't get it to work with the volume control. If it's set to LINE it works fine (USB). If it's on VRBL there is no sound. How can I make it work?

 

No sound:

Volume set to zero?

Mute on?

 

I'm using mine as a preamp. When listening to speakers I set the DAC to VRBL (XLR output to power amp). When listening to headphones I set it to LINE (RCA output to tube headphone amp). I just need to be careful to switch the setting back again to VRBL before turning the power amp on

X

[sbenyo]

I tried using it with pre-amp + amp setup. According to T+A this is not recommended and they say it's better to use LINE and pre-amp volume or use it only when DAC is directly connected to AMP.

I should still get the sound even in this setup. I was told to try and put it on max volume and also put the pre-amp on high volume and test again. I will try it and see if it works.
 

Currently I am much more concerned with the PCM performance which is much less than I expected and as good as my old DAC.

 

[Le Concombre Masqué]

51 minutes ago, sbenyo said:

I tried using it with pre-amp + amp setup. According to T+A this is not recommended and they say it's better to use LINE and pre-amp volume or use it only when DAC is directly connected to AMP.

I should still get the sound even in this setup. I was told to try and put it on max volume and also put the pre-amp on high volume and test again. I will try it and see if it works.
 

Currently I am much more concerned with the PCM performance which is much less than I expected and as good as my old DAC.

 

get hqplayer and send everything DSD 512 to your T+A

[sbenyo]

I just go the volume control working. I had to put it very high and also put my pre amp volume high.

It works fine. Thanks for the advice. I will try using DSD512 as I understand it is the sweet spot for this DAC. I still want PCM to work much better that it current is. I hope it will get better.

 

[m3lraaHnevetS]

On 5-7-2017 at 7:00 PM, sbenyo said:

I just go the volume control working. I had to put it very high and also put my pre amp volume high.

It works fine. Thanks for the advice. I will try using DSD512 as I understand it is the sweet spot for this DAC. I still want PCM to work much better that it current is. I hope it will get better.

 

so you are using the preamp in the T+A and also an other preamp at the same time...? that does not sound right...please tell us your system config

when possible use balanced output and quality cables. also look at AC power.

I used a T+A DAC8 DSD for a few months to do the 512-thing but am now back at redbook (using a different DAC as you can see in my signature).

imho 512 improves the resolution of individual instruments and voices but cohesion and ambiance are lost. the guy over at Kitsune explains this in a nice way click

[sbenyo]

I am using T+A DAC with my vintage system which is Accuphase P-300 (power) and C-200 (pre). 

I have no balanced inputs on either the pre or amp (I think it was not invented yet when this system was born ). 

I currently use both pre and DAC pre and it works very well. I can adjust the volume without problems and I don't see any sound quality issues. I can try connecting the AMP directly to the DAC and see if this makes anything better.

 

I wonder if connecting the balanced output using XLR to RCA can make it better. I saw some good cables, Cardas XLR adapters and the JENSEN adapter. If this can make a difference it can be interesting.
I still need to change the AC power cable and I heard that good feet for isolation/vibration (Cardas?) can also improve the sound.

 

After a few more hours of run-in/burn-in I can definitely say sound quality improved significantly. I am starting to get the hi-end quality I am looking for in PCM. I also use PUC2 lite to connect from USB to AES which also helps addinfg quality to the sound (but limited to 192kHz)

 

As for DSD, I tried using foobar2k to test DSD512 but no matter how I configure it, it cannot do more than DSD128.

Anyone has experience with it? I currently can't use HQPlayer so I am looking for alternatives to test DSD512 with direct connection to see how it compares to PCM and if it really does the "magic" everyone talks about. 

[m3lraaHnevetS]

T+A straight into P300 could be better, XLR --> RCA probably not.

why can you not use HQP?

[sbenyo]

I first want to try HQPlayer trail but after installing it says it expired.

I probably installed it many years ago and did not use. I sent a message but I did not get answer yet.

I currently look for alternatives (foobar2k, anything else?) until I get answer about it.

 

I will try connecting directly to amp later on today. I have to admit it started sounding pretty good (PCM) so I see very little room for improvement.

 

 

[m3lraaHnevetS]

Roon can upsample too. What does your usb chain look like? is it just pc/mac/laptop straight into T+A or do you have some reclocking/isolating going on?

there is a lot of room for improvement on that side too! you can ask Jussi aka Miska developer of HQP questions in the HQP tread on this forum, he seems to be a little less active these days but you can try anyway. good to hear that you are more satisfied already. happy tweaking and most of all listening! 

