ECdesigns

[Jacob]

Hello to all .

Joining the fan club :)

[Jacob]

30 minutes ago, Huubster said:

 

Ha, nice, welcome Jacob! How is your experience so far? Fanclub you say, are you as enthusiastic as all of us here? 😊

More than you think..... so far the Mosaic was always my GOTO unit and i never heard a DAC (here in Israel) that sounded as good as it - well i didnt heard them ALL but quite a lot.
And the new UPL  - for me is the BEST source EVER for pure anologue/digital sound.
I have the intona USB isolater always infront the Mosaicm just to mention.
As far as power problems - not all locations are affected by this, I mean that in my house it works good, at my friend (where the speakers are set) the Power line is perfect since he rewirded the whole line to the HiFi system.

Yes i will do more test to find out how this affect  - but it looks like that almost every DAC with internal standard PS is affected.

 

[Jacob]

21 minutes ago, seeteeyou said:

Hmm, UPL96ETL → DA96ETF → QA390 versus QA390 as a standalone unit would be a mighty interesting comparison.

Well - since the QA390 is battery operated and looks like the filter in done it in the right way - it sound VERY good and close to the UPL/USB - ONLY and ONLY when play WAV files in the wav SF (!!) , once you connect to USB - you will need Intona to Isolate and a good USB cable.
Still  - the UPL is beter sounding  - i just cant even pinpoint or find something bad to say. But QA is close!
5 days a go we had a 3 hours sesion at my friend (speakers) and we were like extatic and glowing from the great sound .

 

[Jacob]

31 minutes ago, hopkins said:

I have the Mosaic UV as well and I really liked that DAC a lot as well, but I never had a very good USB source to use it with. In spite of this it sounded quite good. 

 

In some ways, the Mosaic UV may have been better than the MOS16 (which came just before their current DAC) but with the MOS16 also came the UPL... 

With the MOSAIC it is important to have bit perfect as also with the new U192- without it, it just sounds like everything else.
So no software voume and no convertion and in Tidal i chose "let Tidal take over... sound" so the volume is also fixed - the only volume is on the PC that controls the Mosaic internal volume swhitching. So the U192 connected to external amp and i control the volume on the amp.

[Jacob]

"- use of a proper 5v battery supply instead of a direct connection to PC, though we did not compare without the battery supply."

 

Why do you think u need this for the UPL? Does it matter if i connect it to my laptop and it works on battery?

What cable do i need to test it also so it will be connected to PC for control and external power?

 

[Jacob]

6 hours ago, realDHT said:

I do not agree with this however. In my system there was quite a big improvement when I exchanged the stock DAC supply to a very good one. A friend of mine experienced the same in his system. There has also been some other earlier in the thread that experienced the same.

 

 

I think this is totaly not defenetive - every one has a different quality power lines , so what good for some does not has to be the same for others.

[Jacob]

1 hour ago, nattflax said:

This thread is extremely useful. I have learned so much about digital audio lurking this thread, being a vinyl guy for the most part -- apologies for the heresy. 

 

I want to share my workflow converting .flac to .wav. I own the ~ 2 year old "legacy" products MOS16 and UPL16 and they only accept files with 16 bits bit depth. 

 

Hsopefully my workflow will be useful for user of the newer models as I have found that .wav-dowloads from for instance Bandcamp can be a little bit iffy. Usually I download the .flac-file and scrub the metadata and then convert it to .wav. 

 

For .flac-files I use Puddletag to scrub the meta data (ctrl-e to delete icons/art work and ctrl-r to scrub the rest of the meta data and then hit save)

 

I found this script (link below) for sox to be capable using the command line converting to different audio formats. The script works for Linux and Mac. One thing I found to be very nifty indeed is that the output is piped to parallell-application which uses all the available cores in your computer to convert the files.

 

find . -name "*.wav" -print0 \
  | parallel -0 --eta \
      "mkdir -p {//}/sox-out ; \
       mkdir -p {//}/sox-out/logs ; \
       sox --show-progress \
         --guard {} \
         -b 16 \
         -t wav \
         -C 0 \
         {//}/sox-out/{/.}.wav \
         rate -v 48k \
         dither -s \
         2>&1 \
           | tee {//}/sox-out/logs/{/.}.sox.log"

 

https://notes.maxie.xyz/audio/downsample-audio-with-sox.html#downsample-with-sox

 

Cheers!

 

Nattflax

:):) once you wrote "script" .. my eyes puzzled ... and i needed a smoke...😉

 

So this is how i do it - 

Tidal-GUI for direct file downloading from Tidal.

Freeac - audio converter for batch Flac to Wav.

Bulk Rename Utility - for setting the files name correctly and giving numbers.

Fixing the Folder name.

