ECdesigns

[Norton]

I spent some time listening to the MOS16 today with music from both  Roon and the same USB sticks, this  time without UPL but via the Bryston BDP1> UTOS instead.

 

While the MOS16 sounded great with basic character unchanged, and I still consider the BDP a good source, things were noticeably that bit softer  and less precise/detailed than with the UPL.  The conclusion I draw is that both units contribute significantly  to the overall sound of the  combo.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Thanks again for the reports. How do you intend on using the UPL - occasionally with a selection of your music, or more regularly?

 

I am in the latter case and trying to figure out how I should organize my USB keys... 

[Norton]

On 1/13/2019 at 11:14 PM, hopkins said:

Thanks again for the reports. How do you intend on using the UPL - occasionally with a selection of your music, or more regularly?

 

I am in the latter case and trying to figure out how I should organize my USB keys... 

 

I bought the UPL16/MOS16 combo mainly out of  curiosity, but after a week’s listening it’s in daily use now and looks to stay  that way if I can stick to the “16/44 diet”.

 

I’m part-used to this situation from using SD cards with the Resonessence.  The strategy I have evolved is to keep my music archive elsewhere and just dip into it when I  need to refresh my listening, rather than replicating a complete music  collection across many sticks/cards.  

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Glad you are enjoying it.

 

I really hope ECDesigns will get more "publicity" for these outstanding products.

 

I can understand that a "usb key" player will have limited appeal. However, for the "obsessive audiophile" who is constantly tinkering and optimizing his/her set up (probably out of frustration with some aspects of the sound quality) using the UPL/MOS is the perfect medecine. The peace of mind it offers, knowing you probably cannot take it much farther (or at least not "tinkering") really lets you focus on enjoying the music

 

I was reading today on a French forum a thread on a network player (the Metrum Ambre): arguments over the mertis of upgrading the fuse, upgrading the internal RJ45 cable, tinkering with the various OS it runs on... It is such a relief not to have to worry about any of this ! 

 

Even if I do not end up duplicating my entire collection, I still like to have a fairly large sample "on hand" (selections in various "genres"). I miss having an easy way to look at what I am listening. So I am going to develop a small app to store on a web page the contents of each USB key (usb key id, folders, files, and optionally an image which you can also store in each folder) - it should be simple and quick to use.  That way I can easily search through my collection of USB keys (so far I have 7). Not essential, but a fun little project. I will post a link to it here once I am done.

[Ralf11]

4 hours ago, Norton said:

 

I bought the UPL16/MOS16 combo mainly out of  curiosity, but after a week’s listening it’s in daily use now and looks to stay  that way if I can stick to the “16/44 diet”.

 

I’m part-used to this situation from using SD cards with the Resonessence.  The strategy I have evolved is to keep my music archive elsewhere and just dip into it when I  need to refresh my listening, rather than replicating a complete music  collection across many sticks/cards.  

 

Did you compare it/these to comparably priced setups?

 

If so, which ones?

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

5 hours ago, Norton said:

 

I bought the UPL16/MOS16 combo mainly out of  curiosity, but after a week’s listening it’s in daily use now and looks to stay  that way if I can stick to the “16/44 diet”.

 

I’m part-used to this situation from using SD cards with the Resonessence.  The strategy I have evolved is to keep my music archive elsewhere and just dip into it when I  need to refresh my listening, rather than replicating a complete music  collection across many sticks/cards.  

 

Regarding audio formats (sampling/bits), I find the quality of the recording to be more important than the format itself. A friend bought some of his better recorded music to listen to with the UPL and it sounded terrific. I listen to a lot of older jazz and classical music recordings, and I have to admit it is not as "impressive" with these older recordings, but it is still much better than in any of my previous setups. I was listening the other day to this album: https://www.discogs.com/Bach-Arthur-Grumiaux-Complete-Sonatas-And-Partitas-For-Solo-Violin/release/3403481. It was recorded in 1960, and I was completely "floored" by the purity of the violin.

[Norton]

18 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

Did you compare it/these to comparably priced setups

 

No, only to much more expensive ones...

[Norton]

18 hours ago, hopkins said:

find the quality of the recording to be more important than the format itself

 

It’s taken me a long, circuitous and somewhat expensive route to get to this point, but my big realistation in recent months has been that there really is no need for anything other than 16/44 as a replay format.  I suspect though that recording format is still an important variable in recording quality.  A lot of the stuff I really like on 16/44 comes  from analogue or DSD recordings for example.

 

 

[Ralf11]

2 hours ago, Norton said:

 

No, only to much more expensive ones...

 

would you list them??

[Norton]

1 hour ago, Ralf11 said:

 

would you list them??

 

My only point of comparison immediately to hand is a Resonessence Mirus Signature Pro, fed by its own SDcard transport and with a Bryston  BDP1 player, plus reasonable recall of the performance of the Esoteric K07x and K05x Player/DACs that preceded it.

 

 

 

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Here is a little preview of the solution I am making to lists the files in USB keys: https://paulstephane.github.io/UPL/

 

I have a small program (on PC or Mac) that reads the USB key and copies the data (not the actual music, obviously)  to a github repository.

 

Unfortunately, I cannot directly upload the data from the PC to  Github, so one has to install "github desktop" on the PC - it synchronizes the content with a local directory. Once you get the hang of it, it is very quick to use (just click on two buttons, essentially, and the data is automatically uploaded to Github).

