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Should the behaviour of members of the trade be more strictly regulated than regular members?


Should the behaviour of members of the trade be more strictly regulated than that of regular members  

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Didn't we have the same topic a gazillion times before? In any case, my position hasn't changed: if they we open about their industry affiliation, then we're all set. All of us are adults an can judge on our own how much we trust somebody based on their input. I've seen only a handful of obvious marketing cases, and those were pretty much immediately flagged by some user.

 

In any case what woods this regulation look like and who would control it?

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Didn't we have the same topic a gazillion times before? In any case, my position hasn't changed: if they we open about their industry affiliation, then we're all set. All of us are adults an can judge on our own how much we trust somebody based on their input. I've seen only a handful of obvious marketing cases, and those were pretty much immediately flagged by some user.

 

In any case what woods this regulation look like and who would control it?

 

Your position hasn't changed. You agree that some behaviour is unacceptable. And presumably has been regulated.

 

Looks to me like a defensive knee-jerk reaction. Worried that things might get fairer?

Mike zerO Romeo Oscar November

http://wakibaki.com

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I think the only stipulation would be that their industry affiliation be listed in their post or signature if posting on a subject that relates to that affiliation. For example, if the owner of electronics company posts on their favorite orchestra conductor, the industry affiliation would be irrelevant.

 

Larry

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I think the only stipulation would be that their industry affiliation be listed in their post or signature if posting on a subject that relates to that affiliation. For example, if the owner of electronics company posts on their favorite orchestra conductor, the industry affiliation would be irrelevant.

 

Nobody would suggest any different. The question is more about subtle influences. Would you want Neil Young in a focus group about the Pono? I just think good manners should keep him out, but if necessary I would shove him out.

Mike zerO Romeo Oscar November

http://wakibaki.com

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Nobody would suggest any different. The question is more about subtle influences. Would you want Neil Young in a focus group about the Pono? I just think good manners should keep him out, but if necessary I would shove him out.

 

I certainly wouldn't ban him. In this kind of situation, the famous grain of salt comes handy.

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Nobody would suggest any different. The question is more about subtle influences. Would you want Neil Young in a focus group about the Pono? I just think good manners should keep him out, but if necessary I would shove him out.

 

I would welcome him with open arms. Of course he has his bias toward Pono but that shouldn't preclude his inclusion in discussions about it. I have never understood the backlash against members of the industry being involved in discussions.

If anything, they are closest to the flame and are tuned into newest developments better than most of the public. What would you consider to be a "subtle" influence on a topic? Like maybe they are going to brain wash someone into purchasing their product?

Seems overly paranoid to me. I would think we are all big boys and girls here and can separate the wheat from the chaff so to speak.

 

PS. I am a member of the industry. There, I feel so much better now....kind of like I was at an AA meeting or something. That is in no way meant to be in any way derogatory to people that attend those meetings. They are brave, just making reference to "confessing".

David

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I see no need for it. There have been, IMO, very few examples of abuse by members of the industry. The only one I can think of rarely posts anymore. Most have made very positive contributions to the forum by sharing their knowledge and informed opinions, while keeping any implied marketing to a low and acceptable level.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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I see no need for it. There have been, IMO, very few examples of abuse by members of the industry. The only one I can think of rarely posts anymore. Most have made very positive contributions to the forum by sharing their knowledge and informed opinions, while keeping any implied marketing to a low and acceptable level.

 

+1

 

There are many time where a question, comment or incorrect speculation is made about a product that would be easily clarified if the owner or a representative would make a post.

 

Larry

Analog-VPIClas3,3DArm,LyraSkala+MiyajimaZeromono,Herron VTPH2APhono,2AmpexATR-102+MerrillTridentMaster TapePreamp

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Most have made very positive contributions to the forum by sharing their knowledge and informed opinions, while keeping any implied marketing to a low and acceptable level.

