Qhwoeprktiyns Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 1 hour ago, Ben75 said: It would be very great to delete cables from the chain (and the related losses) and to avoid any « potential improvements » from power amplifiers as it can be always « improvable » In two years time, you will probably ask yourself exactly the same questions. If you wait to own "the best there is" (assuming you could even determine what is the best at any time) you'll probably end up listening to your cureent system for a very long time... Also, I am certainly not claiming that the current PowerDAC is the best DAC out there, or that it could not be improved (setting aside amplification aspects). Link to comment
Popular Post Vincent des Champs Posted April 30, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted April 30, 2021 ECDesigns is aiming end of May for having their website updated and ready to deliver the first batch of PowerDACs. As already said, price point will be approx. 1100-1200 eur. 💪🏻 tapatrick and Qhwoeprktiyns 2 [SOURCE] Ideon Absolute Stream -> Ideon Absolute Time -> [DAC] APL Hifi DSD-MR SE -> [AMP] Dan d’Agostino Progression INT -> [LS] EgglestoneWorks Savoy SE (supported by Stealth Audio cabling, Ansuz network, Stromtank power) Link to comment
Qhwoeprktiyns Posted May 2, 2021 Share Posted May 2, 2021 I have had the opportunity to get a few more people to listen to the PowerDAC in a few systems. It does not leave listeners indifferent, in fact it leaves most wanting to hear more. As for me, my impressions have not changed in the past few weeks. I have not once had the urge to plug back in the previous DAC, even if just to compare, or to use the UPL as a source. It has been working flawlessly. I am really looking forward to comparing notes with some of you, hopefully in a few weeks time. tapatrick 1 Link to comment
tims Posted May 3, 2021 Share Posted May 3, 2021 In my case, if I was to buy the PowerDAC-R, I would like to connect it to my active speakers (which has it's own volume control) and also use it to drive my headphones. Ideally, both would be permanently connected to the PowerDAC-R so I would avoid the hassle of changing the RCA connections each time I wanted to swap to the headphones or vice versa. To do this, the only solution I can only think of is to install a RCA switcher like this one: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MLQ6YH4?tag=offthebroiler-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1&keywords=Toslink Switch I'm thinking the RCA switcher would disconnect the headphones when feeding my speakers avoiding any problems with both connected at the same time. I would want to use the PowerDAC-R's volume control for my headphones but bypass the volume control to feed my active speakers but John Brown confirmed that enabling the link (at the rear) of the PowerDAC-R just sets the volume to its maximum rather than bypassing the volume control completely so I would have the volume set to it's maximum when connected to the speakers. Other than having the switcher and extra RCA cables in the circuit (that may degrade the SQ), anyone think there would be any drawbacks in setting it up this way or have any ideas how I could have my speakers and headphones connected permanently? Cheers Link to comment
Qhwoeprktiyns Posted May 3, 2021 Share Posted May 3, 2021 7 hours ago, tims said: In my case, if I was to buy the PowerDAC-R, I would like to connect it to my active speakers (which has it's own volume control) and also use it to drive my headphones. Ideally, both would be permanently connected to the PowerDAC-R so I would avoid the hassle of changing the RCA connections each time I wanted to swap to the headphones or vice versa. To do this, the only solution I can only think of is to install a RCA switcher like this one: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MLQ6YH4?tag=offthebroiler-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1&keywords=Toslink Switch I'm thinking the RCA switcher would disconnect the headphones when feeding my speakers avoiding any problems with both connected at the same time. I would want to use the PowerDAC-R's volume control for my headphones but bypass the volume control to feed my active speakers but John