 

ye it took me some time at first , now it is easy :)

 

 

[Jacob]

Try to use MP3TAG program to fix the tags.

I dont rmember the whole prosidure that i did - need to practice it again.

 

But use the Tidal Gui for getting any file from Tidal so it is already taged and nothing to fix.

[Jacob]

1 hour ago, mevdinc said:

Wow, 'better than any active loudspeakers' is a huge claim, to say the least.
Obviously, you haven't heard any of the top range active ATCs. I have heard both the Kii Three and Dutch and Dutch 8C side by side and preferred the sound of 8Cs. Neither can get anywhere near my active ATCs and not surprising as my speakers cost around £65K.

I am sure Fractal DAC is quite special as almost all the user experiences in this very topic indicate. And it seems PowerDAC will be very special too, but I would have to hear it myself. It will be very difficult to find a matching passive speaker to mate with it to beat most top range active speakers. If I am not mistaken, that's why ECdesigns is/will be providing a speaker system to go with it.

In the meantime, I will see if I can find a way to try out the Fractal DAC with my system.

Happy listening.

Dont you worry at all about the speakers  - me and my friends here allready planning to build a special bookshelf speakers for the Headphones PowerDAC :):)

[Jacob]

On 7/2/2021 at 8:29 PM, hykbooks said:

no no no, I used the powerdac to just test it with headphones, which I got to test and returned, its not mine

 

while the DA96 I bought and is used in my home system, not used with headphones, so the question about usb isolators is to improve my dac in my home system. With my headphone set up I do not use the DA96, I use my ifi pro dsd as a dac and violectric 590 as an amp. I was able to loan the powerdac and it was not great with my headphones at all. 

 

You have Intona 7054-X which is the industrial version, the other model that you tested is 7055-C.

[Jacob]

PowerDAC and Headphones Competability  
 

I wanted to write a review .... but what is the point??
What words to use or how good your vocabulary should be to describe PERFECTION?
 

I have the MOSAIC UV for 4.5 years and up until now i didnt find a better DAC.

I compared to many units, Streamers that cost 5K$ and other R2R - non, non of them beat the MOSAIC (i was using Intona Isolator in the line).
But now (!!) - the PowerDAC .... It is the MOST Analogue sound ever, period!
There is simply NOTHING that i wish could be better ... I tested it mostly with my Kennerton Rognir, this is a very very good headphone and reveals everything, I was looking for imperfections ... something that i could complain about ... but.. sorry.. i didnt find anything.

Reminds me the "Fifth Element" movie when they assembled LILU and their jaw dropped .... "Perfection" :):)

 

My setup at home is for Headphones only, but yesterday I got a chance to review the PowerDAC at my friend home with Stereo speakers - he was floored!!

So as i'm a headphone specialist - i've condutced a test with all my headphones (tomorrow will update the list with more flagships).

 

Since i made a mistake and forgot to order the USB to Toslink converter i used 2 units for the input:
1. xDuoo XQ-50 Pro - as BT source via Toslink
2. Quloos QA390 - this is a fantastic all in one unit but most important it is a very very good player with dedicated WAV rom to perform as CD Transport and even better. The output was Toslink too. http://www.qlshifi.com/en/wzcapi/qa390.htm
3. Auris HA2 as additional AMP 

 

As in the PowerDAC description written - it will NOT drive ALL the headphones out there but it does an amazing job with many.
My listening volume levels are not high, i have many friends that listen in higher levels than me - so i chose a track that has a low gain recording and marked the PowerDAC volume levels taking in consideration mine and (+) levels.
The numbers X--Y indicate the PowerDAC Volume settings 1-9 - which 9 is the MAX.
6--8 mean that low gain tracks will need 8, high gain tracks will need 6 .

 

Kennerton Rognir		6--8
Kennerton Wodan		6--8
Kennerton Thror		5--7
Kennerton Vali		4--6
Fostex T60RP		7--9
MySphere 3.2 Bass		7--9
HiFiman 1000V2		7--9
HiFiman Ananda		4--7
Focal Stellia		4--6
Focal Clear		4--6
Kennerton Magni		4--6
OLLO all of them		3--5
Verum		7--9
Fostex TH900mk2		4--6
Denon 9200		4--6
AUDEZE LCD3		5--7
Sivga Pii		7--9

 

iBasso new one..                                    3--5

 

Conclusion  - 

From Thursday till Monday - who ever came to me to listen just grabbed their head and say - WOW!!
The PowerDAC R has an Orgasmic sound - from Stage to Clarity and many other describing audio words - it is PERFECTION.

It can drive 85% of Dynamic headphones and about 70% of Planars to their BEST potential.

The limitation will be in the Headphones sound characteristics.

