Sonicorbiter - Native DSD support

[vortecjr]

This thread is intended to be a supplement to the Sonore Rendu series user manuals. The manuals contain quick start information that can be viewed here:

Sonicorbiter Rendu Series - User Manuals

 

The Sonore Rendu series supports native DSD with certain output modes. Currently, the NAA, MPD/DLNA, SqueezeLite, and RoonReady output modes support native DSD.

 

The Sonore Rendu series supports native DSD with most DACs. If your DAC is not supported you can continue to play DSD via DoP streaming. DoP encapsulates DSD into a format without data loss that can be streamed to most DSD capable DACs.

 

We may be able to add your DAC to the list of devices that support native DSD, but we will need some information for you. We have added a feature named DAC Diagnostics that will display the information we need. Fair warning: Not all DACs will support native DSD, some DACs may require a firmware update from the manufacturer, and it takes time to make your DAC available on the system for native DSD.

 

Software update on your unit might also be required and software version 2.7 or greater is recommended. 

Please follow this update procedure:

1. Go to Apps and select Software Manager

2. Now select Update **do not interrupt the update**

3. Wait for "Back to Main Menu" to appear at the bottom of the screen and ignore any Complete notices

4. Reboot your unit 

 

SPECIAL NOTES:

Sonicorbiter 2.7 and newer releases - Adds auto recognition of devices that support Native DSD playback under Linux.

 

Sonicorbiter 2.5 and newer releases - Native DSD playback is POP free between PCM/DSD transitions.

 

Sonicorbiter 2.4 and earlier releases - Native DSD playback can produce noise between tracks, change in rate, and when playback is paused/stopped/resumed. This noise is expected and can be at full volume. For best results select DoP for DSD playback or upgrade to Sonicorbiter 2.5 and or newer releases.

[vortecjr]

I'm puzzled as to why "Are" (I assume you mean Ayre) is on the list of DACs that do not support native DSD. I use Sonicorbiter software, without DSD over DoP enabled. DSF files play just fine.

 

If it's playing you are likely streaming DoP. I can show you how to check it?

 

Jesus R

[vortecjr]

Sure, please tell me. I'm new to DSD. I'm using LMS mode and noticed the checkbox for DSD over DoP was not checked.

 

You want to check that box and then press save so the system sends DoP to your DAC.

 

Jesus R

[vortecjr]

Why? It works fine without that. I was just pointing out that your list might be incorrect regarding the Ayre DACs.

 

If you don't it will convert the DSD content to PCM. The list is correct regarding the Ayre DACs. There is no code in the driver to support native DSD with the Ayre DACs. In addition, SqueezeLite does not support the native DSD format.

 

Jesus R

[vortecjr]

My apologies. I just received my server back from Andrew (for a storage upgrade). I hadn't played DSF files since the return. Everything was reset and the box was unchecked, but I didn't realize it had been changed from before. I just tested again and you are right of course.

 

No problem. I just wanted to clarify what it was doing.

 

Jesus R

[vortecjr]

No problem. I just wanted to clarify what it was doing.

 

Jesus R

 

Some Updates:

 

The Sonicorbiter's operating system has been updated to support native DSD on three additional DACs. The unit now supports the Mytek Brooklyn DAC, NuPrime DAC-10, and the Oppo HA-2. Upgrade the unit from the GUI and wait for a "Back to Main Menu" link to appear at the bottom of the status section. After the "Back to Main Menu" link appears complete the update by rebooting the unit. Please test and provide feedback.

 

Jesus R

[vortecjr]

Jesus, I believe it's only up to DSD256 on the Nano.

 

Indeed. I will clarify this above.

 

Jesus

[vortecjr]

Jesus, can you please look into LH Labs Pulse and VI DACs ?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Do you have a Sonicorbiter SE?

 

Jesus R

[vortecjr]

Native DSD256 has been reconfirmed on the PS Audio NuWave DAC.

[vortecjr]

Just saw your post update. I updated the SOSE software to the newest version, rebooted both the SOSE and RoonServer. No playback issues but one thing i noticed is that Roon still shows 1.0.9 as the version number and the SOSE shows the RoonReady Version number as 1.0.11. I don't know if this matters or not but thought i would relay it. Highest DSD resloution in Roon for my NuPrime is showing DSD128 as well, though i belive you stated that was a limitation on that side.

 

Thanks.

 

Play DSD64, go to the GUI, and then send me the text in DAC Diagnostics via email to [email protected]

[vortecjr]

@vortecjr--

 

Now for another annoying question:

 

@Foggie pointed me to this thread on the What's Best Forum:

 

Amanero now supporting native DSD In Linux

 

Does this mean that you could support native DSD on the Lampizator DACs with the SOSE or microRendu?

