PlugPlayer or minimserver question

[bluemark81]

First some background before my questions: I have minimserver installed on a QNAP NAS. The NAS is connected to a gigabit switch. Also connected to the switch is my router (Apple Time Machine) and my exaSound PlayPoint. I'm using PlugPlayer as my controller on an ipad. When I select the gear in the PlugPlayer menu, it shows my exaSound and a couple of other renders. Under media servers, it shows my ipad, my nas shows twice, but one is "greyed out" and minimserver appears. My music is installed on QNAP's music station. My questions are as follows:

 

1. Under media servers, why would my NAS appear twice and why would one be greyed out?

2. What does minimserver do for me? When I select my NAS or minimserver, I can access the exact same music that is installed in Music Station so I don't quite understand what minimserver is doing for me.

3. Is there anyway of keeping the render and media server I select as my defaults rather than selecting them each time I open the app?

4. I've noticed the time bar at the top often bounces all over the place as it moves across. It will go back to the beginning and then back to the spot it should be within the song. It does not impact the music being played, but a bit annoying while watching it.

5. Is there a better control app than PlugPlayer? I've tried a few, but I don't find any of the ones I've tried too good.

 

Thanks

[tboooe]

I also have a QNAP NAS with Minimserver running on it. Music Station and Minimserver are music servers. You are right in that their basic operation is the same. However, if you look more into Minimserver it has more options that you may or may not find useful. Most important for me are the transcoding options and ability to customize how my music is displayed in the control point software.

 

In terms of control point, I use BubbleUPnP but I do not think that is available for apple. Ive also tried Kazoo which is not bad.

[bluemark81]

I also have a QNAP NAS with Minimserver running on it. Music Station and Minimserver are music servers. You are right in that their basic operation is the same. However, if you look more into Minimserver it has more options that you may or may not find useful. Most important for me are the transcoding options and ability to customize how my music is displayed in the control point software.

 

In terms of control point, I use BubbleUPnP but I do not think that is available for apple. Ive also tried Kazoo which is not bad.

 

 

Can I do things within minimserver? I just downloaded the app, but is there more "features" and how do I access them?

 

Also, minimserver only is seeing the music I loaded onto music station, whereas when I select my NAS server, it sees the music station music as well as music I loaded onto the multimedia folder. I don't understand why this is happening.

 

Also, the music I loaded onto the multimedia folder is my itunes library. None of the cover art is coming through even though I activated the itunes server in my QNAP. The odd thing is all the album art shows up in itunes on my devices, but not in the control app's, such as PlugPlayer, Kinsky, etc.

[master]

Hi,

 

Start with MinimServer user guide and User guide.

 

You can disable both renderer and library in the BubbleUPNP app, pretty certain those features or some of them will be available in PlugPlayer. This way you can set/select a default renderer and library.

 

Now the long and short of it, MinimServer is a DLNA server software, and pretty much every NAS from every major manufacturer will have their own DLNA server. You can use either with similar results, though if you need additional features like transcoding on the fly MinimServer is definitely handy. Obviously, the NAS should support transcoding, and also have a powerful processor if you are into DSD, etc.

 

You can also install MinimServer on a PC or a Raspberry Pi, and then use the NAS (or any external HDD) as a backend solution for only storing the content. I run a DLNA server on both my NAS as well as the Raspberry Pi, but use the Pi exclusively for music playback (just makes for a better music player IMHO), and I use the NAS DLNA server for streaming videos with Kodi as the front end.

[Cebolla]

First some background before my questions: I have minimserver installed on a QNAP NAS. The NAS is connected to a gigabit switch. Also connected to the switch is my router (Apple Time Machine) and my exaSound PlayPoint. I'm using PlugPlayer as my controller on an ipad. When I select the gear in the PlugPlayer menu, it shows my exaSound and a couple of other renders. Under media servers, it shows my ipad, my nas shows twice, but one is "greyed out" and minimserver appears. My music is installed on QNAP's music station. My questions are as follows:

 

1. Under media servers, why would my NAS appear twice and why would one be greyed out?

2. What does minimserver do for me? When I select my NAS or minimserver, I can access the exact same music that is installed in Music Station so I don't quite understand what minimserver is doing for me.

3. Is there anyway of keeping the render and media server I select as my defaults rather than selecting them each time I open the app?

