Design a PC/Server for ROON and HQ Player

[miguelito]

On 9/14/2015 at 11:45 PM, sgr said:

Hi,

I hope Software is the correct place for this question as I want to build a PC to run the combo of HQ Player and ROON. Software drives the hardware, right?

I want to upgrade my Server so it can easily handle the upcoming ROON/HQ Player combination. I have an Audio PC (i7, lpsu, fanless, etc) which connects my Big7 DAC via jPlay. I believe I'm in great shape there.

 

Right now I'm using an AMD Athalon PC as my control PC in jPlay streamer mode. I once used it just as a server with my music files, but when jPlay streamer became available I had to try it. Better sound. Then I decided to try jplay dual PC mode and use it as my control PC as well. Again much better sound then before.

 

Software Used on both Audio and Control PC: jRiver, Windows Server 2012 v2, jPlay, AudiophileOptimizer, Fidelizer 6, dbpoweramp, etc.

 

Future Software: Windows 10?, ROON, HQ Player

 

Its time to update the Server/Control PC.

In place now: Seasonic Fanless power supply, Corsair ATX Tower,

 

CPU: Xeon or i7? Which one? Which model? Needs to be less than 95 watts.

MOBO?

RAM: 16Gb What brand and type? Is ECC needed?

SSD: Samsung 850 Pro?

 

Or maybe I'd be better off buying a CAPS Pipeline to use as a control PC? Thus keeping the server separate from the audio and control PC?

 

Thanks for your informed suggestions.

Get an ass ugly noisy server with a cuda card. Put that in a different room. Get a microrendu to stream to. Peace a cako. 

[bibo01]

On 3/22/2017 at 11:05 AM, Miska said:

First short report on my new AMD Ryzen server.

 

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 1700X

Motherboard: ASUS PRIME X370-PRO

RAM: Kingston HyperX FURY DDR4-2666

OS: Ubuntu Server 16.04 LTS

 

With HQPlayer Embedded, upsampling from RedBook to DSD512 (22.5792M) using poly-sinc-short-mp and ASDM7 takes 16% of CPU time total. No CUDA offload.

 

Pretty nice figures for the price.

How does it compare to your other Intel based server?

[Miska]

15 hours ago, bibo01 said:

How does it compare to your other Intel based server?

 

Which one?

 

It is hard to compare as different servers run different OS and such.  But it depends a bit on what is the exact HQPlayer configuration. World is not black and white, so different things have different strengths and weaknesses. At least I can say it is some serious competition. It is like you'd put 8-cores into current 4-core Intel package. So memory bus is still dual channel. So think it as blend of something like 8-core Broadwell-E put into Kaby Lake socket.

 

[ismewor]

@Miska, by any chance will you working on intel platform support for 6-8 cores as well. Thx

[Miska]

6 hours ago, ismewor said:

@Miska, by any chance will you working on intel platform support for 6-8 cores as well. Thx

 

3.16.0 and newer already have this support and 3.16.1 will have even more advanced automatic tuning for CPUs with 8+ cores (or multi-socket Xeon).

 

[ismewor]

Thx Miska, so 3.16.1 should be able to help out on initial module plug-in for up-sampling? Mostly issue is initial plugin spike of CPU usage.

[Miska]

55 minutes ago, ismewor said:

Thx Miska, so 3.16.1 should be able to help out on initial module plug-in for up-sampling? Mostly issue is initial plugin spike of CPU usage.

 

Sorry but I'm not sure what you mean? The initialization stage before playback begins has been utilizing all available CPU cores already for quite a white...

 

[ismewor]

Miska, you just nail it. I'm actually looking for that answer. Thx

 

also, for pcm to dsd512 does more core help? Or need to have min clockbus in each core?

[Miska]

A note regarding Ryzen 7 (1700X and 1800X) - it generates a lot of heat, as subjective perception more than Intel cores, although it has similar TDP values.

 

I was able to reach DSD256 with poly-sinc-xtr and DSD512 with poly-sinc. But after a short while the poly-sinc-xtr@DSD256 run into thermal throttling with all fans at maximum speed.

 

So if you use or plan to use Ryzen, be prepared to put pretty hefty heatsink for it...

[eltee00]

I have no clues with computer builds at all. Will this be sufficient for DSD512 upsampling?

 

Windows 10 Pro (64bit) English

Intel® Core™ i7-6700 Processor (Quad Core, 8MB, 8T, 3.4GHz, 65W)

8GB (2x4G) 2133MHz DDR4 Memory

250GB 2.5inch Serial ATA (7,200 Rpm) Hard Drive

Intel® Integrated Graphics

 

[eltee00]

Sorry the specs should be 

 

Windows 10 Pro (64bit) English

Intel® Core™ i7-6700 Processor (Quad Core, 8MB, 8T, 3.4GHz, 65W)

8GB (2x4G) 2133MHz DDR4 Memory

250GB 2.5inch Serial ATA (7,200 Rpm) Hard Drive

GeForce GT720 with 1GB ram

[zoltan]

Just started collecting part for a Roon/HQplayer server. So far I bought Gigabyte Z270n motherboard and 16GB Kingston HyperX Savage CL12 2400Mhz RAM memory. These will go into a new Streacom DB4 house (nobody seems to have used it here so far). With the standard heat pipes it can only take an i7-7700 but with extra pipes, it can accommodate an i7-7700K. I plan to use the server for upgrading max. to DSD252 from all sources. Two channels only and no CUDA offload planned. The difference between the two processors and the extra heat pipes would come to about 100 euros/dollars. Is it worth it? 

[ismewor]

Sure the $100 is worth the money for the 2 CPU different. 

However, the only issue I drop this case is you have to use it own power supply it create lot of noise. But YMMV may be case by case. 