Brown confirmed that enabling the link (at the rear) of the PowerDAC-R just sets the volume to its maximum rather than bypassing the volume control completely so I would have the volume set to it's maximum when connected to the speakers. Other than having the switcher and extra RCA cables in the circuit (that may degrade the SQ), anyone think there would be any drawbacks in setting it up this way or have any ideas how I could have my speakers and headphones connected permanently? Cheers The link you included refers to ta Toslink switch, not an RCA switch. An RCA switch may definitely have an impact on sound quality, but how significant, I don't know. Perhaps you could write to ECD and asked them for recommendations. I don't see any other alternatives to switch between two outputs. I have a similar switch - this one: http://www.homehifi.co.uk/S/tc-7240.htm. It works fine, but I rarely used it, and when I have I did not pay close attention to SQ. Link to comment
mevdinc Posted May 3, 2021 Share Posted May 3, 2021 12 hours ago, hopkins said: ... I am really looking forward to comparing notes with some of you, hopefully in a few weeks time. We are all waiting in anticipation. :) mevdinc.com (My autobiography) Recently sold my ATC EL 150 Actives! Link to comment
Superdad Posted May 3, 2021 Share Posted May 3, 2021 16 hours ago, hopkins said: I am really looking forward to comparing notes with some of you, hopefully in a few weeks time. Is EC Designs now accepting pre-orders? Or are we really still a few months out? UpTone Audio LLC Link to comment
Qhwoeprktiyns Posted May 3, 2021 Share Posted May 3, 2021 8 minutes ago, Superdad said: Is EC Designs now accepting pre-orders? Or are we really still a few months out? Someone mentioned it would be sold by the end of this month. I don't think they do pre-orders. Link to comment
Vincent des Champs Posted May 3, 2021 Share Posted May 3, 2021 1 hour ago, hopkins said: Someone mentioned it would be sold by the end of this month. I don't think they do pre-orders. No pre-orders confirmed. [SOURCE] Ideon Absolute Stream -> Ideon Absolute Time -> [DAC] APL Hifi DSD-MR SE -> [AMP] Dan d’Agostino Progression INT -> [LS] EgglestoneWorks Savoy SE (supported by Stealth Audio cabling, Ansuz network, Stromtank power) Link to comment
Popular Post realDHT Posted May 3, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted May 3, 2021 21 hours ago, tims said: In my case, if I was to buy the PowerDAC-R, I would like to connect it to my active speakers (which has it's own volume control) and also use it to drive my headphones. Ideally, both would be permanently connected to the PowerDAC-R so I would avoid the hassle of changing the RCA connections each time I wanted to swap to the headphones or vice versa. To do this, the only solution I can only think of is to install a RCA switcher like this one: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07MLQ6YH4?tag=offthebroiler-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1&keywords=Toslink Switch I'm thinking the RCA switcher would disconnect the headphones when feeding my speakers avoiding any problems with both connected at the same time. I would want to use the PowerDAC-R's volume control for my headphones but bypass the volume control to feed my active speakers but John Brown confirmed that enabling the link (at the rear) of the PowerDAC-R just sets the volume to its maximum rather than bypassing the volume control completely so I would have the volume set to it's maximum when connected to the speakers. Other than having the switcher and extra RCA cables in the circuit (that may degrade the SQ), anyone think there would be any drawbacks in setting it up this way or have any ideas how I could have my speakers and headphones connected permanently? Cheers This looks to be a fairly high quality RCA switchbox: https://www.ebay.com/itm/192864171577?