 

+1

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

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+1

 

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Why do we have this insistent desire to curb our freedoms. We have had so many of these blogs recently wanting to restrict our freedoms and control the behaviour of members.

 

As I recently posted in another thread (sorry for repeating) my reason for being here is to learn about audio reproduction and in my experience the best person to teach you about anything is a professional .... not an amateur regurgitating what he/she has read on the internet or heard from others. (Having said that there are several amateurs here who are very knowledgeable and I appreciate their contributions.)

 

In this case that means people with hands on experience from the audio industry, whether they be retailers, manufacturers, mastering engineers or heaven forbid musicians. We want members contributing to this site who are knowledgeable and passionate about audio, and who are committed to being the best they can be, because in reality their families are counting on them to be successful.

 

I have been a member of CA for over 5 years myself and have never felt any pressure at any time to buy anything. The only product I have purchased is the original $50 version of Audirvana, which is fantastic. I haven't felt the need to buy Version 2, even though it has been out for some time and there is a post here at CA where Damien responds to requests for improvements and bugs.

 

To me you can apply the same argument for not increasing moderation on the site. We are all adults so behave well and show respect for others opinions. Ditto ... as an adult you have the capacity to decide whether or not you purchase a product, use your own judgement, don't rely on someone else to do it for you. The knowledge I have gained during the development of Audirvana (debates over how filters work for example) has been invaluable in increasing my understanding of digital audio.

 

The beuacrats and (in my case Australian) government has already greatly curbed our freedoms and you want to bring that into our hobby?

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Yawn - this all comes back to what you mean by "regulated." Should there be rules restricting how commercial interests can use the forum? You bet. Should that mean that a vendor cannot have a personal account on the system and have the same rights/responsibilities of any other user? No way.

 

-Paul

Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never dealt with a cat DAC.

Robert A. Heinlein

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These concerns rarely exist in vacuums. Something irks the OP - come on, have out with it.

 

I trust the contributors of CA far more than reviews of audio gear.

 

"The function of music is to release us from the tyranny of conscious thought", Sir Thomas Beecham. 

 

 

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Let's just look at the TOS on Head-fi regarding MOTs.

 

.....................................................

 

"Member of the Trade" includes (but is not limited to) manufacturers; individuals selling items he or she made for more than the cost of parts and/or actual shipping charges; individuals selling items acquired (or made by the individual and/or his associates) for the primary purpose of resale; individuals performing services (like modifications or any other service) for which the price charged is more than the cost of parts and/or actual shipping charges; dealers; distributors; manufacturer's representatives; importers; magazine and e-zine writers.

 

"Main Forums" are those forums within Head-Fi not specifically designated as areas for commercial advertising by Members of the Trade.

 

A Members of the Trade cannot use his/her business name, product name, brand name, postal address, e-mail address, telephone number or URL as part of his/her Head-Fi username or avatar. All Members of the Trade must contact the forum administrator at to notify him of an interest in posting before making any posts. If a forum member who was not previously a Member of the Trade becomes a Member of the Trade, he must notify the forum administrator of the change in status. After notification of the "Member of the Trade" status, the forum administrator will then add the appropriate tag (Audio Dealer, Manufacturer, Distributor, etc.) to the appropriate profile(s).

 

A Member of the Trade may not post announcements, advertisements, sales information or the like about a product he makes or sells in the Main Forums, or via Private Messaging, unless pre-approved by the site's administrators.

 

A Member of the Trade may not--via the forums or Private Messaging--volunteer any information about a specific product that he is selling or making, in response to a general request for information about a type of product or in any other discussion in the Main Forums.

 

A Member of the Trade may not post subjective assessments or negative comments about the products/services of competitors.

 

A Member of the Trade may not review (or make any subjective assessments of) his or her services and/or products he or she manufacturers, represents, sells.

 

Head-Fi Private Messaging is not to be used for unsolicited advertising. Using Head-Fi Private Messaging for unsolicited advertising may result in at least a temporary ban of the sender from Head-Fi.