4. I've noticed the time bar at the top often bounces all over the place as it moves across. It will go back to the beginning and then back to the spot it should be within the song. It does not impact the music being played, but a bit annoying while watching it.

5. Is there a better control app than PlugPlayer? I've tried a few, but I don't find any of the ones I've tried too good.

Hi Bluemark81

 

My only experience of the PlugPlayer app was a fair while ago. I found it to be quite problematic at the time and soon went in search of more decent controllers. So I may only be of limited help here, as far a PlugPlayer is concerned, I'm afraid:

 

1. It's as @tboooe has mentioned, the media server with your NAS's name is actually the QNAP Music Station provided one and MinimServer is another one running on the same QNAP NAS, but from a third party provider. From what I remember about greyed out devices on PlugPlayer, it's used to indicate them being inactive (so may be an older device no longer on the network) and you shouldn't be able to select it. It's possible that the greyed out duplicate is an old configuration of the current QNAP Music Station media server. Did you update its software on the QNAP or may be even change the QNAP's IP on your network, since getting PlugPlayer, for example?

 

2. MinimServer is one of the better UPnP media servers out there for music files and certainly agree with the other posters comments about its benefits. Support by its developer Simon Nash, aka simoncn, on the MinimServer forums is excellent, BTW.

 

3. I'm almost certain the version of PlugPlayer I tried remembered both the last selected renderer and media server when you next opened the app after closing, so I don't know why your version doesn't. That is, unless the app happened to last die of its own accord, after yet another one of its crashes!

 

4. I don't recall having seen the time bar problem, so I don't know if it can be corrected or whether it's just a bug in your version of PP. Incidentally, you could always try searching and/or posting about this and the other problems on the PlugPlayer for iOS forum:

PlugPlayer • View forum - PlugPlayer for iOS

 

5. Yes, but unfortunately there aren't really any good ones for the iPad that'll be able to control a standard UPnP/DLNA renderer, like the exaSound. The best ones I know of for the iPad, Kazoo and Lumin are OpenHome (an extension of standard UPnP) only, so won't normally work with standard UPnP renderers. You could try the Audionet Music Manager app, as that is standard UPnP and also supports gapless playback when the renderer also supports it (lack of gapless is my main bugbear with poor controllers).

 

Alternatively, you could try installing the BubbleUPnP Server helper application on the QNAP. One of the UPnP helper functions you can set up on it is to provide an emulated OpenHome renderer for any real standard UPnP renderer on the network, thus allowing you to use an OpenHome controller with a standard UPnP renderer, see:

BubbleUPnP Server

and further down the webpage for installation instructions on QNAP NASs:

BubbleUPnP Server

 

 

Also, minimserver only is seeing the music I loaded onto music station, whereas when I select my NAS server, it sees the music station music as well as music I loaded onto the multimedia folder. I don't understand why this is happening.

MinimServer doesn't automatically search all the storage drive's folders for music files and I'm assuming the QNAP Music Station media server does. You need to initially manually setup MinimServer with root paths to all the drive's folders that contain the audio files that you want it to use, in its contentDir Property. So it's likely that MinimServer's contentDir Property is currently set with just the folder that Music Station uses and you are going to need to add the multimedia folder used by iTunes. You are also going to need to install MinimServer's remote configuration & management software, MinimWatch, on a computer on the same network if you haven't already done so, as you cannot change a NAS installed MinimServer's properties on the NAS itself.

 

 

Also, the music I loaded onto the multimedia folder is my itunes library. None of the cover art is coming through even though I activated the itunes server in my QNAP. The odd thing is all the album art shows up in itunes on my devices, but not in the control app's, such as PlugPlayer, Kinsky, etc.

I believe iTunes needs to store its library's cover art in the music files themselves, in order for external media servers to be able to see it. Unfortunately, I'm not that familiar with iTunes to instruct you how.

[bluemark81]

Hi Bluemark81

 

My only experience of the PlugPlayer app was a fair while ago. I found it to be quite problematic at the time and soon went in search of more decent controllers. So I may only be of limited help here, as far a PlugPlayer is concerned, I'm afraid:

 

1. It's as @tboooe has mentioned, the media server with your NAS's name is actually the QNAP Music Station provided one and MinimServer is another one running on the same QNAP NAS, but from a third party provider. From what I remember about greyed out devices on PlugPlayer, it's used to indicate them being inactive (so may be an older device no longer on the network) and you shouldn't be able to select it. It's possible that the greyed out duplicate is an old configuration of the current QNAP Music Station media server. Did you update its software on the QNAP or may be even change the QNAP's IP on your network, since getting PlugPlayer, for example?

