Sonore microRendu

[asdf1000]

The original Nova used a UAC1 interface chip, so it will work just fine with the microRendu.

 

John S.

 

Hi John, does the same go for the Peachtree Audio 220SE? Amplifier with DAC - nova220SE Amplifier DAC with Tube | Peachtree Audio

 

And will the Peachtree's Asynchronous USB input support work with the microRendu?

 

Many thanks

[asdf1000]

Peachtree switched to a different USB chip quite a while ago. I have no idea what chip is in what product at this point.

 

John S.

 

If the Mac doesn't need any USB AUdio drivers installed for my Peachtree, is it safe to say that the microRendu (running Linux) should be safe too?

 

Or too risky?

 

Peachtree say I only need to install their audio drivers on Windows PC's, not Macs

[asdf1000]

Hi all, just a couple questions.

 

I was thinking of parting completely with my PC for music playback to my USB DAC. My Qnap 251+ isn't that powerful so I don't really want to buy a microRendu with Roon on the Qnap only to find that it stutters (Roon recommend i3, i5, i7 NAS's).

 

So with NAS > microRendu > USB DAC (Peachtree Nova 220SE) and controlled with an Android, what are my options?

 

In terms of the "output modes" and required Android apps, is Output Mode 3a (DLNA) my only option, using a DLNA controller Android app?

 

This then uses the microRendu for all rendering (I think) - is it a significant set back in this mode? Is it significantly better to have something like HQPlayer or Roon doing all the heavy lifting?

 

Thanks again

[asdf1000]

Thanks @vortecjr , @sockpit and @d_elm

 

I was just reading the many pages of this thread (127) and there were a few less preferences with DLNA compared with others.

 

My Qnap TS 251+ also has 8gb RAM already and 2 x 2TB Samsung EVO 850 SSD's

 

So in DLNA output mode, the microRendu does the decoding of ALAC and FLAC files. Is 24/192 still an issue in DLNA mode for ALAC files? I read some of the earlier posts in this thread where it was an issue - I'm still trying to get through the 127 pages of this thread to get the history ;-)

[asdf1000]

I used MPD/DLNA (3a) for my Sonicorbiter-based sources (first SOtM sMS-100, now microRendu for one system and Sonicorbiter SE for another), controlled by BubbleUPnP on various Android devices for quite a while, with a variety of FLAC material from 44.1/16 to 192/24. It works reasonably well, both in sound quality and in play control. Recently I got a separate Intel NUC server to run Roon Core and serve the RAAT to the microRendu and SOSE, mainly because Roon's library management and UI are better. I think I also detected a slight improvement in signal quality, or rather, my wife says she did on the speaker system connected to the SOSE. The headphone system with microRendu seemed to sound a tad more precise as well to me, but I could have been easily fooled by my own expectations. Anyway, the bottom line is that DLNA and BubbleUPnP are work pretty well and gave me many hours of musical enjoyment, even though I eventually went for the extra hardware and software costs of Roon.

 

Nice, thanks for the info mate. In DLNA output mode, did you have any 24/192 ALAC files and have any issues with playback?

As per my post just above your reply, I read that some of the early posts in this thread where it was an issue at the time. But things may have changed with firmware updates since then

 

The free trial for Roon is handy. I can test for any performance issues. I really want to part with the PC so it's handy having Roon on the Qnap. The NAS doing all the heavy work is ideal I guess, as long as the Qnap 251+ has enough power for Roon. As was said above though, d_elm tried it and didn't have any issues with DSD and 24/192 files, so that's extremely positive.

 

 

[asdf1000]

Regarding DLNA and 192 ALAC, if you run mimimServer on the QNAP and configure it with mimimWatch to use the mimimStreamer module you can configure mimimStreamer to convert FLAC or ALAC to WAV and move the decompression work from the renderer to the NAS.

 

Fantastic thanks d_elm. I'm guessing then that 24/192 ALAC is still an issue for the microRendu to decode in DLNA output mode?

[asdf1000]

I play 24/192 WAV via the mR, I wouldn't touch Apple with the 200' battle lance.