 

Shilling, which is posting about products one is affiliated with under the guise/profile of a non-affiliated person, is extremely frowned upon by the moderators and admins of Head-Fi, and may result in a permanent ban from Head-Fi.

 

.............................................

Mike zerO Romeo Oscar November

http://wakibaki.com

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These concerns rarely exist in vacuums. Something irks the OP - come on, have out with it.

 

Perhaps the OP is annoyed that some members of the trade, are in their writings, able to present POVs virtually unchallenged by the Objective side, that he disagrees with ?

As for Head Fi, anything that is posted that is likely to upset a paid advertiser is likely to be removed, and perhaps the poster banned too. A well respected Audio designer who has disappeared off the radar recently, comes to mind here, where he pointed out a potential headphone damaging problem in a headphone amplifier.

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Perhaps the OP is annoyed that some members of the trade, are in their writings, able to present POVs virtually unchallenged by the Objective side, that he disagrees with ?

 

Close, but no cigar. I just think it would be easier to argue a general (and generally well respected) principle than to refute a very many convoluted and entangled false claims all arising in defence of a product. I don't get paid for this.

Mike zerO Romeo Oscar November

http://wakibaki.com

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Close, but no cigar. I just think it would be easier to argue a general (and generally well respected) principle than to refute a very many convoluted and entangled false claims all arising in defence of a product. I don't get paid for this.

 

And who is to say the claims are false, a committee of elderly E.E.s perhaps ?

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Wakibaki

 

In one thread you express great concern about experts being "barracked" but in this one your seem to be advocating for commercial entities being restricted. My opinion is the experts should not be barracked and that commercial entities be allowed to post as long as their affiliations are clear....and I believe this is true here. Personally I think it would be a great loss to CA (and to me) if those with commercial interests are restricted (other than self-identifying).

 

I am left with the feeling that you have some underlying agenda that is bubbling out in your recent posts. If you would please just clearly state what this is, I believe it would be of benefit to you and other CA members.

 

BTW - I realize that you are an expert in a number of areas here, and also list a .com site in your signature. I am happy that you have contributed to these discussions and would miss these contributions if you were somehow restricted in your participation here.

You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star

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Close, but no cigar. I just think it would be easier to argue a general (and generally well respected) principle than to refute a very many convoluted and entangled false claims all arising in defence of a product. I don't get paid for this.

 

Can you name a few made by "members of trade" that have posted in this forum where you noted false claims. Just wondering as I would like to read these claims and what was challenged by the local forum experts. Just send me a PM

The Truth Is Out There

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I always know when I've got you on the ropes, Alex, you resort to insults. You know you'll only regret it later.

 

Dream on !

Why is it that so many "expert" committees that set standards are more often than not, composed mainly of the "elder statesmen" ? Most over 55's have a severe droop in HF response as evidenced by many readily available graphs about hearing with age. Also, their lower limits of audibility are also usually reduced with age. That's without hearing damage too.

 

Listening and Hearing

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Close, but no cigar. I just think it would be easier to argue a general (and generally well respected) principle than to refute a very many convoluted and entangled false claims all arising in defence of a product. I don't get paid for this.

 

It would be helpful if you would provide specific examples of these "very many convoluted and entangled false claims in defense (sic) of a product". Making such statements without providing specific references weakens your point and credibility in my opinion. As long as members of the industry are identified as such I don't care what they say. I think I'm capable enough to draw my own conclusions.

"A mind is like a parachute. It doesn't work if it is not open."
Frank Zappa
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This is ridiculous, how can anyone claim to seek the truth through learning yet forbid a portion of the truly experienced people from offering their knowledge? I think we, as a community, have done a very good job of identifying and chasing off the chills. From what I have seen this problem really doesn't exist here at CA.

 

Maybe I've missed something or I'm just naive but I haven't seen any of the industry experts I listen to (read thier comments) try to push any agendas other than offer their opinion regarding the specific question/thread.

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