 

No, but I did change the ethernet switch it was connected to. In any case, any idea how to remove it?

 

2. MinimServer is one of the better UPnP media servers out there for music files and certainly agree with the other posters comments about its benefits. Support by its developer Simon Nash, aka simoncn, on the MinimServer forums is excellent, BTW.

 

I've copied my iTunes library into my multimedia folder on my NAS, but when I select minimserver, it only sees the music I've copied into my QNAP's music station, but does not see the iTunes music copied into the multimedia folder. When I select the NAS as my server, it sees both, but will not play the itunes files (I get screeching) and album covers don't appear for the iTunes music.

 

3. I'm almost certain the version of PlugPlayer I tried remembered both the last selected renderer and media server when you next opened the app after closing, so I don't know why your version doesn't. That is, unless the app happened to last die of its own accord, after yet another one of its crashes!

 

Don't know, but I'm not a fan of PlugPlayer so far.

 

4. I don't recall having seen the time bar problem, so I don't know if it can be corrected or whether it's just a bug in your version of PP. Incidentally, you could always try searching and/or posting about this and the other problems on the PlugPlayer for iOS forum:

PlugPlayer • View forum - PlugPlayer for iOS

Thanks

 

5. Yes, but unfortunately there aren't really any good ones for the iPad that'll be able to control a standard UPnP/DLNA renderer, like the exaSound. The best ones I know of for the iPad, Kazoo and Lumin are OpenHome (an extension of standard UPnP) only, so won't normally work with standard UPnP renderers. You could try the Audionet Music Manager app, as that is standard UPnP and also supports gapless playback when the renderer also supports it (lack of gapless is my main bugbear with poor controllers).

 

Thanks

 

Alternatively, you could try installing the BubbleUPnP Server helper application on the QNAP. One of the UPnP helper functions you can set up on it is to provide an emulated OpenHome renderer for any real standard UPnP renderer on the network, thus allowing you to use an OpenHome controller with a standard UPnP renderer, see:

BubbleUPnP Server

and further down the webpage for installation instructions on QNAP NASs:

BubbleUPnP Server

 

I tried installing BubbleUPnP on mine and it fails to install.

 

MinimServer doesn't automatically search all the storage drive's folders for music files and I'm assuming the QNAP Music Station media server does. You need to initially manually setup MinimServer with root paths to all the drive's folders that contain the audio files that you want it to use, in its contentDir Property. So it's likely that MinimServer's contentDir Property is currently set with just the folder that Music Station uses and you are going to need to add the multimedia folder used by iTunes. You are also going to need to install MinimServer's remote configuration & management software, MinimWatch, on a computer on the same network if you haven't already done so, as you cannot change a NAS installed MinimServer's properties on the NAS itself.

 

Ah, ok, I will check that out.

 

I believe iTunes needs to store its library's cover art in the music files themselves, in order for external media servers to be able to see it. Unfortunately, I'm not that familiar with iTunes to instruct you how.

 

Yeah, one of my biggest regrets is starting with iTunes a few years ago, but with such a vast library now, I don't really want to start over other than for new rips and downloads going forward.

 

Thanks a lot for the info.

[bluemark81]

 

MinimServer doesn't automatically search all the storage drive's folders for music files and I'm assuming the QNAP Music Station media server does. You need to initially manually setup MinimServer with root paths to all the drive's folders that contain the audio files that you want it to use, in its contentDir Property. So it's likely that MinimServer's contentDir Property is currently set with just the folder that Music Station uses and you are going to need to add the multimedia folder used by iTunes. You are also going to need to install MinimServer's remote configuration & management software, MinimWatch, on a computer on the same network if you haven't already done so, as you cannot change a NAS installed MinimServer's properties on the NAS itself.

 

 

I installed minimWatch and the contentDir is pointing to the multimedia directory in my NAS where my itunes library is installed.

[tranz]

Bubbleupnpserver is available for Mac.