Connecting the PowerDAC to Auris HA2 enable to drive ANY headphone (or use any other amp) - and exactly as John describe - another AMP on the way is degrading the sound by 3% .
Let me be CLEAR - connected to Auris it is still AMAZING sound and other stronger amps will allow you to use more demanding headphones like Susvara , LCD4 or Abyss. But connecting directly to the PowerDAC will reviel the full potential of the unit and you can enjoy amazing headphones like the Kennerton Rognir, Wodan, Vali or Fostex TH and the DENON, Focal and LCD 2-3-X, Beyer variants and many others - they all sound superb!

 

There will not be "next" model (inside knowledge) simply no need.

The production is limited for the next year (due COVID manufacturing problems) - so.... BUY BUY BUY !!!
Trust my words  - you will not regret!!

 

Tomorrow i will add :
Stellia
Meze Empyrean
Grado PS1000
Dan Clark Ether

 

[Jacob]

....and just for Fun - here is my Tidal "Trakcs for Headphones Test"

https://tidal.com/browse/playlist/ff92278a-6755-4bf1-9d27-9dc8474bf90d

 

 

[Jacob]

6 hours ago, Huubster said:

Thanks for your report @Jacob, and what a connection of headlhones you have, wow!

 

I'm happy to see you so happy, welcome aboard and enjoy the ride!  😁👍

Connection or Collection ?? 😉

[Jacob]

4 hours ago, hopkins said:

 

I was (ré)reading yesterday an essay by Arthur Salvatore on the popular opposition between "musical" and "accurate": http://www.high-endaudio.com/philos.html#Two

 

I know many people who call themselves audiophiles and still believe that there is a trade-off between accuracy and "musicality".  This is probably the result of listening exclusively  to inferior products that offer compromises and tradeoffs. 

 

These people should listen to the powerDAC as it is the definitive proof (provided one is not deaf) of what Salvatore concludes:  "My own conviction is simple: A component is "Musical" ONLY IF and BECAUSE it is also "Accurate"."

 

With the PowerDAC I feel we finally have an accurate DAC to demonstrate this. Listening with headphones, without any of the distortion involved with (even the best) amplifiers and speakers, makes it all the more obvious. 

 

Thanks for your very nice review! 

 

I can not agree more!!!
this DAC is totaly demonstrate the BEST sound and how it should have been.

Finaly i can hear the difference..

[Jacob]

The source matter too !!
Im waiting for my USB to Toslink unit to arrive so i can do a comparison with all the possible options.
but for now  - the QLS QA390 as PURE WAV player perfeom the best.
Tried to use AUNE X5s player with optical out  - not even close ... sounds like a digital brick..

[Jacob]

2 hours ago, hopkins said:

Perhaps someone could take me out of my misery and try an android tablet (or phone) with USB Audio Pro connected to the ECD UT96 (USB->Optical) ? It's easy to set up, if you have an android device.

When my USb interface will arrive i can do this  - i have 2 same S10e phones just to do the comparisons and have a very good USB C cable 

 

[Jacob]

What Beyerdynamic model headhpones do you have?

[Jacob]

29 minutes ago, Gavin1977 said:

I would definitely be up for this, lots of positives on the Fractal DAC for me, but as I wrote up in my system is seemed rolled off in the bass and very neutral / top end focused - so wasn't quite there.  I have had a number of very high end DACs in for comparison recently.

I didnt understand your reply  - using the PD in your system had rolled off bass?

[Jacob]

2 hours ago, tapatrick said:

I know it's history now but source immunity was (sort of) claimed for the previous DAC 🧐 🤐

I'm starting to think that the "source" is all about the files and on the software that actualy play the files.
Just had a talk with Sam from MP64 - they do have a very interesting and unique aproach to handeling and eliminating the File / random jitter.
This is why my QLS Qa390 as a WAV player sounds that good too.
And as the PDR is so amazing  - now it become even more clear the difference in the files as from where i got them..... like downloading from Rutracker (CD rip) or from Tidal - both converted to WAV.

[Jacob]

3 hours ago, hykbooks said:

Great, so I would like to put you on a blind test, for the last sentence you wrote, just give me a break man, so now finally you found the magical product to help you distinguish wav from flac 

Please dont address me here - i had enough of it over the phone and in person with you.

[Jacob]

Hello To all.

I took a pause writing here since was waiting for my USB to Toslink converter.

The one i bought is from NobSound , after confiding with Gordon (from EC) - 
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Digital-Interface-Coaxial-Optical-Adapter/dp/B08GYWTY4Y/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=Nobsound+Mini+XMOS+XU208+USB&qid=1628539450&s=electronics&sr=1-2

 

It works perfectly, it can be powered but also PASIVE and i use it like this.

I recomend to order from Amazonm it arrive super fast.... my first unit from NobSound is still on the way after 1 month...

