The "Official" Aurender Discussion Thread

[Mazza]

I use Metadatics and SongKong on the MAC

 

SongKong is great for doing a BIG sort out because it has a batch mode; it tidied up my whole collection to a consistent standard. But easily used just for one album. Tend to use Metadatics for smaller batches of files to sort out, a bit less automated which can be better at times.

 

Unfortunately, neither are free

[jon2020]

8 hours ago, Foxman50 said:

 

Very interesting indeed Jon, looks like youve had a right result there. And to now be happy after having the N10 for a period of time, well im jealous ?

 

Foxman50,

 

I have discovered something interesting.

The lowest most USB port labelled 5V-0.4A below the LAN port sounds much "better" to me than the one meant for the dac at the side which is labelled as 5V-0.1A.

 

If you have the time, try switching between the 2 ports and let me know if you hear any difference.

 

Many thanks in advance.

Jon.

[Foxman50]

1 hour ago, jon2020 said:

 

Foxman50,

 

I have discovered something interesting.

The lowest most USB port labelled 5V-0.4A below the LAN port sounds much "better" to me than the one meant for the dac at the side which is labelled as 5V-0.1A.

 

If you have the time, try switching between the 2 ports and let me know if you hear any difference.

 

Many thanks in advance.

Jon.

 

Jon i thought there was only one USB port available for DAC output, the others being input types. Not that ive ever tried using them for the DAC. 

 

Its not surprising really Aurender update their devices, i wonder if improvements have been made to the entire range.

[jon2020]

29 minutes ago, Foxman50 said:

 

Jon i thought there was only one USB port available for DAC output, the others being input types. Not that ive ever tried using them for the DAC. 

 

Its not surprising really Aurender update their devices, i wonder if improvements have been made to the entire range.

 

Foxman50,

You are correct.

There is supposed to be only one output port to the dac labelled 5V-0.1A.

But the 2 input ports labelled 5V-0.4A, below the LAN port can also be used for the dac and they seem to work very well with my dac. I think maybe usb ports in general are bidirectional.

 

If my physics still holds, Voltage = Current X Resistance or Impedance. So the higher current port offers lower output impedance to drive the dac more efficiently? 

 

Try it one day if you have the time.

[biosailor]

9 hours ago, Mazza said:

I use Metadatics and SongKong on the MAC

 

SongKong is great for doing a BIG sort out because it has a batch mode; it tidied up my whole collection to a consistent standard. But easily used just for one album. Tend to use Metadatics for smaller batches of files to sort out, a bit less automated which can be better at times.

 

Unfortunately, neither are free

 

Thanks to everyone for the very helpful input with regards to metadata editing. Much appreciated!

[jon2020]

5 hours ago, Foxman50 said:

 

Jon i thought there was only one USB port available for DAC output, the others being input types. Not that ive ever tried using them for the DAC. 

 

Its not surprising really Aurender update their devices, i wonder if improvements have been made to the entire range.

 

Foxman50,

 

For the N10, the usb output to dac is labelled 5V-1.0A while the 2 usb inputs are labelled 5V-0.5A. So I suspect the N10's usb output to dac would sound better with an amp rating higher than that of the inputs.

 

This is very puzzling indeed. Why would Aurender vary the amp ratings for the usb inputs and outputs for different models?

[Mazza]

Curious isn't it. 

 

I remember reading somewhere that the higher amp rating on the none-DAC usb's is to support low-power external HDD drives such to avoid their use of a separate power supply. Perhaps the usb module is limited in the total power it can deliver to all sockets and is therefore that is why they are signified to be different? As to why they are different  models, perhaps that is down to the motherboards used for the N100/N10. The N100 is a newer design

 

On the point raised by jon2020, I get that the higher amp-rated connections potentially have lower impedance, but in reality is this likely to make any significant difference? I thought that the biggest problem with usb connections is the potential 'noise' carried on the 5v rail, not the impedance?

[jon2020]

2 minutes ago, Mazza said:

Curious isn't it. 

 

I remember reading somewhere that the higher amp rating on the none-DAC usb's is to support low-power external HDD drives such to avoid their use of a separate power supply. Perhaps the usb module is limited in the total power it can deliver to all sockets and is therefore that is why they are signified to be different? As to why they are different  models, perhaps that is down to the motherboards used for the N100/N10. The N100 is a newer design

 

On the point raised by jon2020, I get that the higher amp-rated connections potentially have lower impedance, but in reality is this likely to make any significant difference? I thought that the biggest problem with usb connections is the potential 'noise' carried on the 5v rail, not the impedance?

 

Mazza,

I guess the proof is in the listening. As the constant is 5V, then any sonic differences if at all would be down to the difference in the amp rating.

 

For the N100H in my system, the 0.4A port sounds better than the 0.1A and it's a night and day difference. 

[Mazza]

5 minutes ago, jon2020 said:

 

Mazza,

I guess the proof is in the listening. As the constant is 5V, then any sonic differences if at all would be down to the difference in the amp rating.