[sbenyo]

I am not familiar with Roon. I already sent Jussi mail and I'll wait for his answer.

I use directly connection from PC. My usb chain is very minimal for now. I only have AQ jitterbug. I also have PUC2 which is great but only for PCM up to 192kHz so it's not relevant here.

 

I do want to get recommendations on the best cost/effective usb chain as I hear from many it can be significantly improved. How about REGEN (usb or iso) or other isolators? Any other recommendations?

 

[rickca]

1 hour ago, sbenyo said:

I do want to get recommendations on the best cost/effective usb chain as I hear from many it can be significantly improved.

I would very strongly recommend an ISO REGEN powered by an LPS-1 (both products from Uptone Audio).  I think you will be thrilled.  

[sbenyo]

I will check it. It's not a cheap option. Both together get as high as $720.

That's about third the price I spent on the DAC.... 

Improvement has to be significant for this price. BTW, anyone knows if I can use TeraDak U9 LPS with ISO REGEN?

 

 

[rickca]

59 minutes ago, sbenyo said:

It's not a cheap option.

The LPS-1 is not a requirement, it's an enhancement.  I suggested the combination because you save $50 if you buy the the ISO REGEN and LPS-1 together.  You can get the ISO REGEN with a Mean Well SMPS for $325 and get a linear power supply later.  Also, Uptone offers a 30-day money back satisfaction guarantee.  

 

Have a look at the ISO REGEN listening impressions thread for user feedback.  A lot of people are really excited about this device.

 

I have no financial interest in Uptone.  I'm just a satisfied user who is happy to recommend their products.

[sbenyo]

I did more listening and I find the PCM setup I have really wonderful. It is definitely at the highest levels now.

It may still not be in the same level of DSD512 but it is not far and holds it own.
I think the combination of USB->PUC2 (w. LPS)->AES is pushing the sound quality up very nicely.

 

Since this is only good for PCM, I now understand I need to find a good usb chain solution for DSD.

I was almost settled on ISO REGEN but I then found there are so many solutions out there that I really got confused.
I am not sure which is the right one for me. There is the ISO REGEN, JCAT Intona, Ifi new solution, SU-1, SU-1 modded, SoTM SMS-200, Sonore uRendo, Mutec MC-3+USB, W4wyre and many others. 

 

I know there are not all exactly the same but they do compete on the USB line. Since these are all in the range of few hundred dollars to thousand, I will have to choose which one to bet on. Any thoughts?

[guiltyboxswapper]

I tried the Intona (which is similar to the ISO Regen).  It's no match for a dedicated PCIE USB card.  There's only so much 'recovery' the reclocking device can do with a not-so-great USB source stream.  The regen/reclocking devices offer some improvement, but given the cost involved, I would look at dedicated devices.

 

Or better yet, enjoy it as is, wait for the Linux Amanero firmware update to come out, and consider other dedicated streaming devices such as MicroRendu or Allo's Usbridge.  Can keep the PCs out of the way using this path.
 

Also worth looking at is the SilentSwitcher by Linear Audio, very cost effective and incredibly high performance PSUs made for analog and digital applications.  Under €70/PCB too.  Add a powerbank and you've also decoupled from the outside AC feed too.

[sbenyo]

My assumptions so far:

1. ISO REGEN provides hi-end isolation and re-clocking. It is probably in the levels of the hi-end products such as ultra uRendo or SoTM sMS-200 ultra. I don't think using both will give much maybe a very minor benefit.

2. ISO REGEN combined with LPS seems to be superior to JCAT intona and similar solutions (e.g. ifi , w4s, etc.). I don't see any reason to use similar products on the same usb chain

3. I am still not sure about Mutec and SU-1. I don't know what they give and if they are sufficient alone or need isolation.

4. SoTM and uRendu are acting as bridge/server so they have the benefit of not needing extra computer. They may be a full solution on their own. The current draw back is they are Linux based which is currently not supported for T+A.

 

I think the decision is either if I want a "closed" server solution or if I want to build my own bridge/server. Building my own gives my freedom choosing Windows/Linux as well as choosing components/mods (may not be cost/effective).

Currently I did not find anything better than ISO REGEN for what it gives for "open" solution (with exception of what I don't know as mentioned in point 3).

I tend to go with ISO REGEN for now as I can't use Linux solution yet. Once it's out I may reconsider and can always add or change.