 

In terms of the modes: I have worked my way through the list, with the exception of Roon. In my system they sound subtly different, but all good.

 

I am currently switching between LMS and MPD/DLNA (Synology Media Server / Bubbleupnp via Kazoo). This is processed through a Mutec MC-3+ USB, excellent front end.

 

Depending on the age of your DAC and its USB implementation I would suggest looking at DDCs. In my system the Audio Breeze DU-U8 (Talema) was excellent, the Mutec better (at a cost).

 

You have probably read a lot about PSUs. I am currently using the IFI and have an Sbooster on order. I did buy a cheap 7.5V PSU, to reduce mR heat, don't bother - quickly binned.

 

M

 

Hi mate, thanks for the reply. My Peachtree 220se's DAC and Async USB work really with my 8 year old Windows laptop, so going to the microRendu should be a good improvement - not only in sound quality but in removing the hassle of turning on the PC at all.

 

LMS is running on your PC/Mac? I'm trying to completely part with a PC/Mac though.

 

Thanks for the info about the 7.5v PSU. Even though you're upgrading to an sbooster, have you been happy with the iFi 9v?

 

Cheers!

[asdf1000]

I'm using Synology DiskStation as my DLNA server and Kazoo as the controller and I have not issue streaming ALAC at 24/192.

 

Nice! I thought I had read of ALAC issues earlier but perhaps I'm confused about something different.

 

I need to find out if QNAP's Music Station app supports 24-bit music (both FLAC and ALAC) natively.

 

If any Qnap users are aware, could you please let me know. I may ask in the Qnap forum too.

 

Thanks again :-)

[asdf1000]

Using minimstreamer try using the libsoxr library with upsampling set at highest quality. Just awesome and it runs on a Qnap 251+ with 2gb memory.

 

Hi @Imitche, I've got minimserver working now on my Qnap 251+.

 

How do I installed minimstreamer though? The installation instructions aren't as clear as for minimserver.

 

Appreciate any help! :-)

[asdf1000]

Thanks @Imitche :-)

[asdf1000]

Using minimstreamer try using the libsoxr library with upsampling set at highest quality. Just awesome and it runs on a Qnap 251+ with 2gb memory.

 

So I've got ministreamer working now.

 

For the stream.transcode command i've set : flac:wav24;, alac:wav24;

 

I want to keep all FLAC and ALACs at both their existing bitrate and sample rates.

 

So 16/44 flacs and alacs to remain 16/44

 

And 24/192 flacs and alacs to remain 24/192

 

Will " flac:wav24;, alac:wav24; " do that? Where the semi-colon keeps the existing bitrate

 

Appreciate any help :-)

[asdf1000]

Minimstreamer transcode command strings are described here: User guide in the transcode section. Wav24 creates a 24 bit stream for the file type preceding the semi colon. So flac:wav24 will create a 24 bit stream from 16 bit Redbook files. You should experiment with these parameters. They can make a stunning difference in SQ.

 

Here is a good discussion on minimstreamer settings: http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/minimserver-users-transcode-flac-wav-24136/

 

Hi, yep I had a look at this earlier.

 

Would the following be ideal: flac:wav24;, alac:wav24;,aac:wav24;,mp4:wav24;,mp3:wav24;,*:wav24;,

 

I.e. convert all the inputs that minimserver is able to read, to 24-bit WAV, keeping their existing bitrate (the semi-colon)?

 

This would make the NAS do all the heavy lifting and the microRendu to just "do it's thing" ?

 

:-)

[asdf1000]

Yes, that's the idea. I don't think you need the commas. I moved on to Roon/HQplayer, so don't have a current implementation to check your settings against. Sorry.

Nice. So you think the Roon/HQplayer was a step up from the minimserver/DLNA mode?

 

I'm planning to compare these 2 options against a 3rd - JRMC running on the Qnap

 

Sent from my Blackberry DTEK50 using Tapatalk

[asdf1000]

I'm using kazoo to control music via DNLA output on microrendu. I have also been on a trial with Roon, using RoonReady output and doing comparisons to decide if I want to pay for Roons great interface. At first I thought Roon had a slight edge. But with more time to compare I think I've come to the opposite conclusion. It is very close call on my system. I have not tried HQplayer and don't want to go there yet. In short, the DNLA output is no "set back" in my experience, and the controllers (kazoo or lumin) are not only nice, but also free.