 

It took a bit of work, but a while back I had posted this on 1/5/15 for setting it up:

 

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f22-networking-networked-audio-and-streaming/truly-gapless-digital-living-network-alliance-controllers-22398/index2.html

 

Hope that helps.

[Bryan]

There is a relative new app called 'Arcam Musiclife' which some have reported preferring over other UPNP offerings with their Apple devices.

[Cebolla]

Last I heard the Arcam MusicLife controller app didn't support gapless playback:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f22-networking-networked-audio-and-streaming/auralic-aries-mini-25054/#post442847

 

Do you know if this is still the case?

[bluemark81]

Lumin seems to be the best one for me so far.

[Cebolla]

Did you manage to get the BubbleUPnP Server helper application (to enable you to use the Lumin app with the exaSound PlayPoint renderer) installed on your QNAP NAS in the end? Or, did you have to resort to installing the BubbleUPnP Server on your Mac, as suggested by Tranz?

[bluemark81]

Did you manage to get the BubbleUPnP Server helper application (to enable you to use the Lumin app with the exaSound PlayPoint renderer) installed on your QNAP NAS in the end? Or, did you have to resort to installing the BubbleUPnP Server on your Mac, as suggested by Tranz?

 

 

No, I could not install BubbleUPnP. I have minimserver installed on my QNAP and I simply downloaded the Lumin app on my ipad and it sees my minimserver and my exasound. Out of all the controllers I tried, I like it the best and none of the glitches I've experience in PlugPlayer and a couple of the others.

[Cebolla]

Ah that's a shame, as it'll unfortunately mean you won't be able to use any OpenHome controller app (such as the Lumin) with the exaSound, without your Mac switched on and the BubbleUPnP Server running on it.

 

BTW, just seen your 'Trying to install BubbleUPnP on a QNAP' thread - good idea!

[tranz]

Perhaps I am missing something, but when Lumin sees your renderer that means it is OpenHome compatible and there is no need for Bubble. Lumin only works with OHMedia.

[Cebolla]

I sort of assumed that Bluemark81 meant that not being able to install BubbleUPnP applied only to the QNAP. I'd already checked, prior to my first post in this thread, finding out that the exaSound PlayPoint is a standard UPnP renderer only, so not OpenHome. My thinking was that Bluemark81 forgot to confirm that the BubbleUPnP Server is actually running elsewhere, so on the Mac.

 

Got (implicit) info of the exaSound PP only being a standard UPnP renderer from Ted's review, eg, section 'Mode 3 (PP as an OpenHome renderer)':

Computer Audiophile - The exaSound Playpoint Stereo/Multichannel Streamer Review

The irony being that any standard UPnP renderer, not just the PP, can operate in 'Mode 3'!

 

Also, the 'OpenHome Player' section on page 8 of the Owner's manual makes it a bit clearer:

http://www.exasound.com/Portals/0/productdocs/exaSound-PlayPoint-Owners-Manual.pdf

[bluemark81]

You guys have me confused. BubbleUPnP would not install on my QNAP. I don't have it installed anywhere else. I have minimserver installed on my QNAP and Lumin on my iPad as a controller. Within Lumin, I selected minimserver as as my server and my exaSound PlayPoint as my renderer. Everything is working great.

[tranz]

In that case you do not need Bubble. It does OHMedia emulation so that, if your renderer is not capable, you can make it seem like an OHMedia renderer.

 

Because Lumin sees it, either your Renderer is OHMedia capable, or Bubble is already up and running, which would seem unlikely.

 

In either case you do not have to do anything as you are up and running.

[Cebolla]

My apologies to Bluemark81 for any confusion. Guess I shouldn't rely so much on reviews or even the device's own user manual and pay more attention to a user's actual first hand experiences!

 

You are right of course, Tranz. The PlayPoint must already support OpenHome, given that it can be seen by the Lumin OpenHome controller app and the OP isn't using BubbleUPnP Server at all.

[bluemark81]

My apologies to Bluemark81 for any confusion. Guess I shouldn't rely so much on reviews or even the device's own user manual and pay more attention to a user's actual first hand experiences!

 

You are right of course, Tranz. The PlayPoint must already support OpenHome, given that it can be seen by the Lumin OpenHome controller app and the OP isn't using BubbleUPnP Server at all.

 

.

No worries, still in the learning mode here