ECdesigns

[M_audio]

On 6/8/2016 at 4:02 PM, juanitox said:

i will compare mine soon with the T+A 8 DSD , the Mosaic sounds very refined and natural and perhaps will be more analog than the T+A in PCM ( need to be confirmed) . but of what i have heard with DSD512 or even DSD 128 it does not play in this league .

the MOSAIC also needs my MUTEC MC3usb toslink output to give it"s best .

 

I just bought T16 in order to relax with this DAC. I will also go for Lifatec cable once i get it, but using XTOS.
I have enough of these DS DACs since i've heard Wadia 581 in my system.

[hvbias]

Looks like their newest DAC is now "Mosaic UV"

[M_audio]

Mosaic UV is their latest and is not available any more. Right now they are working on Mosaic II.

[hvbias]

They change designs more frequently than some people change their underwear ?

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

They improve the design each time. 

 

I have a UV. The UV is an outstanding DAC, offered at a very low price, and anyone who has actually listened to it will agree. 

 

I am impatient to test their latest production. 

[M_audio]

I just got the Mosaic T16 and i just can say I am all set now for the next 10 years.
It has a great design and WAF, external LPSU which i regard as advantage compared to Mosaic UV. 

Got Beady Belle playing right now - Cricklewood Broadway 24bit, and this is IT!

I really can be compared to my vinyl system i sold. And I am not sorry.

[M_audio]

One Hi-Rez picture of the NOS, optical only amazing DAC.

Had enough of the Delta-Sigma ringing terror on my ears.

 

Delta-Sigma is totally wrong direction, and it appeared only because it was cheaper to produce.
 

The guys at EC Designs made a marvellous product, too bad it is not available any more.

[M_audio]

All lights on
Full NOS ahead
192 kHz

 

[M_audio]

Just listening for the first time to this excellent electro ambient Pan American release from 1998 on Kranky. I remember it through CD on Unico CD Primo with tube gain-stage - precise, cold and sterile.

RIpped and played tru fantastic EC NOS DAC it really sounds more like vinyl, organic and natural. Lotsa details. 

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Their new DAC is being produced. Back to Toslink input. I have a feeling this is going to be a ground breaking product.

 

There are quite a few innovations, some of which you can read about on the DiyAudio thread. The DAC will be battery powered. 

 

They have also a small USB to Toslink adapter available (size of a USB key).

 

The claim here is that as long as source is bit perfect you can get a low noise and jitter free signal in the DAC. If that claim is realized, it will be a revolution in computer audio... 

[greenleo]

On 9/3/2018 at 6:01 PM, hopkins said:

Their new DAC is being produced. Back to Toslink input. I have a feeling this is going to be a ground breaking product.

 

There are quite a few innovations, some of which you can read about on the DiyAudio thread. The DAC will be battery powered. 

 

They have also a small USB to Toslink adapter available (size of a USB key).

 

The claim here is that as long as source is bit perfect you can get a low noise and jitter free signal in the DAC. If that claim is realized, it will be a revolution in computer audio... 

@Hopkins,

 

I come to learn.  What's the new DAC?  Jitter free is impossible and a value of tolerance from them will be very much appreciated and again, low noise is relative and a value of reference from them would be very much appreciated.Regards

 

[M_audio]

And there it is! Their new multibit DAC, battery driven for 363€! I guess they have learnt a lot from their previous products so this one can only be great.

I am absolutely pleased with their 1st Mosaic DAC and have no reasons to change, but if i would look for a multibit DAC this would be my 1st choice.

[Norton]

7 hours ago, M_audio said:

And there it is! Their new multibit DAC, battery driven for 363€! I guess they have learnt a lot from their previous products so this one can only be great.

I am absolutely pleased with their 1st Mosaic DAC and have no reasons to change, but if i would look for a multibit DAC this would be my 1st choice.

 

Thanks, look interesting.  I’ve twice been interested in buying from them in the past but each time they’d sold out and moved on to a fresh design, which is not that reassuring.

 

Might give it a go this time (DAC+player) as it’s a fairly cheap proposition, good to see that there are some constants between designs (Toslink etc).  Can’t work out what makes the 24 bit versions of the DAC  and player so much more expensive than 16 bit though (look to be the same apart from bigger batteries) . Would be good to know a bit more about the particular MB implementation and a pity that the player uses  USB rather than SD card (which featured in an earlier design).

 

 

[M_audio]

52 minutes ago, Norton said:

 

Thanks, look interesting.  I’ve twice been interested in buying from them in the past but each time they’d sold out and moved on to a fresh design, which is not that reassuring.

 

Might give it a go this time (DAC+player) as it’s fairly cheap proposition, good to see that there are some constants between designs (Toslink etc).  Can’t work out what makes the 24 bit versions of the DAC  and player so much more expensive though (look to be the same apart from bigger batteries) . Would be good to know a bit more about the particular MB implementation and a pity that the player uses  USB rather than SD card.

 

 

 

The 24-multibit implementation is probably much more work-intensive for them than 16bit, since they don't work with chips off-the-shelf.

I can assure you that 16-bit are more than enough - in case of EC Designs.