Thanks for this. Is your current DLNA configuration where the microRendu itself is doing all the file format decoding? or you are using a PC program to do that?

 

Thanks again

 

 

Sent from my Blackberry DTEK50 using Tapatalk

[asdf1000]

Yes, Roon/with HQplayer upsampling to DSD512 is a step up here.

Nice. Only problem for me is I want to part from a PC completely for playback and control. i.e. just turn on the amp, the Nas and control via phone app. But I will definitely try Roon on free trial with HQPlayer to hear what it's like, for sure.

 

Sent from my Blackberry DTEK50 using Tapatalk

[asdf1000]

Hi, you should leave out the ";". It's used only as separator if you want to transcode the samplerate:

flac:wav24, alac:wav24, aac:wav24, mp4:wav24, mp3:wav24, *:wav24;,

 

This is my Minimserver stream.transcode setting: aac:wav;96, alac:wav;96, mp4:wav;96, mp3:wav;96, flac:wav;96

I'm transcoding all to 96Hz because my dac doesn't like samplerate changes. I don't use wav24 because the ds112 NAS doesn't seem to be able to cope with that.

Hi, thanks for this . Doesn't the semi colon (without a number afterwards) mean the bitrate will not be changed?

 

Also , just for my understanding you are transcoding all music to 16-bit/96khz?

 

Thank you!

 

Sent from my Blackberry DTEK50 using Tapatalk

[asdf1000]

Having the microrendu decode audio files is really not an issue.

 

Having the microrendu decode audio files is really not an issue.

Hi, yep understood. Just observed that most don't have the unit doing the decoding - more tend to have the NAS or a PC - which makes sense since they have more powerful CPU's of course. I would do test to hear for myself but just wanted to understand people's reasons - guessing that everyone has tried to let the unit do the decoding. thanks again

 

Sent from my Blackberry DTEK50 using Tapatalk

[asdf1000]

People are doing everything from A to Z across all the output modes. The posts here are just a fraction of the feedback:)

Absolutely - agreed. Not everyone enjoying the microrendu is on forums

 

Is there a way in minimserver to have input=output, just convert into wav but keep both bit-depth and sample rate identical for input=output?

 

So no upsampling. Just to test out. I do note that a few people have commented positively on the improvement with upsampling

 

thanks again

 

 

Sent from my Blackberry DTEK50 using Tapatalk

[asdf1000]

minimserver already gives you what you want. By default, minimserver preserves the source bit-depth and sample rate when transcoding. See minimstreamer manual under "transcoding". For example, "flac:wav" will transcode flac 16/44.1 to wav 16/44.1, flac 24/96 to wav 24/96, and so on.

 

Hi Andre, thanks for that

 

But for an alac file, if I want a 24/192 alac to be transcoded to 24/192 wav and a 16/48 alac to be transcoded to a 16/48 wav , so with no upsampling, then alac:wav is all I need?

 

No need to use the upsampling alac:wav24; then?

[asdf1000]

I do not personnaly use alac files. However, under "alac" input transcoding, the manual says:

"Apple Lossless (ALAC) files. Valid for local files served by MinimServer (.mp4 and .m4a) only. The output type must be L16, L24, wav, wav24 or wav16. A stream converter program is required."

 

So the answer to your question should be "yes" and "alac:wav" should be all you need.

Stream converter program section of the manual explains how to set the converter program.

