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SACD Player to replace Oppo105?


Norton

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Have you looked into the modifications by Modwright for the Oppo? They are very good

 

If interested, reviews can be found at 6moons.com, TAS, and ModWright's circle at AudioCircle.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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Have you looked into the modifications by Modwright for the Oppo? They are very good

 

Unless you are a dyed in the wool tube fanatic, it looks bloody awful, and there is no way it is going to do anything but degrade S/N compared with a comparable quality SS modification. It will almost invariably add a degree of colouration though, which some with lesser systems may sound pleasing.

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Unless you are a dyed in the wool tube fanatic, it looks bloody awful, and there is no way it is going to do anything but degrade S/N compared with a comparable quality SS modification. It will almost invariably add a degree of colouration though, which some with lesser systems may sound pleasing.

 

Have you ever actually listened to one of Dan Wright's modified SACD players? I suspect not. I have owned two of his modified Sony SACD players and heard a comparison of the stock Oppo 105 versus the modified version. The addition of a rectified outboard power supply and replacement of the analog output stage provide a significant improvement in sound over the stock players.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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Have you ever actually listened to one of Dan Wright's modified SACD players? I suspect not. I have owned two of his modified Sony SACD players and heard a comparison of the stock Oppo 105 versus the modified version. The addition of a rectified outboard power supply and replacement of the analog output stage provide a significant improvement in sound over the stock players.

 

Allan

The analogue out of a non modified Oppo 105 is nothing to write home about. That's why I use mine purely as a transport into a better DAC. TBH, I don't like SACD that much compared with well recorded RB CD, and I don't have enough SACDs to make it worth my while going there.

It is pointless arguing with anybody who prefers valves. Just as it is with Vinyl lovers.

The specs when you use valves WILL be degraded in the S/N area especially, compared with a well reworked SS stage, in which case the S/N etc. will be better.

If the tubes used are dual, then there is also likely to be some kind of mismatch in gain between halves , especially when it comes time to replace them. With 24/192 , you NEED the best possible S/N otherwise there is no point to it!

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Sonore UltraRendu with Uptone power supply —> Meitner MA1

 

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AMG Giro Turntable w Lyra Delos Cartridge —> Audio Research Ref 3 PhonoPre

 

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Allan

The analogue out of a non modified Oppo 105 is nothing to write home about. That's why I use mine purely as a transport into a better DAC. TBH, I don't like SACD that much compared with well recorded RB CD, and I don't have enough SACDs to make it worth my while going there.

 

IOW, you have never listened to a ModWright Oppo 105 and are speculating about how it will sound. SACD well done will blow the pants off RB. OTOH, poorly done, it's not worth it. But that's true of virtually anything to do with audio. :)

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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IOW, you have never listened to a ModWright Oppo 105 and are speculating about how it will sound. SACD well done will blow the pants off RB. OTOH, poorly done, it's not worth it. But that's true of virtually anything to do with audio. :)

 

I wouldn't call the few SACDs that I have "well done"

I don't care how you word it, but including valves in the output stage WILL reduce S/N compared with what is otherwise achievable. Then there is the inevitable regular costs of replacing aging tubes. Getting well matched replacements is quite expensive too.

 

As I said previously , it is virtually impossible to win an argument with either a valve or Vinyl fan. It's almost like arguing with esldude ! (grin)

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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I wouldn't call the few SACDs that I have "well done"

I don't care how you word it, but including valves in the output stage WILL reduce S/N compared with what is otherwise achievable. Then there is the inevitable regular costs of replacing aging tubes. Getting well matched replacements is quite expensive too.

 

As I said previously , it is virtually impossible to win an argument with either a valve or Vinyl fan. It's almost like arguing with esldude ! (grin)

 

OTOH, taking such a strong position without actually hearing it is, IMO, no different from someone insisting that bit perfect files have to sound the same. :) Matching and/or replacing tubes is a completely different issue.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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Hi Norton

 

You imagined a dedicated player Vs ripping your files.

 

Does the Oppo have digital out? It's a relatively no player so perhaps keeping it as a transport and upgrading only the DAC would give you a boost. The PS Audio Perfect Wave is within your budget and handles DSD.

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OTOH, taking such a strong position without actually hearing it is, IMO, no different from someone insisting that bit perfect files have to sound the same. :) Matching and/or replacing tubes is a completely different issue.

 

But in this case it is easily verified by measurements. You may have up to 20dB improvement in S/N alone with a very well implemented SS stage. Replacing valves shouldn't be a separate issue as it is an ongoing ownership cost. How many would even realise that the tubes have slowly deteriorated ?

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Does the Oppo have digital out? It's a relatively no player so perhaps keeping it as a transport and upgrading only the DAC would give you a boost. The PS Audio Perfect Wave is within your budget and handles DSD.

 

alternatively, auralic vega = msrp $3.5k.

dac may serve many sources + oppo 105 is nice multi-purpose tool to keep.

cheers.

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But in this case it is easily verified by measurements. You may have up to 20dB improvement in S/N alone with a very well implemented SS stage. Replacing valves shouldn't be a separate issue as it is an ongoing ownership cost. How many would even realise that the tubes have slowly deteriorated ?

 

Alex, with the greatest of respect, you are losing sight of the most important factor, i.e. how it sounds. Surely you must know that measurements can only tell part of the story of how a piece of equipment sounds. Great S/N ratio specs are no substitute for timbre, dynamics, transparency, etc. Tube gear, sonically, no longer has to suffer from the characteristics you decry any more than solid state gear today has to be cold and un-involving. It's all about the implementation, not the technology itself.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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Alex, with the greatest of respect, you are losing sight of the most important factor, i.e. how it sounds. Surely you must know that measurements can only tell part of the story of how a piece of equipment sounds. Great S/N ratio specs are no substitute for timbre, dynamics, transparency, etc. Tube gear, sonically, no longer has to suffer from the characteristics you decry any more than solid state gear today has to be cold and un-involving. It's all about the implementation, not the technology itself.