 

I display the content with Github web pages (it is free...).  It is not finalized - some cosmetics to be done (html is not my forte), sorting the folders, perhaps a serach bar, and the tracklist by clicking on an album. I had never done this before and am somewhat proud of my modest achievement  Who needs Roon !

 

 

[seeteeyou]

Could the USB port of UPL provide enough power for wireless flash drives such as this 32GB one for $18?

 

https://www.sandisk.com/home/mobile-device-storage/connect-wireless-stick

https://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Connect-Wireless-Stick-Flash/dp/B00ZCFYT5K

 

Hack a Sandisk 32G Wifi enabled flash drive

https://forums.hak5.org/topic/30273-hack-a-sandisk-32g-wifi-enabled-flash-drive/

 

SanDisk Wireless Media Drive Root Crack(and other useful info)

https://forums.hak5.org/topic/35884-sandisk-wireless-media-drive-root-crackand-other-useful-info/

 

SanDisk Connect 32GB Wireless Media Drive root

https://forums.hak5.org/topic/41977-sandisk-connect-32gb-wireless-media-drive-root/

 

We could always add our own USB hub if external power were necessary, though UPL itself might / might not be able to read the files off those somewhat "special" drives.

 

If everything were going as planned while the USB stick could still be accessed locally by UPL and remotely by another computer simultaneously, it could be worth a try to write some relatively simple scripts to manipulate the playlist on the fly.

 

Of course we still need to figure out how slow it REALLY is

 

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/08/26/a_usb_stick_as_a_file_server_weve_done_it/

Quote

The device is no speed demon: I uploaded a 100MB file over my domestic 802.11ac router and it took 3.5 minutes to finish the transfer.

 

That might seem to be a bummer but thankfully 44.1/16 *.wav files ain't THAT large to begin with. Even if replacing files on the fly weren't feasible, hopefully we could at least read stuff like filename (i.e. title of each track) / folder.jpg (i.e. album art) remotely.

 

Does it sound like something that's doable?

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Maybe check with ECDesigns? 

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Here is a second version of the site: https://paulstephane.github.io/UPL2/  with more features.

Anyone interested in using this can send me a PM

[Bill333]

Is anyone who bought the MOS DAC from the U.S.?  I tried to place an order this morning and couldn't do it because the United States was not on the list of countries in the ecdesigns.nl web site.

[Nedi]

I had the same experience with my country (Norway). Contact the webmaster on webshop side, and Gordon will add US on the list.

[Bill333]

Gordon helped me out, just like you said.  😃

[Norton]

With three weeks daily listening experience now, I’m sold on the  UPL16/MOS16 combination.  The best detail retrieval I’ve ever heard from 16/44 replay, really digging out hitherto hidden information in CD rips, but at the same time also relaxed, unfatiguing   and natural sounding.  My listening is near 100% orchestral classical, with 60s and 70s analogue recordings from Decca, HMV and MLP sounding particularly good on the EC designs kit.  

 

Quite a remarkable  combination of  characteristics, even before consideration that transport and DAC together are less than €800.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

I finally had the opportunity to compare the UPL with another toslink source: a Raspberry Pi with a battery power supply, equipped with a JustBoom digi Hat, and running a Japanese low latency distribution (symphonic-mpd), streaming Redbook cd wav files through Roon via Airplay. It is not even close. Again, some will object this is not the best source, but the gap is very significant and obvious, much more than what I have heard in the past when comparing various sources. 

 

Voilà... Enough experimenting for me. Back to enjoying the UPL/MOS.. 

[Bill333]

hopkins and everyone else - what are you using for a Toslink cable?  It seems like this would make a big difference to the sound.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

They don't. I am using a basic toslink cable. I tried a Lifatec cable someone lend me and there was no difference. 

 

This is the cable ECDesigns uses and recommended. You can see it is "basic" and there is no need to spend more: https://www.amazon.co.uk/AVK-216-0050-Cable-Toslink-sides-dia2-2mm/dp/B01LXR87LZ

[seeteeyou]

Try this one for a few bucks

 

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/toslink-best-sound.877004/

https://www.amazon.com/BlackWeb-BWB17AV001-Digital-Optical-Audio/dp/B078XG61KT

 

Not exactly relevant but worth a read

 

https://www.lightwaveonline.com/articles/2017/11/has-plastic-optical-fiber-s-time-finally-arrived.html

[Norton]

I use a QED I found in my spare cables box, seems fine, can’t imagine cable will make much difference, not least as EC designs recommend just the basic plastic type rather than pricier glass. Note if using MOS with UTOS  you will need a specific mini Toslink to std Toslink cable, EC designs recommend avoiding adapters.  I bought another QED Performance to match.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

I actually use this one, just because I wanted something a little sturdier: https://www.amazon.fr/gp/product/B00B2HP2DK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05__o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[M_audio]

14 minutes ago, Norton said:

I use a QED I found in my spare cables box, seems fine, can’t imagine cable will make much difference, not least as EC designs recommend just the basic plastic type rather than pricier glass. Note if using MOS with UTOS  you will need a specific mini Toslink to std Toslink cable, EC designs recommend avoiding adapters.  I bought another QED Performance to match.

EC Designs say the optical they ship is enough to hear sonic advantages of their NOS DACs, but if you ask them for something better, they actually recommend Lifatec.
I have Lifatec and it's much better than standard plastic cable. Certain grayness i can hear with plastic is gone with Lifatec, and sound is more natural. It all depends on the resolution of your system and your hearing sense.