 

Hi, yep the stream converter ffmpeg was already there in minimserver/minimstream

 

I just tested a 24/192 alac and it works on my Denon receiver via DLNA playback from minimserver. The denon tells me the file format and sample rate of the stream

 

I wish I could go back in time and only have FLACS and not ALAC rips of my CDs

 

I guess I could manually convert directly from ALAC to FLAC using XLD on Mac - in theory both are lossless, so converting backwards and forwards again shouldn't change anything (in theory of course). In the meantime if minimserver does this conversion it's a life saver for me - looks to be working well

 

So with the microRendu I can test and compare the following for myself

 

1. microRendu doing all the work in DLNA mode

2. minimserver doing all the work in DLNA mode but input=output

3. minimserver doing all the work in DLNA mode but upscaling all files to 24-bit wav and native sampling rate

4. minimserver doing all the work in DLNA mode but upscaling all files to 24/192 wav (upsampling all music)

5. Roon mode trial, with Roon running directly off the Qnap 251+

 

Depending on my system (Peachtree 220se's DAC), option 1 might be all I actually need anyway

 

Thanks again for the help and guidance

[asdf1000]

I highly recommend using the minimstreamer streamer options to enable libsoxr if you are doing minimstreamer upsampling. The string used to accomplish this was on the older CA posts I referred to above. You also need a libsoxr version of ffmpeg. They exists for Windows and Linux. You can find both by googling around the official minimserver blog.

 

Libsoxr definitely takes sq to a new level and is worth the time spent to get it installed on the Qnap.

 

Thanks mate - I will add this to minimserver on the Qnap.

 

Has anyone installed Kazoo Server on the Qnap and controlled playback on the microrendu via the Kazoo app? They have an app for the Qnap: https://www.linn.co.uk/software

 

Cheers

[asdf1000]

For me, using minimserver with mrendu connected to a Simaudio Moon 780D, your option 1 represents the best choice. minimserver streams the original track data untouched, and mrendu takes care of the rest. I did experiment a lot with your other options, but quite honestly, I could never say for sure that they had any significant and easily reproducible impact on sound quality.

 

However, still to be honest, I learned from all the heated debates that surround those questions that the system in use, especially the type and quality of the DAC and the quality of its USB interface has very much to do with how you perceive the end results. What you get on one system with a given transcoding or upsampling setting may not apply equally to a different system.

 

Very true. I want to keep an open mind before I start testing all these options but I already think letting the microRendu do all the work will be what I settle for (not really an open mind is it? :-) )

 

But I understand the reasoning in letting a computer or NAS do the heavy lifting, so I will definitely try it.

 

How exactly are you controlling your music playback on microrendu in DLNA output mode? Did you need to install Bubbleupnp server on your PC/NAS to be able to control via an ios/Android device?

[asdf1000]

I use BubbleUPnP on android as the control point. I sometimes use Lumin/Kinsky on IOS, but do not find them as complete and useable as Bubble. I used to run BubbleUPnP Server on an external PC (the same running minimserver), but do not use it much anymore.

 

Thanks André. So like me, your music is also on a NAS? In order to control playback on the microRendu from BubbleUPnP on Android, do you need to install BubbleUPnP Server on the NAS also?

 

Thanks again

[asdf1000]

I'm using Synology DiskStation as my DLNA server and Kazoo as the controller and I have no issue streaming ALAC at 24/192.

 

I still am not clear if the microRendu itself is having any issues decoding 24/192 ALAC natively?

 

Not that it's a problem , since I can use minimserver on the Qnap to do this decoding , but just out of interest, is it decoding 24/192 alac files without issues?

 

Thanks again

[asdf1000]

My music is on an external drive controlled from a dedicated Win10 computer where minimserver runs. This setup behaves essentially like a NAS.

 

If you use BubbleUPnP on android as a control point to control the mrendu configured in MPD/DLNA mode, you basically do *not* need to run BubbleUPnP server at all.

 

BubbleUPnP server is needed essentially to supplement the mrendu DLNA renderer with OpenHome functionnalities needed when you use control points like Lumin and Linn Kazoo, which assume they will control renderers supporting OpenHome protocol, and will not work well without that.

The reason you do not need to run BubbleUPnP server when using BubbleUPnP on android is that this control point can work with both types of renderers, openhome or non-openhome renderers.

 

Nice one - this explains everything. Only one thing left to do - test it all and listen :-)

 

I've used BubbleUPnP before so I still have the full license for it under my Android purchases. I found it straight forward to use so will try it again.