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DVD Audio disc - how to identify files associated with 2 channel mix


derekc
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Hi - I have a DVD Audio disc (there are 4 tracks) which is claimed to contain; 24/96 5.1 surround sound, 24/96 2 channel and 16/44 5.1 mixes. When I use "DVD Audio Extractor" programme it shows both Title 1 or Title 2 as MLP 96Kz 24 bit - 6ch.

 

I.e. no 2 channel mix - so was thinking I would copy the files associated with the 2 channel mix to another folder on my lap top in order to force DVDAE onto the 2 channel mix. But am unclear which files I need to select - the two directories on the disc are listed below;

 

Directory of E:\AUDIO_TS

20/08/2004 18:52 <DIR> .

20/08/2004 18:52 <DIR> ..

20/08/2004 18:48 4,096 ATS_01_0.BUP

20/08/2004 18:27 4,096 ATS_01_0.IFO

20/08/2004 18:37 1,073,741,824 ATS_01_1.AOB

20/08/2004 18:43 1,073,741,824 ATS_01_2.AOB

20/08/2004 18:48 906,053,632 ATS_01_3.AOB

20/08/2004 18:52 4,096 ATS_02_0.BUP

20/08/2004 18:48 4,096 ATS_02_0.IFO

20/08/2004 18:52 585,478,144 ATS_02_1.AOB

20/08/2004 18:27 131,072 AUDIO_PP.IFO

20/08/2004 18:27 4,096 AUDIO_SV.BUP

20/08/2004 18:27 4,096 AUDIO_SV.IFO

20/08/2004 18:27 2,457,600 AUDIO_SV.VOB

20/08/2004 18:27 10,240 AUDIO_TS.BUP

20/08/2004 18:27 10,240 AUDIO_TS.IFO

20/08/2004 18:27 102,400 AUDIO_TS.VOB

15 File(s) 3,641,751,552 bytes

2 Dir(s) 0 bytes free

Directory of E:\VIDEO_TS

20/08/2004 18:52 <DIR> .

20/08/2004 18:52 <DIR> ..

20/08/2004 18:24 14,336 VIDEO_TS.BUP

20/08/2004 18:24 14,336 VIDEO_TS.IFO

20/08/2004 18:24 157,696 VIDEO_TS.VOB

20/08/2004 18:24 57,344 VTS_01_0.BUP

20/08/2004 18:24 57,344 VTS_01_0.IFO

20/08/2004 18:24 278,528 VTS_01_0.VOB

20/08/2004 18:25 245,159,936 VTS_01_1.VOB

20/08/2004 18:25 55,296 VTS_02_0.BUP

20/08/2004 18:25 55,296 VTS_02_0.IFO

20/08/2004 18:25 157,696 VTS_02_0.VOB

20/08/2004 18:25 117,317,632 VTS_02_1.VOB

 

Is anyone able to identify which files are associated with the 2 ch mix please? Or is it more complex than that - I have little experience of DVD Audio. Thanks for any help.

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In DVDA there is no 2ch mix independently, decoder must do downmix and for that encoder gives instructions how downmix must be happen (what channels, what level, what is cut-off freq. for SUB channel etc.).

Sorry, english is not my native language.

Fools and fanatics are always certain of themselves, but wiser people are full of doubts.

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Actually, I have ripped most of my own DVD-As with DVD Audio Extractor and the majority of them do have dedicated stereo channels. They show up as a separate Title in DVDAE as you describe.

 

I do have a few discs that don't have a dedicated stereo channel. I don't recall the exact procedure, but an app called DVDA Explorer can perform the downmix from 6 channel to 2 channel based on the instructions encoded on the DVD-A. I ripped The Beatles' Love this way and it sounds fantastic.

 

I'm pretty sure I got the instructions for downmixing with DVDA Explorer somewhere on this board, but I'd have to go searching for the thread.

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In DVDA there is no 2ch mix independently, decoder must do downmix and for that encoder gives instructions how downmix must be happen (what channels, what level, what is cut-off freq. for SUB channel etc.).

 

Sorry, but that is not true at all!! DVD-Audio carries two titles/layers, for 2 channel and multichannel, each independent (and that is the majority). Ever hear the Grateful Dead DVD-A's?? Beck Sea Change? The hirez stereo mix is often entirely a different mix/recording than the surround one (and in the case of the GD stuff Mickey Hart intended it that way).

 

Sometimes there are discs (like Beatles Love) that have no stereo layer in the Audio_TS (the directory where the proprietary MLP hirez is stored) and in that case there is what is called a SMARTS table of contents that tells players what the surround-to-stereo downmix should be....but those are a minority. In those cases there is also, in software like DVD Audio Explorer, a checkbox for stereo downmixing. Don't, however, have that as a default, since most DVD-A discs have a beautiful dedicated 24/192 (max) stereo title (surround is limited to 24/96, another indication that stereo and multichannel are independent).

 

Using DVD-Audio Extractor, make sure you highlight each title to show the output option. See below. BTW the Video_TS folder may well be the place where you'll find the LPCM stereo you are looking for (that's the standard DVD layer). It will be limited to 24/96 and is more often 24/48 unless highlighted in the booklets/cover, etc.

 

DVDA titles.jpg

 

P.S. I've written extensively about how to do this here on CA, a few years ago, and helped Chris create a couple CA Academy articles about it. Let us know how you get on...thx

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thanks Ted - bizarrely, when I clicked on either title 1 or 2 I only had the 6ch option, then earlier this evening for no reason at all a 2ch option appeared on title 2, then reverted back to a 6ch option, then back to a 2ch option - hmm, something a bit amiss here.

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Sorry, but that is not true at all!! DVD-Audio carries two titles/layers, for 2 channel and multichannel, each independent (and that is the majority).

Sorry to hear that...

First, DVD-Audio can carry 2 ch and MCH track independently as different tracks (as you say), but not on different layers, this is not possible. Recording on Dual-Layer disc is not a exeption (from viewpoint of continuous data this is one big volume only).

Picture about that, where we see two independent tracks, one MCH and one 2ch (precence of both or only one is producer's decision):for CA 2.png

 

So, we have tracks. What if... duration of content is to big to carry both versions? The choice is only one - multichannel tracks. But wait, what then if someone wants listen this MCH tracks on stereo only equipment? Then we need do do downmix...

Ted says that's not true at all but how this really is?

 

for CA.png

There it is, the downmix properties for DVD-Audio. In full glory of default settings.

 

We don't know how derekc DVDA disc is made, but if MCH is involved, then in proper case there is instructions for downmix decoding (even if 2ch track is also on disc). Because of that, carrying two sets of tracks is... possible, just not very wise. Different mix/recording is just different track as producer intended.

Sorry, english is not my native language.

Fools and fanatics are always certain of themselves, but wiser people are full of doubts.

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"If no native stereo audio exists on the disc, the DVD-Audio player may be able to downmix the 5.1-channel audio to two-channel stereo audio if the listener does not have a surround sound setup (provided that the coefficients were set in the stream at authoring). Downmixing can only be done to two-channel stereo, not to other configurations, such as 4.0 quad."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Audio

I do have a few discs that don't have a dedicated stereo channel. I don't recall the exact procedure, but an app called DVDA Explorer can perform the downmix from 6 channel to 2 channel based on the instructions encoded on the DVD-A. I ripped The Beatles' Love this way and it sounds fantastic.

So, such disc exists in the wild also.

 

Ted, maybe my english is failing in the post for derekc, maybe. derekc understands, so this exact word is not so important anymore.

Sorry, english is not my native language.

Fools and fanatics are always certain of themselves, but wiser people are full of doubts.

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