 

(My SOSE is in your order queue.)

 

--David

 

Yes. We have been working on it today. However, the code and the firmware have not been tested. We need a volunteer with a SE and Lampi DAC to test things. If you have this combination and would like to test native DSD on it email me at [email protected].

[vortecjr]

Jesus R, can you look into native DSD support for the Unison Research CD Due. Thanks.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile mobile app

 

If you have a Sonicorbiter SE send me the data on the DAC Diognostics GUI page.

[vortecjr]

Yes. We have been working on it today. However, the code and the firmware have not been tested. We need a volunteer with a SE and Lampi DAC to test things. If you have this combination and would like to test native DSD on it email me at [email protected].

 

Looks like this is going to need more work. It's hard to get this right without a unit to test on. Does anyone know what devices use the Amanero USB board? So far I know about AMI Musik and Lampi.

[vortecjr]

Is this correct is what you requested?

 

DAC description: UNISON CDP 2 20b1:302d

Diagnostic information for this DAC

UNISON RESEARCH UNISON CDP 2 at usb-ci_hdrc.1-1.1, high speed : USB Audio

 

Playback:

Status: Running

Interface = 1

Altset = 2

Packet Size = 31

Momentary freq = 44103 Hz (0x5.8348)

Feedback Format = 16.16

Interface 1

Altset 1

Format: S32_LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

Interface 1

Altset 2

Format: S16_LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

Interface 1

Altset 3

Format: SPECIAL

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

 

That looks good!

[vortecjr]

No counter intelligence on that device.

[vortecjr]

Hello, I'm actually not sure whether my LH Labs Geek Out 450 supports "native" DSD or not; and to be clear, I don't necessarily care that much myself, as I intend to use my Sonicorbiter SE primarily with another, non-DSD DAC. I thought I would provide the diagnostic output just in case it would be helpful, though.

 

Thank you. It's being worked on already.

[vortecjr]

Here is the DAC Diagnostics information while playing a DSD64 file from HQ Player (no audio of course).

 

 

USB output

DAC description: xCORE USB Audio 2.0 20b1:3021

Diagnostic information for this DAC

XMOS xCORE USB Audio 2.0 at usb-ci_hdrc.1-1.1, high speed : USB Audio

 

Playback:

Status: Running

Interface = 1

Altset = 1

Packet Size = 294

Momentary freq = 383997 Hz (0x2f.ffe8)

Feedback Format = 16.16

Interface 1

Altset 1

Format: S24_3LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

Interface 1

Altset 2

Format: S32_LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

Interface 1

Altset 3

Format: SPECIAL

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

 

Capture:

Status: Stop

Interface 2

Altset 1

Format: S32_LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 2 IN (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 usaccess: RW_INTERLEAVED

format: S24_3LE

subformat: STD

channels: 2

rate: 384000 (384000/1)

period_size: 38400

buffer_size: 76800

 

Is this a DIY board? Post a link to the product page? DoP should work fine into it.

[vortecjr]

Eastern Electric Audio - MiniMax Tube DAC Supreme

 

I was pretty wiped out last night by the time I got around to DSD, but i didn't see the DSD options for the mR in Roon that I remember when connected directly to the DAC via USB. I should be in better shape tonight to take a closer look.

 

Okay. I'll submit it.

[vortecjr]

Got mine today and listening - RoonReady and NAA outputs both work very well

 

I would like to figure out, however, how to get two things working:

 

1) Native DSD with LH Labs Pulse XFi - It should be able to play direct (e.g., no DoP) via the microRendu - how to get this enabled?

2) DSD256 - I have the latest LH Labs firmware which enables DSD256 on the Pulse - how to get this enabled?

 

Cool. I'll submit the data for you and then we have to update the unit. It's a long process. If it really supports DoP at the rate then go to the GUI and in Settings/RoonReady make sure you have it set for DoP output. For NAA you have to go to HQ Player and set it there.