[ismewor]

On 4/15/2017 at 4:30 PM, eltee00 said:

Sorry the specs should be 

 

Windows 10 Pro (64bit) English

Intel® Core™ i7-6700 Processor (Quad Core, 8MB, 8T, 3.4GHz, 65W)

8GB (2x4G) 2133MHz DDR4 Memory

250GB 2.5inch Serial ATA (7,200 Rpm) Hard Drive

GeForce GT720 with 1GB ram

Base on this you might want to consider 

ssd for hard drive if you looking for fanless.

also if you need cuda offload. GT1080 should help.

 

 

[zoltan]

1 hour ago, ismewor said:

However, the only issue I drop this case is you have to use it own power supply it create lot of noise. But YMMV may be case by case. 

2

I will be using an NAA device, so apparently power supply noise is not an issue in that set-up. 

[Bullwinkle]

On 3/4/2017 at 1:47 PM, Miska said:

Today I made upgrade for my fanless HQPlayer Embedded machine, motherboard was changed to ASUS PRIME Z270M-PLUS and CPU to i5-7600T. This was installed in already existing Streacom Alpha 10 chassis.

 

Storage is Intel 600p series M.2 SSD and RAM is Kingston HyperX Fury DDR4-2133.

 

Only three heatpipes would fit with this motherboard, but since the CPU is only 35W TDP, it seems to be enough (because the chassis is rated for 65W TDP).

 

I can report that with this setup, it can achieve DSD512 with -2s filter variants at least when using auto rate family. CPU temperature averaging between 42 and 46 C and total load around 50%. But overall, it is intended to work to just DSD256, so it has some reserve left for convolution and such.

 

 

Hello @Miska, I am currently building my first server and (loosely) based some of my hardware decisions on this particular build of yours. Currently I'm running my prototype from a 360 watt lpsu and am wondering how much power I will really need. So I was curious whether you happened to have metered the box's total power consumption while you were achieving DSD512? ...Thanks for your time and attention!

[blue2]

On ‎30‎/‎04‎/‎2017 at 4:31 PM, Bullwinkle said:

 

Hello @Miska, I am currently building my first server and (loosely) based some of my hardware decisions on this particular build of yours. Currently I'm running my prototype from a 360 watt lpsu and am wondering how much power I will really need. So I was curious whether you happened to have metered the box's total power consumption while you were achieving DSD512? ...Thanks for your time and attention!

Have you tried this calculator?

[Bullwinkle]

1 hour ago, blue2 said:

Have you tried this calculator?

Yes... I think these calculators give quite high estimates. After asking this question I decided to put a meter on the (in progress) system and reported the results here:

 

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/31667-power-consumption-test-for-a-first-draft-server-build/

 

[szczemirek]

Could you explain me for what (of quality sound) reason you build so powerful PC?
I'm running Roon successfully on modified Thin Client HP t610 with Linux Server and I'm  happy with money in my pocket

[Bullwinkle]

szczemirek, folks on this thread want to be able to use HQ Player and upsampling to DSD512, which requires some muscle. For Roon alone you are right, no need for the muscle.

[ted_b]

9 minutes ago, szczemirek said:

Could you explain me for what (of quality sound) reason you build so powerful PC?
I'm running Roon successfully on modified Thin Client HP t610 with Linux Server and I'm  happy with money in my pocket

If you use Roon in conjunction with HQPlayer (the subject of this thread) then you subscribe to using the best upsampling engine out there..HQPlayer.  Well, upsampling to bit rates like DSD512 requires a lot of cpu (and even GPU at times) so we built powerful servers to do this.  The good news is that the server doesn't necessarily have to be audibly quiet (although mine is and has seven fans, counting cpu and video card fans) just electrically isolated and powerful.  So sit it in another room, in fact.  How?  HQPlayer has something called a Network Audio Adapter (NAA) that sits next to your music rack and connects to HQPlayer server via ethernet.  This is where the dac connects, so this small innocuous machine can be minimalist in design as all it houses is the NAA software and a dac driver (and USB out).  The heavy liting is done by the server box sitting elsewhere in your home.

Ted

P.S.  There are other ways to keep the server away from your music, but NAA is the one you'll see referred to most often.  Adnaco and others are options.

[miguelito]

4 minutes ago, ted_b said:

so this small innocuous machine can be minimalist in design as all it houses is the NAA software and a dac driver (and USB out).

That's called a microRendu!

[ted_b]

16 minutes ago, miguelito said:

That's called a microRendu!

Yep!  Or my other NAA is a simple Windows Caps Carbon with JCAT card.  Both do great jobs.

[tboooe]

On 9/15/2015 at 1:21 AM, Miska said:

 

I have not decided yet for a new machine. Old machine's case is something from Antec's line.

 

For new MoBo I was planning to use ASUS Sabertooth Z170 Mark 1.

 

For PSU I was thinking the fanless Seasonic too.

 

On 9/22/2015 at 3:44 AM, Urs said:

 

Yes, ASUS Sabertooth Z170 Mark 1, is well worth a thought. The only thing, which I find disturbing are the two little MB fans, as part of the sabertooth cooling concept. I assume, one can leave these disconnected... but then one has probably less heat to fight with another MB.

 

Hi guys, just curious if you have found out more about whether or not the cooling fans on this motherboard can be left off?  I want to upgrade my fanless server to an i7-7700 (I currently have an i7-3770s) and need to find the best motherboard possible.  @Miska has pointed out that this board has some high quality components.  

 

Are there any other motherboards I should consider that has comparable high quality components?

[lmitche]

You will likely want a z270 motherboard with an i7-7700 to enable the full set of capabilities like optane memory support.