Through extensive talks with a friend, who does recording and producing of classical and jazz music (and teaches at music academy), i came to conclusion that he is right - mostly one listens to less than 16-bit of dynamic headroom, so 16 bit are more than enough, while the 24-bits are needed in the process of creating the CD - for editing, mixing and cutting.
My EC Designs Mosaic converts the 24-bit FLACs  into 17bit. Of course marketing needs some buzz-words so 24 as a number sounds better than 16
LP's have even less resolution than 16-bit, yet my previous analogue system was amazing..on the level of 5k CD-Players. 
So basically it is all about implementation.

Another thing that i just recently did following the recommendations of my music-friend - upsample 44 & 48 kHz in Audirvana to 96kHz with Izotope SRC & specific settings, and now, it sounds again better (Mosaic was known for its bit relaxed approach - now there is more upbeat). The premise behind is that NOS DAC sounds better at 96kHz since then the not-filtered garbage moves into non-audible area.

This little new MOS16 is really a no-brainer for this amount of money.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

I purchased the MOS 16 and am using it so far with a squeezebox reciever and am very pleased. I did not even bother to compare it directly with the Mosaic UV (their previous model). At 360 euros it is a no brainer. Will receive the UPL (battery supplied, very low power standalone wav reader) soon, and am curious to make some comparison between various sources. 

 

The UPL only plays wav files from a USB key. If the UPL is clearly above other sources, I will make a little program to automate the copy of a playlist and conversion to wav. Having a digital system completely off the grid (power and network) with very low interference, is appealing, in spite of the constraints. 

[Norton]

10 hours ago, hopkins said:

I purchased the MOS 16 and am using it so far with a squeezebox reciever and am very pleased

 

Good to hear more of your impressions,, especially compared to other DACs you’ve owned.

 

I was on tempted by the MOS16 and UPL16, but then the DAC went out of stock almost immediately.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

I'll post some impressions in a few days - when I receive the UPL, and take some time to make some comparisons, at least with the Mosaic UV. 

[beautiful music]

On 12/9/2018 at 7:10 PM, hopkins said:

I'll post some impressions in a few days - when I receive the UPL, and take some time to make some comparisons, at least with the Mosaic UV. 

Awaiting expectantly to your feedback.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Hi, I'll answer your message here so everyone can benefit. 

 

I did finally recieve the UPL, and the gap with my Squeezebox reciever is very significant. In fact, I have never heard such a big difference switching sources. I unfortunately do not have too many other sources to compare it to (as some could argue the Squeezebox Reciever is not among the best out there, and they would probably be right). Still, my feeling at this point is that the UPL is a really really good source. Will do a comparison later this week with a Mac Mini (Uptone supply) and perhaps the latest version of Wtfplay using ECDesign's USB to Toslink converter. 

 

I may try to borrow another source from someone here in Paris. Not sure I can manage that. 

 

I did not have a chance to compare it to the UV. I will also do that using the same Mac Mini. 

 

The MOS DAC seems very good and I do not miss the UV, but will compare... 

 

I asked HifiAdvice is they would be reviewing it, and they said they had a chance to listen to it and thought it was similar to the Mosaic T DAC, which I think they found inferior to the UV. When I first got the MOS DAC I quickly tried it with a few PCs and the toslink adapter and quickly settled on the Squeezebox reciever as it sounded better, but I would have to spend more time comparing. So I have a feeling that we  should be careful what source it is used with. 

 

The UPL may turn out to be the real jewel here, and with it the MOS DAC really shines. 

 

I will provide some more feedback this weekend. 

 

For reference, my system is composed of Harbeth P3ESR 40th Anniversary speakers, a "The Truth" preamp, and a Nuprime ST-10 stereo power amp. Not the best there is, but certainly sufficiently revealing to pass a judgment on sources and DACs... 

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

I actually could not resist making another comparison. So I installed Wtfplay (last version) on my Mac Mini (2012 model with Uptone kit, but with a standard power supply - will try it with an hdplex later, but I doubt it will change much) and connected the Mac Mini to the MOS DAC using the ECDesigns Utos (USB to Toslink adapter). I played the same track (Charles Brown, "I Won't Cry Anymore", good recording) on the Mac Mini and on the UPL. The UPL is head and shoulders above, with much better transparency and depth, the music just flows with much more ease, it makes it a struggle to listen to the Mac Mini. 

 

I hope others will test it. 

[Norton]

On 12/11/2018 at 11:21 PM, hopkins said:

I hope others will test it.

 

Thanks for impressions, just ordered the MOS16/UPL16/UTOS combo to  satisfy my curiosity.

 

 

[Ralf11]

The product addresses several things often thought to degrade SQ.  Too bad it only has RCA output.  I'll be interested to hear listening impressions, or - better - blinded listening tests.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Hopefully sometime in January I will be able to organize a comparison (blinded as well) with some other streamers. 

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

15 hours ago, Norton said:

 

Thanks for impressions, just ordered the MOS16/UPL16/UTOS combo to  satisfy my curiosity.

 

 

 

Looking forward to hear your impressions. 

[Norton]

@hopkins any thoughts/experience with the SVC passive volume control?

 

N