[vortecjr]

Jesus,

 

Ok, I'm able to play a DSD file from Roon (no HQ Player for now). Here is the DAC diag info for a DSD64 file:

 

DAC description: xCORE USB Audio 2.0 20b1:3021

Diagnostic information for this DAC

XMOS xCORE USB Audio 2.0 at usb-ci_hdrc.1-1.1, high speed : USB Audio

 

Playback:

Status: Running

Interface = 1

Altset = 2

Packet Size = 392

Momentary freq = 352795 Hz (0x2c.1970)

Feedback Format = 16.16

Interface 1

Altset 1

Format: S24_3LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

Interface 1

Altset 2

Format: S32_LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

Interface 1

Altset 3

Format: SPECIAL

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 1 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

 

 

EDIT: BAH, I just discovered the DoP check mark box in the Roon Ready settings for the mR. I'm now playing DSD64 and 128 files using DoP directly from Roon as well as through HQ Player. So is there a way (or a reason) to send Native DSD to the DAC? Thanks!

 

Not possible yet. As for the reason...some say you most have it, but only you can decide. FYI I'm just doing this fun:)

[vortecjr]

Hi Jesus:

 

Using HQPlayer/NAA I'm only able to get to DSD using DoP with my W4S DAC2 DSDse. Here are the diagnostics and custom dac info:

 

USB output

DAC description: 32bit 384kHz DSD Interface 27f7:1301

 

Diagnostic information for this DAC

 

Wyred 4 Sound 32bit 384kHz DSD Interface at usb-ci_hdrc.1-1.1, high speed : USB Audio

 

Playback:

Status: Running

Interface = 2

Altset = 1

Packet Size = 448

Momentary freq = 352799 Hz (0x2c.1990)

Feedback Format = 16.16

Interface 2

Altset 1

Format: S32_LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 5 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 32000, 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000

Data packet interval: 125 us

access: RW_INTERLEAVED

format: S32_LE

subformat: STD

channels: 2

rate: 352800 (352800/1)

period_size: 35280

buffer_size: 70560

 

0) USB Audio Class Digital alsa audio output interface `hw:0,0'

- device name = 32bit 384kHz DSD Interface

- interface name = USB Audio

- usb audio class = 2 - isochronous asynchronous

- character device = /dev/snd/pcmC0D0p

- encoding formats = S32_LE

- monitor file = /proc/asound/card0/pcm0p/sub0/hw_params

- stream file = /proc/asound/card0/stream0

 

Never had use DoP before! Help!

 

Bob

As-is it is not supported. W4S needs to update the firmware before we can get to work on it.

[vortecjr]

It's hooked up to my NuPrime IDA-8 integrated modified by TDDS, doing DSD64 and DSD128, but am not getting DSD256 to work yet. It's in DLNA mode.

 

Send me the output of DAC Diagnostics from the unit's GUI. Until the driver can be made DoP is probably listed to DSD128.

[vortecjr]

How about the Chord Mojo?

 

Chord Electronics Ltd Mojo at usb-ci_hdrc.1-1.1, high speed : USB Audio

 

Playback:

Status: Running

Interface = 2

Altset = 1

Packet Size = 228

Momentary freq = 176402 Hz (0x16.0ce0)

Feedback Format = 16.16

Interface 2

Altset 1

Format: S32_LE

Channels: 2

Endpoint: 5 OUT (ASYNC)

Rates: 32000, 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000, 705600, 768000

Data packet interval: 125 us

access: RW_INTERLEAVED

format: S32_LE

subformat: STD

channels: 2

rate: 176400 (176400/1)

period_size: 4410

buffer_size: 17640

This will not support native DSD as is.

[vortecjr]

Received microRendu today. Setup with my W4S DAC2 DSDse, but like the above poster cannot stream native DSD. Using microRendu as NAA, with Roon and HQ Player both on my main PC. Using DOP or PCM there are dropouts no matter what the rate is set at, so can't play music at all. I am using an optical network like Ted Brady. MicroRendu is showing a Gig connection.

 

Thanks

Colin

 

Thanks

 

That device does not currently support native DSD on Linux. First W4S has to update the unit's firmware and then we can start our work to support native DSD on it.

 

I recommend that you simplify things and retest. Here are some things to try:

1. Connect server and microRendu directly to your router.

2. Remove complex optical isolators and wireless bridges from the network.

3. Try Roon alone before you move on to Roon / HQ Player and NAA.

4. Don't scan a large library in Roon while testing. Even after Roon finds your library it will continue to work behinds the scenes for a long time (depends on the size of your library) getting information from the web.

5. Check your server build against the Roon and HQ Player minimum hardware requirement specifications..

Roon - minimum requirements

Signalyst - home page

[vortecjr]

Tried direct Ethernet from router to microRendu. Dropouts gone. Bizarre. Can stream DSD via DOP but only up to DSD128.

 

Colin

Is it the same optical isolator as Ted's? DSD128 seems to be the default DoP max with XMOS. It's possible to go higher, but the DAC would need to decoding in an FPGA.