 

For the N100H in my system, the 0.4A port sounds better than the 0.1A and it's a night and day difference. 

 

Interesting, obviously you are onto something

[jon2020]

3 hours ago, Mazza said:

 

Interesting, obviously you are onto something

 

Things get more vexing when one wonders more.....

 

If the usb output to dac of the N10 of 1.0A is spec'd at double the input of 0.5A, why is the usb output of the N100H of 0.1A spec'd at only 25% of the input of 0.4A? Should it not be 0.8A  instead, so as to be consistent with the design of the N10?

 

When I had the N10 in my system, the volume of my preamp which ranges from 0-100 is barely at 25-35 but with the N100H, I need to move the volume to the 40-50 range to achieve the same loudness.

 

This would indicate that the N10's output of 1.0A is way too much gain for my dac and preamp. My preamp running at 25 - 35 with the N10 is certainly not in the ideal range of 40 - 50, which I get with the N100H.

 

Could this explain why I find the SQ of the returned N100H to be nearly as good as the N10's, all because of this gain differential?

Questions, questions.........

 

[Mazza]

jon2020,  didn't you find something similar happening when you were explaining your trials with USB 3.0 a couple of months ago?

 

You say that the differential gain seems to be causing a change in replay volume levels ...........I recall an article I read sometime ago (sorry can't remember where) about the vagaries of auditioning kit (brings me back to some of previous posts!) by a very well respected audio journalist. He basically warned that one of tricks or fooleries used when auditioning, and can catch you out particularly when trying to compare A vs B, is that our ears are incredibly sensitive to changes in volume. Literally we can differentiate to a fraction of a dB and the louder the music is, the more dynamic, pacy and exciting it sounds and THAT is often the reason when we listen to A vs B, we might prefer one over the other. Think about it, music played loud is always more exciting than when played at subdued levels.

 

Might go some way to explaining what you are finding?

[Foxman50]

Jon you raise many questions to ponder indeed. I have an N100 as well as my N10. The thing is when i have compared the two i have not even considered the outputs being different, not that i had noticed a volume change.

 

maybe its something i need to revisit.

 

mind you the N10's advantages, at least to me, are more to do with presentation than detail alone.

 

As you say questions questions. What a great hobby 

[jon2020]

4 hours ago, Mazza said:

jon2020,  didn't you find something similar happening when you were explaining your trials with USB 3.0 a couple of months ago?

 

You say that the differential gain seems to be causing a change in replay volume levels ...........I recall an article I read sometime ago (sorry can't remember where) about the vagaries of auditioning kit (brings me back to some of previous posts!) by a very well respected audio journalist. He basically warned that one of tricks or fooleries used when auditioning, and can catch you out particularly when trying to compare A vs B, is that our ears are incredibly sensitive to changes in volume. Literally we can differentiate to a fraction of a dB and the louder the music is, the more dynamic, pacy and exciting it sounds and THAT is often the reason when we listen to A vs B, we might prefer one over the other. Think about it, music played loud is always more exciting than when played at subdued levels.

 

Might go some way to explaining what you are finding?

 

Mazza,

Yes, the increase in volume does makes a lot of difference.

 

But with the N10, the gain was too much for my system.. With the N100H, it was just right, again for my system. But the increase in volume in both situations comparing the different usb ports did not increase the noise floor or distortion, while the usb 3.0 did both.

 

So back to Aurender, why this big difference in usb port specs between the N10 and N100H? It is unlikely we will get straight answers but it is very unlikely  the big gap in price between these 2 models can be justified by just this difference in power supply design resulting in such very different usb port specs that do not seem to be consistent along the product line.

But some consistency is noted as the W20 and N10 share the same usb port specs while the N100H share specs with the N100C and X100.

 

But the 10 times difference for the usb output to dac between these 2 models groups, 0.1A vs 1.0A, is indeed very, very puzzling.

[jon2020]

7 minutes ago, Foxman50 said:

Jon you raise many questions to ponder indeed. I have an N100 as well as my N10. The thing is when i have compared the two i have not even considered the outputs being different, not that i had noticed a volume change.

 

maybe its something i need to revisit.

 

mind you the N10's advantages, at least to me, are more to do with presentation than detail alone.

 

As you say questions questions. What a great hobby 

 

+1, Foxman50. Great hobby!

[Foxman50]

Jon, can you confirm your new unit is as the Aurender link you supplied and your old unit was as the Audiostream link you supplied.

 

the reason i ask is my N100 is as the Aurender link, however ive had this for 3 - 4 years. 

 

Maybe ive misunderstood your comment.

[jon2020]

40 minutes ago, Foxman50 said:

Jon, can you confirm your new unit is as the Aurender link you supplied and your old unit was as the Audiostream link you supplied.

 

the reason i ask is my N100 is as the Aurender link, however ive had this for 3 - 4 years. 

 

Maybe ive misunderstood your comment.

 

Foxman50,

 

My original unit is like yours which is  the one on the Aurender website. 

 

My returned new unit is like that on the Audiostream website.