 

While i was waiting ... I got here The Memory Player NUC !!!
I want to thank someone here that mantiond them since inever knew that they excist,

 

As i wrote before  - once you step up with the DAC ... and the PD is one of the best if not THE BEST - everything start to matter.

Every part in the audio chain become more important since the resolution and clarity is so high you just start to notice things that are simply were not visable before.
I also advice to use Intona USB isolator 7055C . Far better than 7054 models!!

 

So here is my setup:
1. Memory Player NUC
2. simple USB 
3. Intona 7055C
4. Neotech NEUB-1020 USB cable 
5. NobSound Mini XMOS converter
6. EC PD optical cable
7. EC Power DAC
8. Kennerton Rognir Headphone
or

* Neotech NEVD-2010 x2 as Interconnect
* AURIS Ueterpe
* Kennerton Rognir Headphone

Most of the time i use the Auris amp since it is more convinient to adjust the volume with different headphones - and YES direct connect to PD sounds BETTER !

The Memory Player NUC is simply amazing source  - as the PD came along it is  become very clear that the file source is super critical.
For Comparison i use QLS390 as a WAV player simulating HQ CD transport - it was the best sound .... until the MP NUC came and killed it :):)

A few days ago i had couple of friends came over, they are Pro guys that have HQ equipment from Music MIxing - they were FLOORED by the sound !! As I AM TOO.

We try to describe the sound here and this is not easy... how can you describe Analogue sound from Digital source? 
Well .... as always with audio  - you will have to try yourself :):)

Anyone wish to contact me - +972-54-9333389  Jacob. Please use WhastApp.

P.S - i just try to use PD with a Power Bank insted of the Power Suply - and it worked quite well.
I will do more test and compare.

[Jacob]

1 hour ago, hopkins said:

I recorded a track from the output of the PowerDAC and the Khadas Tone Board DAC. The recording obviously involves Analog to Digital conversion, so you may not get the same result as when listening to the output of the two DACs directly, but I assume that if there are differences they could be still heard? 

 

 

Unfortunately, the volume is not identical, so you will have to match the volume yourself when playing the tracks. Let me know if you hear any differences...

You should be able to download them from these two links (opening the link will play the tracks, but click on the three dots to the right of the embedded player and you'll see a download option).

 

https://storage.googleapis.com/cloudplayer/Feuilles Mortes/17.wav

 

https://storage.googleapis.com/cloudplayer/Feuilles Mortes/19.wav

With my PRO audio friend we are going to do interesting test - 
Record a same song to 16 track tape from PD and from other DAC  - to see if the difference are audioable later in playback mode.

[Jacob]

3 hours ago, Varinder said:

Don’t your Memory player has toslink out ,., if so did you try toslink option vs Usb out with PD .. any difference?

No, this NUC model dont have optical out.
not sure but i think that optical out from a PC will not perform as optical out from a CD player. 
Im working now with MP guys to figure out a simple and more cheaper solution for the MP a way that it could be sold via distributors and wont need special instalation for each client  - this will reduce the cost segnificaly.
But choosing a hardware with Optical out will increase the total cost.
They also prefer the USB option, and it is better to have Intona on the line  - this unit will follow you everywhere.

[Jacob]

1 hour ago, hopkins said:

 

Playback of the original file through the PD sounds better than the other two but I would give a slight edge to the PD recording over the Khadas recording. Khadas recording sounds a little more aggressive to my ears. 

 

I also took the opportunity to compare again playback of the UPL versus Foobar/UT96 and Foobar/U192 and I still cannot hear differences.  I really don't know what to say about all this... I am a little bit puzzled about the results of the use of the Memory Player + Intona Isolator reported earlier by Jacob, especially since this is all going through an XMOS USB -> optical converter which is probably introducing again noise/jitter... Taking a fancy player + isolator but putting it through a basic converter you have to wonder what the benefit would be.

 

It would be good to do some blind testing comparing this setup with the UPL, and then again with a basic source. 

 

I am sure the Memory Player is a good player to use when you don't have the PowerDAC, but I cannot help being spkeptical about its relevance here. I wish I could try one or better, once again, listen to all this with others in attendance, in the same system.

MP - it IS the player to use with PD!!
Because PD is so good and revealing - the quality of the source become more important.

Wait for a month +/- - we will present a relativly cheaper version of MP  - i think it will be based on this PC:
https://www.pepper-jobs.com/collections/mini-pc/products/glk-uc2x-mini-pc

with this remote control:
https://www.pepper-jobs.com/products/w10-gyro-azerty-smart-remote

and this option too:
https://www.monect.com/  as a phone control

 

I will do more test compared to UPL vs MP and post here.

[Jacob]

Did anyone try the Ferrum Hypsos with the PowerDac-R replacing the Stock PS?