 

Very well said Allan. I would also strongly recommend to the OP that you consider the full blown Modwright upgrade for your Oppo 105. Read the reviews and commentary on this modded player. There are also members here who own the Modwright modified 105's and swear by them.

 

SandyK, respectfully, your view of tube based electronics is at least several decades out of date, in general, although I will grant you there are some exceptions. However, do you suppose all of the major reviewers who routinely hand out the highest of accolades to both tubed equipment and solid state are just simply overlooking the supposed shortcomings of tubes that you mention? Some of the most awarded amplifiers and preamplifiers currently for sale are fully tube based.

 

I will grant you that replacing tubes of certain designs can be expensive though, but I don't really look at that as much different than the fact that I have to put premium gas in my car. It makes the benefits of the car, in the performance realm, possible.

 

And while I will admit there are some less than well done SACD masterings, you really should hear some well recorded SACD's, they can be a revelation!

 

JC

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SandyK, respectfully, your view of tube based electronics is at least several decades out of date. Do you suppose all of the major reviewers who routinely hand out the highest of accolades to both tubed equipment and solid state are just simply overlooking the supposed shortcomings of tubes that you mention? I will grant you that replacing tubes of certain designs can be expensive though, but I don't really look at that as much different than the fact that I have to put premium gas in my car. It makes the benefits of the car, in the performance realm, possible. And you really should hear some well recorded SACD's, they can be a revelation!

 

JC

 

Rubbish!

I have an Aune DAC with a valve in the DAC section, and didn't like the colouration.I gave it to my son.

I also heard a very expensive valve preamp quite recently, and I wouldn't be able to live with it's shortcomings compared with my own SS preamp. The host loved it's added warmth though.

Your User name says it all though, so it's a waste of time discussing this further.

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Rubbish!

I have an Aune DAC with a valve in the DAC section, and didn't like the colouration.I gave it to my son.

I also heard a very expensive valve preamp quite recently, and I wouldn't be able to live with it's shortcomings compared with my own SS preamp. The host loved it's added warmth though.

Your User name says it all though, so it's a waste of time discussing this further.

 

I was, for the majority of my adult life, a confirmed solid state audio devotee, and would never have even considered something tube based. Until the day where I was literally almost dragged to an audio show, and shown the error of my previous, limited outlook. I was simply attempting to encourage the same degree of enlightenment which has brought me much closer to the music I love.

 

JC

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I was simply attempting to encourage the same degree of enlightenment which has brought me much closer to the music I love.

 

JC

An enlightenment, or simply a personal preference ?

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Rubbish!

I have an Aune DAC with a valve in the DAC section, and didn't like the colouration.I gave it to my son.

I also heard a very expensive valve preamp quite recently, and I wouldn't be able to live with it's shortcomings compared with my own SS preamp. The host loved it's added warmth though.

Your User name says it all though, so it's a waste of time discussing this further.

 

That's very enlightened, Alex. Based on two pieces of equipment you dismiss all tube based gear. Do you have any idea how much solid state crap there is out there as well? I personally have no devotion to tubes and my current system is all solid state. As I run the the audio output from my television and DVD player through my stereo, a tube preamp or amp would be impractical. While there is no question that some tube gear has an unwanted coloured "tubey" sound, some of the the best, most expensive high-end preamps and amps employ tubes. I repeat. It's the implementation, not the technology. Maintaining tube gear is a different issue that may or may not be an important factor to an individual in choosing equipment.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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That's very enlightened, Alex. Based on two pieces of equipment you dismiss all tube based gear.

 

No, I dismiss all the BS about the claimed superiority of tubes over well implemented SS.

Sure , there is a lot of mediocre gear out there, both valve and SS.

It's similar with the BS about the superiority of Vinyl over digital, even when the Vinyl was sourced from a digital master, as well as resampled RB CD to DSD, where many report a slightly smoother sound. Of course it couldn't be that their systems have a digital "glare" about them, and they are treating the symptoms, instead of correcting the problem ?

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Of course it couldn't be that their systems have a digital "glare" about them, and they are treating the symptoms, instead of correcting the problem ?

 

It could be, but it's far more likely a case of alternatives sounding better than most digital, at least until recently. A good vinyl rig still sounds more natural than most RB digital. Good transparent electronics are just going to accurately reproduce what they are fed from the source. Anyhow, I'm through with arguing about it. :)

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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A good vinyl rig still sounds more natural than most RB digital.

 

Perhaps that says more about your digital replay or your source material ?

Recently I heard a Bricasti DAC and I would pit it against any Vinyl rig.

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Perhaps that says more about your digital replay or your source material?

 

Anyone who has heard a Luxman DA-06 through a good system would know how ridiculous the above statement is.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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Anyone who has heard a Luxman DA-06 through a good system such as mine would know how ridiculous the above statement is.

 

If it is good as you claim, then al USB cables to it should sound the same. Do they ?

 

How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file.

PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020

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Anyone who has heard a Luxman DA-06 through a good system would know how ridiculous the above statement is.

 

You have people in this forum using low cost class D amps and swearing that transcoded DSD is better than RB :)

Seriously Allan, with a well matched system where every component matters not only the DAC, RB gives you a better result than vinyl.

 


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