[jon2020]

4 hours ago, Foxman50 said:

Jon, can you confirm your new unit is as the Aurender link you supplied and your old unit was as the Audiostream link you supplied.

 

the reason i ask is my N100 is as the Aurender link, however ive had this for 3 - 4 years. 

 

Maybe ive misunderstood your comment.

 

Just to add, although my original unit is still under warranty, it is from an old batch manufactured several years ago.

[jon2020]

My returned new unit has the power cord socket and power switch positioned as shown on the Audiostream website.

 

But its usb output to dac is rated at 0.1A instead of the 0.2A rating shown on BOTH the Aurender and Aidostream websites. 

 

Scratching my head even more now.....

[Foxman50]

Many thanks Jon for clarifying and there was me hoping i had the later unit ?

 

time to sit back and just enjoy the music me thinks.

 

cheers

[michaelD]

My son has a Parasound Integraded and a Aurender N100H for a couple of years.  To the best of our knowledge Parasound is not going to update (at least existing units) to unfold and render MQA in all its glory.  So he ordered a black A10 that he got yesterday.  I got to say I was real impressed.  I've seen and heard it at Axpona but this is the first time in a more familiar system.  

 

First off my son handed it to me and I was very surprised at how heavy it was.  We looked it up its similar in weight to my N10.  As always the workmanship was great and it just looks so impressive!  Just a real work of art - not that I'm surprised as when I think of quality manufacturing Aurender is very much on my list!  We proceeded to update the software etc. all went without a hitch then on to cloning.  This is the second time I have been involved in this process and its so easy and convenient.  You can only fully appreciate this process if you ever had do this all manually which many of us did the first time.  Playlist, albums, art etc. all come over its just great! 

 

So now to the sound and finally comparing MQA Tidal tracks to local PCM.  It was so easy to tell which one was the MQA version.   Comparing DSD at times it was not so obvious all the time but in most cases the MQA version sounded better.  I got to say the one real obvious one was the Fleetwood Mac Dreams track. I was excited a few years back to get the DSD version of this album but was so disappointed in the sound quality.  I liked the PCM version so much better.  The MQA version is so much better then both but in particular the DSD version. This is also a brand new unit with like 4 hours on it so the sound quality will only get better!  NIce going Aurender!!

[rwwjr44]

On 3/27/2018 at 3:31 PM, biosailor said:

Something else, doesn't involve upgrading : just downloaded The Modern Jazz Quratet's 'Pyramid' (super recording, super album, BTW) and transferred it onto my N100H as a wav file. The N100H displays it as an album, but it lists it as 'Unknown'. Tried re-transferring it with just 'Modern Jazz Quartet', but doesn't help, still displayed as 'Unknown'. Would anyone know the reason?

 

 

I think something is wrong with the metadata created when you ripped it (I am assuming that it was ripped). I have the same album and the Conductor lists it correctly. I don't know how much you know about editing metadata and metadata software but that is what you need to do. If you haven't done this before, I suggest using Google and taking some time to get it correct.

[jon2020]

5 hours ago, Foxman50 said:

Many thanks Jon for clarifying and there was me hoping i had the later unit ?

 

time to sit back and just enjoy the music me thinks.

 

cheers

 

Foxman50,

Certainly doing just that......

Enjoy the Music!

[biosailor]

1 hour ago, rwwjr44 said:

I think something is wrong with the metadata created when you ripped it (I am assuming that it was ripped). I have the same album and the Conductor lists it correctly. I don't know how much you know about editing metadata and metadata software but that is what you need to do. If you haven't done this before, I suggest using Google and taking some time to get it correct.

 

I downloaded the album from Qobuz, so no CD rip. But indeed, it was missing metadata that made the Aurender to display it as unknown album. I downloaded Metadatics, had it tagged and re-loaded the album onto the N100H and voilà, there it was correctly displayed as 'The Modern Jazz Quartet'. Thanks for the suggestion! BTW, a great album, and lovely recording!

[jon2020]

On 3/27/2018 at 8:27 PM, Vincent1234 said:

B). Some MAY underestimate the improvements brought by better/more expensive equipment. This can especially happen when they realise that they are not willing or able to spend the amount of money required for it.

 

 

From a medical standpoint,  this is a very interesting observation of human behavior amongst audiophiles........and I am so, so guilty as charged! 

 

I texted a big smiley to my local dealer upon listening to my returned unit at home for having saved 6+ grand for the non-upgrade.

Dopamine-triggered euphoria all the way!

 

[Vincent1234]

6 hours ago, jon2020 said:

 

 

From a medical standpoint,  this is a very interesting observation of human behavior amongst audiophiles........and I am so, so guilty as charged! 

 

I texted a big smiley to my local dealer upon listening to my returned unit at home for having saved 6+ grand for the non-upgrade.

Dopamine-triggered euphoria all the way!

 

Hahah, I'm really happy for you! Still, in the back of my head I'm wondering what the N10 might bring additionally to your system. But since I don't know your system and since you are very happy now, let's not talk about that anymore (for now...). ?