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D232195%26meid%3D122b5be7179346d4a059a0b830e4ec7d%26pid%3D101195%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D284246139866%26itm%3D192864171577%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv9PairwiseUnbiasedWebWithSearchFilterPromotion&_trksid=p2047675.c101195.m1851&amdata=cksum%3A192864171577122b5be7179346d4a059a0b830e4ec7d|enc%3AAQAFAAACEClKviNOdewYUBffQVCCI2t2UH65%2BGLEzS88JNzc3G9KoPgmfUFC6HTUubVM1cj1KavzFCKmsAzut1k134GZwW6ARRxQ81mSdRMfiLXGB%2F5rcaFf5JQZgLTc8qeitDSxyGKAjSjVB4%2FaYomfEX0JlcGoyIU%2F5gIG1DjaCX14a1UGxFzqR%2FPr9hvZ4mzzL4aNNQ7E5DvYU4wrYlSrXILI3106nCqg5yQiWF911SoIQOs1MeeAWfL9Y5rpZwoF75WXBSN46wlJ3umNLBSd9H2SiURzhMIzGLGLqFlIHXb8JxlWAXgO6jcOTtuu4OcqFdCrPDzmbx4Lkr76Oll8CqeAGx8V1o1IaRAlaBqcEX15cNQ1I2PFvOp5%2BUiQXppqR04TCidbxiyEWlO17GQnvXclOeSwTLpID0JQM14s7I32cKqw1EunknfYM0S7MwrsrhFmm%2Fk0aZeAPciQoIqwCe44fqNaSeYebIAFFq27iq9bjDMqgGnSHUhsfUfSHQHJjlckVGLBxRxa0QppZ1qMVtZ98PElBppYWKA1A%2FxzodZr8%2ByvpgJyg6j8kk71AsnvMud5%2F%2BGze5rTzj47yWm9GtlImu2IUWqPIKrV0IUnGYKu2mzBkytSoZa2rWLhc8YEGzt4E7WJClwT0iSRvCOpiKZm8Hqylw5%2BINS28Xnq68PPIX1Cj2mHeSjEahGOvzyQRrYbTA%3D%3D|ampid%3APL_CLK|clp%3A2047675 You could reverse-connect it so that the R+L outputs will be your inputs Then you could remove 2 of the 6 RCA inputs, expand one of the holes with a drill to make it fit a headphone jack like https://www.thatcable.com/6-35mm-stereo-panel-mount-solder-connector-audio-jack-socket-chassis-patch Then you can take the L, R and ground wires previously connected to the removed RCA connectors, and solder to the headphone connector. This would make a suitable switchbox without the need for an extra headphone adapter cable. tims and Qhwoeprktiyns 2 Link to comment
Vincent des Champs Posted May 11, 2021 Share Posted May 11, 2021 Anyone interested in my da96etf / upl96etl/ u192etl? Send me a dm 👍🏻 [SOURCE] Ideon Absolute Stream -> Ideon Absolute Time -> [DAC] APL Hifi DSD-MR SE -> [AMP] Dan d’Agostino Progression INT -> [LS] EgglestoneWorks Savoy SE (supported by Stealth Audio cabling, Ansuz network, Stromtank power) Link to comment
szczemirek Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 I have a problem with Snakeoil OS and ECdesigns. Anybody help, please. Link to comment
Qhwoeprktiyns Posted May 12, 2021 Share Posted May 12, 2021 1 hour ago, szczemirek said: I have a problem with Snakeoil OS and ECdesigns. Anybody help, please. Details? Link to comment
nattflax Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 21 hours ago, szczemirek said: Snakeoil don't see a dac. The latest EC-designs use toslink as a interface and no OS will be able "to see" the dac. Are you sure that a signal is sent to the correct output i.e. check your settings in the OS. The Snakeoil OS wiki/forum seems to have a well of information. I suggest you'll try troubleshooting there first. If you are using an older DAC with usb-conncection. USB is built in the Linux kernel and the OS should "see" the dac. Sometimes you will need to mount a USB-device. You are in luck because SOS is Ubuntu-based and there is a ton of help out there. Google is your friend here. Check SOS wiki/forums first though. Good Luck! szczemirek 1 Link to comment
Popular Post Qhwoeprktiyns Posted May 14, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted May 14, 2021 Some people have asked me about the use of the PowerDAC-R with power amplifiers, so I am adding a few comments on that for the benefit of everyone. The point to keep in mind is that the PowerDAC-R's volume control has 10 steps, with 27db total gain. There is a mute position, then step 0 already offers some gain (44 mV rms) and it increases by 3db steps (up to 1.4 V rms). So if your speakers are relatively sensitive and you have a powerful amplifier hooked to the PowerDAC-R, you may reach your listening level at a relatively low gain setting (ex: 3). In that case, controlling the volume through the PowerDAC-R alone will not provide sufficient range. Ideally, you would want to have your maximum listening volume with the PowerDAC-R volume output around 7 or 8. This situation may already arise with your current amplification and current DAC. For example, when using the current ECD DAC with my Lavardin ISX integrated amplifier, I can only use a fairly limited range on the Lavardin's volume control, usually about 1/3 of the total volume range. If the PowerDAC's "useable" volume control range turns out to be too small, given the characteristics of your power amplifier (wattage) and your speakers (impedance, sensitivity), then you may need to add an "attenuation" between the PowerDAC-R and your amplifier. This is what I am currently doing when using the PowerDAC-R with ECD's MBV power amplifiers. I use either ECD's SVC, and keep it at a fixed volume of 50%, or use another preamp (The Truth), also at a fixed setting. This way I can use a much larger range with the PowerDAC's remote control. As I mentioned, the SVC works actually much better with the PowerDAC than it did (in my opinion) with the previous DAC, essentially due to grounding aspects (improved) and higher output impedance of the PowerDAC. My other preamp also works very well, and I alternate between the two, but have not made up my mind yet on which I prefer. I am waiting to see if I upgrade my amplifier (possibly to the upcoming ECD tube mono-blocks). In conclusion: - if you already have a separate preamplifier, then you can wait until you test the PowerDAC-R to see whether you still need it - if you have an integrated amplifier, then you can see whether you choose to control the volume with that or with the PowerDAC's remote. - if you are looking to upgrade your amplification, depending on the power of the amplification you choose you may still need an "attenuator" in the loop, and in that case the SVC is probably a good choice, but there could be others. If you want to get completely rid of this extra "attenuator" (so PowerDAC directly connected to your power amplifiers) then you may need to choose your amplifier so that it does not provide too much output (given your speaker's specs). Hope that helps ! tapatrick, Vincent des Champs and bodiebill 3 Link to comment
Popular Post Qhwoeprktiyns Posted May 14, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted May 14, 2021 And since some have asked me as well, I'm still thrilled with the PowerDAC-R simply connected to my NUC (optical cable from the NUC's optical out). I have not had the urge to go back to the UPL. I also find I am listening less to vinyl now, and that the difference between the two has become less relevant. My vinyl rig is basic, but this difference was more pronounced before. Your mileage may vary, obviously. If you plan on using the optical out of a PC or Mac, you may find that their Toslink outputs are limited to 24/96. I have only a handful of 192 kHz albums, so I've converted them to 96 kHz, but if you want to benefit from 192 kHZ there are plenty of solutions: ECD's small Toslink/USB converter works fine up to 192, no problem. For the time being, I felt like keeping things "super simple" and not introduce the USB converter, but I may change my mind. If you are currently using a "hifi" music player (Bryston, Antipodes, Innuos, etc...) you may want to check whether the Toslink output does 192. Otherwise you can add the small ECD USB converter, or any similar device. There are plenty of other solutions: RaspberryPi with a digital Hat card, etc... It is hard to wrap our heads around this "source immunity", since we are so used to the opposite - its the only way we have heard digital so far. Honestly, its a huge relief not to have to worry about all this any longer. Its important to be relaxed when you listen to music :) Eager to get some of your feedback in a few weeks ! tapatrick, realDHT and Huubster 1 1 1 Link to comment
mevdinc Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 @hopkins Thanks for the detailed info on the volume of PowerDAC-R. I would test it with my active speakers to see how the volume works. I normally listen at highish volumes, as long as I get a reasonable range I might get away with using PowerDAC-R's volume. If not I will use my existing DAC's analog input and its excellent analog volume control. Qhwoeprktiyns 1 mevdinc.com (My autobiography) Recently sold my ATC EL 150 Actives! Link to comment
Huubster Posted May 15, 2021 Share Posted May 15, 2021 On 5/14/2021 at 5:51 PM, hopkins said: If you plan on using the optical out of a PC or Mac, you may find that their Toslink outputs are limited to 24/96. I have only a handful of 192 kHz albums, so I've converted them to 96 kHz, but if you want to benefit from 192 kHZ there are plenty of solutions: ECD's small Toslink/USB converter works fine up to 192, no problem. For the time being, I felt like keeping things "super simple" and not introduce the USB converter, but I may change my mind. Good point, my Innuos' Toslink tops at 96khz. Have you by chance used the USB converter and did you notice any difference with optical out? Or did you not check it out at all? Ben75 1 Link to comment
Qhwoeprktiyns Posted May 15, 2021 Share Posted May 15, 2021 9 minutes ago, Huubster said: Good point, my Innuos' Toslink tops at 96khz. Have you by chance used the USB converter and did you notice any difference with optical out? Or did you not check it out at all? I did some comparisons with the USB and did not notice any differences, but I did not spend too much time on it. I don't know how much they'll be selling that small USB converter. I assume it will be pretty cheap (100€?). [I am purchasing the units they send me, by the way, but will be doing so when the site is updated so it makes it easier for them to generate an invoice.I never asked about the USB converters price.] You could still use the U192. I actually did not even try the U192. ElectroTos cable does not "lock" into Toslink plugs like regular Toslink cable do, so I prefer using regular Toslink. Maybe it would be possible to retrofit the U192 with a regular Toslink cable? Link to comment
Huubster Posted May 15, 2021 Share Posted May 15, 2021 12 minutes ago, hopkins said: I did some comparisons with the USB and did not notice any differences, but I did not spend too much time on it. I don't know how much they'll be selling that small USB converter. I assume it will be pretty cheap (100€?). [I am purchasing the units they send me, by the way, but will be doing so when the site is updated so it makes it easier for them to generate an invoice.I never asked about the USB converters price.] You could still use the U192. I actually did not even try the U192. ElectroTos cable does not "lock" into Toslink plugs like regular Toslink cable do, so I prefer using regular Toslink. Maybe it would be possible to retrofit the U192 with a regular Toslink? Thanks Stephane, glad you did not hear much difference. My preference would also be to go for the the same 'less is more' approach you chose. My music is already at 96khz anyhow since the DA96ETF can't handle any higher. But I would like to be able to compare the 192khz versions using the PowerDAC, so I might initially opt for the converter for testing purposes as well. Using the U192, interesting idea, haven't thought about that yet. But I actually want to skip the U192 for the same 'less is more' reasons. Link to comment
Popular Post Qhwoeprktiyns Posted May 15, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted May 15, 2021 You can't go wrong with the converter, it is very small and powered from the USB. You could probably even fit it inside the Innuos with some DIY wiring... The problem with Toslink outputs is that most music server manufacturers have not bothered offering 24/192, as Toslink is generally seen as an inferior connection. Ben75 and Huubster 1 1 Link to comment
Ben75 Posted May 16, 2021 Share Posted May 16, 2021 20 hours ago, hopkins said: You can't go wrong with the converter, it is very small and powered from the USB. You could probably even fit it inside the Innuos with some DIY wiring... The problem with Toslink outputs is that most music server manufacturers have not bothered offering 24/192, as Toslink is generally seen as an inferior connection. I completely agree with Stéphane ! The Toslink to USB converter from ECD is just excellent and did not deteriorate (from my little experience with it) the sound quality over a streamer that has a Toslink output integrated. :-) Huubster 1 Link to comment
Huubster Posted May 16, 2021 Share Posted May 16, 2021 28 minutes ago, Ben75 said: I completely agree with Stéphane ! The Toslink to USB converter from ECD is just excellent and did not deteriorate (from my little experience with it) the sound quality over a streamer that has a Toslink output integrated. :-) Glad you agree Ben :) My current line of thinking is that I will use the PowerDAC 'as is' first. Meaning using my Innuos with Toslink out, and using the PowerDAC as stand alone DAC, just as I use the DA96ETF currently for proper comparison. Later on I may try using USB, and using PowerDAC as a pre-amplifier. Link to comment
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